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Revive GoLive - Interested Parties Only

Nov 4, 2009 10:04 AM

Greetings GoLive Users!

 

I am starting this thread for one reason only. To see how many GoLive users would be interested in either supporting GoLive being revived, or seeing a new or current application be developed using similar features we all loved in GoLive as well as a similar interface.

 

Please only post if you are a supporter of this idea. You only have to say yes, or if you like you can say yes and why.

 

It's possible that nothing can be done. We all know that. But it would be nice if we could just get a feel for how many users would at least support the idea if this were possible. For starters I am hoping to see 1,000 or more valid yes posts. Perhaps it would create an interest on behalf of Adobe's developers, or another venue...

 

Please don't post to argue why this idea would not work. Please don't post if you are opposed. I am only looking to see how much interest can be generated by those in favor.

 

Thank you!

Linda

www.revivegolive.com

 
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 4, 2009 11:32 AM   in reply to LRK 2

    I support the idea that the Adobe Forums are offered to everyone to learn and share. This thread seems entirely anti-intellectual and selfish for an impossible agenda at the private web site of revivegolive.com.

     

    The topic has been discussed in this forum for years - - that is how long it has been since we all learned what would happen to GoLive. Why attempt to create a future with GoLive without having any understanding of the past?

     

    Many excellent alternative WYSIWYG programs have been suggested. Why haven't these other apps been tested? Why would someone be so set on the impossible task of reviving GoLive instead of discussing alternative applications?

     

    We all know there is no way Adobe is going to release its intellectual property (either source code or software patent) to a competitor. Even if starting from scratch, a competing developer cannot develop identical features as they could violate Adobe's software patents. Your favorite GL features will either appear in DW gradually or they will not appear at all.

     

    This forum is to help current GoLive users make use of their still-functional software. Promoting a false hope of a resurrection does not help anyone. That false hope may actually hurt as it distracts web designers from maturing.

     

    http://www.revivegolive.com/ suggests a grassroots movement but that web site does not offer any method for users to register, collaborate and organize. Maybe you need to look at another web design tool to make revivegolive.com functional as a community action site.

     

    If you really want to be productive, tell us which WYSIWYG editors you have tried and what element of those programs did not meet your needs. We might be able to suggest an alternative.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 4, 2009 12:42 PM   in reply to LRK 2

    Leaders only gain a meaningful following if they are inviting and exhibit the appearance of intelligence.

     

    I think you missed the point where this is a public forum and if you seek an opinion, you're going to get it. Maybe you need to start your own blog where you can control your own content, moderate the comments and even offer a poll. Surely a professional web designer would know this.

     

    Linda, I asked you what other WYSIWYG programs you have tried and what aspects of them did not appeal. If you are not going to answer that then why are you bothering here? How could you possibly expect a developer to cater to your wishes if you cannot even define what you want?

     

    Good luck on your private club. 

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 4, 2009 1:47 PM   in reply to LRK 2

    I do recall you answering my question in the past as having only used DW as an alternative. This is why I am so confused about your position. There are so many other options for web design besides DW and GL. Why aren't you looking at them?!! You would not feel so helpless if you realized what tools are available.

     

    I've seen you make assumptions that I prefer (or even use ) Dreamweaver simply because I have not joined you in the same wishful thinking about GL. I rarely use DW. I am not here to usher people from GL to DW. It has never been a matter where we must use either DW or GL. I'm here to say use GL while it works and look around for other options if you are concerned about GL's continued use on newer systems.

     

    LRK 2 wrote:

     

    ...I am only trying to see how much interest there is in GoLive...

    Can you not already tell by the emptiness in this forum? You were here when the forum was much more active. Where do you suppose those posters have gone? Would it be safe to assume they are devoting their time and energy to something more productive than empty wishful thoughts?

     

    Adobe already measured how much interest there was in GoLive. That is why it is discontinued. It seems pretty pretentious that any of us would think to be a better judge than Adobe in surveying the level of interest, especially when none of us here have the ability to resume development on GoLive based on whatever results come from such a survey.

     

    At no point have I attempted to argue with you for the sake of argument. I appreciate your passion for GL. I like the program as well. That is why I am here in this forum.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 18, 2009 12:11 PM   in reply to LRK 2

    All for it.  I love the way GoLive integrates with other Adobe software using Smart Objects and supports pdf files as images.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 19, 2009 1:53 PM   in reply to LRK 2

    Sounds good to me. Although, I will have to add that I am not a professional user of GoLive; only a hobbyist. As such I figure I would have little impact on a company like Adobe. I'm still at 6.0.1 for GL and 6 for PS. I cannot afford to pay the upgrade costs for this software even though I very much like the way it works and it's usefulness.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 23, 2009 10:27 AM   in reply to LRK 2

    Please hurry! I want a new GoLive. I hate Dreamweaver - that's right - hate hate hate!!!!!

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 24, 2009 6:13 AM   in reply to AlleyCatSmith

    diloretta wrote:

     

    Please hurry! I want a new GoLive. I hate Dreamweaver - that's right - hate hate hate!!!!!

    Linda, do you see the insanity you are fostering here? 

     

    diloretta thinks he/she is talking to Adobe by asking someone to 'hurry'.

     

    LUH3417 thinks your idea sounds good as well but admits he/she would never pay for it and hasn't supported GoLive for the past 3 releases.

     

    This is exactly why Adobe discontinued GoLive. If people do not support/buy a program, the program dies.

     

    Adobe is laying off 680 people right now (9% of their workforce). They laid off 600 people at this time last year (8% of their workforce). How could anyone think Adobe is going to devote their diminishing resources to a discontinued application?

     

    Adobe is not going to change course on GoLive. You'd have much better luck sending donations and contributed code to an open source web design application. Sourceforge.net probably has a few projects you can support if you really think a grassroots campaign is going to have any effect.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 24, 2009 8:18 AM   in reply to LRK 2

    I'm not upset.

     

    You are much brighter than you have let on in this thread. I'm no fan of misinformation, which unfortunately, is all that a thread like this can generate. Promoting the idea of reviving GoLive is up there with the idea of a suicide bomber finding a reward of 70+ virgins. I guess we all need to hold to silly beliefs to get us through the day.

     

    cheers...

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 24, 2009 8:20 AM   in reply to Marian Driscoll

    I'm not talking to Adobe. Adobe could care less about what I want. I'm responding to those of us who want GoLive or its replacement.

     

    diloretta

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 24, 2009 8:33 AM   in reply to AlleyCatSmith

    diloretta wrote:

     

    I'm not talking to Adobe. Adobe could care less about what I want. I'm responding to those of us who want GoLive or its replacement.

     

    diloretta

    This is exactly what I'm talking about when it comes to misinformation and insanity.

     

    Adobe owns GoLive, its code and its software patents. If you are not talking to Adobe, to whom are you talking? Are people so insane to think a handful of forum users can continue to program and support GoLive? You might as well be discussing this in a forum for automobile mechanics.

     

    If you really are interested in a replacement for GoLive, then discuss it like we have for the past years since GoLive's demise was announced. Set your sights beyond Dreamweaver. DW is not the only option. What programs have you tried? What features in those programs did not work for you? What features are you seeking?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 24, 2009 8:49 AM   in reply to LRK 2

    yes

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 24, 2009 9:08 AM   in reply to LRK 2

    yes - yes - yes

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 24, 2009 9:58 AM   in reply to Marian Driscoll

    I am talking to the person who started this thread.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 24, 2009 10:00 AM   in reply to AlleyCatSmith

    I think Linda is hurrying as fast as she can. How do you suggest she goes faster? 

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 24, 2009 5:02 PM   in reply to Marian Driscoll

    Marian, I never said I don't support GL although if support is only measured in the outlay of cash then it is a fair statement. I understand where you are coming from and, indeed, if there are not enough customers willing to purchase a product it is certainly foolish to continue to produce the product.

     

    As to why I haven't "supported" GL, I simply can't afford the cost to do so - not because I think the product is poorly conceived and executed. I went through - and am still going through - this same thing in the audio production realm. The good and productive tools are very expensive for someone like myself who does not make a living from those tools, but still feels that buying the best tool for the job is the smart way to go. That's why I bought GL back at version 3 or 4. It was, at the time and from my research, the best tool for the job. I want to work with good tools as they generally make the work at hand much easier than using poor tools.

     

    As you mentioned, there are other tools available. Focusing solely on GL does seem foolish. I sometimes think part of this "foolishness" comes from the fact that the tool is familiar, comfortable and has become intuitive in it's use. To know that this tool will have no further improvements (or official support from the owner/"manufacturer") that may make it even better could be - and perhaps is - interpreted as a loss of investment by those who chose to purchase that tool. Some may even see it as a betrayal of trust. I'm not there, but I do see how this could be the case for some.

     

    Such is life. Things do indeed move on and nostalgia is not - nor should it be - a reason to continue to produce a product like these tools we use in this creative electronic world of ours especially in light of waning support. Just as people need an income to eat, clothe themselves and have a place of shelter a company needs to realize a benefit from a product it brings to market. After all, that company is made of of folks who need an income to eat, clothe themselves and have a place of shelter.

     

    Thanks for making the products you have. Thank you for developing new products that may blow away the older ones in terms of productivity and genuine usefulness. Thank you for allowing folks like Linda and others to exercise their freedom of speech to express their opinions - and their support - of GL.

     

    May you all have a great holiday with family and friends!

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 25, 2009 7:11 AM   in reply to LRK 2

    YES!

     

    That was easy. All Linda asked for was a simple yes or no answer. Why then all the mindless drivel

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 25, 2009 9:31 AM   in reply to LRK 2

    For you, Dear, not a problem. Have a Happy Thanksgiving...

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 25, 2009 12:18 PM   in reply to Dirk Williams

    Dirk Williams wrote:

     

     

    YES!

     

    That was easy. All Linda asked for was a simple yes or no answer. Why then all the mindless drivel

    LOL @ Dirk for thinking posting 'yes' or 'no' is a simple answer. Linda might as well have asked if we like cute little kittens. She'd get more 'yes' votes.

     

    As of right now, this thread has had 328                 views and 27 posts. That means there were 321 views from people that think Linda's idea is absurd enough that they can't throw their support behind it.

     

    Look at what this forum has become with trivial, impotent threads like this. There's barely any discussion about using GoLive. It is all mindless drivel now.

     

    Happy Thanksgiving everyone. Be thankful for what you've got. We've still got GoLive. Why all the ranting from Linda about its demise?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 25, 2009 1:01 PM   in reply to LRK 2

    Yeah, I'm thinking the reason no one is participating in this thread is because no one want's to deal with the trouble-maker. Plus the fact that the Adobe forums are dying out due to many reasons… by the way, is that a he or a she?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 27, 2009 9:33 AM   in reply to LRK 2

    A BIG YES!!! I boycotted Dreamweaver for years. It was never designer friendly. It was the choice application for all the programmers I worked with. Not the designers.These programmers were all about the bells and whistles and couldn't care less about the look or usability of a site. But they loved that they could do all their coding. That is great for a programmer. I want it to be easy.  I can always hire a programmer to do all the dynamic stuff.

     

    I am an Adobe Baby... I started with Illustrator 88. There is a certain logic and design flow that you expect from all Adobe products and you always get. Dreamweaver never had that and still doesn't. It is very "programmer" almost Microsoft-like.

     

    When Adobe bought Macromedia, I thought they would take the best of the two softwares and merge them. Not just drop Golive altogether. I was shocked that they didn't. Even though I have Dreamweaver, I am still using Golive to manage my sites. I need the little bug to identify broken links. And when I double click on a folder, I want to go inside that folder, not just open in a hierarchy.

     

    Heck, I am still keeping ImageReady also to break apart my sites. I had a great flow going for years: Photoshop to ImageReady. ImageReady to Golive. It was a dream come true. Then we got to a screeching halt! Bumps on the road all the way. I know that I must evolve and adapt. But I want it to continue being easy. Dreamweaver is just not as friendly.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 30, 2009 6:08 AM   in reply to pachi1

    pachi1 wrote:

     

    Heck, I am still keeping ImageReady also to break apart my sites. I had a great flow going for years: Photoshop to ImageReady. ImageReady to Golive. It was a dream come true. Then we got to a screeching halt! Bumps on the road all the way. I know that I must evolve and adapt. But I want it to continue being easy. Dreamweaver is just not as friendly.

    Have you tried Fireworks to build a design?

     

    DW is not the complete replacement for GL.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 30, 2009 8:16 AM   in reply to Marian Driscoll

    Marian, referring to the thought mentioned above, do you have any idea why Adobe chose not to take the best  - and most useful features - of GL and DW and consolidate those into one app? It would seem a wise decision to do so, but obviously there is more to it since that course of action was not pursued.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 30, 2009 9:00 AM   in reply to LUH3417

    Have you noticed the features that have already been blended? How do you know it is not being pursued?

     

    The applications we use today are based on code that can be 10 years old. Writing a new program or tweaking an existing program is not something that is done instantly.

     

    You also have to look at the existing customer base. Dreamweaver designers and developers significantly outnumber GoLive designers and developers. Which audience do you think Adobe is more concerned about disrupting with major application changes?

     

    Adobe is wrestling with an unusual mix of apps since the acquisition of Macromedia. The Adobe web designer did graphics in Photoshop (ImageReady) and web page layout and content in GoLive. The Macromedia web designer did graphics and page layout in Fireworks and then fine tuned it and added content in Dreamweaver.There's an overlap that Adobe must now work out.

     

    Adobe has killed ImageReady and GoLive. Is Fireworks the new ImageReady and/or GoLive? Or will Fireworks go away as well?

     

    We can't assume the dust has settled. Adobe must still be working on this.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 30, 2009 9:18 AM   in reply to Marian Driscoll

    I do work with Dreamweaver every day. It is not my choice but a necesity. I just don't like it. But, like I have done for the last 20 years, I will move on and adapt. However, I would like to see more user-friendly features geared towards people who are more visually oriented. I still miss my little bug... why couldn't they just add the little bug back? When I click on a folder, I want to go inside that folder. I also want DW to add http:// to my URLs automatically and the Maitlto. That just saved me time, Those are the little things that I still keep Golive for. CSS was also easier. I liked having the check boxes. It was easier to work with.It is just those little detais that make me keep Golive as a backup app.

     

    I really don't expect Adobe to do anything at all. This is just a wish list. I know that most people are using DW. That is why Golive was killed.

     

    I will have to upgrade to CS4 soon and I will have Fireworks and DW together and will grin and bear it. That is the process of evolution. I don't have to be happy about it though.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 1, 2009 10:36 AM   in reply to Marian Driscoll

    I apologize Marian. I misspoke in my comment. Indeed, I do not know with any certainty that Adobe is not pursuing a best of both worlds app. Your answer did verify what I suspected. Indeed, it is not something that does - or could - happen instantly. It would be a very labor intensive effort. I also apologize as it appears I have assumed you have knowledgeable access to what Adobe has in the works.

     

    I would like to follow up on one of your points. If the change in the app was truly beneficial and intuitive would there be much of a disruption for the users? I am assuming a thoughtful integration of features making the changes near invisible to the user  - a "wow it can do this now automatically/easily compared to the old version!" kind of reaction. Again, I'm sure there is more to it than I am aware. Thank you for your previous response. I do appreciate it.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 1, 2009 11:57 AM   in reply to LUH3417

    Believe it or not, I was a bit trim with my previous notes. There's a bit more to it than a sudden 'disruption' by adding GL features to DW. Imagine if Adobe added all the bells and whistles of GL to DW in DW CS5. How would they sell CS6 if CS5 was so spectacular?

     

    Developers often trickle out new features over several subsequent releases to ensure that the customers keep coming back for upgrades.  It is a carrot hanging on a stick.

     

    Development roadmaps often define a period over several years.  A developer might push out a feature earlier if they see a competitor working on something similar. We have a special situation as Adobe became a competitor with itself when it acquired Macromedia. Without real competition from GoLive anymore, Adobe can (unfortunately for us) take as long as they want in adding GL features to DW.

     

    That's why a thread like this may do well to discuss the alternatives out there instead of wishing for impossibilities. There are quite a few WYSIWYG web editors out there now.

     
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