Jun 1, 2010 10:57 PM
Photoshop CS5 jpegs being resampled on import to another program?
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I just installed Photoshop CS5 yesterday. If I save an image as a jpeg at, say, 300 dpi, when I import it into CorelDraw the image is being resampled to 72 dpi, so instead of, say, the correct 5x7" image @ 300dpi importing I get a 20x30" image @ 72dpi.
I've being using Photoshop CS3 for a couple of years 9and CS2 and CS before that) and jpegs imported into CorelDraw always retain their correct dpi/size. Why is CS5 causing this to happen?
I have tested with exactly the same image in both CS3 and CS5 and the new program is the only one causing the problem.
Images saved in CS5 as a PSD file retain the correct dpi/size on import to Corel - the issue is only with jpegs.
As I produce a lot of images that go into Corel for print work, CS5 is currently unuseable for me.
Any suggestions?
Thanks, Dave
The issue has to do with one of the programs not reading the exif data on import. As long as the width and height in pixels does not change then nothing happened to your file. It should be fairly easy to see if CS5 is saving the jpg with the correct exif data, as you can look at the data in bridge or reload the image into photoshop. If you can see the correct exif data, then Corel has a bug.
Thanks Silk. At this stage I am assuming it's a Corel import problem. Looking at the files in Bridge, they do have the correct pixel dimensions/dpi etc. I can also import the images into Illustrator CS3 no problem, so it looks like a Corel issue.
I have the same problem. I always create images in photoshop to place into powerpoint. This works fine with CS2, CS3, CS4 but with CS5 it seems to not know the image size when it is a jpg. I still have jpg saved from CS4 that work fine. Very annoying. Also when I try to extract images from powerpoint into photoshop this has also stopped working well.
James, while I'm sorry you're having problems too, I'm glad as at least now I know I'm not the only one with this issue.
It does seem like it might only be an issue importing the images into certain non-Adobe programs. If I create and save a 300dpi jpeg in PS CS5 and bring it into CorelDraw it imports at 72dpi and physically huge. However, I can place the same image in Illustrator CS3 and it imports at the correct physical dimension/resolution - and the same with Word 2007.
That would make the problem appear to be with CorelDraw - yet I can import jpegs created in PS CS3 or earlier no problem at all, which would suggest CorelDraw is NOT at fault. Very frustrating!
Dave
It's a problem with CorelDraw - they're reading just the JFIF resolution and ignoring the EXIF and XMP resolutions.
But the JFIF resolution tag is obsoleted by the EXIF specification, and not written by Photoshop CS5 to make Photoshop JPEG files compliant with EXIF specifications.
I think it's a CS5 thing. I still have jpgs saved from CS4 of the same file and they work SS into Powerpoint regardless of DPI. CS5 jpg output makes powerpoint ignores the size (2004 or 2008). The real bug is when you try to copy it from PPT back to photoshop. The image gets cut and the actual res going through the roof (about 4.5 times!). J
Sorry, just read your post. I'm sure you know what your saying. If that's true what's the work around?
(It's a problem with CorelDraw - they're reading just the JFIF resolution and ignoring the EXIF and XMP resolutions.
But the JFIF resolution tag is obsoleted by the EXIF specification, and not written by Photoshop CS5 to make Photoshop JPEG files compliant with EXIF specifications)
Hi Chris
Does that mean that Photoshop CS5 is saving jpegs differently to earlier versions then (I have no experience with CS4)? Did CS3 and earlier not save EXIF and XMP resolutions with the file, only JFIF? As I said in my initial post, jpegs saved in CS3 import perfectly into CorelDraw at correct resolution/physical size.
I have just done another test. I opened the exact same psd file in both PS CS3 and CS5, resized and saved as a 300dpi jpeg. In Bridge, the metadata for the two files (File Properties, Exif etc) is identical (apart from filename and time of course). Yet the CS3-created version imports into Draw correctly (at 300dpi, 5x7cm), while the CS5-created version imports at 72dpi and 20x29cm.
If it's a case of CorelDraw not reading the file correctly, I want to be able to post that on the Draw newsgroup so hopefully their tech guys will see it and address the issue in a service pack. The issue affects all versions of CorelDraw I have installed (V12, X3, X4 and X5).
It seems really strange that with seemingly identical file properties for the 2 images, one will import OK and the other not.
Dave
Does that mean that Photoshop CS5 is saving jpegs differently to earlier versions then (I have no experience with CS4)?
Yes. Photoshop dropped one piece of data from the old JFIF standard to be compliant with the newer EXIF standard.
Older versions of Photoshop saved EXIF, XMP and JFIF. But some software may not have been up on their standards and been reading only the JFIF data.
Yes, this sounds like CorelDraw is not reading the JPEG metadata correctly.
OK, thanks for that explanation Chris. I'll post that info on the CorelDraw forum and hopefully it will get picked up by Corel's techs for future action.
I'm using a program that creates virtual reality and it's fairly current and I'm having same problems as described: CS5 is definitely leaving something off of the JPG files when they are being saved. JPG files saved in CS4 and CS3 work fine with the app otherwise. Tested and retested -- took me a while and drove me nuts, but now I'm sure.
Wonder how many other programs are going to wind up in the heading of "Photoshop CS5 is not saving JPG files the way it used to." I'm guessing it's more than just 2 programs.
What was the net gain and benefit for leaving this additional amount of coding out of the program?
If the answer is "It's an old standard," then my next question is "So what?"
If you wound up on this thread and are having the same problem as generally described, please take a moment to report the name of the program that's having an issue with Photoshop CS5's "saving to jpg" problem.
Other than this issue, and so far (knock on wood), this new version of CS5 64 bit is very definitely an excellent upgrade. Highly recommended. Hat's off to Adobe. Thanks.
P.S. Please fix the bug.
Leaving out the obsolete metadata means that Photoshop JPEGs are now EXIF compliant and work with more devices and applications than they used to.
Nothing to fix in Photoshop - but your other app has a problem reading metadata that needs to be fixed.
I'll presume a "non-compliance" selection is out of the question at that rate ![]()
Nuts.
Just to follow up, the issue with my application was related to Photoshop CS5 having dropped JFIF metadata when saving JPG files. The developers for the tools I use are updating their software accordingly so they can be in compliance and don't get busted by the EXIF enforcers ![]()
Glad they could get it fixed quickly.
Sorry, but this is ridiculous. I do vehicle wrap artwork and then import the images into FlexiSign for layout and then print them on Shiraz RIP. Both of these programs won't import the JPEGs 'correctly' You're saying I should sit around and wait for these companies to release a patch for this? Get real, I have a business to run and work to do now. CS5 is being unistalled and sent back.
You're saving to JPEG as an intermediate step for your workflow? You realize that incurs some visual defects, as JPEG compression is lossy, right?
Isn't there another format you could choose that would do the job and both avoid the JPEG compression and give you the proper sizing? And is there no dialog in FlexiSign or the other software to allow you to control the import size? If not, it sounds like pretty brain-damaged software, frankly...
Adherence to standards is important, or we end up with a hodgepodge of stuff that just doesn't work in any fashion. Far too many developers create software that just barely works, basing its decisions on some info that they just found laying around. With the Internet available today there's simply no excuse for that. Blame Photoshop if you want, but no one but you chose to buy new professional software that's keeping up with standards while trying to continue to use other software that's based on smoke and mirrors.
-Noel
Edit: Wow, I looked up FlexiSign. You're saying you paid thousands of dollars for this software, and you aren't willing to even ask them whether they have a patch to fix their software to be compliant?
Photoshop CS5 with the 12.0.1 patch seems to fix the problem for me with powerpoint 2008. So something has changed.
Unfortunately, the bug is in your FlexiSign and Shiraz software, not in Photoshop.
Yes, you need to contact FlexiSign and Shiraz and see if they have an update, or if they still need to fix their JPEG import code. (maybe nobody has told them about the problem yet)
I've just downloaded a trial version of CS5. I'm saving JPEGS and other people can't open them.. When i check the file info it comes out as Adobe Photoshop Jpeg Image. I've tried alsorts and it seems that no matter what i try it still has the same effect...i can sort the image, but not everyone can open it...MARE!
So, why did you add your problem to this unrelated topic? The only thing in common is "JPEG"...
WHAT other programs can open them?
Did you check the image size and mode?
How are you sending the files to the other users, could the files be corrupted by an email program?
You haven't told us what troubleshooting you have done, or enough details for anyone to guess what might be wrong.
Hi,
I have a similar issue with CS5 and PTC Arbortext. I have successfully changed the density of JPEGs with CS and CS2. However, this is not the case with CS5. The denisty settings are not recognized correctly anymore. As per the reply from PTC:
"The ‘CS5 file has its “density units” field set to 0, which indicates the file has no resolution specified. The X_density and Y_density fields are both set to 1, which we wouldn’t be able to do anything with in any event. This file has no resolution. Our practice in Arbortext Editor is to use the default screen dpi in the case of a raster image with no resolution. That’s typically 96 dpi. The effect is to display the file one-to-one – one image pixel maps to one screen pixel, which is what browsers typically do with all raster images (they ignore resolution entirely)."
Could you advise on a possible workaround or help finding a patch that would correct the metadata?
Kind regards,
Bogodar
Bogodar, you might want to read the thread above more carefully... Adobe has said they have purposefully dropped creation of some obsolete JFIF information. The Density Units field is JFIF data.
See post #9 above, specifically.
-Noel
What you've told us is that PTC ArborText has out of date JPEG parsing code, and doesn't seem to know the details of JPEG metadata.
Yes, this is their bug, and needs to be fixed in the ArborText code.
Thank you for your prompt answers.
I use the latest version of Corel Draw and Photoshop CS5. Like others, I was disappointed to find that Adobe chose to abandon the previous JFIF standard and replace it with EXIF. The EXIF is not supported by any standards organization while the JFIF is. (JPEG, Joint Photographic Experts Group)
For info on EXIF visit: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exchangeable_image_file_format
Perhaps the motivation was to create problems with any non Adobe products. The EXIF format may well be adopted by others in the future but the JFIF is still being used by many software products. It seems that Adobe could have taken the high road and provided a choice during the save mode until it is more universally accepted.
That said, fixing the photo in Corel is simple to do. Click on the bitmap menu, choose resample, check maintain original size, and enter your original resolution. Your photo will now be as you designed it in CS5. An extra step, but life seems to be filled with extra steps lately.
Another fix is to start saving photos as a TIF, no problem with these.
The EXIF is not supported by any standards organization while the JFIF is.
That is incorrect, most organizations have moved to the EXIF standard.
And most applications have moved to the EXIF standard.
JFIF standards JPEG files were rapidly becoming a problem to many workflows (cameras, printers, other software, etc.) - far more so than using EXIF standard files are currently a problem for out of date software (such as you are seeing).
My statement was “EXIF is not supported by any standards organization” and I believe that is true. Many organizations such as camera and cell phone manufacturers do use this format but without an international standards organization to maintain the specifications and control revisions, all are free to modify to suite their purpose.
A case in point, geotagging is a very controversial subject at the present. Many phone and camera manufacturers include the location that the photo was taken in the metadata thus compromising the privacy of the subject. Predators then know the location of celebrities, children and people advertising expensive items. Geotagging is only supported by EXIF, JFIF does not. Several manufactures are already making modifications and the social websites, e-bay, Craig’s list and others are looking into striping the data from the photo.
My point is, EXIF already has a lot of problems and detractors, why tie yourself to one JPEG standard. Let the user decide which to use. Adobe has used the JIFI for years so the software already exists, just include it with the “Save as” options. Seems like a simple and logical solution to me.
EXIF is not supported by any standards organization” and I believe that is true.
Nope, that is quite incorrect. If anything, it is supported by more standards bodies than JFIF was.
See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exchangeable_image_file_format
And JEITA/JEIDA does actually maintain the DCF/EXIF standard (I know, because they keep trying to add things they shouldn't, and I get calls from people asking questions). I'm not sure why someone claims that it is not maintained on the wikipedia page.
Many other standards reference the EXIF and DCF standards.
And JFIF has been abandoned for a long time.
Sorry, JFIF is gone, and software makers have had many years to add EXIF support.
We resisted the move for a while because other software wasn't ready, but we had to make the change at some point.
And so far fewer than 20 software packages have had problems reading EXIF standard JPEG files (which is dwarfed by the number that can't read JFIF).
I'm wondering why the EXIF specification is not maintained by any industry or standards organisation, but at the same time it remains in almost universal use by camera manufacturers.
I use the latest version of Corel Draw and Photoshop CS5. Like others, I was disappointed to find that Adobe chose to abandon the previous JFIF standard and replace it with EXIF. The EXIF is not supported by any standards organization while the JFIF is. (JPEG, Joint Photographic Experts Group)
For info on EXIF visit: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exchangeable_image_file_format
Perhaps
the motivation was to create problems with any non Adobe products. The
EXIF format may well be adopted by others in the future but the JFIF is
still being used by many software products. It seems that Adobe could
have taken the high road and provided a choice during the save mode
until it is more universally accepted.That said, fixing the photo in Corel is simple to do. Click on the bitmap menu, choose resample, check maintain original size,
and enter your original resolution. Your photo will now be as you
designed it in CS5. An extra step, but life seems to be filled with
extra steps lately.Another fix is to start saving photos as a TIF, no problem with these.
I understand the reasoning why Adobe has changed the jpeg standard to be compliant but to assume that it is the fault of other programs for the image not working is wrong. there should be an option to save out as a legacy jpg in CS5. To expect the thousands of programs out there to meet the new standard when many of them may have not even know of the standard is poor judgement on adobes part. Plus to expect users of their software to go to the developers of the software they use and tell them that they need to develop a patch in order for them to continue to use that software is unacceptable.
It is much easier to go back to an older version of adobe and have things work correctly now then to beg, plead and if necessary fight the develpers of their program in order to get a product that will work with adobes output weeks from when it is necessary.
I tend to agree... Something that affects compatibility with other (legacy) applications probably deserves a "[ ] Generate Compatible JFIF Metadata" setting, for one version of Photoshop at least. Have it set to "off" by default upon Photoshop installation, so people (including the developers of those other programs) will realize where the problems with the other programs are and start the process of getting them updated as well. This would give the end users a workaround when they really need it. Not everyone really wants to (or can) buy new Adobe software across the board.
The key issue here is that most end users (and who knows how many application developers) never realized that the JFIF stuff was iffy and have just assumed their JPEGs were up to good standards all along (hey, if Photoshop puts it out, it must be good, right?). So while knowledgeable people at Adobe behind the scenes have been feeling like they've bent over backwards to maintain compatibility with old apps for long enough, it's all a surprise to users and possibly other application developers all in this one new version.
I do respect Adobe for adhering to standards and their committment to move their implementations into the future.
-Noel
Two quick thoughts.
1) Adobe prides itself on being THE image people. And rightly so. But on this issue --- and several others along the way --- they have fallen into the trap of believing they are the arbiters of what shall be. Pope, Adobe isn't.
2) Get a copy of IRFANVIEW for free on the internet. Irfan has a simple mission and he has been brilliant in implementing a policy of taking whatever is there and allowing the user to see it and convert it into a range of outputs. If you take a jpg, put a different extension on it, and feed it to any Adobe product, it will be rejected. IRFANVIEW will come back and say this extension is squirrely but would you mind if it is renamed "jpg?" For me using IRFANVIEW as the image prep for Adobe has become just a piece of the work flow.
3) $600 or free?
Um, we're just reacting to the industry. We even made the change to EXIF standard a bit late... (after resisting requests for several years)
A few years ago when Bridge was just under development I suggested that it would do the whole computer-based imagery community a great service by making Bridge the Swiss Army knife of the industry. Feed it any vector or raster and it would display it or give the user some tools to help it display it. Maybe someday, Chris. But, really, wouldn't that be a fun project to work on?
Now, I think Adobe could still fill that niche. Hire Irfan.
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