> If Adobe were to take all the great help docs that are online and package those on the installation DVD's...

 

That would mean that the material would have to be written, edited, translated, and produced in time for the DVDs to be sent off for mastering, duplication, and testing. This would mean that the writing would have to stop _months_ before the software shipped.

As it is, we can write and research for much longer, which means that the information is _vastly_ better.

Trust me. I did it the old way, and I've done it the new way. The result from the old way was crap. And not just when I've been working for Adobe. It was true for all documentation groups in every software company I've worked for. (And I've worked for the big ones.)

If you want documents for offline use, you can grab them whenever you like. (I've provided all of the download links here.) The bonus is that you can grab a fresh, up-to-date document. I made literally hundreds of changes to correct errors and add links to additional information in the Premiere Pro document in July, three months after Premiere Pro CS5 shipped. If you were relying on a document that was on your installation DVD, you'd be relying on a lot of bad information.

All we, all of us, can do here is try and make the forum as useful and civilized as possible.

Amen.

> Now, how the hell do we get the internal Help system of each program to use THOSE instead of going to the web?  The way it used to work (and still should, in my opinion).

 

Please tell the folks on this forum what you want:

http://forums.adobe.com/community/creativesuites/communityhelp

The people who create the content are not the people who control how it is accessed and displayed. I am in the former category; the folks on the forum that I linked to are in the latter.

I wanted to address the subject of condescension separately, as it can be a complex one.

There are several different fora in the Premiere group. While there is no given, it can generally be assumed that if one is posting to the PrE forum, they are less experienced, than say a poster to the PrPro forum. That is not always the case, but is a generalization, painted with a rather broad brush. It follows, that a poster to the PrE forum might also not be as experienced with their computer, as one using PrPro might be. It then follows that a user of PrE might also not have as powerful computer, as a PrPro user. Again, this is not always the case, but is where I begin to approach the problem.

I will spend a bit more time explaining things, and likely do more screen-caps, pointing to the exact setting, or button, on the premise that the PrE user might be newer to NLE work, and perhaps computers. When I move over to the PrPro forum, I usually will use just the terms, and not offer to hold the poster's hand quite so much, at least not initially.

It is very possible that a power-user with PrE will feel that I am talking down to them. A very few have pointed that out. In the PrPro forum, I've had several posters, who tell me I am assuming more about their level of expertise, than I should. No problem, as I can then go into greater detail, and offer more instruction on where to find things.

Also, forum subscribers have different styles. I am more of a William Faulkner, and will go into more details, even trying to cover all aspects of a concept, though the poster is focused in on just one. I want them to know what will happen, when they stray that well-defined path, as is likely to happen. Others are more like Ernest Hemingway, and go right to the exact answer. Ann Bens has this style. She is seldom wrong, extremely knowledgeable and versed in many wide-ranging aspects of NLE work. However, she is a person of few words, so will almost always be directly focused on the precise answer to the question, and seldom goes into much detail. Again, if I see that she has responded, I feel certain that the OP has gotten the answer to their exact question. Only comment that I may make will be a little "fleshing out" of the process, and some details on what might be encountered elsewhere. I believe that we both help posters, but just in slightly different ways.

Some regulars, like Harm Millaard, are a bit of each of us. In general, Harm is more like Ann, in that his replies are usually precise, using few words. However, if you ask him a question about the ultimate I/O configuration, be prepared for a complete book on magnetic storage. Again, he is seldom wrong, and I feel that the OP has probably gotten the precise answer sought. Now, some posters might find that Ann and Harm appear to be a bit terse. However, that same poster might feel that I have told them how to build a clock, when they only asked "what time is it?"

We see similar with the posters themselves. Some will state, "I have a problem with playback. What's wrong?" Not much to go on there, so we usually get into a session of 40 Questions. That is why I did an ARTICLE on how to ask a question, and what info would be so very useful to start. Others will come with all the necessary info, and will usually get a prompt answer for their specific issue, 'cause they did their homework.

Some feel that by posting the link to my article, I am being condescending, when all I am attempting to do is get the necessary info quickly, so we can focus on the problem and the most likely causes.

Most of us also use a rather linear process, when remotely troubleshooting a problem. We start with a rather broad palette of "likely suspects," and then systematically eliminate those. I had one poster, who stepped through that list of possible causes, and when we finally nailed the issue, asked, "why didn't you just give me that answer to begin with?" Well, that "answer" was not even on the first three pages of "likely suspects." It was a rather odd solution, and until the most likely causes were ruled out, was not revealed. I one is experiencing a BSOD, my first thoughts will always be:

1.) heat

2.) bad RAM

3.) PSU

4.) MoBo

If we rule those out, then, we can work towards major software incompatibilities, starting with drivers. Some posters do not appreciate that linear thinking. They liken us to a mechanic, who asks about the tires, when the client says "my car will not start." It is not so cut and dried, and what many do not realize is that with a computer, so very much is interrelated. They cannot imagine that a bad audio driver can shut down an NLE program, especially if they have not yet imported any Assets with Audio, into the Project. They also seldom realize how intensely a program, like PrPro, must interface with either the audio, or video driver. They point out that WMP works, so why not PrPro. Same with Assets. If VLC Player plays that file, why will PrPro not playback, when that file is on the Timeline. Well, editing is very different from playing, and VLC Player contains its own CODEC's and playback engine, and only relies on the audio and video driver at a very low level. Many can never be convinced that editing is different from playing, and feel that we are spreading BS. As few of us are farmers, we try to NOT do that.

Responding to a post in a product forum is not as easy as it looks.

Hunt

I should have just saved my two cents for a premiere lounge topic on a lighter note I guess... like the one about toilet snakes!

David,

Never! (Not the snakes though.) We can all benefit from critiques of the general forum responses. Often, there are things that we do not consider. I encountered a bit of that, when I started following the PrE forum - a different demographic there, and people, who needs from the forum. That opened my eyes greatly, and I think that I benefited in my interaction in other fora, as well.

It also seems that more posters to the PrPro forum are coming from a more "consumer-oriented" background, than we say some years back. Having spent time in PrE, it's helped me approach those problems and the poster, from a different frame of reference. I hope that has helped them.

The Lounge is a good place for your topic and I think that it is a good one, and one worth discussing. Thanks for posting it.

Now, back to snakes in a toilet...

Hunt