I am using Illustrator CS5 and need to design a logo for print. However, I was wondering if someone could please shed some light on whether or not I am allowed to use one of the Adobe fonts that came with my application for commercial use such as a logo? Also, what is the difference between the Adobe fonts you can purchase here on this web site versus the fonts that come installed with AI CS5? Would I necessarily have to purchase a license on Adobe.com to use a specific font for a logo?
Any assistance is greatly appreciated.
You certainly may use any of the fonts bundled with Adobe applications for a logo or similar static content. You may also embed the font in the resultant PDF file or EPS file that you create for the logo for placement in other content. What you cannot do is give out the font file itself to others. By having the font embedded in the PDF or EPS (PDF is the preferred format, by the way), you avoid any such problems or limitations. Note that this is true for Adobe fonts, but not necessarily fonts from other vendors.
our company wants to use either "myriad pro condensed" or "myriad condensed web" in a windows-application they sell. what kind of licensing do we need? any directions? the endusers would not be able to "see" (use) the font outside the application btw, as it will be "hidden" (packaged) within the app — the font would so to speak be "embedded" in the app
any assistance is greatly appreciated, thanx
The use you're describing would require a special license which allows application font embedding. You can write to us at firstname.lastname@example.org for more information about that.
I have a similar question regarding the commercial license of some fonts contained in my cloud softwares. I'm on a project right now where I'm to create a logotype, among other things. I'd like to use Gill Sans, Futura or Eurostile, but I'm unsure whether or not the license allows this.
Also, for the future, is there perhaps a directory or any other type of resource where it's easy to see what fonts may be used for commercial purposes?
Thankful for help!
Does this mean that I can use eg. Adobe Song Std L font for a logo design, and embed it to the file, given to the customer? Or does the customer have to buy the license? The mentioned font is on the Preview & Print list.
Thanks in advance for your help!
You may embed such a font in a PDF (or an EPS) file created from the logo such that the logo will render properly with high quality when either directly printed or viewed or more likely, placed in another document that supports placement of a PDF (or an EPS) file such as InDesign, Illustrator, QuarkXPress, etc. You cannot send a loose font file along with a .AI file that references it unless the recipient also is licensed for the font in question.
Dov, or whomever ... as I understand it Adobe and Microsoft have worked together to develop (open type) fonts and so I have been searching for a way to purchase fonts found in Microsoft Word in order to be able to install them into Photoshop, Illustrator and InDesign, etc.
Do you know if such a package exist? I've searched and searched via Google to no avail.
I have come across many clients that start designing their logos in (the ubiquitous) Microsoft Word and then want me to improve upon their homemade logos but none of my Adobe products contain the Microsoft fonts they choose. This, of course, creates a problem for those clients that do not wish to supplement their font for a rather similar one.
I'm also wondering if it's possible (considering the Microsoft/Adobe (font) relationship), to make available to Ps., Illy, etc. the fonts from the M.Word already on my laptop ... ?? That would be so awesome But probably too simple to be so, huh?
Thank you in advance for your time and efforts to help me.
To start with, just one bit of technical nitpicking. You typically don't actually purschase any fonts themselves, but rather, you purchase licenses to use such fonts.
I've read you posting a few times and am somewhat confused by your question. Regardless of whether your “laptop” is running Windows or MacOS, every font that is installed on your system, whether one of the fonts that is bundled with the operating system or installed by one or another software package (such as Microsoft Office) should be visible and available for use in any Adobe application including InDesign, Photoshop, Illustrator, Fireworks, FrameMaker, etc. without any additional action on your part. Such fonts (including all the styles associated with same such as regular, bold, italic, and bold italic) should appear in the font lists that you see in the Adobe applications and available for you to format text with in those applications. I personally do this on a regular basis. If you are not seeing those fonts in the font lists for the Adobe applications, something must be very wrong with your system's configuration. Are you using some third party font manager? If so, that may be the source of the problem. Please advise.
I have been searching for a way to purchase fonts found in Microsoft Word in order to be able to install them into Photoshop, Illustrator and InDesign, etc.
You can license Microsoft fonts via Ascender http://www.ascenderfonts.com/foundry/microsoft/
I am sorry for the confusion. I am very new to all of this and had not touched a computer for over 10 yrs, save for an email account, so I have a very long road of learning ahead.
I will now take a moment to recover from .... being .... totally ... and completely embarassed!!
I did not realize it until your post ... that yes, indeed'ie the fonts in Microsoft Word are available to me in Ps etc.
What stumped me is that last I knew my client also had Windows 7 and so his M.Word had the same fonts but he recently upgraded to 10 and so his font list no longer matches mine. Good thing I am going to upgrade myself this week.
(still feeling )
Well, that was fun. lol ... I swear, I'm not usually like a 5watt bulb
Thank you so much for your time!!
Where can I find that acknowledgement? I need to prove that I am permitted to use those fonts for commercial use.
I am using those as parts of my book templets and design.
And there are already many fonts form other vendors added in my mac, how can i know that it's bundled with Adobe products?
For Adobe fonts, you can look at the EULA (End User License Agreement) posted on Adobe's website. It has no restrictions against such commercial use. For Adobe EULAs, see <http://www.adobe.com/products/eulas/> and select the appropriate font product(s).
The list of fonts bundled with CS6 is provided at <http://www.adobe.com/type/browser/fontinstall/cs6installedfonts.html>. For CS5 and CS5.5, see <http://www.adobe.com/type/browser/fontinstall/cs5installedfonts.html>. For CS4, see <http://www.adobe.com/type/browser/fontinstall/cs4installedfonts.html>.
Is it permissible to keep using fonts licensed through our installations through the previous installs of the CS software? And no matter what platform? For example:
I've been upgrading through the years on my PC from CS through CS5. I just bought a MacBook Pro and joined Creative Cloud. Can I copy some of my fonts that were installed with my CS5 (or 4, 3, 2 for that matter) PC version over to my Mac to use with CS6?
I've called, emailed and posted in the type forum but still can't get a straight answer so I'm asking here. Can I embed an Adobe font (ITC Avant Garde Gothic) in a HTML Adobe AIR desktop application? This application does not allow the user to download or manipulate the font in anyway. Essentially it falls under the Preview portion of the license.
Thanks for any help you can give on this matter.
Sorry, not Dov, but I think I can help, because I've asked Adobe the same question before, just not in this forum.
See response #2 in this post: http://forums.adobe.com/message/5133917#5133917
Basically, the EULA allows you various embedding rights for documents, but apps are a different animal, and not covered by the Adobe EULA. They have mentioned that they are working toward having an app license you can purchase in the future, but I don't believe anything is available yet. I know it's restrictive for designers, but system fonts are your friend in these situations, really.
Brad, what do you mean by "HTML Adobe AIR" app? An AIR app is Flash-based, not HTML.
And ITC Avant Garde is owned by Monotype, not Adobe -- although we do sell licenses for it through our Type Library and Font Folio. It's important that you know from whom you licensed it and what the license allows, because another vendor might have a EULA different than Adobe's.
You can build AIR apps in HTML:
Nowhere does it say that ITC Avant Garde Gothic is owned by anyone else. Where did you get your info from?
For your information, Christopher Slye is a long time member of Adobe's Type Development organization and he does know what he is talking about!
ITC, currently owned by Monotype, licensed its styles to a number of different foundries, Adobe being one of them. When you license any ITC font from Adobe, a royalty is paid by Adobe to Monotype. Your use of the font is subject to the EULA (End User License Agreement) from Adobe. However, if you licensed the font from Bitstream, Monotype, ITC, or other vendors, you are subject to a EULA which may be (and probably is) very different from that of Adobe.
I'm not trying to question anyone's knowledge. I'm here to get a solution from staff and colleagues. I'm big on asking questions and I don't want to come off as testing someone.
I understand that Adobe doesn't own the font. I was just making sure I was not missing something that said I had to abide by two separate EULA's. Hence the link. And I was merely posting the AIR link to show the context of how I was going to be embedding the font and that it indeed is built using HTML and not Flash. Just trying to provide all the details I can so I can
The font was purchased from Adobe Systems so naturally I figured Adobe would be able to answer my licensing question, but from what I'm gathering though nobody really knows what to do when it comes to embedding fonts in apps. There's no documentation and I have not been able to get a straight answer from anyone. After a week and a half of digging, calling, emailing and posting all anyone can come up with is this nice big gray area.
This is extremely frustrating as we have invested heavily in Adobe fonts.
This is an example of what I expected from Adobe: http://www.fontspring.com/licenses/fontspring/application
I'm a huge fan and supporter of Adobe but to be honest this whole ordeal has been a big let down. I just expected Adobe to be on top of the licensing since they are so on top of the technology. I'm using not only a font licensed from them but also using Adobe technology to build the app so I figured this would be open and shut in a day or two.
If you're on a Mac, I find the info section in Font Book to be very helpful. The EULA is still needed, but some basic info can be seen here.
Go to Preview menu > Show Font Info.
Although I use FontAgent Pro, I will sometimes put a font into my User > Library > Fonts folder just to see the additional info about it in Font Book. I then remove the font so I don't have issues with it being installed in two places.
Here's a screenshot of what I see with my version of ITC Avant Garde Gothic Std, just as an example:
The EULA is your most important piece of information. Without the EULA that came with your particular fonts, it's really hard to know for sure what you can and cannot do with your fonts and be in legal compliance. There are obviously many places you could have gotten them, such as part of FontFolio, part of a software package, or purchased individually from a variety of foundries. To keep us on our toes, each foundry has their own unique language and terms.
Over the past 16 years, I have purchased fonts from over 150 different foundries, and I actually read the EULAs! I have to for my job, since I purchase and manage the font licenses for over 600 artists in 20 locations across 5 countries. I don't have a copyright law degree (boy, that would come in handy!!), so I find wading through these agreements to be tedious and difficult at times, and I do it everyday, so I can imagine how hard it is for someone who reads one occassionally. The language around embedding is especially tricky, but I'm finding most desktop licenses allow embedding in a document, but they will vary in regard to additional restrictions that might need to be in place. For instance, many EULAs allow PDF embedding as long as the file is secure and set to view and print only. There are many variations on that alone.
It's possible, but would not be common, for a desktop license to cover embedding the fonts into an application. Berthold fonts, for instance, require a special license for iPad use even if the fonts are rasterized! (I just walked one of our clients through this specific type of purchase yesterday). With so much variation, it can be downright overwhelming at times to keep up on what you can and cannot do with each of your fonts.
An important question for kossos007 would be — does the foundry consider what you're creating to be an application or a document. It sounds "to me" like you're creating an application. When I click the link provided above about Adobe AIR, it says "application" over and over again in the text, but the foundry is often who determines this based on the info you give them about your project. With so many ways to embed fonts, I think it scares the foundries a bit as they are also learning along the way about all these new technologies. Their goal is to make sure their product is secure and cannot be extracted, and then pirated.
These types of license questions are never easy, and I'm sorry for making it seem too cut and dry in my response. I definitely made some assumptions about the question, and did not mean to overly simplify it. It's not easy to get at this type of info. I have searched for awhile to find a resource where I could look at a list of foundries and see a summary of their basic usage rights, such as various forms of embedding. I could not find anything, so I'm currently making my own database from the EULAs that have come with my font license purchases. There are 170 of them so far, so it's a huge project, but I think it will be a very valuable resource for me, and hopefully others when I get it done.
Thanks for the detailed response! In no way do I think you over simplified it. To me the question is very simple. I think the licensing for "apps" is just stuck in transition at the moment and the legal stuff hasn't been able to keep up with the technology.
Also, I've only been pursuing this so hard because the project I'm designing is a large one for a large client and they like straight answers. I need to beat this horse till it's dead because I have to be able to explain to the client that we can't use their brand font and here's why. I've had a webfont replacement ready since before I even started this journey. So it looks like we'll be going with plan B.
Thanks everyone for all of the input.
I think Caleb Belohlavek (Adobe Type Product Manager) gave you a clear answer at Licensing Question: Can I embed an Adobe font in a HTML Adobe AIR application?
Did you miss that?
No, I didn't miss it. And his answer was basically "Read the EULA because they vary." Which I have done... several times and the EULA is too vague on app embedding so I was trying to get an answer from someone who could tell me from experience or from the actual vendor the font was purchased from. Tiki supported his statements with his experience and I really appreciate someone who takes the time to go into details.
I've decided to use my web font fallback. I'm a digital designer and I need fonts for web and apps. I don't make PDF's and I don't design print material. Web's not problem because plenty of foundries have web fonts and I use services like Adobe's Typekit (which STILL has no Adobe plugin so we designers can't use the font in our layout but that's a different problem). For that grey area that are app fonts I need a vendor that has solved this problem and Adobe just hasn't yet and for now I'm moving on to another type vendor for my font needs.
Hi - I know Dov's response above was ages ago, but with regard to .eps files, does "embedding" a font such a sMyriad Pro, mentioned above, just mean that you didn't make it into an outline?
Main clarification I'm seeking is whether embedding might mean that (for Adobe fonts) that you don't have to convert to outlines before sending the files off to clients.
Correct. I needed to embed the actual font file into an Adobe Air application so the HTML would be displayed with that typeface. If you create outlines in an eps file you're essentially sending an "image" of the text stuff and you are good to go. Hope that helps.
Cool - thanks for the message. I read through your situation above. I do static graphics and specifically with regard to the logo I just made for a client, I'm just trying to discern whether I should convert the tagline, which is in Myriad Pro, to outlines, or whether I can leave it as live text when I send it.
Is this considered "embedding", and is it better to just convert, in case they don't have the same font on their end and it converts to some other font? These are .eps files.
Sorry for my blind feeling around here - lots to take in regarding proper font handling.
When I'm doing print stuff I just convert all of the fonts to outlines and send the eps that way. If you're sending a PDF you can embed the fonts.
From Adobe's Licensing page:
Preview & Print: A font with an embedding permission of Preview & Print allows the font, either fully or as a subset, to be embedded in an electronic document solely for the purpose of viewing that document on screen and/or printing that document. While a font with a Preview & Print embedding permission (either through data in the font file or the font’s license agreement) may be embedded in an electronic document, the embedded font may not be used to further edit the document it is contained in or to edit or create other documents. Most fonts in the Adobe Type Library are set for Preview & Print embedding.
Great this is helpful. I know Dov has said in the past that creating outlines can degrade the text a bit, which is why I was hoping that for a logo tagline, for optimal quality, the file could be safely (and legally) transferred as an .eps with the tagline remaining in "live" text rather than outlines.
But I need to check that there isn't a further step during the saving of the .eps file to ensure that it's set to "preview and print". I did not change any settings during the save process that I know of.
When converting text to outlines, you lose the hinting applied. That might be what Dov was referring to. It will look a little rougher on screen, but will print fine. The hinting is for improved on-screen viewing, so if this logo is for print, converting to outlines should not effect the print quality.
The hinting is very helpful for text in PDFs, web text, Office docs — anything with text that will be viewed on screen. Hinting is lost when converting text to an image in Photoshop. This would be required to save the logo for use on a website, for instance, since the EPS format is not compatible with the web.
Myriad Pro has fairly flexible embedding rights, as shared above by Kossos007.
In Illustrator CS6 (and probably previous versions), just check the box for "Embed fonts" when saving as an EPS. I think that should cover you, and the client should not need the fonts.
I'm not as familiar with the embedding options in Illustrator, however, as I am with Acrobat, where you have a lot more control over things like subsetting. Subsetting isn't required by Adobe's license, however, so that doesn't matter anyway.
Laurie (aka: Tiki-Monger)
I always forget something!! Photoshop and Illustrator will apply anti-aliasing to text to make it look better on screen, as well, when you convert a logo (or any text) to an image. That's similar to what hinting does, yet different. You can get even better results if when applying anti-aliasing to hinted, non-outlined text. Here's some decent info and images of how these various settings effect your type on Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Font_rasterization
Not my area of expertise, but I thought it might be relevant for you if your client asks for web ready versions of the logo.
Does the same apply for using "default" Adobe supplied brushes Strokes included with Illustrator? As a basic example creating a logo with a square that used the Charcoal - Feather Art Brush stroke applied. Are we ok to use this commercial use as well?
Would we need to include a copyright Adobe reference somewhere in our works if we used the Adobe fonts that came with Illustrator?
As long as the font itself isn't in the game, i.e. the “static picture” is a raster image or vector outlines - in other words, you are generating live text from an embedded or downloaded font dynamically, you are OK.