Adobe Community: automatically splitting a heading between two frames

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automatically splitting a heading between two frames

Feb 14, 2012 4:54 PM

Tags: #framemaker_10 #auto_numbering #text_flow

I'm trying to simplify a template I inherited without changing its appearance. I'm using FrameMaker 10.

The First page layout has three frames: a small box at the top left that contains only the chapter number, to the right of that a rectangle that contains the chapter name, and a box below for the page body. All three are in the A flow and are autoconnected in the specified sequence.

Currently the chapter number and name are two paragraphs that use ChapNum and ChapName tags.

I'd like to combine these into one tag. Is there some way to format a paragraph tag so FrameMaker will put the autonumber in the first box and the title in the second?

1654 Views 23 Replies Latest reply: Arnis Gubins, Feb 17, 2012 10:31 AM

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1. Arnis Gubins,

Feb 14, 2012 7:05 PM in reply to rlauriston

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Make the first box small enough so that only the autonumber fits and use a leading space for the chapter title to ensure that it starts in the next box.

Alternately, you could use a cross-ref from the first box to the chapter title and use the <$paranumonly> building block in the cross ref. In the chapter paragraph autonumber use the "< $chapnum>" building block (note the leading space) to not display the number beside the chapter title.

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2. rlauriston,

Feb 15, 2012 8:49 AM in reply to Arnis Gubins

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A leading space for the chapter title will mess up the formatting and I can't build a cross-reference into a paragraph tag.

Maybe I could use a Running H/F in the first block in the master page.

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3. peter at knowhowpro,

Feb 15, 2012 9:33 AM in reply to rlauriston

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rlauriston wrote:

A leading space for the chapter title will mess up the formatting and I can't build a cross-reference into a paragraph tag.

Maybe I could use a Running H/F in the first block in the master page.
A screenshot would help.

If the chapter number and chapter title are on the same line, consider a single text frame, the width of the body text, for the whole page, with the horizontal distance between the number and the title set by tab stops, and the distance between the chapter number/title line and the body text set by space below the chapter numbertitle.

[EDIT] Following-up on Arnis' suggestion, instead of a leading space between the chunks, consider inserting a non-breaking space after the first word of the title, to force it out of the small text frame. If the title is only one word, use enough non-breaking spaces to force it out. If the title is referred to in a cross-reference, or extracted for a TOC, the trailing spaces may be problematic. [/EDIT]

HTH

Regards,

Peter
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4. Arnis Gubins,

Feb 15, 2012 10:13 AM in reply to rlauriston

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Actually, if you don't use a space or any other positioning in the autonumber component, then you don't need a leading space in the Title (weird FM interaction here), so no formatting gets messed up.

For the x-ref approach, the first paratag would be something like a Body tag and then you x-ref to the next one, i.e the Chapter Title.

Neither of these is something that I would really recommend.

You've suggested the less intensive maintenance way yourself, e.g. use a running h/f variable to get the <$chapnum> in a background frame on the Master Page. If you don't want the Chapter Number to duplicate in the title, but still have it available for cross-refs and generated lists, remember the leading space attribute in the autonum building block for the chapter number, i.e. "< $chapnum>"

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5. rlauriston,

Feb 15, 2012 10:18 AM in reply to peter at knowhowpro

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I'm applying this new template to existing documents, so everything has to be done in the autonumber format or page layout rather than by editing the ChapTitle paragraph text.

The ChapNum box is above the ChapTitle box. I don't see any way to specify vertical space in an autonumber format.

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6. Arnis Gubins,

Feb 15, 2012 11:06 AM in reply to rlauriston

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Where does vertical spacing come into this? Are you trying to create something that looks like this:

If so, then the first suggestion I made does this. You just have to make the first box the critical size (depending upon your typeface and font size) to force the text to start in the next one.

There's also a quirk with using hidden autonumbers in variables, they don't display; whereas, when used in an x-ref, they work. Another FM inconsistnecy.

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7. rlauriston,

Feb 15, 2012 12:27 PM in reply to Arnis Gubins

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Yeah, it looks roughly like that. Given the difference in widths of chapter numbers, there's no one width of a text frame that will work.

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8. Arnis Gubins,

Feb 15, 2012 12:56 PM in reply to rlauriston

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You can always just have the first text box be a background text frame on the Master Page holding just the <$chapnum> variable. Then use the < $chapnum> (with the space) for the autonumber in the chapter title to not display the chapter number again. Or is there something else more complicated in your design?

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9. rlauriston,

Feb 15, 2012 1:28 PM in reply to rlauriston

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I've got this working, though it's a kludge.

One of my goals here is to eliminate the need to break documents up into chapter files, so I can't use <$chapnum>.

For the chapter number, I have a background text frame with a Running H/F variable defined as <$paranumonly[ChapName]>.

The ChapName autonumber format is <n+>, character format Hidden.

The Hidden character format is 1 point, color white.

This works OK but I'd prefer to actually suppress the ChapName autonumber if there's some way to do that.

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10. peter at knowhowpro,

Feb 15, 2012 1:49 PM in reply to Arnis Gubins

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Arnis Gubins wrote:

Where does vertical spacing come into this? Are you trying to create something that looks like this:

If so, then the first suggestion I made does this. You just have to make the first box the critical size (depending upon your typeface and font size) to force the text to start in the next one.

There's also a quirk with using hidden autonumbers in variables, they don't display; whereas, when used in an x-ref, they work. Another FM inconsistnecy.

As proof that nothing on the Internet ever dies, the I'm sure I learned the technique of sinking text from Arnis, back when computers were powered by steam.

[EDIT] I replaced the screenshot because the earlier one lacked the insertion point in the CnumTitl paragraph, hence it lacked the tab stop in the ruler.[/EDIT]

Also, I had a suspicion that FrameMaker's Japanese "rubi" text feature might work, and in Klause Daube's document, I found he'd credited me with a tidbit, back in 2008! If you're curious:

http://www.daube.ch/docu/files/rubi-in-latin-scripts.pdf

I think the sunken text in a single paragraph format in a single text frame is the most direct approach. To recreate the feature in other locations, copy/paste is the most efficient.

HTH

Regards,

Peter
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11. rlauriston,

Feb 15, 2012 2:04 PM in reply to peter at knowhowpro

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I don't understand the bit about "sinking" text, but I'm not editing these files, only importing formats and updating the book using Apply Master Pages.

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12. peter at knowhowpro,

Feb 15, 2012 6:03 PM in reply to rlauriston

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rlauriston wrote:

I don't understand the bit about "sinking" text, but I'm not editing these files, only importing formats and updating the book using Apply Master Pages.
Sorry if I wasn't clear enough. The autonumber of the CnumTitl paragraph is above the line on which the title text rests, something like a superscript (but don't go there,) but it's a single paragraph in a single text frame. I was emulating Arnis' example that uses two text frames to place the text at different heights on the page. The main title text is "sunk" compared to the position of the autonumber; the technique for sinking is described in my earlier post.

If you're trying to combine two paragraph formats into one format, you're doing more than simply importing formats and updating by using Apply Master Pages, IMO.

As I suggested earlier, a screenshot would be helpful, otherwise we're guessing what you're thinking about.

HTH

Regards,

Peter
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13. rlauriston,

Feb 15, 2012 6:27 PM in reply to peter at knowhowpro

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Book A uses a complicated, cruft-ridden, print-oriented template I inherited.

Book B uses a streamlined template I designed for easy export to XHTML or Word.

What I developed today is template C. I import its styles into book B, update with Apply Master Changes enabled, enable side heads, and voilà, book B looks just like book A, but it's still easy to export. I can also revert to the original look by importing template B.

What I was asking about here involved duplicating the chapter title style of template A, which used two text frames and two paragraph tags with a single paragraph tag. The trick was putting the chapter-number counter in a background text frame.

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14. peter at knowhowpro,

Feb 16, 2012 8:39 AM in reply to rlauriston

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rlauriston wrote:

Book A uses a complicated, cruft-ridden, print-oriented template I inherited.

Book B uses a streamlined template I designed for easy export to XHTML or Word.

What I developed today is template C. I import its styles into book B, update with Apply Master Changes enabled, enable side heads, and voilà, book B looks just like book A, but it's still easy to export. I can also revert to the original look by importing template B.

What I was asking about here involved duplicating the chapter title style of template A, which used two text frames and two paragraph tags with a single paragraph tag. The trick was putting the chapter-number counter in a background text frame.
Glad you got what you wanted.

If there's a reason to change the relationship between the background number and the body-page text, may need to work with both body and master pages. The single-frame single-paragraph format method might be less fussy if you need to readjust.

HTH

Regards,

Peter
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15. rlauriston,

Feb 16, 2012 9:19 AM in reply to peter at knowhowpro

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As I said, the single-frame methods didn't work.

I won't be changing anything. I'll be deprecating the old template when we migrate to a wiki (if not sooner), just need to make the docs look the same in the meantime.

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16. peter at knowhowpro,

Feb 16, 2012 11:45 AM in reply to rlauriston

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rlauriston wrote:

As I said, the single-frame methods didn't work.

I won't be changing anything. I'll be deprecating the old template when we migrate to a wiki (if not sooner), just need to make the docs look the same in the meantime.
Well, not seeing a screenshot of successes and failures keeps me guessing.

Regards,

Peter
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17. rlauriston,

Feb 16, 2012 11:55 AM in reply to peter at knowhowpro

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I can't take a screen shot because I didn't do it. As I understood the single frame solutions they involve editing the headings, and all I'm doing is importing styles and updating (i.e. separating content and presentation).

If it were possible to define a baseline offset in a character format I could perhaps do it in the autonumber.

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18. Arnis Gubins,

Feb 16, 2012 12:14 PM in reply to rlauriston

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Actually, you can specify a baseline offset in a character tag (however Adobe in it's infinite wisdom still doesn't see the benefit of providing access to this via the user interface... ). See MIF Reference for FDX & FDY.

See Scott Prentice's ExtraCharFormat utility: http://leximation.com/tools/info/extracharformat.php

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19. rlauriston,

Feb 16, 2012 3:03 PM in reply to Arnis Gubins

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Wow, that's the geekist bit of esoteric FrameMaker lore I've learned in a long time.

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20. peter at knowhowpro,

Feb 16, 2012 3:08 PM in reply to Arnis Gubins

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Arnis Gubins wrote:

Actually, you can specify a baseline offset in a character tag (however Adobe in it's infinite wisdom still doesn't see the benefit of providing access to this via the user interface... ). See MIF Reference for FDX & FDY.

See Scott Prentice's ExtraCharFormat utility: http://leximation.com/tools/info/extracharformat.php
According to Scott's page, this plug-in only through FM 5, 6, 7. 8 is in development. Nothing later.

I guess, like presidential nomination candidates, I didn't disclose something important until it was brought up by someone else. The steps I described in post 10, actually change the baseline offset; I didn't use the term because technically it doesn't exist in FrameMaker, and I didn't think it was clear. Moving a selection up/down with Alt+ArrowKey is commonly used for moving graphic objects, but it happens to work with text selections as well. Selected text can be moved up/down/left/right. An anchored frame in line with text can only move up/down. Autonumbers can't be selected and moved, but they don't move when other paragraph text is moved.

Regards,

Peter
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21. Arnis Gubins,

Feb 16, 2012 4:57 PM in reply to peter at knowhowpro

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Peter,

The plug-in does work with later versions of FM as well. FM10 is a bit cranky with many FDK plug-ins, so it may crash once in a while. Scott's aware of this, but since he's graciously & freely put it out there, it kind of has low priority

Whadda'ya mean "a baseline offset doesn't technically exist in FM"? FM's fonts are laid down on a baseline and the offset is defined as a %em relative to the baseline. There's also the horizontal FDX component for custom kerning.

An Autonumber can have a character style applied that has a custom FDX & FDY, so yes they can be moved (albeit in a non-intuitive way).

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22. peter at knowhowpro,

Feb 17, 2012 7:30 AM in reply to Arnis Gubins

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Arnis Gubins wrote:

Peter,

The plug-in does work with later versions of FM as well. FM10 is a bit cranky with many FDK plug-ins, so it may crash once in a while. Scott's aware of this, but since he's graciously & freely put it out there, it kind of has low priority

Whadda'ya mean "a baseline offset doesn't technically exist in FM"? FM's fonts are laid down on a baseline and the offset is defined as a %em relative to the baseline. There's also the horizontal FDX component for custom kerning.

An Autonumber can have a character style applied that has a custom FDX & FDY, so yes they can be moved (albeit in a non-intuitive way).

Arnis:

Good to know the plug-in works with later releases.

By "doesn't technically exist," I probably should have said "doesn't apparently exist in the UI." My earlier credit to you was about just this ability. I suggested "sinking" selected text with Alt+arrows as a way to achieve the shift in the UI.

I don't see FDX and FDY options in FM 10's character designer; are you referring to creating them in MIF? In the UI, autonumbers cannot be raised or lowered, but raising or lowering paragraph text can achieve the same effect in most situations.

Regards,

Peter
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23. Arnis Gubins,

Feb 17, 2012 10:31 AM in reply to peter at knowhowpro

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Peter,

The FDX and FDY parameters have always existed for all text objects (character tags, paragraphs and line-text - graphics tool). Unfortunately, they are not exposed even in the new & improved UIs of late. Having these available through the UI has been on wishlists for at least 19 years! Scott's plugin adds the FDX and FDY values to the Character Catalog values for a specified tag. They can be seen when the FM file is saved to MIF and also can be imported from MIF. However, if you ever do an Update All on that character tag and select Remove Overrides, FM removes the FDX and FDY entries from the catalog definition for that tag. REALLY DUMB!! [Programmer: The user really didn't want that anyway, so even though they explicitly specified it, lets take it away from them and not let them know...]

Regarding autonumbers, in the UI you can also specify a character tag that will raise or lower the autonumber component without having to adjust the paragraph text. The opposite of what you're saying. My preference is to leave the parent containers (paragraphs) alone and set to the design grids, and tweak other containers (character tags, tables, frames) relative to that.

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