Got a minute? Super! Try this.
Open an image with some detail in the lower right area. Create a duplicate layer. Choose the crop tool. Make sure the option "Delete Cropped Pixels" in NOT checked.
Grab the crop corner in the lower right of your image and move it diagonally inward somewhat. Confirm the crop.
Get the blur tool, make your brush size fairly large and brush the lower right of your image. Allow your brush to go beyond the border of your image.
Okay, when your image is noticeably blurred, switch to the move tool, grab your image and move it up and to the left exposing some of the area you cropped out.
Ta-da! Isn't that pretty? It only happens with the blur tool. Try using the burn or dodge tool and this doesn't happen.
I reported this when I was playing with CS6 beta. You'd think it'd be fixed by now.
Gerry
I don't believe much of what was reported during the beta was fixed in the release version, but hopefully it will be addressed in the 13.01 update (or whatever the update is called).
That is also a problem in some earlier versions of photoshop, but crop with hide wasn't the default as it is in photoshop cs6, so i guess it wasn't as obvious.
I'm pretty sure adobe knows about the problem in cs6.
Same procedure in photoshop cs5 on windows, except one has to choose Hide after drawing out the crop tool:
updated to add screenshot from cs5
Message was edited by: R_Kelly
I am not exactly sure what effect you were after, but if you wanted to restrict the blurring to only the visible part of the cropped image, you can do that very easily by making your Crop; then Selecting All; and then using the Blur tool.
If you then go to Image/Reveal All, you will see that the Blur has not affected the area beyond the marquee.
CameraAnn, you probably didn't try the procedure I described. If you had, you'd have discovered the blur tool completely destroys the pixels beyond the crop. When trying the same thing with the burn and dodge tools one finds the pixels beyond the crop receive the same treatment as those within the crop.
This is a bug, pure and simple. What I was trying to accomplish has no bearing on that fact.
Gerry
I had actually followed your steps exactly — and I saw the problem that I assumed that you were seeing.
After further testing, I discovered that simply activating a Selection around the visible pixels retained all blurring within the selected area and prevented the problem that you had had previously with the damaged pixels in the masked area beyond your Crop.
Try doing it my way and see if that doesn't solve your problem.
I am not so sure that this IS a Bug: it looks more like a User using a tool in a way that perhaps it was never intended to be used?!
gswetsky wrote:
I still contend it's a bug.
I agree. The wrecking of pixels must be considered a bug.
I've compared the behaviour of some tools; only Blur Tool and Sharpen Tool wreck hidden pixels. Other tools are as follows.
Ignore hidden pixels
----------------------------
Background Eraser
Magic Eraser
Art History Brush
Spot Healing Brush
Healing Brush
Color Replacement Brush
Mixer Brush
Smudge
Affect hidden pixels as if visible
------------------------------------------
Eraser
History Brush
Brush
Pencil
Dodge
Burn
Sponge
Gradient
Wreck hidden pixels
---------------------------
Blur
Sharpen
Note some strange inconsistencies: Eraser versus Background Eraser, History Brush versus Art History Brush.
Great list, Conroy - nice work. I wonder if Adobe had such a list before you compiled it.
DEFINITELY a bug! The inconsistency of it makes the use of the "preserve pixels past edge of image" feature practically useless.
And such an obvious bug it makes me wonder...
Given that Adobe has changed the behavior of Crop to make the preservation of cropped pixels more likely, it's hard to believe such a bug could actually get out to the customers.
As with some other issues (the release of the product with a serious text corruption bug), it seems clear to me that there are several management problems in Adobe's software development process:
It really feels like the released code isn't buggy so much as just unfinished. Has Adobe decided to just release whatever they have every now and then, without a focus on getting it done first?
And worse, now that they've released it, Adobe is faced with a new problem: Do they finish the code and make it work right in a 13.0.x update, or do they just leave such problems in the product for another major or minor release (e.g., 13.1 or 14.0)?
Speaking of major or minor releases... Assuming the correction of such problems as are being described in this thread are somehow deemed "feature enhancements" (I wouldn't put it past Adobe management to do this), do the Creative Cloud subscribers get them while people who have bought perpetual licenses do not?
Does anyone here see any good in all this? I'm struggling to see any. I suppose you could say that the folks who don't use Photoshop in such a way that requires these tools to work consistenly get some benefit from the other features they did find a way to finish, and of course there's financial benefit for Adobe, so they can continue development rather than close their doors.
I can't imagine that the Adobe engineers could like doing business this way.
-Noel
Warning - potential thread hijack
"Given that Adobe has changed the behavior of Crop to make the preservation of cropped pixels more likely, it's hard to believe such a bug could actually get out to the customers."
I dunno, over the past few days I've been working with the new crop tool in CS6 @home and just don't see the point of any of the the supposed improvements. Even after reverting to the "old" way in CS6 it still isn't. Why on earth is the darn tool persistent even after initiating a crop selection?. Even an 'escape' doesn't get rid of it (like the old tool). At least with the real old tool you don't have this selection window sticking around until you get so frustrated you select a different tool just to get rid of it. IMO the entire new crop tool is a complete bug, adding nothing to my skill/ability and making a simple step into a very complicated one...
From my own testing, this has nothing to do with the Crop tool, it's purely about the Blur tool and how it reacts to materials that are off canvas. To prove it is not the Crop tool, open an image, duplicate the background layer. Transform it to 200% scale (so that it is now double the canvas size, thus having a great deal of material off canvas), and use the Blur tool near a corner. Move the layer and you will see the same effect, Crop tool never having been used. But I'll report this to the engineering team to get fixed.
No I don't, Brett. I reported them on the forums and a responder said they would report the bug to the engineering team. So far neither this bug nor the other one which causes trouble when you are booting from an SSD and installing all programs to another drive. P'shop insists on putting the cache file on the SSD regardless of the settings. I could go on......
I know this varies from the subject. Perhaps we should go to PM or e-mail.
Gerry
I'm not sure who you worked with before, but I logged the bug with engineering and it is already being investigated, but I haven't been told that this is a duplicate. But it is being worked on now.
Do you happen to have the links to any of the former posts you've made with these bug reports?
I can find none of them. Some were sent in the CS6 Beta forum group and I imagine they were deleted. I was under the mistaken impression that Adobe would consider it important to examine the contents of that group prior to dumping it.
Brett, I'm sorry for the sarcasm, but I am well into my senior citizen years and have been reporting program bugs for years. To put it kindly, I have worked with companies who value their customers' input much more than Adobe seems to. By the way, AT&T is NOT included in the previous statement. ![]()
Gerry -> Retired from Unisys in 2001 - A+ certified
Good to know your issues are getting more attention this time around. I found the post about the long load time and I see you have Chris Cox on the case (he is one of the top Photoshop engineers). I can't find the 4 GB temp file post, but I can tell you this: When you launch Photoshop, it create a temp file called the scratch disk. The size of the scratch disk is exactly equal to the Memory Usage setting (RAM allocation) in Preferences > Performance. If this setting is 4 GB, your scratch disk will be 4 GB.
Brett N wrote:
Good to know your issues are getting more attention this time around. I found the post about the long load time and I see you have Chris Cox on the case (he is one of the top Photoshop engineers). I can't find the 4 GB temp file post, but I can tell you this: When you launch Photoshop, it create a temp file called the scratch disk. The size of the scratch disk is exactly equal to the Memory Usage setting (RAM allocation) in Preferences > Performance. If this setting is 4 GB, your scratch disk will be 4 GB.
Brett, the bug is that you cannot tell Bridge or Photoshop to place the temp file on another drive. My C drive is a 60Gb SSD w. about 12Gb free. Everything else is supposed to be on my D drive.
I haven't re-enabled UAC, so I don't know if they ever fixed the bug about Bridge insisting on running as Administrator.
One thing about me; if there's a bug to be discovered, you can count on me finding it - often with disastrous results. ![]()
Gerry
In the same Preferences > Performance area, under Scratch Disks you can set which drives to use and their order of priority. If you want the scratch disk to be on the D: drive, simply put a checkmark in the D: drive and remove the check from C:. Or you can use the arrows to the right to move a drive up or down the list to change its priority. So if you still want to use the C: drive incase your D: drive becomes full (unlikely as it may be), you just move D: to the top of the list. Bridge doesn't have a scratch disk or temp files, but it does have a cache for the thumbnails produced. You can change the location of the cache by going to Preferences > Cache. Bridge shouldn't ask you to run itself as an administrator, but if you find that running it as an administrator helps it means the settings in the UAC are too strict. The UAC sets global permissions, running as administrator gives an application elevated permissions to help get around the UAC limitations.
Thanks, Brett. Actually, my settings are exactly as you suggest. The problem is Bridge and I guess Photoshop too, treat the temp file differently than the scratch file. As far as I know, the scratch file is behaving exactly as advertised.
There are apparently no controls for the temp file. In about a year I should be able to find a 320Gb SSD that I can afford to replace bothe my present drives. Until then......
Gerry
Gerry, what are your TEMP and TMP environment variables set to?
If they're still pointed at a subfolder of your user area on C:, you might consider creating a D:\TEMP folder and setting the value of both TEMP and TMP to: D:\TEMP
That might help instruct some programs to store their temporary data on D:. I'm not sure whether Photoshop or Bridge will do so, but it's worth a shot.
-Noel
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