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Ongoing Problem With CS6 Crop / Blur

Jul 31, 2012 5:09 PM

Tags: #error #issue #crop #cs6 #blur #bug_report

Got a minute?  Super!  Try this. 

 

Open an image with some detail in the lower right area.  Create a duplicate layer.  Choose the crop tool.  Make sure the option "Delete Cropped Pixels" in NOT checked.

 

Grab the crop corner in the lower right of your image and move it diagonally inward  somewhat.  Confirm the crop.

 

Get the blur tool, make your brush size fairly large and brush the lower right of your image.  Allow your brush to go beyond the border of your image.

 

Okay, when your image is noticeably blurred, switch to the move tool, grab your image and move it up and to the left exposing some of the area you cropped out.

 

Ta-da!  Isn't that pretty?  It only happens with the blur tool.  Try using the burn or dodge tool and this doesn't happen.

 

I reported this when I was playing with CS6 beta.  You'd think it'd be fixed by now.

 

Gerry

 
Replies
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 1, 2012 2:27 AM   in reply to gswetsky

    I don't believe much of what was reported during the beta was fixed in the release version, but hopefully it will be addressed in the 13.01 update (or whatever the update is called).

    That is also a problem in some earlier versions of photoshop, but crop with hide wasn't the default as it is in photoshop cs6, so i guess it wasn't as obvious.

     

    I'm pretty sure adobe knows about the problem in cs6.

     

     

    Same procedure in photoshop cs5 on windows, except one has to choose Hide after drawing out the crop tool:

     

     

     

     

    Untitled-1.jpg

     

    updated to add screenshot from cs5

     

    Message was edited by: R_Kelly

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jul 31, 2012 9:36 PM   in reply to gswetsky

    I am not exactly sure what effect you were after, but if you wanted to restrict the blurring to only the visible  part of the cropped image, you can do that very easily by making your Crop; then Selecting All; and then using the Blur tool.

     

    If you then go to Image/Reveal All, you will see that the Blur has not affected the area beyond the marquee.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jul 31, 2012 11:38 PM   in reply to gswetsky

    I had actually followed your steps exactly —  and I saw the problem that I assumed that you were seeing.

     

    After further testing, I discovered that simply activating a Selection around the visible pixels retained all blurring within the selected area and prevented the problem that you had had previously with the damaged pixels in the masked area beyond your Crop.

     

    Try doing it my way and see if that doesn't solve your problem.

     

    I am not so sure that this IS a Bug: it looks more like a User using a tool in a way that perhaps it was never intended to be used?!

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 1, 2012 5:22 AM   in reply to gswetsky

    Sharpen Tool wrecks hidden pixels, too.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 1, 2012 7:26 AM   in reply to gswetsky

    gswetsky wrote:

     

    I still contend it's a bug.

     

     

     

    I agree. The wrecking of pixels must be considered a bug.

     

     

    I've compared the behaviour of some tools; only Blur Tool and Sharpen Tool wreck hidden pixels. Other tools are as follows.

     

    Ignore hidden pixels

    ----------------------------

    Background Eraser

    Magic Eraser

    Art History Brush

    Spot Healing Brush

    Healing Brush

    Color Replacement Brush

    Mixer Brush

    Smudge

     

     

    Affect hidden pixels as if visible

    ------------------------------------------

    Eraser

    History Brush

    Brush

    Pencil

    Dodge

    Burn

    Sponge

    Gradient

     

     

    Wreck hidden pixels

    ---------------------------

    Blur

    Sharpen

     

     

    Note some strange inconsistencies: Eraser versus Background Eraser, History Brush versus Art History Brush.

     
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  • Noel Carboni
    23,513 posts
    Dec 23, 2006
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 1, 2012 8:17 AM   in reply to conroy

    Great list, Conroy - nice work. I wonder if Adobe had such a list before you compiled it.

     

     

    DEFINITELY a bug!  The inconsistency of it makes the use of the "preserve pixels past edge of image" feature practically useless.

     

    And such an obvious bug it makes me wonder...

     

    Given that Adobe has changed the behavior of Crop to make the preservation of cropped pixels more likely, it's hard to believe such a bug could actually get out to the customers.

     

    As with some other issues (the release of the product with a serious text corruption bug), it seems clear to me that there are several management problems in Adobe's software development process:

     

    • Project planning deficiencies - who wrote the spec for "preserve pixels past the edge" without taking all these things into account?

     

    • Overwhelming pressure to release on time, regardless of all else.

     

    • Process timing issues (release build completed before beta test even starts).

     

    • Inability to properly judge what's acceptable to leave broken in released software and what's a "show stopper".

     

    • Problems in communicating feature development changes to the system test plan.

     

     

     

    It really feels like the released code isn't buggy so much as just unfinished.  Has Adobe decided to just release whatever they have every now and then, without a focus on getting it done first?

     

    And worse, now that they've released it, Adobe is faced with a new problem:  Do they finish the code and make it work right in a 13.0.x update, or do they just leave such problems in the product for another major or minor release (e.g., 13.1 or 14.0)? 

     

    • On the one hand, finishing the code is the right thing to do, from a customer quality perspective, but major changes chance exposing new problems, and it would further expose their process problems to the world. 

     

    • On the other hand they could just leave this stuff broken, bringing out fixes in a future update, which might "save face" after a fashion, but send the message that Adobe quality and attention to detail has reached an all-time low.

     

    Speaking of major or minor releases...  Assuming the correction of such problems as are being described in this thread are somehow deemed "feature enhancements" (I wouldn't put it past Adobe management to do this), do the Creative Cloud subscribers get them while people who have bought perpetual licenses do not?

     

    Does anyone here see any good in all this?  I'm struggling to see any.  I suppose you could say that the folks who don't use Photoshop in such a way that requires these tools to work consistenly get some benefit from the other features they did find a way to finish, and of course there's financial benefit for Adobe, so they can continue development rather than close their doors.

     

    I can't imagine that the Adobe engineers could like doing business this way.

     

    -Noel

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 1, 2012 1:47 PM   in reply to Noel Carboni

    Warning - potential thread hijack

     

    "Given that Adobe has changed the behavior of Crop to make the preservation of cropped pixels more likely, it's hard to believe such a bug could actually get out to the customers."

     

    I dunno, over the past few days I've been working with the new crop tool in CS6 @home and just don't see the point of any of the the supposed improvements. Even after reverting to the "old" way in CS6 it still isn't. Why on earth is the darn tool persistent even after initiating a crop selection?. Even an 'escape' doesn't get rid of it (like the old tool). At least with the real old tool you don't have this selection window sticking around until you get so frustrated you select a different tool just to get rid of it.  IMO the entire new crop tool is a complete bug, adding nothing to my skill/ability and making a simple step into a very complicated one...

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 11, 2012 6:25 PM   in reply to TLL...

    From my own testing, this has nothing to do with the Crop tool, it's purely about the Blur tool and how it reacts to materials that are off canvas. To prove it is not the Crop tool, open an image, duplicate the background layer. Transform it to 200% scale (so that it is now double the canvas size, thus having a great deal of material off canvas), and use the Blur tool near a corner. Move the layer and you will see the same effect, Crop tool never having been used. But I'll report this to the engineering team to get fixed.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 12, 2012 1:17 PM   in reply to gswetsky

    Have you recieved any feedback on your bug reports? How did you report them? Did you get bug numbers that I can look up?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 12, 2012 11:02 PM   in reply to gswetsky

    I'm not sure who you worked with before, but I logged the bug with engineering and it is already being investigated, but I haven't been told that this is a duplicate. But it is being worked on now.

     

    Do you happen to have the links to any of the former posts you've made with these bug reports?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 19, 2012 11:04 AM   in reply to gswetsky

    Sorry about your previous experience. Did you get a response from an engineer on your posts? What types of issues did you report?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 20, 2012 7:57 AM   in reply to gswetsky

    Good to know your issues are getting more attention this time around. I found the post about the long load time and I see you have Chris Cox on the case (he is one of the top Photoshop engineers). I can't find the 4 GB temp file post, but I can tell you this: When you launch Photoshop, it create a temp file called the scratch disk. The size of the scratch disk is exactly equal to the Memory Usage setting (RAM allocation) in Preferences > Performance. If this setting is 4 GB, your scratch disk will be 4 GB.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 20, 2012 8:41 AM   in reply to gswetsky

    In the same Preferences > Performance area, under Scratch Disks you can set which drives to use and their order of priority. If you want the scratch disk to be on the D: drive, simply put a checkmark in the D: drive and remove the check from C:. Or you can use the arrows to the right to move a drive up or down the list to change its priority. So if you still want to use the C: drive incase your D: drive becomes full (unlikely as it may be), you just move D: to the top of the list. Bridge doesn't have a scratch disk or temp files, but it does have a cache for the thumbnails produced. You can change the location of the cache by going to Preferences > Cache. Bridge shouldn't ask you to run itself as an administrator, but if you find that running it as an administrator helps it means the settings in the UAC are too strict. The UAC sets global permissions, running as administrator gives an application elevated permissions to help get around the UAC limitations.

     
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  • Noel Carboni
    23,513 posts
    Dec 23, 2006
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 20, 2012 7:27 PM   in reply to gswetsky

    Gerry, what are your TEMP and TMP environment variables set to?

     

    If they're still pointed at a subfolder of your user area on C:, you might consider creating a D:\TEMP folder and setting the value of both TEMP and TMP to:  D:\TEMP

     

    That might help instruct some programs to store their temporary data on D:.  I'm not sure whether Photoshop or Bridge will do so, but it's worth a shot.

     

    -Noel

     
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  • Noel Carboni
    23,513 posts
    Dec 23, 2006
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 21, 2012 4:51 AM   in reply to gswetsky

    And just to be absolutely certain...  Does your username, specifically, have Full Control permissions to the D:\TEMPMAP folder?  I may have asked this before in another thread, and if so I'm sorry for having lost track.

     

    -Noel

     
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