Adobe Community: Where are the AE render settings in Media Encoder?

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1. Rick Gerard,

Jun 15, 2012 7:58 AM in reply to Clint Porter

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If the presets are not going to be sufficient, or you want to edit them simply click on the preset to edit the settings. When you've got what you want you can save the preset so you only have to create it once. The layout is a little different but you'll find everything you need there as long as you pick the right preset format to start.

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2. Clint Porter,

Jun 15, 2012 8:10 AM in reply to Rick Gerard

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Where do you set these render settings in Media Encoder?

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3. Advetel,

Jun 15, 2012 8:36 AM in reply to Clint Porter

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Its not on that screen.

You do it in Premiere. Choose Menu Edit/Preferences/Memory & MultiProcessing.

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4. Clint Porter,

Jun 15, 2012 8:46 AM in reply to Advetel

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Was your comment meant for a different thread? This one is about setting After Effects composition render settings in Adobe Media Encoder instead of the AE Render Queue, so you can take advantage of background rendering.

Adobe has frequently encouraged us to try AME instead of the Render Queue, but I'm confused about how AME is handling the AE Render Settings and I can't find the corresponding controls in AME.

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5. Rick Gerard,

Jun 15, 2012 9:39 AM in reply to Clint Porter

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You set the bit depth in the project settings in After Effects. Your project is brought into AME with the default Render Settings you see in the Render Cue. If you want to change them edit the Render Settings and set a new Movie Default:

(Edit>Templates>Render Settings)

In AME you can only change the Source Range from Whole Composition, Work Area, or Custom.

The output settings are adjusted using the interface in AME. It's pretty straight forward.

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6. Clint Porter,

Jun 15, 2012 12:05 PM in reply to Rick Gerard

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Thanks for your time. This is apparently false, though:

This is a bright ball moving quickly with motion blur on. The project is 32bit. (There's a 3D camera a little out of focus to help make the highlights distinct) I created a new default setting at 8bt with motion blur off for all layers. I then sent the comp to the render queue and rendered it without touching any settings.

I then rendered the exact same comp in AME and got a completely different result. It looks like AME produces something more like what you might get if you set all of AE's render settings to "Current Settings". But who really knows?

I think this helps explain why more people don't use AME to do all of their After Effects rendering. I mean, why wouldn't you want to render in the background? But we just don't know (or we have mistaken ideas about) how AME is handling our comp.

What about anyone else reading this out there? Why do YOU use the render queue?

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7. Tim Kurkoski,

Jun 15, 2012 2:59 PM in reply to Clint Porter

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Hi Clint,

I can address your technical questions about the differences between rendering via AE and AME.

The short version of the answer is that no, AME can not access the Render Settings that are available in AE's Render Queue.

AME reads AE comps via Dynamic Link, the same technology used for Premiere Pro to read live AE comps. The sequence of events goes something like this:

You tell AME which AE comp you want to render.
A headless version of AE spins up in the background. (Regardless of whether or not you have the project open in an active version of AE.)
The headless version of AE renders each frame and hands it to AME.
AME encodes the frames to the settings you defined.

Dynamic Link can not currently access the AE Render Settings to affect intrinsic comp properties like bit depth, resolution, or frame rate. WYSIWYG.

So, in a nutshell, what AME can render will look exactly like the frames you see in the comp window in AE. Or, as you put it:

It looks like AME produces something more like what you might get if you set all of AE's render settings to "Current Settings". But who really knows?

As a matter of fact, I know.

Here's the good news: in AME CS6 we put some effort into allowing AME to access AE's Render Settings. If you add an AE comp to the AME queue, right-click on it and choose Source Settings. You'll get the cleverly named After Effects Composition Render Settings dialog, which has a whopping ONE control in it for setting the visibility of Guide Layers.

It's clear that we have some work to do here. This feature was added very late in CS6 development, and hooking up the rest of the Render Settings controls requires significant under-the-hood plumbing. Guide Layers were easy; the rest are hard. But it's a start.

Mind that it won't make sense for us to completely replicate the AE Render Settings dialog within AME. As Rick pointed out, some of those controls like Time Span are handled elsewhere in AME.

I am interested to hear which of the Render Settings controls are most important to you; which you change on a regular basis, and which you don't use at all. And of course, always feel free to file a feature request. They actually do get looked at (if you file one against AE, it is looked at by the person in the office next to me, so if you put a secret message in your request he can pass it to me).

-=TimK

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8. Clint Porter,

Jun 15, 2012 6:08 PM in reply to Tim Kurkoski

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Tim,

It's responses like yours that are the reason I switched from Apple to Adobe and never looked back. Seriously. Thank you!

This was a great technical article. It really needs to be part of the Media Encoder help (I realize the revamp isn't out yet).

You asked which features are important; I think it's best to think of it in terms of peace of mind. That's partly what the Render Settings in AE offer right now. After Effects gives us a bevy of tools for speeding up our previewing process, like lowering resolution, bit depth, solos, motion blur, draft, effect toggles, ect. We could be using any number of those in our normal workflow to get the edit done, and those settings are strewn all over the application. It's way too easy to miss something when getting ready to render. That's why it's awesome that Render Settings pulls most of it together so you don't have to hunt everything down before AND after you render. Renders can be a big time investment, and we need to know everything is happening the way we expect it to happen. I know AME is WYSIWYG, but after you stare at a comp for hours, you stop seeing some things.

Actually, there's a few more things I'd like to have in the render panel, like raytracing quality and maybe shadow resolution. I don't use the Solo switch in Render Settings too often, but I use pretty much everything else quite a bit.

This is why it's so important for the Adobe Help and Adobe TV videos to explain everything you just wrote. AME requires a significantly different way of setting up your render, but it's good to know that if you do, you can count on the results. Most people don't know that. The main thing is giving designers peace of mind than when they start that 36 hour render, the right file will come out the other side.

Regarding the difficulty of the internal plumbing, would it be easier to make it so you send something from the Render Queue to AME? (Like the way Premiere's Export vs. Queue options work) I think that would be fine with most people, and would also be a nice way to ease people over to AME. Though I suppose it's inelegant to make it a two-step process for awhile.

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9. Clint Porter,

Aug 8, 2012 10:02 AM in reply to Tim Kurkoski

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Thanks for the time you all take to respond on these threads. I'd like to ask a few more questions about AME/AE encoding. I could not find adequate clarity on this anywhere in the help documentation.

1) AE renders compositions at a bit depth of 8, 16, and 32 (float). AME can encode frames at 24, 32, 48, and 64 (for ProRes 4444, for example). How do these things relate to each other, and how/why should you use a particular AME bit depth setting for an AE comp?

2) What effects does "Use Maximum Render Quality" have on a comp? Does it only come into play if your are encoding to a different resolution to the source comp? Will it change the color processing?

3) Does AME always render at "Full" resolution or does it look at the resolution setting in the AE comp window? What if it's set to "auto"?

4) Does AME pay attention to the comp window Region of Interest?

5) Does AME care about the composition motion blur button or does it just look at the layer motion blur settings?

6) How does AME decide whether to interlace the render?

7) How does AME handle color management? Does it always output in the working space?

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10. Clint Porter,

Aug 8, 2012 10:21 AM in reply to Clint Porter

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Another question.

As a test, I just tried rendering something out of AE using AME, and it didn't have an alpha channel. It just rendered on black. I'm using ProRes 4444, and I just successfully rendered out a ProRes 4444 movie with straight alpha using the render queue.

How do you render with an alpha channel using Media Encoder? How do you select straight vs. premultiplied?

Thanks,

Clint

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11. BenMarkus,

Aug 8, 2012 10:30 AM in reply to Clint Porter

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I think the folks on the Adobe Media Encoder Forum might also be helpful.

http://forums.adobe.com/community/ame?view=overview

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12. Clint Porter,

Aug 8, 2012 10:41 AM in reply to BenMarkus

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Thanks. Should I go ahead and double post? Also, which forum is the right one for future AE+AME integration questions?

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13. BenMarkus,

Aug 10, 2012 8:47 AM in reply to Clint Porter

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The AE+AME integration questions are probably fine for the AE forum, but you just had a lot of questions specific to AME so I thought the post might fit in better over there.

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14. Tim Kurkoski,

Aug 27, 2012 4:28 PM in reply to Clint Porter

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Hi Clint,

Sorry for the long delay on replying, I've been busy. Doesn't look like you've cross-posted this to the AME forum, so I'll take a crack at the answers:

1) AE renders compositions at a bit depth of 8, 16, and 32 (float). AME can encode frames at 24, 32, 48, and 64 (for ProRes 4444, for example). How do these things relate to each other, and how/why should you use a particular AME bit depth setting for an AE comp?

These numbers all represent bit depth. AE states bit depth in terms of bits per channel (bpc). AME usually states bit depth in total bits per pixel (bpp = bpc multiplied by the number of channels). It's one of those little inconsistencies that comes from the two apps growing up under different development teams.

RGB has three channels. RGB + Alpha has four channels. Doing the math:

RGB 8 bpc = 24 bpp
RGBA 8 bpc = 32 bpp
RGB 16 bpc = 48 bpp
RGBA 16 bpc = 64 bpp

So if you want 8-bit output with an alpha channel, you'd set the bit depth in AME to 32. If you don't need an alpha channel, set it to 24. Note that AME doesn't have equivalent options for 32 bpc formats. (If it did, the bpp equivalents would be 96 and 128 bpp!) There are very few such codecs anyway.

2) What effects does "Use Maximum Render Quality" have on a comp? Does it only come into play if your are encoding to a different resolution to the source comp? Will it change the color processing?

IIRC, the "Use Maximum Render Quality" switch doesn't affect AE comps. It only has an effect when the source is a Premiere Pro sequence. This article has some detail about how the switch affects Premiere Pro sequences:

http://blogs.adobe.com/premiereprotraining/2010/10/scaling-in-premiere -pro-cs5.html

3) Does AME always render at "Full" resolution or does it look at the resolution setting in the AE comp window? What if it's set to "auto"?

4) Does AME pay attention to the comp window Region of Interest?

5) Does AME care about the composition motion blur button or does it just look at the layer motion blur settings?

7) How does AME handle color management? Does it always output in the working space?

These questions all have the same basic answer. When the AE comp is loaded via Dynamic Link, it will be processed using the state of the comp at the time the AE project was saved. Any switches available in the Timeline panel like Motion Blur will be used in their current state, and there is no control over them from the AME side.

Keep in mind that comp viewer switches like Region Of Interest and preview resolution aren't a function of the comp itself, and thus aren't seen by AME. They are a function of the Comp viewer panel. (The difference being the same as between a piece of artwork and the glass of the frame. If the glass is warped then the art looks warped. AME only looks at the artwork without the glass.) Color Management, similarly, while controlled at the project level is interpreted via the Comp viewer panel or by AE's Render Queue; AE's color management is not in the chain of processing used by AME. But you can acheive the same color management transforms via AME by using the Color Profile Converter effect and setting the input and output profiles specifically.

So, what AME sees in an AE comp will be identical to what you see in the Comp panel in AE at full resolution when ROI and any other viewer switches (like the Transparency Grid or guides or color channel selection) are turned off, and without a project working color space being set. From this point the pixels could be affected by AME via scaling or if there is a color space transform inherent to the chosen output format (ex., RGB to YUV).

6) How does AME decide whether to interlace the render?

This is defined by the Field Order setting in the AME Output Settings. That seems pretty straightforward to me, so if I'm missing something about your question please clarify.

-=TimK

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15. aefilter,

Oct 20, 2012 6:35 PM in reply to Tim Kurkoski

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Thanks for the replies.

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16. andi_urra,

Dec 2, 2012 6:49 AM in reply to Tim Kurkoski

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Hi, Tim, I just wanted to post the same question as Clint, when I came across this thread.

First, thank you so much for your elaborate information. This is highly valuable for us Adobe users.

Now for your question about what render settings controls are of most value: My answer would be exactly the same like Clint's post No. 8. The most satisfying solution for a user would be something like the "Export/Queue" choice in Premiere. Another great solution would be the ability to call upon your AE Render Settings presets from within AME. In the end, like Clint said, predictability is of extreme importance when kicking of renders that take days to complete.

Please keep the development going.

Kind regards,

Andreas

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Where are the AE render settings in Media Encoder?

Jun 14, 2012 2:06 PM

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