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Dynamic Content in Select

Oct 9, 2012 3:37 AM

Tags: #dynamic #select #cs6 #dw #lightning #bolt

Is there a reason why the lightning bolt that lets you add dynamic content to a <select> list box has disappeared? Is there some other way of doing this now?

 
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Oct 9, 2012 3:56 AM   in reply to RicardoApples

    Yes, there is a reason. Unfortunately, I'm not at liberty to tell you what it is. That information needs to come from Adobe.

     

    What I can tell you is that  Adobe announced recently that it would no longer invest in the development of Spry, which hasn't been updated for years. Dreamweaver's server behaviors have similarly been neglected. So much so, that when I wrote a book on PHP in Dreamweaver a couple of years ago for Adobe Press, I actively discouraged their use. I did so with Adobe's full permission. Perhaps you can begin to see a pattern emerging.

     

    As to whether there is another way to do it, you either have to hand-code it or revert to the basic version of Dreamweaver CS6.

     
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    Oct 9, 2012 4:07 AM   in reply to RicardoApples

    If you want to tell Adobe directly, submit a report through the bug report/feature request form at http://adobe.ly/DWBug.

     
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    Oct 9, 2012 6:13 AM   in reply to David_Powers

    Are you implying that the days of support for dynamic content by Dreamweaver are numbered?

     
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    Oct 9, 2012 7:27 AM   in reply to Ken Renwick

    I chose my words very carefully. In the book I'm referring to, I wrote the following: "Judging from the decision to discontinue ADDT and not add new server behaviors to Dreamweaver CS5, the role of server behaviors is likely to decline."

     

    The same book devoted a chapter to Dreamweaver's support for WordPress, and many more to working with a third-party PHP framework. I have no reason to believe that support will be withdrawn.

     
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    Oct 9, 2012 7:53 AM   in reply to David_Powers

    Surely removing the capability to easily attribute dynamic data to form fields is going much further than just diminishing the role of server behaviors.

     

    And is it the same reason why I can no longer easily insert a server side include or even a comment?

     
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    Oct 9, 2012 8:01 AM   in reply to Ken Renwick

    Adding dynamic data to form fields through the Property inspector in Dreamweaver is directly related to server behaviors.

     

    As far as server-side includes are concerned, the PHP category of the Insert panel has options for both include() and require().

     

    Comments are inserted using the Apply Comment icon in the Coding toolbar.

     
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    Oct 9, 2012 9:28 AM   in reply to David_Powers

    I think I'll revert to my lightning bolt and my insert menu.

     

    For the first time since DW4 it looks like what I want and Adobe wants are different.

     

    Most depressing

     
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    Oct 9, 2012 10:13 AM   in reply to Ken Renwick

    Ken Renwick wrote:

     

    For the first time since DW4 it looks like what I want and Adobe wants are different.

    Web design and development are changing at a rapid pace. The changes mightn't suit you, but Dreamweaver will die if it doesn't keep pace with the industry. However, if you want certain features in Dreamweaver, tell Adobe directly through the bug report/feature request form at http://adobe.ly/DWBug.

     
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    Oct 9, 2012 10:33 AM   in reply to David_Powers

    I fail to see how deleting useful workflow options is keeping pace.

     

    No. Dreamweaver will die when nobody wants to use it any more and if legitimate criticism continues to be patronised.

     
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    Oct 9, 2012 10:56 AM   in reply to Ken Renwick

    I apologize if you think my comments are patronising. That's not my intention. I'm not an Adobe employee, but I write books and create video training courses about Dreamweaver, so I take a deep interest in the program and in web development in general. I've also written several books about PHP, so I'm very aware of the deep flaws in Dreamweaver's server behaviors, which rely on deprecated code.

     

    I would agree that the Creative Cloud update to Dreamweaver has been poorly handled by Adobe. I particularly dislike what's happened to the way form elements are inserted. I believe that Adobe should inform users in advance what changes are proposed. In fact, I've been arguing that point with my Adobe contacts for many months now.

     

    Quite what level of support there will be for dynamic web development in future versions of Dreamweaver, I don't know. As I said before, if certain features are important to you, tell Adobe directly through the form I pointed to. There's no guarantee that Adobe will fulfil your request, but if sufficient people request certain functionality, there's a greater likelihood of it being implemented.

     
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    Oct 9, 2012 11:14 AM   in reply to David_Powers

    David_Powers wrote:

     

     

    Quite what level of support there will be for dynamic web development in future versions of Dreamweaver, I don't know. As I said before, if certain features are important to you, tell Adobe directly through the form I pointed to. There's no guarantee that Adobe will fulfil your request, but if sufficient people request certain functionality, there's a greater likelihood of it being implemented.

    I shouldn't have to be filling in forms requesting features that have arbitrarily been deleted. Just as you say, Adobe should consult before they do things - why does it have to be so secret?? Maybe this mysterious "reason" is the greatest thing to happen to DW and justifies all the changes they are making but I can only judge on their actions and at the moment they are simply counter-productive

     
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    Oct 9, 2012 12:07 PM   in reply to Ken Renwick

    Ken Renwick wrote:

     

    I shouldn't have to be filling in forms requesting features that have arbitrarily been deleted.

    Odd. You find time to post in a user-to-user forum complaining about changes that have inconvenienced you, but you don't like the idea of communicating your feelings directly to Adobe. I don't think Adobe would agree that features have been removed arbitrarily. Deliberate decisions were made about what to cut. However, if a good argument can be made about restoring some of them, it's worth putting your case directly.

     

    By the way, that form isn't only for reporting bugs. You can use it to suggest new ideas of features that would improve your workflow. In my experience, Adobe is open to ideas. It doesn't implement all of them, but if you don't tell the Dreamweaver engineering team what's really important to you, it's likely to change in ways you don't like.

     
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    Oct 9, 2012 3:14 PM   in reply to RicardoApples

    It's the 12.1 Creative Cloud update, which is available only to Creative Cloud subscribers. If you want to roll back, you need to uninstall Dreamweaver. You can then reinstall it using the Adobe Application Manager. After doing so, install the 12.0.1 patch, but not the 12.1 update (confusing numbers, I know, but that's the way it is).

     
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    Oct 9, 2012 3:27 PM   in reply to David_Powers

    David_Powers wrote:

    Odd. You find time to post in a user-to-user forum complaining about changes that have inconvenienced you, but you don't like the idea of communicating your feelings directly to Adobe.

    Even odder. You seem to make a lot of assumptions. At which point did I say that I hadn't filled in the form. I said I shouldn't have to and neither I should if Adobe did their research properly in the first place

     
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    Oct 9, 2012 3:58 PM   in reply to Ken Renwick

    Geez, this discussion is going nowhere. 

     

    Ken, if you have a gripe with Adobe, vent your feelings at them, directly through the link David provided.   If you don't want to complain to Adobe, please stop venting here.  This is a user-to-user group.  You're preaching to the choir here.

     

    I for one did not update/upgrade or whatever you care to call it my Cloud DW because I read the blogpost about it when it was released.  Can I live with the changes Adobe made?  Sure.  But I don't care to right now.

     

    A certain amount of consumer due diligence is required these days.  Just because it's new doesn't mean you need to jump on it. Microsoft taught me that lesson many years ago.  I no longer accept updates to anything without first researching whether I really need & want it.

     

    Did Adobe make blunders with this release?  Yeah.  I think we can all agree on that point.  Is b-i-t-c-h-i-n-g about it at fellow users doing anything constructive?  No. 

     

     

    Just my 2 cents.

     

    Nancy O.

     
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    Oct 9, 2012 4:01 PM   in reply to Ken Renwick

    Ken Renwick wrote:

     

    neither I should if Adobe did their research properly in the first place

    You're assuming that Adobe didn't research its target market sufficiently. Maybe so.

     

    An alternative viewpoint is that Adobe has identified what it regards as a more lucrative market that has different requirements from yours. It's also possible that Adobe has misread the market.

     

    Time will tell.

     
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    Oct 10, 2012 12:54 AM   in reply to Nancy O.

    Nancy O. wrote:

    Is b-i-t-c-h-i-n-g about it at fellow users doing anything constructive?  No. 

     

     

    Then stop ******** then!! Methinks the lady doth protest too much

     

    Nuff said

     
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    Oct 10, 2012 3:56 PM   in reply to David_Powers

    David_Powers wrote:

     

    Yes, there is a reason. Unfortunately, I'm not at liberty to tell you what it is. That information needs to come from Adobe.

     

    How nice for you to have inside info.... Can you at least hint as to "when" this reason might come to light? I have a book of business to attend to, and the changes like what's mentioned at the start of this thread are making that a lot more challenging. I have been following the Adobe blog for Dreamweaver, among other things, and they've never mentioned they were going to remove dynamic data features like that.

     

    You also say: "Web design and development are changing at a rapid pace. The changes mightn't suit you, but Dreamweaver will die if it doesn't keep pace with the industry."


    While I totally agree with you that Dreamweaver needs to keep pace with the industry, I am a little confused by your comment because it sounds as if you are saying that the industry is changing in a direction away from working with dynamic data. In that case, I couldn't disagree with you more. If anything, static content is going extinct; replaced with data driven content management solutions and other dynamic sources. And it's in this regard where I'm baffled at Dreamweaver removing features that help the users who can't code from scratch build sites with these capabilities. I've been running a business for over 15 years because of the dynamic data tools and capabilitites of Dreamweaver and add-on extensions.

     
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    Oct 10, 2012 4:07 PM   in reply to Steve Skinner

    Steve Skinner wrote:

     

    Can you at least hint as to "when" this reason might come to light?

    No, that's entirely up to Adobe.

    While I totally agree with you that Dreamweaver needs to keep pace with the industry, I am a little confused by your comment because it sounds as if you are saying that the industry is changing in a direction away from working with dynamic data.

    I'm not saying that at all. But if you're relying on Dreamweaver's server behaviors, you're working with code that's hopelessly out of date. The PHP server behaviors use deprecated code that both PHP and MySQL have urged developers to stop using for several years.

     

    Since CS5, Dreamweaver has had extensive support for third-party PHP frameworks. I have no reason to believe that's going away.

     
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    Oct 10, 2012 4:15 PM   in reply to David_Powers

    I appreciate your response, and I believe I'm reading between the lines correctly. :-) It just sucks to be in this in-between period. Guess I'm left with no other option to un-install DW and reinstall 12.0.1 - and then all my extensions again... <sigh>

     
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    Oct 11, 2012 1:28 AM   in reply to David_Powers

    Thanks David. I bought your book ( allready was helped a lot with PHP 5 for Flash)

    I also made the feature request to adobe support. I realy hope adobe will find ways to help with serverbehaviors that are not depricated

     
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    Oct 11, 2012 2:38 PM   in reply to RicardoApples

    I came from GoLive 6 where dynamic content was how I ran my business. When Adobe dropped gl6, I had to jump to DW ricky-tick. All good. However, the jump left me in the dark as far as how DW3 at that time did things, so I found Webassist.com and made things happen with their tools. Now, on DW6, I use WA for many features lacking in DW and if they are going to pull dynamic (again), I feel confident WA will serve.

     
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    Oct 11, 2012 2:52 PM   in reply to PatriceAnn

    Indeed. The combination of Dreamweaver and 3rd party extensions is killer. I have a number of extensions from WebAssist, as well as a bunch from DMXzone.com and DWzone-it.com too. All are reputable sources for excellent extensions that extend Dreamweaver beyond it's own server behaviors. WebAssist is all PHP though, but the other two I mentioned cover PHP, ASP.NET and even traditional ASP, which is great because there are always customers who want support for their existing websites.

     

    If the extension makers keep up with what Adobe's doing with Dreamweaver, it shouldn't be too much of a disruption.

     
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    Oct 11, 2012 2:56 PM   in reply to PatriceAnn

    I use WA for many features lacking in DW and if they are going to pull dynamic (again), I feel confident WA will serve.

    If Adobe are not updating server-behaviors and just pulling them out of DW 12.1, you've got to ask WebAssist if their products have been updated to cope with these changes.

     

     

    Nancy O.

     
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    Oct 11, 2012 3:01 PM   in reply to Nancy O.

    There is a thread on their site about adjusting on the fly to cloud. Since I'm not using cloud, I've not followed closely. I am not the expert here, but I think WA server behaviours are independent of DW, but I don't know.

     
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    Oct 24, 2012 10:29 PM   in reply to PatriceAnn

    Nobody has answered the original question. To add dynamic data to form elements go to: Insert->Data->Dynamic Data

     
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    Oct 24, 2012 10:39 PM   in reply to lfirth

    Well the thread focuses on the first part of the question "Is there a reason..."

     

    Fact is, although it can be done, it's not best practice because the code generated by DW is so outdated. In fact use of this feature is discouraged as David notes.

     
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    Oct 25, 2012 6:59 AM   in reply to John Waller

    OK then. Moving forward then, aside from coding from scratch, what's the best way to implement dynamic data then? For those embracing these changes in 12.1, how are you doing this? What extensions, etc.? Or, is lfirth's answer the best way?

     

    People with the skills to code from scratch really aren't going to be bothered by this change. It's the rest of the DW users who'll need to adapt. I'd love to hear how others using 12.1 are getting their data driven development done.

     
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    Oct 25, 2012 7:13 AM   in reply to John Waller

    Hey John, I was thinking about what you wrote and I was wondering if you could explain more about why the code generated by DW is outdated. I'm just trying to better the issues surrounding the code created by DW.

     

    For a long period of time, it was obviously considered pretty good at generating code for dynamic data. It always worked very well for me, and I never had a customer site hacked or any security problems relating to DW generated code.  I know there are just better ways of doing things now, but is the code DW generates really that bad, or dangerous to use? I guess I'm just wondering how it became something that is now discouraged, especially when it has not been replaced with something better yet.

     
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    Oct 25, 2012 7:36 AM   in reply to Steve Skinner

    The problem with the code generated by Dreamweaver's server behaviors is that they rely on the original MySQL functions in PHP. This is no longer recommended by either PHP or MySQL (see http://docs.php.net/manual/en/mysqlinfo.api.choosing.php). The functions are deprecated, and will eventually be removed from PHP, although probably not for a long time.

     

    The original MySQL functions are no longer actively maintained, and are incapable of performing many common tasks, such as prepared statements and transactions. You should use MySQL Improved (MySQLi) or PDO instead.

     

    One reason Dreamweaver didn't switch to MySQLi at an early stage is because it requires PHP 5, and many hosting companies were extremely slow to migrate from PHP 4.

     

    I don't think there is any immediate security risk in using Dreamweaver's PHP code, but it's extremely basic. Among its faults are the lack of server-side validation, connecting unnecessarily to the database, and lack of reusable code. Unfortunately, third-party extensions rely on Dreamweaver's antiquated base functionality. So, although they offer improvements over the built-in server behaviors, they are also in need of updating.

     
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    Oct 25, 2012 2:44 PM   in reply to David_Powers

    I wonder if Adobe's direction is to remove SB's from Dreamweaver entirely and move dynamic development to  Edge Code. They seem to be encouraging plug in developers with that. Maybe they intend to discontinue Dreamweaver entirely and go with a Reflow/Edge code combination.

     

    Just putting it out there.

     
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    Oct 25, 2012 2:59 PM   in reply to lfirth

    Maybe they intend to discontinue Dreamweaver entirely...

    I don't think so.

     

    Edge Reflow appears to be aimed at designers who want responsive web sites. Edge Animate is for CSS3 Animations, etc...  I don't know how MySql & Server Behaviors would fit in with either of those two tools.

     

    Nancy O.

     

     

     

    Nancy O.

     
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    Oct 25, 2012 3:03 PM   in reply to Nancy O.

    I said Edge Code not Animate.

     
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    Oct 25, 2012 3:05 PM   in reply to lfirth

    Edge Reflow hasn't been released yet, so quite frankly I don't know what Edge Code is.  Do you?

     

     

    Nancy O.

     
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    Oct 25, 2012 3:07 PM   in reply to Nancy O.

    It's Adobe's implimentation of Brackets I believe.

     

    http://html.adobe.com/edge/code/

     
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    Oct 25, 2012 3:24 PM   in reply to lfirth

    lfirth wrote:

     

    Maybe they intend to discontinue Dreamweaver entirely and go with a Reflow/Edge code combination.

    Only Adobe can confirm or deny such speculation, but I tend to agree with Nancy that there's no plan (at least not yet) to discontinue Dreamweaver. I attended the Create the Web roadshow in London earlier this month. Edge Reflow and Edge Code are aimed at niche markets that are different from Dreamweaver. It's quite possible that some Dreamweaver users will migrate to the new products, but that doesn't mean Dreamweaver is facing the chop. Quite the opposite, I would venture.

     
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    Oct 25, 2012 3:27 PM   in reply to David_Powers

    I attended the Create the Web roadshow in Sydney, thats what gave me the idea..... I was just a thinking aloud.

     
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