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Sanpanza
Currently Being Moderated

Trying to create a wire frame object in 3D

Nov 11, 2012 11:04 AM

Tags: #mac #cs6

Hi Folks, I am trying to create two objects: something called a gravity well and a wire framed globe in Photoshop 3D CS6. The examples are here: http://www.carreonphotography.com/3D/   #'s 1/5 and 5/5. I tried using a gradient map to create a depth map but the form is not editable if I understand PS 3D correctly. Only the scale, light, texture and perspective.

 

The surace of the gravity well needs to be a  white wire grid pattern over black with. The globe is basically the same. Can this be accomplished on Photoshop CS6 3D or do I have to farm this out to a 3D guy.

 

I have included samples of my objectives: #1 and 5 plus screen shots of what I ended up with, the form of which was uneditable based on what I understand. I also don't know how I would create the wire frame once I have the form.

 

I deally I would use the final images as png's on a 2D suface which I would later wrap onto a 3D surface.

 

Any thoughs please!

 

Thanks folks in advance:

 

Ed Carreon

www.carreonphotography.com

 
Replies
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 11, 2012 11:48 AM   in reply to Sanpanza

    Aside from your example being hugely incorrect in terms of the scientifics (I mean, polar coordinates and twisting similar to a tornado funnel, RLY?), I'm not sure what you are having difficulty with. Yes, you would have to create displacement maps to create the denting. A simple blurred circle will do just that. There's no magic involved beyond that. You just need to learn how to create these maps and experiment a little. And any grids can easily be simulated by crafting suitable grids with transparencies used as textures or relying on the wireframe rendering mode. So unless you are trying to turn a 3 minute project into the next "Tansformers" movie, there should be no need for any 3D program.

     

    Mylenium

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 11, 2012 1:26 PM   in reply to Sanpanza

    Leaving aside the "scientifics" that Mylenium mentioned, you can use an opacity map to create the grids.

     

    I used the Photoshop sphere mesh, but it's an extremely low resolution mesh and renders with obvious facets and a nasty fan-like pattern is seen at the poles. Photoshop provides no way to put a different material on front and back of a surface, so the inside of the sphere is too distinct for a good illustration.

     

    The well is a revolved extrusion of a path with the same grid opacity map as before. I set "remove hidden backfaces" otherwise it was a confusing mess of grids due to Photoshop being unable to extrude an open path (as far as I know). That made the bottom of the funnel invisible on one side, though. An edited opacity map could have solved that.

     

    With better models and some post-render work, you could create much better results than my quick effort to show that it is indeed possible to render your 3D grids with CS6 Extended.

     

    Screen-shot-2012-11-11-at-20.25.23.png

     

    Screen-shot-2012-11-11-at-20.25.28.png

     

    Screen-shot-2012-11-11-at-20.26.28.png

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 11, 2012 5:09 PM   in reply to Sanpanza

    I'll be glad to help, but rather than be paid, I would much prefer you to contribute to this registered charity: http://www.pdsa.org.uk/

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 12, 2012 4:30 PM   in reply to Sanpanza

    Hi Ed,

     

    The opacity is not controlled by opacity/transparency of the diffuse texture. A material has a separate opacity control that can accept a texture. I used a white grid on black background as seen in my third screenshot above - it operates similarly to a mask on a layer in a regular document. For the diffuse colour, I just used the material's diffuse colour picker and removed the (empty layer) texture that Photoshop had automatically given the material when the sphere was created on an empty layer.

     

    Screen-shot-2012-11-13-at-00.02.28.png

     

     

    Then in that little menu that's revealed by the texture button (which has a folder icon for a reason I cannot fathom), pick "Edit UV Properties" to get the dialog shown below (with the mismatching title of Texture Properties). Changing U Scale to 200% will result in the square grid being tiled twice around the sphere to make "squares" around the equator.

     

    Screen shot 2012-11-13 at 00.06.07.png

     

     

    Here are other settings used for the sphere render.

     

    Screen shot 2012-11-13 at 00.16.45.png

     

    Screen shot 2012-11-13 at 00.16.53.png

     

    Screen shot 2012-11-13 at 00.17.02.png

     

    Screen shot 2012-11-13 at 00.17.08.png

     

    Screen shot 2012-11-13 at 00.17.24.png

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 14, 2012 9:21 AM   in reply to conroy

    Hi Ed and conroy,

     

    Using Depth Map for mesh creation is going to cause you more heaache than help for this task. Revolving a path extrusion as conroy shows is a much better way to go. You'll need to iterate to get what you're after but it can be done with opacity maps as shown above.

     

    To get the inside rendering like your example takes an easy little trick (but it won't work so well for animation). Duplicate the 3d layer once you have the camera view set. On the top layer set the Scene attribute to Remove Hidden: Backfaces, but leave it off for the 3D layer below. Now on the layer below, apply a Saturation adjustment layer that clips to the 3D layer, adjusting it's values to lighten and desaturate.

     

    Here's a flattened version (with added crazyness) to show you the effect.

     

    regards,

    steve

     

    3DribbonBallon.png

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 14, 2012 8:15 AM   in reply to Sanpanza

    Sanpanza wrote:

     

    Perhaps then Steve and Conroy, you might consider a query from me?

     

    Yes, of course!

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 14, 2012 8:18 AM   in reply to SG...

    SG... wrote:

     

    "Remove Hidden Lines"

     

    I think you meant "Remove Hidden Backfaces".

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 14, 2012 9:26 AM   in reply to conroy

    Thx! I updated the post with the correction.

     

    I wanted to second Ed that your directions and screenshots are really helpful and much appreciated.

     

    regards,

    steve

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 14, 2012 12:02 PM   in reply to SG...

    Thanks, Steve!

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 20, 2012 6:23 PM   in reply to Sanpanza

    Sanpanza wrote:

     

    How do I eliminate the artifacts along the edges of the frontal vertices of the well?

     

    I think I know what you're referring to, but to make sure we're on the same page, repost the image with red ellipses/boxes surrounding the artifacts which trouble you.

     


     

    As recommended by someone on the forums I started with a 32 bit grid map but knocked it down to 16 bits to speed up the 3d engine. Was my thinking correct? Can I use a gray scale image instead so PS CS6 doesn't get bogged down?

     

     

    I used an 8-bit grayscale image for the grid and I rendered to 16-bit output (i.e. my main document's mode was 16-bit RGB). Rendering to floating point 32-bit output images can have advantages when using illuminants with realistic intensities but it usually requires subsequent tone mapping. I don't think your illustrative image will benefit from that, so I recommend you render to 16-bit.

     

    There is absolutely no reason to use a 32-bit per channel image for that grid opacity texture. The grid has only black and white and is entirely horizontal and vertical lines, so you should be able to get away with a 1-bit per pixel texture, but use an 8-bit grayscale texture because I know that works in Photoshop

     

     

    The output of the final document is 5000 X 5000 pixels but the gravity well is but small element in the background so I have made it 3000 by 3000. If the 3D engjine is using vector math to draw the lines, does size even matter?


    The polygons making up the surfaces that are rendered will be calculated with vector maths but the size of the opacity texture should be large enough to prevent it becoming fuzzy due to upscaling to cover the surface area when rendering an image of a given size. Remember that a texture can be tiled (up to ten times in each direction) to repeat over a surface (using the UV Mapping Properties), so your grid doesn't need to define every "square" of the well.

     

     


    Can't figure out how to move a point light from the bottom so it matches the second example. I like the way this artist handles transparency in his grid. Can you tell me now to move the light. The interface is different than in CS5 tutorials.


     

    Click on a point light with the Move Tool to activate its manipulator then drag on the heads of the red, green and blue arrows. You might want to switch view to each of the top, right and front views to aid alignment. You can store the current 3D view before changing then return to it. There's a secondary view window that can be enabled, which would aid with alignment, but it doesn't show lights for some reason.

     

     

    Is it possible to select all the shape layers containing horizontal lines and change their width simultaneously? I am doing so one layer at a time.

     

     

    Do you mean to scale the width of the lines without scaling their offset?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 21, 2012 6:27 PM   in reply to Sanpanza

    Hi Ed

     

    Changing the stroke of multiple Shape layers works here. Multiple Shape layers can be scaled simultaneously, too. Did these functions not work as expected when you tried them in your document?

     

    You may find a document easier to handle if you merge multiple Shape layers into one with Cmd/Ctrl+E. Maybe merge all the horizontal lines into one Shape, and all the verticals into another. The Path Selection Tool and Direct Selection Tool have stroke control and they have alignment and distribution controls similar to the Move Tool.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 21, 2012 7:07 PM   in reply to Sanpanza

    You've absolutely nothing to feel guilty about, Ed. Many of us participate here because we enjoy helping, and we improve our skills and knowledge by trying to solve problems. Please ask for any help required.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 3, 2012 9:21 AM   in reply to Sanpanza

    Re: MathType

     

    If the copy/paste from MathType into Photoshop was satisfactory, that's probably the best way to handle it. MathType does allow saving as EPS though, so if that would be better, you might try that.

     

    Bob Mathews

    Design Science

     
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