Skip navigation
Currently Being Moderated

Grey outline around text

Nov 15, 2012 9:41 PM

Hi I have designed a brochure in illustrator which has a black background and white text, with magenta headings.  The printers are saying that there is a grey line around the text and yet I have applied no stroke and they also mention that it is not trapping?  I have designed the brochure in CS6 and they have CS5 and have selected illustrator CS5 when saving it but I am not sure how to fix it.

 

Appreciate your advice.

 

Screen Shot 2012-11-16 at 1.40.48 PM.png

 
Replies
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 16, 2012 3:16 AM   in reply to broomeGirl

    How is the black background colour made up? I think your problem will go away if you use a rich black.

     

    There seems to be some kind of stroke on the big pink E and there’s some bad anti-aliasing on Mobile Makeup Service.

    If you don’t want to use a rich black you may need to make a trap on the coloured type elements.

    Usually a trap of this kind can be made by giving the lettering a stroke set to overprint.

    View you artwork with Overprint Preview to make sure things are o.k.

     
    |
    Mark as:
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 16, 2012 6:06 AM   in reply to broomeGirl

    broomeGirl,

     

    #000000 is RGB (or web) speak. Literally translated to CMYK it would be soaking black rather than rich black.

     

    Are you supposed to deliver an RGB file for print?

     
    |
    Mark as:
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 16, 2012 6:19 AM   in reply to broomeGirl

    broomeGirl wrote:

     

    The printers are saying that there is a grey line around the text and yet I have applied no stroke and they also mention that it is not trapping? 

     

    The grey line around the text is a screen draw issue. It should not matter in printing, if the service bureau know their job and have the right equipment. Usually doing the trapping is their job. Or at least do they have to instruct you just how much trapping is needed since it depends on the machine and paper used for printing. Normally trapping is handled in the RIP.

     
    |
    Mark as:
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 16, 2012 10:36 AM   in reply to Jacob Bugge

    an off topic thought

    Jacob Bugge wrote:

     

    ...

    #000000 is RGB (or web) speak. Literally translated to CMYK it would be soaking black rather than rich black.

    ...

    Jacob, while the OP should speak a CMYK color space given this is the destination, if by soaking you mean C=100% M=100% Y=100% K=100% which is exceeding the allowed ink coverage, this is not possible in color managed programs if the color values are entered using the RGB color model. For example in a CMYK document using the RGB sliders set to 0 in the Color panel or entering #000000 in the hexadecimal input field of the Color Picker will result in CMYK values with the maximum ink coverage allowed as defined in the color space (profile) of the document. This can be seen in the Color Picker by checking the CMYK values when entering  #000000 or in the Color panel by switching to the CMYK sliders after using the RGB sliders. Changing the document profile for different paper using Edit > Assign Profile will give different CMYK values for the same RGB values that take into account the maximum ink coverage because print profiles for different media are made also using densitometers.

     

    And if the document is in RGB color mode but the destination is CMYK, the values will be converted at one point by software according to certain predefined rules and I don't think there will be ever a case where R=0 G=0 B=0 will end up as C=100% M=100% Y=100% K=100%. Soaking is only possible if entering CMYK values in a CMYK document and one way to ensure that the ink coverage will not be exceeded is for the very dark and black colors to enter the values using the RGB color model (sliders). Of course this will work properly only if the document profile is the same as the color profile of the printer (paper).

     
    |
    Mark as:
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 16, 2012 10:39 AM   in reply to emil emil

    I agree with your off > on topic thought, Emil, hence the wording literally translated.

     

    But any automatic translation of R=G=B=0 to (non soaking) CMYK will lead to uglifying misrepresentation in most or at least some cases, where rich blacks should be customized.

     
    |
    Mark as:
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 16, 2012 11:29 AM   in reply to Jacob Bugge

    May be in reality this is mostly the case because a lot of people on both sides (designers and printers) don't want to bother or find it difficult dealing properly with color management. But if it is done properly it works nicely. And the conversion can be done not only RGB to CMYK but CMYK to CMYK too. For example, let's take a document in the default U.S. web coated swap v2 space and imagine the user created colors with values that exceed the ink coverage which will cause soaking if the document is printed on another paper or entirely different CMYK printer and different paper. If the print house provides a color profile that describes correctly the limits of the ink coverage for the used paper then the profile can be used to find the needed rich black. You can even try that if you pretend that one of the CMYK profiles that come with Illustrator was a user installed profile supplied by the print shop for their printer. Create one document with the default U.S. web coated swap v2 space and a black box in it with C=100 M=100 Y=100 K=100. Create another CMYK document and using Edit > Assign Profile, choose the imaginary profile supplied by the print shop as say US Newsprint (SNAP 2007). Then open the Color Settings and change the Color Management Polices for CMYK to Convert to Working Space. Copy the black box from the first document and paste it to the new one. A warning may come that the destination is not the same as the working space in the Color settings, click OK and check the CMYK values. This is how the correct ink coverage limit can be ensured if the print house knows what they are doing and provides a color profile for their printer/paper.

     
    |
    Mark as:
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 16, 2012 1:20 PM   in reply to emil emil

    I was thinking of customization within the range of rich blacks, including cool and warm, Emil.

     
    |
    Mark as:
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 16, 2012 4:13 PM   in reply to broomeGirl

    For my part you are welcome, broomeGirl.

     

    Less than 100K is a bit unusual, but the overall balance may be good, especially because of the dual (triple) text colouring; without that, I might be inclined to let the warmth of the photos seep into the blackness.

     
    |
    Mark as:
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 16, 2012 4:18 PM   in reply to broomeGirl

    C=72, M=68, Y=66, K=89 (total ink in the region of 300%) sounds pretty much o.k. for hard (glossy or semi matte) paper.

    If you need to print on softer paper or newsprint you should lower the total ink to more like 250%, leaving the black (K) where it is but lowering the % of the other 3 colours.

     
    |
    Mark as:
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 16, 2012 4:33 PM   in reply to Jacob Bugge

    Jacob Bugge wrote:

     

    I was thinking of customization within the range of rich blacks, including cool and warm, Emil.

     

    I understand, the conversion itself doesn't change colors to nicer or worse, it tires to match them and the user is the one to decide and can change them before or after the conversion but I was talking about how to ensure the colors  are within the ink coverage range without exceeding it.

     
    |
    Mark as:
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 16, 2012 4:38 PM   in reply to emil emil

    I know, and agree, Emil, and Steve.

     

    I like the nicer or worse part.

     

    Edit: Half past one, I really have to attend to other duties.

     
    |
    Mark as:
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 17, 2012 8:39 AM   in reply to broomeGirl

    It is a coated matte paper and you should be fine with these values. The appearance on your screen depends on how you set it in Edit > Preferences > Appearance of Black but your current setup is good.

     
    |
    Mark as:
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 17, 2012 10:25 AM   in reply to broomeGirl

    broomeGirl,

     

    ... looks more black on my mac screen ...

     

    Your carefully calibrated monitor, we take it.

     

    And what Emil said.

     
    |
    Mark as:
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 17, 2012 11:37 AM   in reply to Jacob Bugge

    Hi Jacob. It’s here again with a vengeance. Freeze the b***s off an eskimo. :-)

     
    |
    Mark as:
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 17, 2012 2:24 PM   in reply to Steve Fairbairn

    Lucky you again, Steve. Monday morning may be the third this year with a reduced opacity in the ground greenery here, presumably followed by another fortnight of green, grey, and blue.

     
    |
    Mark as:

More Like This

  • Retrieving data ...

Bookmarked By (0)

Answers + Points = Status

  • 10 points awarded for Correct Answers
  • 5 points awarded for Helpful Answers
  • 10,000+ points
  • 1,001-10,000 points
  • 501-1,000 points
  • 5-500 points