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TVPRICH
Currently Being Moderated

Razor Tool should have single keystroke anywhere anytime.

Dec 13, 2012 8:57 PM

Tags: #custom #tool #key #razor

Often I find CS6 clunky feeling, such as some key commands that I often use during timeline editing. having to move back and forth between modes is so Ancient History that I feel like I'm cutting on a Moviola.  Cutting clips on the timeline should be a programable key stroke that doesn't need to be chosen first in the "Razor Tool". This way i have less to look at what i'm pressing and I could perhaps assign the letter 'X' to cut through my clips no matter what mode I'm in. Much faster.

 
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 13, 2012 9:06 PM   in reply to TVPRICH

    Often I find CS6 clunky feeling, such as some key commands that I often use during timeline editing. having to move back and forth between modes is so Ancient History that I feel like I'm cutting on a Moviola.Often I find CS6 clunky feeling, such as some key commands that I often use during timeline editing. having to move back and forth between modes is so Ancient History that I feel like I'm cutting on a Moviola.

     

    Maybe its you...

     

    Take a look at the Razor Edit shortcuts for this...before you come out all guns firing!

     

    If the short cut doesn't suit you..edit it so it does.

     

    Maybe you could even try editing a more professional and efficient way from the within the Source Monitor

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 14, 2012 12:34 AM   in reply to TVPRICH

    one still has to choose the razor tool to get to that shortcut. Why?

     

    Because shortcuts do different things depending in which tool is selected.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 14, 2012 1:20 AM   in reply to TVPRICH

    No Rasor Tool just the Selection Tool:

    Ctrl+K: add edit (Make sure the right track is selected),

    Ctrl+Shift+K: add edit to all tracks.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 14, 2012 7:58 AM   in reply to TVPRICH

    Wow! An Emmy winner! Back in the day, I once won an M II User's Group Award.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 14, 2012 1:08 PM   in reply to TVPRICH

    O.K

     

    Have you now found a single keystroke that serves your purpose?

     

    eg. Select the Razor Tool with one shortcut Key or make a razor cut with a shortcut key.

     

    I did not understand why you  thought. you  had to choose "Razor Tool" first?  How so?

     

    My point to you was... I did not think you looked thoroughly  at the short cut options before letting Adobe know what a dinosaur (Moviola) that this application was  in your opinion and maybe your very short experience of it.

     
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  • Al Bergstein
    107 posts
    Aug 8, 2009
    Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 14, 2012 10:38 PM   in reply to shooternz

    Well, i feel his pain. Having come from Vegas, where the letter S when you are working in the timeline cuts just like the razor tool without the two fingers,, it is frustrating at  times with Pr. But there pros as well as cons.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 14, 2012 11:57 PM   in reply to TVPRICH

    and I could perhaps assign the letter 'X' to cut through my clips

     

    Whats stopping you doing exactly that in Premiere?  Edit > Keyboard Shortcuts.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 15, 2012 11:30 AM   in reply to shooternz

    I feel the need to add my voice to this conversation.

     

    Here's the deal. I can easily use the existing shortcut, or change it to "X", or whatever. What I can't do, is simply hit Ctrl+Shift+K and have it cut through the timeline if I have been using the controls in the Program Monitor panel with my mouse. And yes, I admit that now and then, it seems easier to cut than to trim. Even on the timeline. So what if it isn't the "right" way.  There I am, moving the CTI one frame at a time and I decide that is the perfect place to cut or trim to. I decide to cut. But first I have to select the panel. Why?

     

    Perhaps Adobe could add a place in the keyboard customization menu that would let me swear that I know what I am doing and that I promise to only press Ctrl+Shift+K if I really mean it. I should not have to click on the sequence panel or use a shortcut to select it before  I use Ctrl+Shift+K.  

     

    The same goes for Ctrl-k. After all, if I click on the sequence panel. Premiere Pro remembers which track I had selected, so why not? If those shortcuts are lmited to the squence panel, why not carry out the command even if the panel is not selected?

     

    As far as that goes, I would be very happy to see a basic scripting language for Premiere Pro. Wouldn't it be great to be able to hit a key combination and have multiple things happen? Combinations of a few, or even many, shortcut combinations.

     

    @TVPRICH,

     

    Please forgive shooternz as he is quite helpful around here. We sometimes get a little possessive of, and protective of, "our" software. I used to hang out here a LOT. I was gone for a few years, but now I am back using Adobe products and back hanging out online again. I consider Premiere Pro to be "my" software, when in fact, of course, it is merely my choice in software. Although I used to have a little more say in the feature set. Not much, but a little more than just feature requests.

     

    The problem is that many new people make a statement instead of asking a question. When a question is asked, many of us fall over over ourselves in an attempt to answer a question and show off "our" software.

     

    Some of us would take your statement, tear it apart to address the issues, and seeing that you were not aware that you were making an error,  would take offense a little that you accused "our" software as being clunky and ancient. And if we are not careful, or annoyed that the export we started before going online is still not finished, we might answer in a way that is less than sweet and polite. And maybe less than just technically accurate like Ann's.

     

    Others might have been sweet like Ann quite often is. She really helps a lot of people around here too.

     

    Personally, I attempt a different strategy when I can. I try to address the reason the question is being asked instead of just answering the question. I do that because some people use words in their questions that confuse the issue. Like writing "render" when they mean "export". Stuff like that.

     

    Had I answered the original question, I probably would have said what Ann said, and then provided instructions for changing the shortcut to "X" and perhaps even went a step farther and suggested that maybe Ctrl-X might be a better choice to avoid accidental cuts.

     

    In any case, welcome to the forums, and if you have additional questions, feel free to ask. Just keep in mind that quite often the answer to the question is a link to the feature request form.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 15, 2012 12:35 PM   in reply to TVPRICH

    Not sure that you will ever just be able to make a cut (your way) if Premiere is not focussed on the Timeline (Sequence) Panel. Premiere has multiple Panels all with specific tasks.  The "Add Edit" command ( shortcut) seesm very specific to a timeline and none of the others.

     

    But I am curious about your workflow.

     

    When you make a single cut in the timeline...what is your next action?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 15, 2012 1:17 PM   in reply to Steven L. Gotz

    Please forgive shooternz as he is quite helpful around here.

     

     

    An epitaph written for my headstone with added plea,  to atone me for my sins!

     

    I often think I have been round these parts far too long ...and worn out my welcome.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 15, 2012 2:14 PM   in reply to TVPRICH

    Craig (Shooter NZ) is on the North Island of NZ (hence the screen name), but if you lure him with a bottle, or two, of Cloudy Bay Sauvignon Blanc, he might trek up to Burbank.

     

    Good luck,

     

    Hunt

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 15, 2012 2:19 PM   in reply to TVPRICH

    shooternz  as in a shooter from New Zealand.

     

    Invite accepted if I get that way. Thanx.

     

    I can visualise your workflow now and it sounds like you would have "focus" on the timeline panel most of the time anyway. 

     

    Assumeably you have found and are using shortcuts for Navigating Playhead, Add Edit, Ripple Deleting and Track Targeting as well.  All these can be done easily with no mouse input if you choose.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 15, 2012 2:23 PM   in reply to Bill Hunt

    Hey Bill

     

    ITs funny that NZ is famous for the Sauv Blancs but its not what most of my friends and I drink ( if at all).

     

    We have some very nice  Pinot Noirs but its the Pinot Gris that favour our palates mostly.  You have to find the style of them that suits I might add because they can be aweful as well.

     

    Lynnne and I drink a lot of nice Rose over summer as well and I am a huge fan of our "boutique craft beers" that we have in abundance here.

     

    But we digress and TVPRICH will be wondering  wtf?  

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 15, 2012 2:27 PM   in reply to shooternz

    Gotta' try the PG's. Have found some nice PN's from your area, but have never found any PG's, and I am always looking for a great one.

     

    Appreciated, and take care,

     

    Hunt

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 15, 2012 3:30 PM   in reply to TVPRICH

    I must admit that it really should not be that hard to remember to click on the correct panel, but I used to forget. A lot. So to be completely honest and in the interest of full disclosure, I got in the habit of hitting Ctrl-L (which I set up to access the timeline panel instead of Shift-3) and Ctrl-K in rapid succession, whether I needed to or not. The two letters are next to each other and my hands just sort of got used to doing it. So even if Adobe fixed it the way I suggested, it would probably take me a while to get used to NOT doing it that way. Habits are habits and once formed, they stick.

     

    So there, now they won't have to move this to the lounge because of all of that wine talk.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 15, 2012 4:32 PM   in reply to Bill Hunt

    Hey Bill

     

    A Premiere wine suggestion for you from the "cloudy bay"  Marlborough wine  region of the famous NZ Sauvys

     

    http://www.herzog.co.nz/wines/

     

    The Pinot Gris is very very nice.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 13, 2013 7:30 PM   in reply to shooternz

    I came across this thread after spending more time than I felt necessary trying to figure out the keyboard stroke for adding an edit. I got the answer early on -- that it's command plus k (thank you, Ann) -- but I have to sympathize with the original poster. I am new to Premier Pro, using it because I agreed to teach an editing class at a school that doesn't have Avid available. I love the idea of learning a new program, although doing it a week before I have to teach it has been challenging. But as I discover how Premiere is set up, I share a bit of the annoyance that other newbies may feel about features that seem counter intuitive. Premier does have a razor tool, which I think any reasonable, experienced editor would expect exists to cut a clip in the timeline. And Premier's list of shortcuts does say that the keystroke for the razor tool is the letter c. I spent a bit of unnecessary time -- no, not an eternity, but wasted nonetheless -- discovering the command k secret. That's really the point. Why make it appear that one keystroke is the shortcut when it turns out its really another? Why have both a razor tool and an add edit command? It just makes the software feel goofy. In fact I don't get the tool panel at all. Little on it seems necessary since the mouse cursor is context sensitive enough to make the panel redundant. And that's a good thing. (BTW -- I invested in a keyboard overlay to help me learn the keyboard shortcuts. The more I know about the program, the more I feel I may have wasted some money.) Like TVPRICH, I'm very experienced, have a couple of Emmy noms, ACE Eddy noms and wins, and know what I'm doing in an editing room. I have to say that Premier's occasional silliness makes me sympathize with any experienced editor who might feel cautious about how well this program would fare in a high pressure, professional editing environment. It may be fine, but for me it remains to be seen.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 13, 2013 7:49 PM   in reply to mark2ain

    Something you will discover is that Premiere often offers "more than one way to skin the cat"

     

    eg a Razor Tool for those that prefer a Mouse edit style and then a Short Cut Key  for "Add edit"

     

    So what is actually silly about that?

     

     

    CTRL- K ( Command -K ) is not a hidden or secrt command.  Its in the Default KB Shortcut Customisation List ( at least it is on a PC)  "SEQUENCE> ADD EFIT = CTRL-K  ..and its in the Help / User File

     

    I also have a Premiere Key Board that also indicates that its a known command for that function.

     

    I have to say that Premier's occasional silliness makes me sympathize with any experienced editor who might feel cautious about how well this program would fare in a high pressure, professional editing environment. It may be fine, but for me it remains to be seen.

     

    Hmmmm...do you consider teaching editing  fits into this category?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 13, 2013 11:32 PM   in reply to shooternz

    I'm fine with more than one way of cat skinning. The surprise is to discover there's this c key shortcut that actually seems to do nothing at all. That's what I mean by counter intuitive and -- to a new guy -- silly. The k key on the Logic Keyboard overlay I bought only references it's use as the shuttle stop and, when modified by the shift key, the command to "play around." Since k in all editing programs I'm familiar with is one of the transport commands, to find it used here as an add edit command too is also not intuitive. And as I said, that use is not indicated on the overlay so it is sort of a secret.  Everything is learnable, of course. I'm talking about a first impression.

     

    No, I don't consider teaching to qualify as a high pressure editing environment. That's probably why I'm doing more of it in my old age. That's also why it's fun to take on the challenge of teaching something at the same time I'm learning it. I can't do much damage and whatever issues I encounter with PrPro, I'll always have it down better than my students. But right now if I were approached by a producer with a high budget editing job and told that for some reason the studio had decided we should cut on Premier, I would anticipate problems -- at least until the software proved to me it could handle the complexity.

     

    (Perhaps I should add that it's not only this shortcut issue that leads me to feel that way. That just happens to be the quirk I was trying to figure out this evening.)

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 14, 2013 4:02 AM   in reply to mark2ain

    Anything you find to be not intuitive...change it until it is.

     

    I have customised many actions to suit my self because of this.

     

    BTW - the overlay on your keyboard was not designed by Adobe so its hardly their fault that you think it's a  "secret".

     

    Its documented and customiseable.

     

    But right now if I were approached by a producer with a high budget editing job and told that for some reason the studio had decided we should cut on Premier, I would anticipate problems -- at least until the software proved to me it could handle the complexity.

     

    And you have worked this out after a mere week of experience with the application.

     

    [personal insult removed]

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 14, 2013 9:34 AM   in reply to mark2ain

    this c key shortcut that actually seems to do nothing at all.

     

    It changes the tool to the razor blade, so you can cut with a mouse click.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 14, 2013 10:33 AM   in reply to Jim Simon

    Yes, I see that the keyboard shortcut allows me to add an edit with the mouse. The reason I keep calling that counter intuitive is that to me the purpose of a keyboard shortcut is precisely so I don't have to use the mouse.

     

    As for the fact I can customize the program and that I'm bound to be more comfortable should I use it more over a longer period of time, I'm certain that's true. I was commenting on a feeling I get about it's design based on my first impressions -- and agreeing with the original poster who had similar feelings and seemed to get attacked here for having them. What shooternz fails to understand is that my impressions as well as those of the first poster are those of experienced editors who have put other editing programs through the wringer. That gives us perhaps more credibility than those of, say, your average freshly minted film school graduate. Shooternz seems to be on some mission to protect Premiere and does that by attacking other people's credibility or competance. I want to reassure him that my intention in coming on an Adobe forum is both to find out how the software is meant to work as well as to alert others to issues that perhaps could be addressed better by the program's designers. There are a few other functions Premier lacks which for the work I usually do -- dramatic narrative editing -- are more important to me than whether or not a silly shortcut key is useful. If I were using Premier for that sort of project, I'd be visiting this forum more often.  Still my intentions would be constructive. I have no malice toward Premier. I own no stock in any other software company.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 14, 2013 10:57 AM   in reply to mark2ain

    Welcome to the forums!

    mark2ain wrote:

     

    Yes, I see that the keyboard shortcut allows me to add an edit with the mouse. The reason I keep calling that counter intuitive is that to me the purpose of a keyboard shortcut is precisely so I don't have to use the mouse.

    I hear you, but many of our users are beginners who don't think to use a keyboard shortcut. They see a picture of a razor blade in the Tools pane and reach for that. We have a lot of new users who find Premiere Pro amongst the other applications in the Creative Cloud, they might be totally new to editing and will find the razor tool more suitable for them. We also have a lot of users that are coming in from Final Cut Pro 7 where they are used to having both a razor tool and and Add Edit keyboard shortcut. As you might imagine, it is difficult to please all these people in addition to professional editors used to other applications.

    mark2ain wrote:

     

    There are a few other functions Premier lacks which for the work I usually do -- dramatic narrative editing -- are more important to me than whether or not a silly shortcut key is useful. If I were using Premier for that sort of project, I'd be visiting this forum more often. 

    Please do share. We have dynamic trimming tools in CS6 which blow the doors off other NLEs in many respects. These are great tools for fine-tuning dialogue scenes. If we don't have the functions you are looking for, I'd like to know about them so we can get some feature requests written up.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 14, 2013 1:08 PM   in reply to TVPRICH

    I mapped the middle button on my mouse to do an "Add Edit" which saves a lot of time.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 14, 2013 1:26 PM   in reply to mark2ain

    I was commenting on a feeling I get about it's design based on my first impressions -- and agreeing with the original poster who had similar feelings and seemed to get attacked here for having them.

     

    I was commenting on the fact that after one week you and the OP had not actually discovered how the application worked. 

     

    Your first impressions were based on your experience of other applications and your expectation that Premiere would do it the same way.

     

    This Forum is littered with similar first impression comments from  "immigrants" who had not spent any time checking out the options.

     

    Seemed to me that  you only wanted things your way and that others techniques and preferences  were not considered worthy.

     

    Shooternz seems to be on some mission to protect Premiere and does that by attacking other people's credibility or competance

    .

     

    Not at all.   Long before you got here I have fought my battles to try and get some "silly" Premiere issues "fixed". 

    To no avail...so I have given up and live with them.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 14, 2013 3:43 PM   in reply to mark2ain

    I keep calling that counter intuitive is that to me the purpose of a keyboard shortcut is precisely so I don't have to use the mouse.

     

    Well, it sort of fits that bill.  The purpose of that particular shortcut is to change the tool, which it does, instead of you clicking on the tool in the Tools pane.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 14, 2013 10:30 PM   in reply to Jim Simon

    Were I to start listing all functions I wish Premiere had -- or perhaps has but I haven't discovered yet -- I feel like I'd be starting a whole new thread. And -- to shooternz point that I haven't spent enough time with the program to deserve an opinion -- let me add that I've discovered these issues (at least they are to me) while doing no more than trying to prepare some teaching materials. It's precisely the low pressure situation I'm in that makes me wonder what I'd discover under greater demands. So -- with no intention of starting a bunch of new discussions without new topics -- I'll list a few frustrations: I've yet to figure out how to use the trim monitor so I can scrub audio while making single frame adjustments to a cut. I've yet to figure out how to slide a cut from the keyboard i.e. using the J-K-L keys and don't know if there is such a feature. Clips that I know I've created with an alpha channel (one which is recognized in other programs) don't seem to be interpreted as having any alpha. If I want to share a project or just copy it to another computer (as in -- I've created a demo project at home, want to bring it to the school's computer and open it there) I find that copying a project, pasting it to another computer's hard drive, and trying to open it leads -- at least so far -- to a crash and a "serious error has occurred" message. Those are a couple of concerns that far exceed my brief hiccup with the c command.

     

    Shooternz suggests I haven't been checking out the options. But that's the very reason I'm on this forum. I came here because I kept hammering on the damn c key trying to add an edit to a clip and nothing was happening. So I checked out my options - HERE. And what I discovered was another person who had had the same frustration, got the correct answer, but then also got attacked for not having figured it out for himself. I was expressing my sympathy. Why shouldn't this forum be "littered with immigrants?" If we can't come here for support, where then?

     

    Yes, a razor blade icon is a clear indication that there is a way to add an edit to a clip. Yes, the icon makes it obvious I can do that with a mouse. But if I point the cursor at the blade icon, the tool tip opens telling me the shortcut is c. With that information presented in the interface, what would lead either an experienced or an inexperienced editor to decide to go looking for an add edit command? The fact I'm having trouble communicating that this is unnecessarily confusing is itself confusing.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 15, 2013 10:05 AM   in reply to mark2ain

    Were I to start listing all functions I wish Premiere had

     

    You start and end below.  Anywhere else will likely be unheard by those who matter most (the programmers).

     

    https://www.adobe.com/cfusion/mmform/index.cfm?name=wishform

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 15, 2013 10:00 AM   in reply to mark2ain

    or perhaps has but I haven't discovered yet

     

    FAQ: How do I learn Premiere Pro?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 15, 2013 10:05 AM   in reply to mark2ain

    If we can't come here for support, where then?

     

    Start here:

     

    http://helpx.adobe.com/pdf/premiere_pro_reference.pdf

     

    Then come to the forums.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 15, 2013 10:07 AM   in reply to mark2ain

    if I point the cursor at the blade icon, the tool tip opens telling me the shortcut is c.

     

    That how all Adobe programs work.  The shortcut listed when you point at a tool is only for the selection of that tool, not necessarily it's function.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 15, 2013 11:17 AM   in reply to Jim Simon

    Thanks for the links Jim. When it comes to feature requests, I find myself oddly agreeing with shooternz -- I don't yet know enough to ask for features. I'm just looking to understand how the program works as is. And since my purpose is to teach a class, waiting for the next iteration of the software doesn't solve my immediate issues.

     

    I clicked on the FAQ and couldn't find a search field. So I'm not sure how it would have helped in the instance I came here for.

     

    I clicked on the help pdf. That does have a search field so I typed in "How do I add an edit to a clip?" The search turned up no result. I then tried one of the other issues I mentioned earlier. I typed "How do I scrub audio while trimming?" That search also turned up no result.

     

    I see now that the shortcuts are tool selectors. I realize also this is an Adobe legacy from its being built around programs such as Photoshop and Illustrator where one is using the cursor a lot to draw vector lines or make selections while using the keyboard at the same time to alter cursor behavior on the fly. That works great for masking, etc, but a professional editor needs keyboard shortcuts more for speed than functionality alone. Of course one can edit using mouse clicks, but in a studio set up, where one is usually working with either two monitors or a single very large one, dragging a cursor around all that real estate is a time consumer. My issue on that point wasn't in coming to an understanding of what the shortcut does. My issue was in being criticized on a help forum for not having figured it out for myself.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 15, 2013 11:32 AM   in reply to mark2ain

    Your search queries are too complex.  Keep them simple.

     

    Add Edit and Trim turn up the relevant information.

     
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