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A bit of help with a logo

Dec 23, 2012 6:37 AM

Tags: #design #inspiration

Hello,

 

I wonder if someone might be able to give me a bit of direction with a logo.

 

This is the web site: https://neighbourgood.co.uk and this is how it looks:

neighbourgood.JPG

 

The thing that I am not so sure what to do with is the arrow/shadow.  So, like most of my design work everything developed as I went along and originally, I had a pale background.  I quite like the house, sun, cloud combo but like I say, I am having trouble with the arrow/shadow part.  The reason why I want to keep it (one option is to remove it) is because the site itself is to with, "signposting" which is an important concept in modern social care.  So, an arrow and a reference to pointing is what helps keep all that together.  Now I have told you that I made my mind up to keep the shadow/arrow I admit that I don't know a) what's wrong with it and b) what to do to fix what I'm not sure is wrong.  It just doesn't feel right.

 

Thanks for your help, forgive my ramblins and Happy Christmas.

 

Martin

 

PS I am up for any other criticical comments so long as it doesn't include the words, "Start again."  I couldn't bear that because this bad boy has consumed about 80 hours head scratching and Illy wrestling!

 

Message was edited by: martcol

 
Replies
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 23, 2012 6:53 AM   in reply to martcol

    Martin,

     

    It is all a bit dark under the sun; it might be more suitable with a moon.

     

    Apart from that, if you open the door a bit, you will have a nice sharp narrow shaft to your arrow.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 23, 2012 10:20 AM   in reply to martcol

    You did not ask about this but I will state my opinion.

     

    The visual and subjective concept of the log o is brilliant, the light of the sun causing the House to cast a shadow which forms the outgoing direction of the arrow as a the cast shadow. Very brilliant.

     

    But the house itself is to literal and  what I mean by that is that it is too detailed to reproduced samll and there may be times when you would want this logo to be small. I don't say that the detailed house is not fine it has a certain charm to it. But the logo has it stands is more an Illustration than a logo although there have been successful logos that are more or less illustrations.

     

    Have you thought about simplifying the the geometry?

     

    I also not sure about the need for the cloud!?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 23, 2012 11:42 AM   in reply to martcol

    Martin,

     

    Going with the sun and brightening up the background would give a more clearly distinguishable shadow arrow. You may use a simple green/blue background with a horizon where you decide between the base of the house and the sun. The lack of trees, neighbouring houses, and the like, may be a bit strange given the name.

     

    With the moon, you might try a solid black shadow arrow and some suitable value of K for the surroundings, maybe with a certain amount of green/blue below/above a horizon.

     

    In any case, the house actually shaping the arrow is a fine and subtle concept.

     

    I should miss the cloud if it drifted away.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Dec 23, 2012 4:20 PM   in reply to martcol

    For my part you are welcome, Martin.

     

    Happy New Year, looking forward to our seeing the New Neighbourgood.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 7, 2013 2:40 PM   in reply to martcol

    I like it, Martin.

     

    Such a dark blue is fine. If you wish something different you might consider a peachblow (for the front and a corresponding darker colour for the openings and side) or something similar. And maybe a brighter sun. And you may consider a slightly darker green to ground the ground.

     

    Obviously, the colours should both work together and with any relevant colours outside the logo.

     

    Why the concave arrowhead, a straight one seems more natural (a real shadow)?

     

    A last suggestion: if you put the Pointing You in the Right Direction at the bottom, below the longer text, the arrow may actually point at it (and the position of NEIGHBOURGOOD could be adjusted relative to the other parts).

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 7, 2013 3:09 PM   in reply to martcol

    Hi, Martin,

     

    At the size image you've shown us (after clicking on it to show full size) the letter e in both the and Direction look like letter o with a bar across it, distracting to me. If you don't want to increase the type size, perhaps a different font?

     

    Peter

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 9, 2013 11:41 AM   in reply to martcol

    Martin,

     

    How about moving the full sun (that is still showing in the tab), or a plain round sun or a (crescent/half) moon, up in the left corner so it looks right with the direction of the shadow?

     

    The Neighbourgood has turned into Neighbourhood under What Next?

     

    If I were you I should forget about Kuler and choose the colours more freely, trusting that what looks right is right.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 9, 2013 7:50 PM   in reply to Jacob Bugge

    I don't wish to confuse anything. I haven't read the entire thread. But a downward, right pointing, arrow often results in the impression of saddness, depression, meloncholy, or otherwise unhappy feelings. You may want to rethink that shadow which creates a downward arrow. Downward left is the worst. Downward right isn't great. Upward right is best (happy, joyous, etc). Upward left is somewhat neutral.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 9, 2013 8:01 PM   in reply to martcol

    I agree with Wade about it being to literal and too detailed for a logo. It needs to be more link a symbol and be able to work when scaled down. I think you've done a great job at simplifying it in your more recent revisions.

     

    I also agree with Scott abou tthe downward arrrow. I know it sucks, I've been in a similar situation and tried to convince myself that it didn't matter because I had spent so much time on it but I ended changing it in the end. I think you could stick with your concept though and just move the shaddow behind the house, pointing in an up-right direction. If you wanted to keep the sun you could then move it in front of the house, but I personally like it without the sun.

     

    I think the type needs some attention. Doesn't have to be more complicated - in fact I think you could get rid of that white box - just a bit more clean and modern.

     

    Great concept

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 9, 2013 8:06 PM   in reply to [scott w]

    I'm not contradicting you, Scott, merely curious: what is the basis for this assessment of arrow directions?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 9, 2013 10:57 PM   in reply to tromboniator

    Psychological studies I read during college. Granted many years ago. And forgive me I coudn't name them now. Through real world testing throughout my career I've proven these psychological aspects via my own projects. Any project with an upward right direction to it seems to always pull a higher ROI. Just my experience. I avoid downward, and especially downward left, motion in any design as much as possible.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 9, 2013 11:05 PM   in reply to [scott w]

    Okay, thanks; good enough for my purposes!

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 9, 2013 11:45 PM   in reply to tromboniator

    I found this Peter... just some light reading

     

    http://theses.gla.ac.uk/1072/

    (You can download the PDF for free without registration)

     

    It's not anything I have read before but seems to cover the same basic thesis. Upper right quadrant of motion tends to incite the most pleasant emotions.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2013 3:40 AM   in reply to [scott w]

    Scott,

     

    So (drop) shadow be hanged?

     

    What if the arrow, far from being the downcast end, points to the horizontal punch line, which would even end up (literally) in the comforting neighbourhood still in the picture when the pointing to the punch line was suggested (posts 7&8)?

     

    My suggestion was borne out of a notion that the whole thing addresses a serious issue (consistent with the down(cast) arrow and emphasized by a moon/night scene as suggested in posts 1&4) and offers a straightforward/uplifting solution.

     

    For me this is an inspiring exchange of thoughts.

     

    Just starting to read the words of the lady from Glesga, and also trying to fully grasp the nice and comforting effects of underhead lighting with shadows up on the walls.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2013 6:54 AM   in reply to [scott w]

    All the 231 (230 numbered) pages of the thesis seem to be about biological motion, almost all (except for pages 10 - 13 and 21 - 23) specificalluy about human motion.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2013 9:59 AM   in reply to martcol

    Martin,

     

    I must say that I really like and still prefer the natural shadow that is in accordance with the house shape and angle, especially with the sun as suggested. As you have also seen already, I like the dynamics of the issue (bad) > solution (good), which actually implies its starting with the issue.

     

    Apart from that, the dark side/roof opposite to the shadow (and towards the sun) is strange. The sun somewhere up there would fit the downcast shadow.

     

    Edit: I just realized (some three quarters of an hour later) that you may just have pressed the nearest Reply button, rather than actually replying to my post(s).

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2013 11:41 AM   in reply to Jacob Bugge

    Jacob Bugge wrote:

     

    All the 231 (230 numbered) pages of the thesis seem to be about biological motion, almost all (except for pages 10 - 13 and 21 - 23) specificalluy about human motion.

     

     

    Motion is motion Jacob. The thesis is generally about how perceived motion (even if human motion) elicits emotion. But again, I hadn't read that entire PDF.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2013 12:27 PM   in reply to martcol

    Martin,

    You've lost me there..

     

    Trying to be less obscure:

     

    I see the original version(s) single house (to the viewer: your house) and the shadow that falls from as it representing an issue (anything from an overturned dustbin to burglary or fire), in other words: you may need help (with something bad); this is most obvious in the darkest first version, but it also works in the others. So far this is even in accordance with the shrink aspect.

     

    But:

     

    Then the viewer immediately sees the arrow literally Pointing you in the right direction, in other words helping you to find the (good) solution, the concept good actually being part of the name in a fine and subtle play of word(s).

     

    With this, the logo presents a whole story, (almost) from the dark and stormy night to the happy ending, which may be directly represented by the neighbourhood/Neighbourgood in the second version.

     

    What more can anyone wish for?

     

    And there!

     

    At first I (mis)read your post #20 as a direct reply to my post #19/20 and decided to try to clarify what I meant, obviously with questionable success.

     

    I try to always hit the Reply button of the OP, unless I reply to a specific post, but it requires a conscious and unfailing effort which is impossible.

     

    The absence of a general reply button causes some confusion sometimes.

     

    Edit: There is still one Neighbourhood in the What Next section.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2013 12:22 PM   in reply to [scott w]

    Motion is motion Jacob.

     

    Indeed, Scott.

     

    I am also fully aware that a still may also have a perceived motion, but not necessarily, hence my drop shadow question (or everyone should change to hop shadows).

     

    Also, when it comes to shadows, up can be rather distressing, like those from underhead lighting in horror films.

     

    But in this case, as mentioned, I find the inherent story intriguing and uplifting, actually emphasized by any graveness at the beginning.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2013 12:58 PM   in reply to Jacob Bugge

    Here's my take (forgive the quick rendering ofthe logo)....

     

    You can use a shadow but you need to be aware of the overall "motion" which is percieved in the image and intentionally alter things so it presents a more favorable impression. Just because the arrow/shadow may be at a downward arrow it doesn't mean the entire image needs to have that motion percieved.

     

    With the shadow in the lower right quadrant, the sun in the upper left quadrant and the demensioning of the house - this all leads to a downward right motion. If you move the sun to the upper right quadrant and move the shadow to the lower left quadrant you retain both elements but change the motion perception entirely.

     

    directions.png

     

    English speaking people read from left to right, so that is how any logo is initially percieved. If you start low and end high, you've gained the proper motion. Start high, end low, you leave readers on a down beat.

     

    I may be over maticulous, but I never use the canned Adobe 120° angle for drop shadows. I much prefer a 60° angle or 90° angle for this reason.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2013 1:54 PM   in reply to [scott w]

    Thanks, Scott. As Jacob says,

    Just starting to read the words of the lady from Glesga

    and so far am more distracted by the proofreading and editorial needs of the the writing (one of my more despicable habits) than absorbed in the content, but it seems interesting enough to continue as time permits. I appreciate the link.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2013 3:13 PM   in reply to martcol

    Scott, I may be too used to boustrophedon, or the lack of lateralization is catching up. But you had me fooled with the Downward left is the worst in post #12. And I am still inclined to stick with the (bad>good) story.

     

    Peter, I did notice the non insignificant occurrence of errors, but I believe I have a lesser degree of CPRD.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2013 4:14 PM   in reply to Jacob Bugge

    CPRD

    Incurable.

     
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    Jan 11, 2013 2:01 PM   in reply to martcol

    I like that even better, Martin.

     
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