Adobe Community: Very poor video quality after transcoding in Adobe Encore CS5.1

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Very poor video quality after transcoding in Adobe Encore CS5.1

Dec 26, 2012 1:03 PM

MERRY CHRISTMAS AND A HAPPY NEW YEAR!

I have very poor video quality after transcoding the video file (MPEG) in Adobe Encore CS5.1. Below you see my used settings in my filmproject.

The problem exists after transcoding in Adobe Encore CS5.1. I checked all steps and found out that there is no problem until transcoding. My exported file in MPEG has very good video and audio quality.

Facts:

1. Camcorder: Panasonic AG-AC160AEJ

Operating System : Windows 7, 64 Bit, Ultimate edition

Source files: MTS files

Recording settings (clip settings):

Type: MPEG Movie

Image Size: 1920 x 1080

Frame Rate: 25,00

Source Audio Format: 48000 Hz - compressed - Stereo

Project Audio Format: 48000 Hz - 32 bit floating point - Stereo

Pixel Aspect Ratio: 1,0

2. Sequence settings in Premiere Pro

Sequence was created from Clip directly with settings above.

3. Exporting settings in Adobe Premiere Pro:

Match sequence settings was activated. Now other changes were set.

4. Exported File:

Video

Image Size: 1920 x 1080

Data Transfer Rate: 25920 kBit / s

Frame rate: 25

Audio:

Bit rate: 384 kBit / s

Channels: 2 (stereo)

Frequence: 48 kHz

5. Transcoding settings in Adobe Encore:

I used different transcoding settings such as automatic DVD Transcoding, CBR and VBR.I also set “use maximum render quality”. But all results were always the same: very poor quality.

Why does the encore transcoding cause such bad video quality?

How can I solve this problem?

Please help me soon.

Best regards.

3717 Views 46 Replies Latest reply: Jim Simon, Dec 30, 2012 7:31 PM

Replies 1 2 Previous Next

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1. Ann Bens,

Dec 26, 2012 2:09 PM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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If you want to make a dvd from your HD file.
export to mpeg2-dvd with multiplexer off. This will give you a video file and audio file.
Import this into dvd project in Encore. Make menu and burn. No transcoding will occur.

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2. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 27, 2012 1:32 PM in reply to Ann Bens

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Dear Ann,

I tried many options, including MPEG2-DVD with multiplexer off, in PremierePro in exporting settings. The exported file in your suggestion has poor video quality although the preset setting has highest quality.

I tried also H.264 and other export settings. The results were the same.

When I used "Match sequence settings" in the exporting settings in Premiere Pro, I got as result the xxxx.MPEG file with excellent quality.

BUT after the transcoding the xxxx.MPEG file in Encore, the viedo quality is absolutely poor!
The simple and free DVD authoring tools such as "DVDStyler" or "DVD Flick" have the better results than Adobe Encore!!!
It must be a reason for it. As I read in forums, many people claim about the quality in Encore.

Who can give me other tipps or a solution for this big problem?

Regards

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3. Stan Jones,

Dec 27, 2012 1:56 PM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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If I understand your examples, you are exporting high def files from Premiere and then comparing them to Encore files after it downrezzing them to DVD size. Ann's suggestion is to export/transcode once, from Premeire, so that the file says "do not transcode" once in an Encore DVD project. Is that what you tried? How does the DVD-pixel-size MPEG2 look from Premiere?

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4. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 27, 2012 2:27 PM in reply to Stan Jones

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Hi Stan,

yes, I did not transcode the exported MPEG2-DVD file in Encore, as you know, it does not need to be transoced in Encore again. The problem is that the exported MPEG2-DVD file has the poor quality.

Here are the settings in exporting process in Premiere Pro:
Format: MPEG2-DVD
Preset: Match Source Attributes (Highest Quality)
Source: xxxx.MTS, 1920 x 1080 (1,0), 25 fps
Output: PAL, 720 x 576, 25 fps

Regards

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5. Jim Simon,

Dec 27, 2012 5:36 PM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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You understand there will be some unavoidable degradation due to the scaling? There's nothing you can do about that.

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6. Stan Jones,

Dec 27, 2012 5:49 PM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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In my post 3, I was responding this;

When I used "Match sequence settings" in the exporting settings in Premiere Pro, I got as result the xxxx.MPEG file with excellent quality.

BUT after the transcoding the xxxx.MPEG file in Encore, the viedo quality is absolutely poor!
In your post 4, you indicate that you are now exporting a file from premiere that does not look good.

Export a short, representative piece and post where we can download and take a look.

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7. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 27, 2012 10:49 PM in reply to Stan Jones

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Hi Stan,

I exported now a short clip (about 42 seconds) by using following exporting settings in Premiere Pro:

Format: MPEG2-DVD
Preset: Match source attributes (highest quality)
Codec: MainConcept MPEG Video
Frame Rate: Automatic (based on source)
Field Order: Automatic (based on source)
Pixel Aspect Ratio: Automatic (based on source)

Bitrate Encoding: VBR, 2 Pass
Multiplexer: None

Result: poor video

You can download the video and audio files by following links:

http://www.klavierlehrer-bayern.de/download/test_short_mpeg2_DVD.m2v
http://www.klavierlehrer-bayern.de/download/test_short_mpeg2_DVD.wav

When I export the same clip by using the option "Match sequent settings", then I get very good quality. But the problem, if I use this file in Encore, after transcoding is the video quality again very poor!

Regards

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8. Ann Bens,

Dec 28, 2012 4:33 AM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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Your example is not bad considering its HD to SD. You could tweak the bitrate.
Don't use match sequence settings.
Use a preset (like NTSC widescreen high quality) or set everything manually.
Or use Dynamic Link and let Encore do the math.

If you want better quality use avisynth + HC encoder or frameserving +TMPGenc.

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9. Stan Jones,

Dec 28, 2012 6:56 AM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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Listen to Ann.

Note that of the settings you are giving us, you are not reporting the bitrate. The "highest quality" is a preset name; it does not mean taht you cannot tweak the bitrate and get better quality. Edit: the default for that setting is an average target of 6, max of 7. Many users push those.

When you play this back and see it as poor quality, what player are you using and are you making sure it is not zoomed? (Make sure the computer window it is playing in is not full screen, but 720x576.

Note that you have the think black lines left and right. Set output crop to "scale to fill."

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10. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 28, 2012 7:54 AM in reply to Ann Bens

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Hi Ann,

1) I did not only „Automatic (based on source)“ options in my tests, but also many other customized options.
The results are very poor. I have done a new test with the following settings. The result is also poor:

Download link: http://www.klavierlehrer-bayern.de/download/test_mpeg2dvd_1.m2v

Export Settings:
Format: MPEG2-DVD
Preset: Custom
Codec: MainConcept MPEG Video, Quality: 5
Frame Rate: 25 fps
Field Order: Upper
Pixel Aspect Ratio: Automatic (based on source)
Render at Maximum Rate: [active]

Bitrate Encoding: VBR, 2 pass
Minimum Bitrate (Mbps): 5
Target Bitrate (Mbps): 9
Maximum Bitrate (Mbps): 9

GOP Settings
M Frames: 4
N Frames: 12

Use Maximum Render Quality: [active]

Multiplexer: None
2) Why shouldn’t I use the “Match Sequence Settings” in exporting? Because of the big output file size?
I used it and the results are very good as I expected:

Download link: http://www.klavierlehrer-bayern.de/download/test_MatchSequenceSettings .mpeg

Export Settings
Match Sequence Settings [selected]
1920 x 1080, 25 fps, Upper, Quality 50
User Maximum Render Quality: [active]

3) I tried also Dynamic Link in PremierePro (to Encore).
The results are also poor.

4) I will test also LagarithLoslessCodec and frameserving +DGMPGDec. But the video is vertical long drawn-ot.
I think I did not use it correctly.

Regards

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11. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 28, 2012 8:13 AM in reply to Stan Jones

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Hi Stan,

> When you play this back and see it as poor quality, what player are you using and are you making sure it is not zoomed?
I use Philips 46PFL8606K to see the results. The automatic zoom is disabled.

My source file has 1920 x 1080i, 25 fps, PAR 1,0. I use PAL standard in DVD creating because of compatibility in Europe.

Regards

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12. Stan Jones,

Dec 28, 2012 8:35 AM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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> When you play this back and see it as poor quality, what player are you using and are you making sure it is not zoomed?
I use Philips 46PFL8606K to see the results. The automatic zoom is disabled.
How are you playing the mpeg file on the tv?

Your second link in the last post is a high def export. It should look much better. It does. But it also shows the only problem I see in the others - the combing like appearance that makes me wonder about interlacing. (I am viewing the mpeg/m2v on vlc, and setting deinterlace on removes this).

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13. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 28, 2012 9:13 AM in reply to Stan Jones

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Hi Stan,

> How are you playing the mpeg file on the tv?
1) I copy the m2v file to a usb stick and attach it on Philips TV.
2) I am viewing mpeg and m2v file by using both VLC and Windows Media Player.

Bye

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14. Ann Bens,

Dec 28, 2012 10:19 AM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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DVD looks horrible on hdtv.
You need a BD player or a DVD player with upscaler.
A dvd file played full screen on a 1920 widescreen lcd computer screen also looks awful.
The only time it will look very good is on an analog tv.

If you want a good picture make a BD.

Cant open last link.

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15. Jim Simon,

Dec 28, 2012 11:19 AM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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My source file has 1920 x 1080i, 25 fps, PAR 1,0. I use PAL standard in DVD

And there is the issue. There's just no way to make a DVD look as good as the original high definition media. It's just not possible.

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16. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 28, 2012 12:20 PM in reply to Ann Bens

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Hi Ann,

the issue is not related to players!!!

Bye

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17. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 28, 2012 12:29 PM in reply to Jim Simon

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What do you mean, Jim?
You mean that good quality DVDs cannot be created by using PAL standard?
Please explain more in detail.

Regards

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18. John T Smith,

Dec 28, 2012 12:38 PM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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Message #1 in http://forums.adobe.com/thread/1120039 is a picture example of the screen size at various resolutions

Down scaling from HiDef to DVD throws away a LOT of information... so a DVD will never look as good as a BluRay

If you play a DVD in an upscaling player it will be "somewhat" better than a regular player

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19. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 28, 2012 1:08 PM in reply to John T Smith

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Hi John,

the issue is not related to DVD players. I see the poor quality also in my PC by using VLC or Windows Media Player.

Regards

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20. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 28, 2012 1:18 PM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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WHO CAN EXPLAIN ME WHY I GET a VERY GOOD VIDEO QUALITY, WHEN I SET THE EXPORTING SETTINGS INTO "MATCH SEQUENCE SETTINGS" in ADOBE PREMIERE PRO?

I get the a relative big output file in MPEG format.
Then, if I use this output file in Encore and transcode it, the file becomes very poor video quality.....WHY?

Thanks in advance.

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21. Stan Jones,

Dec 28, 2012 1:38 PM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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WHO CAN EXPLAIN ME WHY I GET a VERY GOOD VIDEO QUALITY, WHEN I SET THE EXPORTING SETTINGS INTO "MATCH SEQUENCE SETTINGS" in ADOBE PREMIERE PRO?
The one you posted above like this retains its HD pixel size (1920 x 1080). It is not DVD size (720 x 576).

Then, if I use this output file in Encore and transcode it, the file becomes very poor video quality.....WHY?
Encore must reduce it to 720 x 576.

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22. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 28, 2012 1:54 PM in reply to Stan Jones

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Hi Stan,

>> Encore must reduce it to 720 x 576.

OK, what is the solution?

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23. Ann Bens,

Dec 28, 2012 5:05 PM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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OK, what is the solution?

DVD is 720x576 you cannot change that. It has nothing to do with Encore. That is just how dvd's are made.
If you want the quality you got with you match sequence setting you will have to make a BluRay disk and forget all about DVD.

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24. Stan Jones,

Dec 28, 2012 7:43 PM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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>> Encore must reduce it to 720 x 576.

OK, what is the solution?
Ann has pointed to the solution a couple different ways. Export from Premiere as a file that does not require Encore to retranscode it. Maximize your bitrate. Or dynamic link to Encore as automatic.

Judge the quality on an HD TV only from a butrned disk using an upscaling DVD player.

You are complicating this by exporting HD quality files and focusing on the different between HD and SD. We are having difficulty addressing the quality of specific files.

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25. Stan Jones,

Dec 29, 2012 5:53 AM in reply to Ann Bens

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Ann, if I look at this in VLC player and turn deinterlace on, the combing appearance is gone; looks much better. I can't burn a test disk at the moment. I can see the combing even in the original; is this an artifact of viewing via VLC or ?

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26. Ann Bens,

Dec 29, 2012 6:37 AM in reply to Stan Jones

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I am unable to open the two links in post 10.

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27. Stan Jones,

Dec 29, 2012 6:43 AM in reply to Ann Bens

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I did a save target as.

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28. Ann Bens,

Dec 29, 2012 6:59 AM in reply to Stan Jones

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The first link does not let me download.
I managed to get the second one.
But this is a mpeg in hd resolution. Cannot comment on the Quality as i never make these and besides thery are not suited for intermediare file.
I like to see the original straight from the camera.

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29. Jim Simon,

Dec 29, 2012 9:05 AM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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You mean that good quality DVDs cannot be created by using PAL standard?

No, I mean they will not look as good as the original. It's very possible your expectations are simply too high on this one. There will be some loss of quality going from HD to DVD. You just can't avoid that.

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30. Jim Simon,

Dec 29, 2012 9:06 AM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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WHO CAN EXPLAIN ME WHY I GET a VERY GOOD VIDEO QUALITY, WHEN I SET THE EXPORTING SETTINGS INTO "MATCH SEQUENCE SETTINGS" in ADOBE PREMIERE PRO?

Because in this case, Match Sequence Settings creates a high definition output. DVD requires a standard definition file, so there will be quality loss.

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31. Jim Simon,

Dec 29, 2012 9:08 AM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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OK, what is the solution?

You have two options.

1. Live with the loss of quality on DVD
2. Create a Blu-ray instead, which keeps the original HD quality.

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32. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 29, 2012 1:25 PM in reply to Ann Bens

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Hi Ann,

I think the industry has forgotten the billions DVD user in the world.

Regards

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33. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 29, 2012 1:26 PM in reply to Ann Bens

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Hi Ann,

the links are no more available. I deleted all on the server.

regards

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34. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 29, 2012 1:31 PM in reply to Stan Jones

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Hi Stan.

I tried many options, also Ann's suggestion.
Bad quality...

Regards

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35. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 29, 2012 1:33 PM in reply to Jim Simon

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Hi Jim,

you mean that the people MUST have BluRay to get a good video quality?
How about with industry standard in business and consumer area?

Regards

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36. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 29, 2012 1:35 PM in reply to Ann Bens

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Hi Ann,

the exported MPEG file (Match Sequence Settings) are available now in the link
http://www.klavierlehrer-bayern.de/download/test_MatchSequenceSettings .mpeg

Regards

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37. Ann Bens,

Dec 29, 2012 2:18 PM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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I managed to download this file already.
I was referring to the mpeg2-dvd.
Is it possible to upload the original.

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38. Aida-filmmaker,

Dec 29, 2012 3:45 PM in reply to Ann Bens

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Hi Ann,

I uploaded a part of the original recording file (.MTS, about 93 MB). You can download it from

http://www.klavierlehrer-bayern.de/download/2012_Weihnachtsmusikcal_Sc hule_13-12_1.MTS

Regards
Claudia

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39. Stan Jones,

Dec 29, 2012 4:59 PM in reply to Aida-filmmaker

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I tried many options, also Ann's suggestion.
Bad quality...
What are you describing as "bad quality"? Other than the combing I am describing, your DVD sized piece (and the one I exported using your full pixel size download) are not "bad" for DVD quality.

You seemed to not understand the effect of keeping the full pixel resolution n the PR export, so I am not sure you are correctly assessing what you have.

Have you burned a disk and watched?

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