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Problems with laying out text in InDesign CS6

Feb 22, 2013 6:26 AM

While working on a book I encuontered some problems with InDesign CS6. Maybe these probles could be found in earlier versions, also.

 

 

  1. Nested paragraph styles (parent/child) does not work properly (let's say - the font is always taken from the parent style, and so on). I have to change the font using Find Font very often.
  2. Every last line on any page (within document witn continious text) can not be manually hyphenated (I think that InDesign treats every page as separate one).
  3. The user must decide if the master page elements should be locked or editable on the pages, not InDesign. Please, remove that restriction from the master pages (like QuarkXPress).
  4. A new page should be automatically opened when there is no more room for the text on the previous page. No, please, I don't want to use Story Editor or InCopy. I want to layout text directly in InDesign.
  5. I start a new document (only one page, with facing pages option activated). I <shift> click on the upper left corner and InDesign opens as much pages as needed. But, sometimes there is a problem that a lot of (left) pages are left blank. No, there is not page break setting in Word document or something else. The problem is in InDesign.
  6. There is no Macedonian hyphenation dictionary. So, can you tell me if there is an option, like in PagaMaker, to create an user dictionary and to put word by word hyphenated with tildas (or something else) for future use?
  7. Sometimes I have to change some glyphs with new ones. But, when I <alt> click on a paragraph style to reformat it, new glyphs are replaced with the old ones. Can this be fixed somehow? QuarkXPress in its new version offered us some interesting trick on this subject.
 
Replies
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 22, 2013 7:24 AM   in reply to Petar_MK

    1. may be caused by having applied a character style (which would not show as an overrride) or local formatting to the text...

     

    2. is a setting in your hyphenation options

     

    3. ID is not Quark, and you need to stop thinking like a Quark user to get the most out of it. Master frames are mostly usesless, but if you insist on using them they can be overridden by holding down the Cmd(Mac) or Ctrl(Windows) and Shift keys and clicking on them. Master frames do not need to be overridden, and should not be, for placing external content, especially text, as that removes them from the master threading.

     

    4. Enable Smart Text Reflow

     

    5. Sounds like you have a text frame on the right master page that is not threaded to the left.

     

    6. You can create a USer Dictionary, though it may not do what you want. You can also look into whether there is a Hunspell dictionary for Macedonian.

     

    7. Alt Click on a paragraph style is the command to remove local overrides. If you want to simply change the style to a different one, slect the style without using the Alt key.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 22, 2013 12:50 PM   in reply to Petar_MK

    7. I don't want to change the patagraph style. simply to reapply it without changing the glyphs.

    Can you describe this with a little more detail?  Do you mean that you are manually selecting contextual alternates by going to the Glyphs panel and clicking-and-holding on a glyph to select an alternate?  Because there may be better ways for you to get the alternate glyphs you want, that do not induce overrides. It sounds like you may be inducing overrides simpy by selecting alternate glyphs - so of course when you clear overrides (by alt-selecting a paragraph style), your manually-selected glyphs disappear.

     

    E.g. you go into the Glyphs menu to manually select small caps alternate glyphs, then when you clear overrides by alt-clicking you lose your smallcaps, because your paragraph style overtly specifies Normal in the Case: area in Basic Character Formats. (In this example, you'd be best served by making a character style called SmallCaps that only applied this one feature you need.)

     

    But that's just a guess - if you can go into more detail I'm sure we can figure out some way for you to get what you want.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 22, 2013 12:53 PM   in reply to Petar_MK

    1. No style was applied.

    Then you may need to state the problem more clearly. Why do you have to use Find Font?

    2. it is not about the last word, but about the whole line.

    What does hyphenation have to do with a whole line? Are you saying you can't type a hyphen anywhere in the line?

    3. I don't think nor Quark user, neither InDesign user, simply -- user.

    In any event, InDesign gives you full control over whether an item on the Master is editable from the document page.

    4. how to enable smart text reflow?

    Read help: http://helpx.adobe.com/indesign/using/threading-text.html#use_smart_te xt_reflow

    5. I starts new document with only one page. The other pages are added by InDesign.

    That's one possible scenario. There are many others you can initiate.

    7. I don't want to change the patagraph style. simply to reapply it without changing the glyphs

    Why does it need re-application? If you add something to a paragraph, that isn't part of the applied style, (local formatting), then you reapply the style, it is you disposing of the local formatting, not InDesign. Just click without Alt.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 22, 2013 2:58 PM   in reply to Petar_MK

    Microsoft made a mistake when implementing Macedonian language. When I want

    to swich to italic font, some characters turn into Bulgarian. So I use

    Find/Replace/Glyphs to make the changes throughout the document, but when I

    want to reaply the paragraph style (for some reason) the glyphs turn back

    into Bulgarian again.

     

    I suspect that the answer for your issue is "use a font that is well-built" but I can't say that until I actually know what you are doing. Despite their extensive array of glyphs, that really can't be said of most Microsoft fonts. I mean, they draw some nice glyphs at Ascender, but the advanced font features seem to be designed to work in Microsoft applications only. 

     

    Are you picking contextual alternates from within the same font? Or are you picking them from another font? If the latter, then obviously you'd need a character style. You sound knowledgable enough to already know that, so I suspect you are picking alts from the same font. Which font(s) are you using? What letter(s) are rendering incorrectly? It's very useful if you open up the Glyphs menu and tell us the official Unicode name from the mouseover popup.

     

    Is it oblique Cyrillic ghe? (I'm just guessing - I do some Bulgarian typesetting, but I can't tell you the last time I handled Macedonian. Are you using a Greek gamma instead?)

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 22, 2013 3:44 PM   in reply to Petar_MK

    Petar_MK wrote:

     

    2. When the words of the last line of the page are too loose, I try to

    hyphenate the first word of the next page, but it does not work. I must use

    (shift) (enter) to the part of the word to cut it and that word to go to

    the previous page and then manually add hyphen sign at the end of the line.

     

    The last line of a page gets too loose because you disallowed automatic hyphenation of the last line on a page.

    From the online InDesign Help on Hyphenation:

     

    Hyphenate Across Column
    To prevent words from being hyphenated across a column, frame, or page, deselect this option.

     

    -- and you must have exactly that in your style(s). Look here:

     

    hyphenate.png

     

    Message was edited by: [Jongware]

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 23, 2013 4:44 AM   in reply to Petar_MK

    Please see http://helpx.adobe.com/indesign/kb/add_cs_dictionaries.html

     

    There are Macedonian language Hunspell dictionaries, but not being a user of Hunspell it's not clear to me if these dictionaries include hyphenation rules.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 23, 2013 9:16 AM   in reply to Peter Spier

    @Peter Spier

     

    From the first paragraph of the page you linked to:

     

    Support for Hunspell dictionaries in InDesign CS6, to verify spelling and to hyphenate words, extends the number of languages shipped with the product...

     

    Take care, Mike

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 23, 2013 1:45 PM   in reply to MW Design

    I believe I saw a note further down the page not to repalce the exisiting dictionaries for hyphenation, so, having no direct experience, I can't say one way or the other.

     
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