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Encore replacement Software

Jun 20, 2013 10:05 AM

Tags: #not #encore #future #the #duh

Please give me  suggestions for Adobe compeditors to DVD and Blu Ray authoring since I can no longer rely on Adobe as they are dropping Encore becasue its so 2010 and discs are not the future (what a load of BS)

 
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jun 20, 2013 10:44 AM   in reply to AlistairGraham

    [Moved the discussion to Encore Forum]

     
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    Jun 20, 2013 11:14 AM   in reply to AlistairGraham
     
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    Jun 20, 2013 11:48 AM   in reply to AlistairGraham

    Click the link I provided and read

     
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    Jun 20, 2013 11:51 AM   in reply to AlistairGraham

    I don't think anyone reporting here has researched the alternatives sufficiently. Short term, those of us who own (well, rent with a perpetual license or otherwise have access to) Encore CS6, will continue to use it. In the meantime, we'll research alternatives.

     

    Start here:

     

    http://www.videohelp.com/tools/sections/authoring-bd-hd-dvd

     

    Note that this listing shows an Encore "CC 7.0," which does not, of course, exist. I sent them a note.

     
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    Jun 20, 2013 12:58 PM   in reply to AlistairGraham

    What do all the pro video production companies use ?

    The answer used to be Scenarist, now owned by Rovi. Links to Scenarist there appear to be dead. Look at post 5 here:

     

    http://forums.adobe.com/message/5309554

     

    Sony products and others?

     

    http://www.videohelp.com/tools/sections/authoring-bd-hd-dvd

     
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    Jun 21, 2013 11:15 AM   in reply to AlistairGraham

    You can use Encore CS6 with Premiere Pro CC. Adobe blog post explaining how to do here http://blogs.adobe.com/davtechtable/2013/05/using-encore-cs6-with-prem ierepro-cc.html.

     
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    Jun 24, 2013 7:38 AM   in reply to AlistairGraham

    AlistairGraham wrote:

     

    Please give me  suggestions for Adobe compeditors to DVD and Blu Ray authoring since I can no longer rely on Adobe as they are dropping Encore becasue its so 2010 and discs are not the future (what a load of BS)

    Indeed it is pure BS. The main reason Encore is dead is (I suspect) because Rovi have killed Sonic off completely - which is to my mind a nasty thing to do because their main business is streaming media and it seems they bought Sonic in order to kill them off & remove the main competitor. Streaming on demand means you pay every time you watch a film, assuming you have

    A - a fast enough internet connection, and

    B - an unrestricted one (most are not, despite the adverts saying "completely unrestricted" they will be throttled back under the small print "fair use" terms). The internet is one of the few areas where "unrestricted" does not mean unrestricted, rather like telephone companies saying the same thing with "unlimited" that turns out to be nothing of the sort.

     

    Thanks to Rovi killing off Scenariost SD/BD and all the MPEG-2 encoding tools, things are difficult.

    I am not sure what else is still available except for Sony's DVD Architect (definitely a going concern, and unless you include DVDSP it leaves Sony as the only player left now) and - perhaps - Media Chance Lab's "DVD Lab Pro 2" - I will check with the writers to see if new licenses are still available.

     

    DLP (as we know DVD-Lab Pro) is a very, very good tool. It does have issues but these can all be worked around and I am waiting to find out of new licenses are still available.

    Support for this tool is also very good - one of the mainstays in the forums knows more about this app than I can begin to describe & it is very good indeed.

    I would also recommend any DVD authors to get a copy of the wonderful PGCEdit. It's donationware, but well worth $50 of anybody's money as it allows you to edit a compiled Video_TS without having to go back into authoring again.

    The other fly in the ointment will of course be getting product to replication as Encore's DDP & CSS functions are seriously unreliable and the layer break routine is a joke.

    GEAR Pro Mastering Edition is the way forward here and there will soon be an update to this that will, when you create a new project as a DVD9, look for all valid layer break points & give you the choice before master DDP files are created. GPME will also handle CSS scrambling (and does it properly, unlike Encore) and is in my opinion invaluable.

     

    BluRay is harder - there are now only 2 applications that can output spec legal BDCMF folders with AACS applied (mandatory).for replication (again, Encore cannot do this at all and required an addon to manage this. Both are owned/coded by Sony Creative Media.

    1 - DoStudio. This comes as a modular tool, and starts very cheaply indeed with the DoStudio Indie option (Straight BDMV only) or the EX addon module, and you can also get the BD-J module as well as a 3D module. Unlike Scenarist, the basic version is fully expandable.

    2 - BluPrint. This is Sony's top-of-the-line tool, and you will need a remortgage to get into this one.

     

    DoStudio is suitable for beginners to intermediate users and requires a good working knowledge of PhotoShop. This is the tool we use (we run DoStudio EX with BD-J module) and have made several successfully replicated titles that passed folder/content verification from Sony DADC with no trouble at all.

     

    http://www.mediachance.com/dvdlab/dvdlabpro.html

    http://download.videohelp.com/r0lZ/pgcedit/index.html

    http://www.gearsoftware.com/pro-mastering.php

    http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/dostudio

     

    The demise of Encore is a sad day, I believe, as it could have been so good if only the bugs had been nailed, and support for more advanced operations added via scripting.

    DLP requires a certain amount of knowledge of the structure of DVD - Encore's abstraction layer boxed it into a corner to a great extent and the way every timeline became a new VTS was a nightmare of complexity, as it forced nearly all menus into the VMGM domain. It is full-spec, and there is very little it cannot do.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jun 25, 2013 2:50 AM   in reply to Neil Wilkes

    If you're primarily going to be making DVD's, I would try DVDRemake Pro.  It's not the most user friendly, and requires knowledge of registers and the DVD structure, but it makes up for it by being extremely powerful.

     

    I generally design my DVD menus in photoshop, compile with Encore and then put the DVD's together with DVDRemake Pro, mostly because Encore doesn't support DVD navigation programming.

     

    You can check it out here:  http://www.dimadsoft.com/dvdremakepro/

     
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    Jun 25, 2013 1:35 PM   in reply to Neil Wilkes

    1 - DoStudio. This comes as a modular tool, and starts very cheaply indeed with the DoStudio Indie option (Straight BDMV only) or the EX addon module, and you can also get the BD-J module as well as a 3D module. Unlike Scenarist, the basic version is fully expandable.

     

    It costs ~$2500. Is that "very cheaply"?

     
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    Jun 26, 2013 12:27 AM   in reply to Yellamokara

    Yellamokara wrote:

     

    1 - DoStudio. This comes as a modular tool, and starts very cheaply indeed with the DoStudio Indie option (Straight BDMV only) or the EX addon module, and you can also get the BD-J module as well as a 3D module. Unlike Scenarist, the basic version is fully expandable.

     

    It costs ~$2500. Is that "very cheaply"?

    Compared to what you will have to pay for BluPrint ($50,000 and upwards plus the encoders), compared to what you woiuld have had to pay for Scenarist (2D vertsion was £25,000 retail, and if you wanted to go to 3D you had to pay a similar amount as there was never any upgrade path fromn Scenarist SD > BD > BD3D) and even compared to what I had to pay for DoStudio when it was still NetBlender (I paid £5000 for the base mode, plus additional for the EX & BD-J, coming in at a total of £13,000) then yes - I would say a pitiful $2500 that gets you an application capable of replication (which is something Encore never dould do) is VERY cheap indeed.

     

    It may be well to remember that technically, Encore cannot create BluRay discs - it can create BD-ROM, but Encore's output certainly should never be described as BluRay bevcause it isn't. No written disc is "BluRay" and no written discs should carry the BD logo because it is non compliant.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jun 26, 2013 12:30 AM   in reply to bigmanfontu

    bigmanfontu wrote:

     

    If you're primarily going to be making DVD's, I would try DVDRemake Pro.  It's not the most user friendly, and requires knowledge of registers and the DVD structure, but it makes up for it by being extremely powerful.

     

    I generally design my DVD menus in photoshop, compile with Encore and then put the DVD's together with DVDRemake Pro, mostly because Encore doesn't support DVD navigation programming.

     

    You can check it out here:  http://www.dimadsoft.com/dvdremakepro/

    Interesting - is that for Mac?

    On PC we have something called PGCEdit - it allows 100% complete access to all navigational/menu/buttons etc and you can edit what is alteady compiled.

    The biggest problem with Encore is the way that it turns each timeline into a single clip VTS - the amount of dummy menus required is insane.

     
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    Jun 26, 2013 1:01 AM   in reply to Neil Wilkes

    I  was curious what software do the studios use or Criterion, is it

    BluPrint?

     

    Note to Adobe and Apple .- People still need to author dvds and blu rays, if you are a videographer or filmmaker, you are most likely going to deliver a disc at some point.  

     

    Now with Apple we know they don't care, but I thought Adobe listened to professionals? When was there an outcry from professionals saying they don't need Encore?

     

     

    To quote Stan Jones over at the cow boards:

     

    I think it is ultimately that Adobe does not want to invest the money/programming resources to fix problems. It is absurd to say that Encore is not being brought into CC because the future is somewhere else.

     
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    Jun 26, 2013 1:05 AM   in reply to Joe Riggs

    Joe Riggs wrote:

     

    I  was curious what software do the studios use or Criterion, is it

    BluPrint?

     

    Note to Adobe and Apple .- People still need to author dvds and blu rays, if you are a videographer or filmmaker, you are most likely going to deliver a disc at some point.  

     

    Now with Apple we know they don't care, but I thought Adobe listened to professionals? When was there an outcry from professionals saying they don't need Encore?

     

     

    To quote Stan Jones over at the cow boards:

     

    I think it is ultimately that Adobe does not want to invest the money/programming resources to fix problems. It is absurd to say that Encore is not being brought into CC because the future is somewhere else.

    Hiya Joe.

     

    Most of the big studios use Scenarist - always have, always will.

    For regular DVD, it is either Scenarist, Maestro or DVDSP (which used to be Maestro before Apple screwed it up).

    I honestly believe the reason Encore is dropped is because the authorcore was licensed from Sonic, who no longer exist having been killed off by Rovi (who are a streaming media company that bought Sonic out in a hostile takeover & closed them down 2 years later). Not sure why behaviour like this is even legal.

     
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    Jun 27, 2013 7:35 AM   in reply to Neil Wilkes

    Well, this explains a lot. I didn't know Adobe was dropping Encore -- shows how out of touch I am, I guess.

     

    So is it even possible to create a Blu Ray compliant file in Encore to send out for replication?

     
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    Jul 8, 2013 1:03 AM   in reply to MannyEdwards

    MannyEdwards wrote:

     

    So is it even possible to create a Blu Ray compliant file in Encore to send out for replication?

    If the people you are sending it out to have the necessary add-on by Rivergate Software

    1 - BluStreak Tracer

    2 - BDCMF Export Add-On

    You need both, as the important one (BDCMF Export) only seems to run alongside the other one - so it's a $600 investment. Pretty cheap option - although it is Mac OSX (10.6 & later) only. If you are on PC, you have no way to get this done.

     

    The problem is the mandatory AACS scrambling, and Encore simply cannot do this.

     
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    Jul 14, 2013 6:13 AM   in reply to Neil Wilkes

    Yes, it's really sad to see Encore go away.

     

    It seems that we have three options:

    1. Stay with Encore CS6 and be aware of that a new OS can/will eventually break it.

    2. Buy another authoring application for conumers. (Cheap)

    3. Buy another authoring application for professionals. (Expensive)

     

    #2 is problematic for those who want to create their own menus since many of them applications are template based. I tried the kind-of-popular TMPGEnc Authoring Works 5 and like to work in that program. But, if i have a timeline with five chapters the menu created will have five buttons and i have not yet found a way to remove anything in a template. (Or add my own buttons to a custom background i have made)

     

    #3 is among other reasons problematic since it's more expensive. I tried DoStudio and the learning curve seems quite steep and it could not even playback 1080p24 in realtime on a HP Z800 with 2x6-core processors. It seems that those applications is kind of "work-with-blindfolds" when coming from the Encore world when i am used to see my menus, see my timelines, etc. I tried DoStudio, BD Author and Easy BD Pro. I don't do so much authoring that i can justify the price and the time i will have to spend to learn the applications either.

     

    Sony DVD Arhitect is a no-go since it don't support popup-menus. Maybe it will in the future. I don't even know if that is a good program.

     

    I am personally looking for an alternative that let's me use my own menus, is reasonably priced for an enthusiast, don't take too long to get into the how-to-use-mode.

     
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    Jul 21, 2013 1:21 PM   in reply to Averdahl

    Put the image you want into a premade button:

     

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYx56bqPOlE

     
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    Jul 22, 2013 1:23 AM   in reply to _Paz_

    Thank you _Paz_,

     

    I am an experienced Encore user, so i don't need tutorials for how to use Encore.

    ,

     
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    Jul 23, 2013 6:27 AM   in reply to Averdahl

    Ooops!

     

    On re-reading I see you were talking about a different program, TMPGEnc Authoring Works 5.

     

    >>I don't need tutorials

     

    I'm a brand newbie and I do.  I've been watching so many of them lately it's all starting to run together.  My apologies for not paying attention.

     
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    Jul 23, 2013 8:04 AM   in reply to Neil Wilkes

    Just read your comments.

    Sounds like you have a handle on what other software options are available.

    Thank you for your support in keeping us all informed.

    PLEASE continue to offer your advice and comments.  Your comments are relevant and provide people direction.

     

    It is sad to think that a giant like Adobe with endless resources, would just give up on the challenge to make Encore a viable and competitive product.  And to announce the ending of Encore with such a BS reason that no one believes, is an insult to most people's intelligence. 

     

    I'm 65 and have been a loyal Adobe advocate for decades, but I think Adobe have really chopped the legs from under its customer base, which will not be forgotten.  People will continue to speak highly about their marvelous products, but always with the caveat "ya but do you remember what they did to Encore."

     

    I hope that a young startup company may see this as an opportunity to fill a niche.

     
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    Aug 1, 2013 5:55 PM   in reply to AlistairGraham

    Please let me know what you find. I am having the same problem. I purchased Production Studio which included Encore DVD and now I cannot use it becuase Adobe won't let me reguister it! WHat the heck?

     

    Please let me know if you find a solution

     
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