Will you consider adding compatibility please??
Love the dark interface - been waiting a long time for that actually. Never knew why it didn't happen when Photoshop got it. But very dissapointed that I cannot open FLAs with AS2 in them, perform an update, and simply export them back out.
Yea yea... I heard it - Adobe doesn't "support" AS2 anymore. But that doesn't mean that new products we are paying for should have zero "compatibility" with our previous work. Opening , editing, and closing an AS2 -based FLA file does not mean I am refusing to get on board with AS3 after a million years. It is a simple necessity. I prefer AS3 for coding to AS2. I get the focus on the latest scripting rev. I get that it uses the better VM that runs 10 times more efficiently blah blah - so better for mobile etc. (probably the motivator here). So, no longer "supporting" AS2 programmers - as in being there to help/encourage people who still write it etc - is understandable at this stage. BUT to disable the ability to open a legacy file with AS2 in it - perform a simple edit and reexport it - is a horrific decision. Here is just one real world example of why.
The group I work with has developed HUNDREDS of learning modules and tools over the last DECADE using Flash. Some of tools are complex interactive games etc - that require updates from time to time based on requests. Am I supposed to entirely recode them so I can use my new software? This as opposed to spending 15 minutes on an update and export? Each lesson module uses a custom designed AS2-coded shell environment that loads - on average - 30-50 external swf files - all coded in AS2 themselves because the shells cannot load AS3. To go backwards and reprogram the shells themselves (very complex), as well as all the interactivity and videos and buttons and audio and testing that is inside these shell-loaded swf files (numbering in the thousands likely) would be an enormous and absurdly wasteful undertaking.They regularly need small or minute updates to their content - mere text changes here and there even - previously taking only minutes to perform. Now, if I export the swf, it will be AS3 and won't work. These updates are done regularly. Are we supposed to now say "hey - client - guess what - your stuff needs to be completely retooled for no good reason - even tho it runs beautifully as-is" ?? I can't even open an FLA and export it out if it has AS2 in it??? I don't expect Adobe "support" in regards to new AS2 projects, but backwards "compatibility" is another thing. Some people have a ton of work still being used on a regular basis that was written prior to AS3 being the standard - and the clients don't care about AS3 - they care about their budgets.
I will have to keep Flash CS6 installed apparently, even tho I pay 50 bucks a month for the CC. Flash - for many of us interactive devs, who build stuff for government contracts and/or big companies that are still running IE7 and IE8 across their corporations (with no intention of updating anytime in the near future - believe it) have no option other than Flash, so we still spend an incredible amount of time in this tool. I can't just kick out static down-staged images for these guys with my magical Edge Animate software. Great product too - which I use for other things - but not the silver bullet of online animation/interactivity by any stretch of the imagination.
The older version FLA can be opened in Flash Pro CC.
If it contains dropped features, few examples of what will happen are:
Reference documentation: http://helpx.adobe.com/flash/using/opening-cs6-files-cc.html
Also note that you will be able to open fla created in Flash Pro CC , back in CS6 if you need to add AS2 code and complie.
Hope you find this useful.
Thanks for your reply Sujai. This is good information. But unfortunately the delimma remains. There is no setting in Flash Pro CC for exporting to AS2, so anything built in AS2 that loads these files is not going to be able to anymore. Also, the amount of coding involved in the loaded files in many cases is hugely time consuming and intricate, so, having to go back and recode it all to AS3 would be serious pain and suffering, and still wouldn't resolve the AS2 shell loading issue. And - no one would pay for it. Why would they?
Just reeeeeeally irked with Adobe for turning their noses up at legacy FLA files and the possibility of them needing to be part of current workflows. Legacy software being used in conjunction with the latest software is a fact of life in all computer-based industries. These guys in aerospace are still working with Fortran for godssakes. Paying companies don't care about the latest and greatest languages and so forth. If it works and it is gorgeouse and it sounds great... they keep it for a VERY long time. That means we as developers need to be able to keep working with it for a very long time. Unfortunately I think Adobe overlooks this and assumes it is some hard-assed mentality that refuses to code properly with the latest revision or something. Quite the contrary. It is based on real world requirements and constraints - and heck just plain practicality. If it aint broke, don't fix it is pretty much the mantra of the payer. And Flash aint just for gaming Adobe, even tho you repurposed it for that like a few months back, that doesn't make the world just instantly torch all their previous software solutions. And all this talk of telling everyone to simply upgrade IE9+ and stuff... lol try telling that to some monster-huge company with an already strained IT department with a billion protocols in place for going to the bathroom. Or worse - tell it to a goverment agency. Aint happening anytime soon - and Adobe seems to be pushing ahead as if this is not a reality - like we are all building goofy iPad-compatible web pages for some simple online art gallery. Very annoyed right now.
But - yes, thank you for your info Sujai, you are most kind and very thorough too. I'm just ranting right now man. Unbelievable. Sigh.
I feel ya The Jayster
Here is my rant...
I work for a large company with a ton of legacy files that need updating periodically.
Just had to work on something just the other day because the path to a server needed updating.
This would be impossible to do in Flash.CC unless I recoded the whole app.
Nobody is going to pay for that when it works perfectly already for years.
If you have to maintain legacy code for several sites you need to be able to edit any file you have ever created.
I started out with Flash 4 ( 1998 ) and have had every single version since.
Even when there was very little offered in the upgrade.
I will not be using Flash.CC though.
1) I need to edit legacy files.
2) I will not rent software.
3) I do not agree with the restrictions imposed by CC
4) There is no way to edit new files created in Flash.CC if you quit.
Saving as CS6 version will loose forward features added in Flash.CC
( Exporting to Dart would be an example );
I could think of more reasons but whats the point.
These are my gripes with Adobe.
1) Went to a "rent to use" software model.
2) Ended support for mobile browsers.
3) Removed design view from FlashBuilder.
4) Cant edit legacy files in Flash.CC
I am also sad to see Fireworks go bye bye.
That was also in my original Macromedia Suite along with Dreamweaver.
I have upgraded those too over the years.
I'm sure that Dreamweaver will be next on the chopping block.
Guess we have little choice but to stick with what works.
I have recently been tasked with converting our video chat product to HTML5/CSS3/JS
I decided to use Sencha for the framework.
Although I have been able to recreate the interface and most of the functionality there are some huge roadblocks only Flash can handle.
1) Broadcast your Webcam/Microphone via any Desktop browser or Mobile app.
2) RTMP support for live video encoded from a browser or app, RemoteSharedObjects and onSync events.
So I guess I will be stuck in the muck along with you.
Shame on Adobe for self destructing and alienating its long time fatefull customers.
I have always been gung-ho for Flash but my ho's been gunged.
FB3 - you are in my shoes exactly. Thanks for describing your scenario as well! A classic case study.
Adobe... listen to FB3. This is yet another perfectly described, real-world example of a major issue you are creating for software developers that have promoted and utilized your software suites for many many years. We have stacks and stacks of legacy files that we still need to access and use. We may even recieve them from others! To not provide compatibility with legacy code is simply ignorant. Your recent actions are worthy of igniting the sparks of conspiracy theory in my opinion. You and Apple - and all the product-centric promotion and advertising on your site and in your videos etc... it's getting weird.
And FB3 - I'm totally with you on the Fireworks thing too. I found Fireworks to be my personal go-to for image editing. It was far more user-friendly imo. I am very annoyed to see it disappear from here on. I'm quite certain that Adobe has not performed their latest round of feature and application executions based on customer surveys and feedback. I can't fathom Flash devs saying they don't want legacy compatibility anymore - or web graphics guys saying Fireworks is useless and they don't ever use it. A clear case of steering the ship based on their own private agenda - trying to force the planet into some sort of development workflow that is much too premature for real-world scenarios.
There are still MANY BIG organizations in this world who use a huge array of different browser versions that are incompatible with the work-in-progress HTML5 stack. Flash is still the only logical answer for these groups. And Flash was not just a banner ad tool - it is/was a robust software development tool. That software is still out there being used - in so many ways you can't begin to pigeon hole it. Pushing forward like this is offensive. I'm not one to often gripe online about things either... but this is getting pretty transparent and annoying. I (the customer) pay Adobe salaries with my subscription and with my promotion of their suite of products in working with my clients. We should have a say in what stays and what goes. Perhaps we don't pay as much as some else?? I begin to wonder. One thing is obvious... what I need in the latest product suite is not a concern of Adobe's.
if you have as2 projects that you could edit before you install flash cc, you still have an as2 editor that works with those files. installing flash cc does not require removing any previous flash cs versions.
in fact, keeping older versions of flash has been needed for, at least, 10 years if you need to save fla files in formats compatible with flash versions more than 1 version older than the current version. that aggrevation is old news. there's no significant additional aggrevation with the current state of affairs.
removing AS2 it's one step for removing old features and this is only one right step to the future. If you have any as2 files and want to edit they - u can use old flash version. But coding with as2 it's like driving a horse in the city between cars. When cars will fly what than? You will be ready for this or still driving a horse?
kglad - that is a good point! Thanks for your response.
I have not yet been forced to keep previous versions of Flash running prior to this CC release, and I have been working in Flash (from a paid contractor perspective) I guess since 2001 or so. Probably because AS2 was the first version I started really working in anything that filled the role of a software application - and that was powerful enough to remain in widespread use still today. Software builds on itself over the years in some cases. So, for me - and probably many others - this form of aggrevation is new. I also don't find any real solace in the observation that all we have to do is keep the older software version around. There shouldn't be any need for that. It's bizarre. CS6 had backward compatibility for AS2 - why drop it? Just really short-sighted. IMO Adobe is suffering from some serious tunnel vision. as of late. Unfortunately for me - I generally love and depend upon their products.
Anyhow - I suppose aggrevation is the right word. Guess I'm in your boat now. I've got CS6 back up and running (was tough to find that little drop-down list to get it back) where it will stay for a loooooong time. Hope they keep it available tho! I'm a cloud member - been one since the very first minute. Makes me nervous - they have the keys. Sigh. Suppose I could "buy" it in other places if it that need ever arose. Oh well...
I'm getting a hold of myself over here. Catharsis is nearly over. I am powerless. lol
Anton - I get and appreciate your point. For many years now - if given the option - I have used AS3 over AS2. Obvious choice. But yer missing my entire point. Many of us long-time flash software devs have clients who are using older AS2 platforms! These are huge and robust and very expensive custom software solutions that they paid for already over the course of years and do not wish to retool for no apparent benefit. It would not be cost effective for them, and they are not interested in the latest "future-minded" coding that they cannot see or even read. They just want to keep the core software they paid for, and keep making small additions and updates upon occasion. There is still a huge need to be able to provide these services to these clients (huge clients btw). We are talking 100's of thousands of dollars in their investment over the years - tools that are running entire learning development platforms - and it all runs and performs perfectly as-is. AS2 or AS3 makes no difference to the end user, especially if it means more money. Removing my ability to use my latest software (which I was super excited about) and work on these legacy projects is annoying to say the least. And, it aint like they where written in AS1.
Anyhow - I've explaned my perspective on this string enough to bore most people to death likely. I'll leave it at this. Others can comment and discuss. A special thanks to fB3 for your very applicable post that reiterates my point exactly. Take care!
Sure clients have as2 project that work prefectly And you can offet swtich to new as3 Not for free ofcoarse
But as game and media developer I see why Flash Player Next was not releaseed. It's because big amount developers that still use as2. If they all will not publish for as2 anymore - this can just speed-up whole flash player developer team extend and impove Flash performance because they will not waste time for old as2...
But if you really need as2 - just install old flash professional
i don't know how you avoided clients that didn't have the latest nor the one prior to the latest version of flash. i even keep a log of which clients have what versions so i don't have to always ask them what flash version they're using.
i have one computer that has cs3, cs4, cs5, cs5.5, cs6 and now cc for the sole purpose of saving down to versions compatible with client versions. i could get by with every other version up to a certain point but i've never had a compatibility issue so i've always left the old versions alone.
see my message 5. no matter whether cc supported as2 or not, you would still need your older versions of flash if you have to send edited fla files to clients that do not have the latest (or one prior) version.
Ah yes - I see what you are saying. Hmm. I guess I have just been fortunate in this regard. All the other Flash guys I have worked with always keep their software up to date, and our FLAs have revved up with our new Flash Pro versions. I don't do a ton of sending my source FLAs to others actually - in the vast majority of cases I just do the work and kick out the SWFs for the clients. I'm a bit a of a permalancer I suppose. So, this has not been an issue for me in my 11 years of Flash work. But yes - if you worked with lots of different clients and/or team members and where sending tons of FLA source files all over the place - I could see how a need might possibly arise to have 2 or 3 versions back. Whenever that has happened to me, it has always been withn 1 or 2 versions. With the frequency of updating-type work I do, I typically open my files and resave them within a version update timespan. Same with the other guys I work with. Guess I got lucky that way - up till now.
And - that is a seriously impressive amount of versions you have on one machine lol! That's awesome actually Thanks for yer responses. Thanks all you guys actually for your responses.! I'm off to enjoy this weekend and get away from this darned computer for a bit.
Once again I have to agree with The Jayster.
The external contractors I have to work with always keep their software up to date. The last time I recieved one that was incompatible with my version I was the one who had to upgrade.
I would never ask them to revert to an old version for me.
Every version reverted will loose potential functionality and would not be professional IMO.
All we are saying is until now, We can open every .FLA ever created since Flash 4 ( Maybe earlier but I cannot say first hand ) with FlashCS6 and save it to the current version or 1 prior if needed.
With all due respect,
I should not need to maintain old software.
I never had to do that before.
Even if Adobe changes their mind about this rental software B.S and they do offer a standard upgrade.
I can no longer just use the most current version for all of my needs.
Something I have always had with Flash.
Its a shame whats going on.
This is especially hurtful because anyone without blinders on can see that the Flash tool probably has very little future. If we're really lucky, we'll be able to limp along indefinitely like Director. So it's not like this is aimed at masses of new AS3 developers that Adobe expects. No one with any sense who doesn't know Flash would invest the time in learning AS3, so why not support the existing developers as well as possible as the tool slides into obscurity.
I think expecting Adobe to remotely care how much the companies using their tools have invested in applications built on top of their tools or how big those companies are ignores the fact that this is not the first time Adobe has abandoned such companies (probably the very same companies in many cases). There once was a tool called Authorware, which was used to produce training for huge companies and the US government. Adobe dropped it like a rock as soon as the acquisition of Macromedia was finalized.
I think it's highly likely that at least some of these companies will get to the point where they won't embrace Adabe technologies, because any idiot can see that it's only a matter of time until that particular rug gets pulled out. I guess Adobe's new business model is to cater toward the one born in the next minute, as the ones who fell for it last time move on to other tools.
Both really excellent points Amy. I had previously had that first thought as well - but I couldn't quite form it into something I could articulate. The concept of not investing in the huge pursuit of learning AS3 is very valid too imo. I expect however, some commentors to disagree simply based on the gaming industry and how Flash is really being re-pointed in that general direction. So, it isn't going away per se, but defintely being ripped out of the hands of we who used it for many years (and still do) as a tool for corporate solutions. Game devs depend on AS3 really, just from a standpoint of faster more efficient processing speed and leveraging the latest and greatest virtual machines etc. But YES yes yes... totally agree with you from Flash outside of pure game development. The tool has been used in corporate training, interface, and presentation development for YEARS now, and those guys are bought in big with lots of "legacy" AS2-based software still working and performing just fine for them. "Pulling the rug" out - as you say - is exactly the way to phrase it. These companies are trapped in a no-man's land amidst a strained economy where budgets and sales force sizes are no where near what they were when we built the tools for them. As a contractor/developer, it really sticks you in a tough place. Like I said earlier, older code and newer code always exists simultaneously in the world of industry. I get the feeling Adobe and Apple and these sorts are attempting to just simply force-purge it all out of the system somehow. Leverage their development software ownership/power to reduce developer options and squeeze these huge corps all into IE 10 and retooled solutions. A very naive concept, if indeed this is their aim. Can't BELIEVE some of these big companies are using iPads for their sales forces... they can't even log into their own Active Directory networks or access their own internal portals and resources, or use their preexesting learning management systems. They still have to carry their laptops! What a complete mess. All blowing money on 3rd-party off-site iPad compatible vendors as a stop-gap. Insanity! Hopefully these Windows 8 slates catch on and help remedy it, since they won't have these issues - not even the plug-in issues since they can run desktop browsers. Probably the way of the future I think. Desktop OSs on tablets (which are becoming laptops in a new form factor really). Looking at Adobe's site and tutorials tho - you'd never know they even existed! Poor decision making (from the top levels) seems to be compounded by the confusion these guys are causing.
Anyhow - yours are good points for sure imo.
I don't think Flash has a long future in gaming, either. Unity is no longer supporting Flash, and most of the game devs I know who were working in Flash a year or two ago are not working in it anymore.
Wow... that does not bode well for Flash. All the Flash guys I work with develop corporate solutions with it, so I don't personally know any hardcore "gamer" devs. Knowing that Adobe has repurposed it for that tho, and hearing this feedback from someone who knows what is really happening out there in the development world... yikes Doesn't leave much room for a purpose. Thanks for the info Amy.
And thanks for all your feedback too fB3! Fergot to respond to your last one. Good to hear I work in a somewhat standard capacity with my FLA files. As a contractor - you can often wonder what everyone else is doing. lol
Have a safe and meaningful day everyone.
Could be Flash as future of games or not - this can be easy changed in one day. And this depends only from Adobe If they today will change main idea and workflow of the Flash Runtime - they will have realy great platform
Simple steps that can give a new born of Flash it's develop if from the ground up as new plugin and don't integrate with old capabilities
I'm not talking about returning to the Flash AS Next dialog. I'm telling about realy new and re-factored plugin Without any AS2 capabilities. Stop improvement flex, as2, lite and hurl all effort into new player
That will as Unity3D work much efficiently and without vector graphics But we all understand that almost impossible - it's require big funds spending
At now days I see a big insteresting from clients in Flash games because they can be played in web, desktop and mobile as application. And Flash have big performance advantage comparing to HTML5.
HTML5 have low performance on my iPad 2,3,4 with the same projects. So I don't know why HTML5 can be better
Anton - this same performance feedback is what I keep hearing from everyone else too. I'm with you on this! And yep - the multi-platform aspect is huge. Is HTML5 reeeally the big "improvement" they keep preaching, simply because of web "standards"? Sure doesn't seem to be panning out that way. And even if some prefer to work in it (when browsers currently in use finally catch up), there's still no need to eradicate or limit another extremely powerful tool like Flash. I'm just as confused as the next guy. The choice should be left to the developers - which tool is best for a certain job. Alas - we seem to be getting funneled by the visions of a few big men. But, what's new. I'm getting more into the jQuery lately tho - don't know if the Flash trend is gunna turn around personally (with regards to Flash as a corporate/business solutions tool) - just too much of a misinformation campaign out there imo. Maybe it'll turn around tho - who knows. But I'll tell ya what.... removing AS2 compatibility in all future versions (which I get from a gaming dev perspective) is definitely in opposition to the concept of maintaining "legacy" AS2 products we've already built for our corporate customers. Guess Adobe is picking their road - and I'll just have to keep a copy of CS6.
here are some differing (from ab's) viewpoints on flash for gaming, http://max.adobe.com/sessions/online.html?sdid=KEWZQ#tv