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Photoshop for Linux OS?

Jul 7, 2013 10:22 PM

Tags: #photoshop

I recently switched to Linux and have yet fully figured out if I can use photoshop in some way, shape or form...I appreciate the help!!

 
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jul 7, 2013 10:22 PM   in reply to transportvehicle

    Only through WINE.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jul 7, 2013 11:18 PM   in reply to transportvehicle

    You could also install windows in a virtual machine on linux.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 7, 2013 4:38 PM   in reply to transportvehicle

    I am also an Ubuntu user. So are at least 5 other front-end developers in my immediate line of site. I work for a very large international company.

     

    All our servers, like 99% of the rest of the internet, are Linux. For a front-end dev, that means Ubuntu has some advantages over PC when working with our teams. We all need/want Photoshop here, and our company would buy more PS seats (but not more Macs, hence why the Ubuntu user base is growing here).

     

    So while Adobe doesn't need to make a Linux ver (hell, they don't even need to make a Mac ver),  I do think they underestimate the actual demand for one. Also, I believe that they probably overestimate the effort in porting from Mac, a Linux distro itself,  to a more traditional Linux environment like Ubuntu. Just my 2cents.

     

    I'm a buyer. Even if it ends up being a PS that's a little behind the current versions, even it runs a little slower, and even if it's a little buggier.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 7, 2013 11:29 PM   in reply to DoseTequila

    All of that has been brought up and emphasized in detail many times before.  Adobe remains unmoved.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 7, 2013 11:43 PM   in reply to transportvehicle

    Photoshop 5 through CS2 and CS4 install and work pretty well on wine. Photoshop CS3 has some issues but most things work.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 4, 2013 1:12 PM   in reply to Chris Cox

    Hi Chris,

     

    I was looking at some old threads on the 'PS on Linux' conversations.   I know some are old threads (years old) and you likely had enough of it but always wanted someone at Adobe to hear my cries.  8)

     

    - PS was ported to IRIX back in the day,  it was the second platform I used it on (mac being the first) - while I could be wrong I suspect you would sell more licenses for linux than for all the SGI ones ever sold,   in your first year of offering it on linux.    I know they don't exist today and that was a long time ago - Adobe was a smaller company back then and was likely more nimble. 

     

    - PS is done in C+,  a port would be fairly "easy".

     

    - I am willing to bet a linux port within Adobe already exists,  as a result of an official mandate or skunkworks project.  I worked at a few large software companies (Alias/Autodesk) and know this is how some ports of projects start their existence, as internal skunkwork efforts.

     

    - A few years ago you said its too complex to offer on linux as the landscape isn't settled (which is still the case).   At Alias we ported a few of our products such as Maya in the 90's,  to both linux and windows,  I suspect Maya has more lines of code and is more complex than PS.   What we did to address the 'linux fragmentation' issue as many other vendors do who offer ports,  is state the system OS/Distro requirements.    Many list / standardize on RHEL as an example.   If you are not using that, you are not using a supported configuration - support is off the hook (unless its Ford or a similar sized client calling you).

     

    - effort vs cost.  An interesting thing here is the amount of effort it took for the ports we did.     2 guys in the Seattle office ported the IRIX code base of Maya to Windows in 2 weeks during their off time!   Every company/project is different,  i understand it may not be the same at Adobe. 

     

    - another comment you may of made was 'linux users don't typically buy software'.   I think things have changed here.   I can say from my personal experience working in M&E studios for the last 15 years or so that Adobe would of had purchase orders for a few hundred linux cuts.   That is from 2 or 3 studios here in Town that I've been at.   How many cuts does Adobe have to think they need to be able to sell before the effort gets traction?    In 3 studios there was an effort made to roll the desk tops over to linux,  and its always the same road block which prevents many from doing so,  Adobe Photoshop.   Its used in almost every department so it makes it extremely difficult to move off of windows or mac.   Every one of these studios would be more than happy buying PS for linux post roll over.  If these 3 studios in town here would be good to buy 40-100 cuts each,  we are only 3 of hundreds or thousands of studios out there..   The first release may not sell a bunch as it would take people time to realize the final road block has been removed,  and plan for a migration,  which typically have to be scheduled weeks/months in advance due to project schedules.  But i'm sure with each quarter,  sales would continue to climb.     Aside from all that we spend _hundreds of thousands_ of dollars on licenses for products which will run on linux.    the industry spends money.

     

    - I ended up here on this page as yet again I find myself at yet another  studio who wants to move off of windows to linux for the desktop,  and we are seeing how/if the landscape has changed related to the Photoshop challenge.    Perhaps its the M&E bubble i'm stuck in that makes be believe there is lots of potential for PS on linux - but man,  everyone i've talked to in the industry (from ILM, Disney, Wetta,  Arc and many others) for the last decade or so has always maintained a desire to see PS released on linux.

     

    -  I wonder who these surveys you state which indicated there is little opportunity are being completed by or what the target audience is.  I've been in a management role for years and have never been asked by Adobe or anyone for that matter if I would like to see Photoshop ported,  or any 'survey' related to Adobe for that matter.   Who is being asked?    There is a forum named "Studio SysAdmins",  if one were to go to that list and prompt the question and I assure you,  you would have several hundred purchase commitments.  That forum is dedicated to people in M&E and many of them are chomping at the bit to migrate off of windows,  yet the common show stopper continues to be Photoshop - for the last decade or so.

     

    - Most of the open source flag wavers who state they won't buy commercial software are likely still stuck in their basements or just don't get it.   A company who is out to make a profit will use the proper tools to achieve that goal,  regardless if that tool is a commercial one.    some PFY in the tech department refusing to use PS because there is a cost associated to it would/should be turfed.   Some of the people piping up here probably have no decision making role,  but unfortunately they tend to be the most vocal.    

     

    - If Autodesk can do it,  Adobe can too! 

     

    - I'm being forced to consider some sort of remote to the desktop photoshop solution.  its going to cost us more per workstation to use PS than the product itself.  We have never had any luck using PS under emulation,  such as Wine.   it "works" but has many issues and i've never seen an Artist accept it.    Wine is not an option for most professional applications I suspect.

     

    - Adobe is out to make money,  they have lots of money.  I'm sure they could afford to test the waters without going under or pissing off the share holders.   There is always a budget for projects when times are good.

     

     

    - conspiratorial theories aside - M$ has been known (many times) to 'influence' vendors in ways which are attempts to maintain M$'s market share. They have been brought to court many times for related issues.   Apple not so much,  as far as I know.   I mention this its not a far leap to make when someone says "M$ has a deal with Adobe".     Personally I don't think this is the case in this particular situation but its  plausible.  Stranger deals have happened at the executive level in many companies.

     

     

    thanks for your time,

    take care,

    g

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 5, 2013 1:04 AM   in reply to Greg y!

    @g - Really? You're serious that the Linux i.e. OpenSource community would embrace a subscription to Adobe CC? Why do I doubt that???

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 5, 2013 5:37 AM   in reply to DocPixel-BMW

    not sure if you are trolling or not -  but taking your question as it is,  its obvious you don't have much insight to the industry.    M&E is not the OpenSource community, i'm not sure how you came up with that relation.  

     

    we have hundreds of thousands of dollars invested in licenses for products which run on linux,  and woudln't think twice about dumping more money on PS cuts,  as its the tool required.    you doubt this because apparently you are ignorant to how things are done these days in our industry.   

     

    i'm not sure why so many people assume once you start using an open source OS,  you no longer support the use of commerical products.  Why is that doc?

     

     

    g

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 5, 2013 2:45 PM   in reply to DocPixel-BMW

    DocPixel, have you ever priced a full seat of Flame on Linux?  Or a Baselight?  Or even something "cheap" like Maya/Nuke/Mari?  Lots of people spend quite a lot of money for tools that run on Linux.  Most big studios have very serious reservations about the implementation of the Creative Cloud stuff related to licensing being so much harder to manage than something like Flexlm floating licenses in a large organisation.  But the few dollars a month for the subscription or fact that it isn't open source are very unlikely to be any sort of obstacle in the film/VFX/M+E areas if the tool works well and integrates nicely into the studio.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 6, 2013 1:03 AM   in reply to Greg y!

    Woah! Sorry guys... I am NOT dissing Linux or OS, and do not for a minute think that those professional M&E houses don't spend literally 1000's on licensing.

     

    I do think I may need to apoligize for bringing my rant and skepticism along for the ride, against those that don't see the benefits to CC now on Win and Mac. So I wouldn't expect any less moaning and groaning from the Linux crowd truthfully; and then I'm almost sure that the OS-Traditionalists would add a negative spin to the discussion. From Adobe's side: would it be worth it? From my skeptical side: could they even do it? Adobe's programming chops seem to have left with the last generation of retirees.

     

    IMHO, the Linux community could and should do something about bringing a competitive alternative to Photoshop. Gimp doesn't cut it.  As with Blender and assorted other "alternative" titles, develop something that is community-driven, expandable, updatable, and BETTER than PS. CHARGE for, or license it even, so that development and growth could be achieved, while at the same time giving users a peace of mind that their efforts and learning curve isn't a waste of time.

     

    Which, speaking of learning curves, is the biggest detriment to Adobe, MS and a number of "commercially successful" and widely used software companies being able to truly innovate. Linux doesn't carry that baggage, and as soon as Adobe for example would bring anything out on Linux that doesn't emmulate 100% the software on other platforms: I foresee a big B*** & Moan Festival!

     

    I personally believe (and for a long time) that PS should be torn down and rebuilt using modern API's, frameworks and code-compilers. Why shouldn't... or couldn't... the Linux community show them the way?

     

    So you see... I'm not against "you guys" or P-ing on your dreams; I'm just hoping for something so much better... and I succumb as humans do once in a while to "generalized snarky comments"... Mea Culpa.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 6, 2013 2:35 PM   in reply to DocPixel-BMW

    Note: Photoshop is built using modern APIs, frameworks and compilers.  We constantly refactor the codebase and update it.

     

    Also, nobody has retired from the Photoshop engineering team (and we keep adding new college hires as well).

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 6, 2013 2:52 PM   in reply to Chris Cox

    wish they would re-factor and update their corporate sand on this issue too once in a while.    Seems like they are still stuck with a 1992 mindset/understanding.

     

    -g

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 6, 2013 6:01 PM   in reply to transportvehicle

    It's funny to me because as of ~2007 Apple's OSX operating system has UNIX 3 certification. Just checked, and yep, Mountain Lion has UNIX 3 certification. It's why I can go to the command line and things work like they do in Linux, and why installing and setting up server stuff like Apache, MySQL, PHP and Ruby On Rails is identical to doing it on a linux box.  IMHO linux  has already proven itself; everyone on this board is using right now, you're using it everytime you get online, send/get mail, watch videos on youtube,  blog on Facebook or turn on your Android phone. People are already making a ton of money running their services on Linux (including Google). And guess what? Even Adobe already devs for linux via Flash Media Server.

     

     

    So the question is not do people use Linux, it's wether they do so in a desktop environment. I'm betting, like me, more and more people are doing just that. Additionally, very few designers these days can get by without knowing a little HTML, and increasingly many of them are learning to work with Linux servers and Linux tools at some level.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 7, 2013 6:15 AM   in reply to Chris Cox

    Chris Cox wrote:

     

    Note: Photoshop is built using modern APIs, frameworks and compilers.  We constantly refactor the codebase and update it.

     

    Also, nobody has retired from the Photoshop engineering team (and we keep adding new college hires as well).

    Question: are your APIs and frameworks cross-application, or singular for example only Photoshop; the reson I ask because since Adobe sells the apps as a "suite", many dialogs and functions across programs (InDesign -> Illustrator ->Photoshop) are not synced, nor allow the same capabilities. Example: Scale dialog i.e. pop-up control panels.

     

    Note: when I state "modern", I'm specifically talking about Adobe's very own stated desire from some 12-15 years ago when CS1 came into being, that they were working on a way to "modularize" the entire suite, rather than develop every program as an island. More or less a creative platform OS. Think iOS or Android, specifically built for creative programs, plug-ins and "apps". What ever happened to that "modern thinking and engineering"?

     

    Question: ever? The original team is still intact? I'm impressed. So I assume they would know what I'm talking about, because I believe it was either before or shortly after "plug-ins" came into being and were the "first phase". Just curious.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 7, 2013 2:55 PM   in reply to DocPixel-BMW

    The frameworks are hard to describe - they are shared, somewhat, but not by all applications.

    Engineers with experience quickly realized that the "modular" approach was a disaster in the making -- that isn't modern, that's just something dreamed up by a computer scientist who never had to write or maintain code that gets used by real people.

     

    People do leave the team for other jobs, or due to layoffs - but nobody has actually retired from the engineering team. Our people tend to take a lot of pride in our product, and stick with it.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 10, 2013 5:11 AM   in reply to Chris Cox

    @ Chris Cox

    Maybe you misunderstood what I was getting at. Because calling "modular based" software a disaster in the making, is the same as saying iOS, Android... and a number of your biggest plug-in developers (Nik and OnOne for example) ... well... disasters.

     

    Modular the way I understood it at the time, is something that Adobe is doing as we speak with the Edge Tools and just yesterday with the PS 14.1 update. HOWEVER... IMO Adobe is still doing it wrong. Why isn't Adobe Generator being exposed for use in Illustrator or InDesign at the same time? These are also "web design and asset creation tools" are they not? And what about SVG assets? While being scalable vectors is their main usage, which will be more and more in the future, don't they also need to be exported? I'm thinking Illustrator with it's improvements to CSS exporting, why not Generator?

     

    As an example of "modular", I'm talking about the simple and effective "plugin architecture" that is already in place in most of Adobe's products, but they use different plugin APIs and SDKs themselves, rather than be "cross-program". Adobe's job is to create a cross-app API and SDK for their own software plug-ins if you will.

     

    For example: Character and paragraph styles and palettes. Why do these work differently across programs within the suite? Modular would mean that they would be synced across the suite and possibly even projects, and use the best developed panels in the arsenal, meaning those from InDesign. Two palettes with the most powerful functions that Adobe has already developed, available to ALL programs in the suite that use text.... RATHER than 6 (8, 10, 12?) palettes that do something just a little bit different to make them frustrating going from one program to the next.

     

    It's also very user UNfriendly to expect a simple thing like character/paragraph styles to be re-learned in each program. There is so much to learn in the suite, why should we not expect that once you "get" a function in one program, it carries over to the next?

     

    I know you're going to come back and say that certain functionality and user-defined features are not needed cross-program. But that's not what we're seeing is it, as design software evolves into uses that even Adobe itself never intended nor foresaw. Such as: Photoshop as a primary web design tool? As a content creation and editing tool for photos that would find their way to the web: yes; but I seriously doubt that any of your colleagues thought it would evolve into the "go to tool" for web layout, wireframes, CSS, and now, GUI and sprite generation.

     

    While the tech is great for a subset of users that have chosen PS for unintended tasks, the photogs (majority use of PHOTO-shop) that I have as clients all went, "Huh?" yesterday when I told them about the update. Couldn't really get them excited about it, even if there are some under-the-hood advantages for them specifically.

     

    That Adobe is taking notice of the wide and variable usage of PS is one thing, and I guess I have to compliment them on that at least. However to continue to develop isolated software solutions today for unforeseen usages of tomorrow, is to ME... a disaster in the making.... and we the users will be (are) paying for it. Adobe is still making "Silo Software" rather than a "Software Suite" IMHO.

     

    NOTE: your quote, "write or maintain code that gets used by real people" struck me as especially odd. 1) a modular approach is far easier to maintain, or else Apple and Google are doing something wrong; 2) your code that is being used by real people every day is rather bug-ridden, quirky cross-program within the suite, and even exports differently to the point of importing into another program in the suite is many times a fatality... rather than an easy and problem-free click-to-open-in-xxx. We should talk cross-meta data problems within Bridge, Lightroom and Photoshop some day... this post is long enough.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 19, 2013 1:33 PM   in reply to Chris Cox

    Hello Chris. I am wondering where have you obtained statistics, that linux users wont buy licensed software? In real world any programmer can ask manager to buy any software, that he needs. 95% of web programmers needs photoshop. Why do people should suffer with windows virtual machine? [admin - pointless insult removed]

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 19, 2013 1:32 PM   in reply to Andrew Aladjev

    We do surveys of users, and prospective users, pretty regularly.  Plus we get the results of larger surveys done by other companies.

    But the numbers for Linux haven't changed much from year to year - it's still primarily used on servers and embedded devices. Linux desktop numbers are pretty tiny.  There is simply not enough of a market in Linux desktop software to justify the cost of a port or ongoing support for a new platform.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 19, 2013 2:00 PM   in reply to Chris Cox

    not to go on, and thanks for removing those posts Chirs...

     

      to which markets do you focus your surveys on?  I've been having discussions about this topic in other non adobe forums on and off for years (yes specific to my industry,  but it is a large one,  M&E) and out of the hundreds of people on these,  no one has received any sort of survey from adobe or any other entity asking about usage of linux machines and/or usage of adobe products within their environment.      This is a sampling from all over the world.  So who are we asking?    which sectors does the survey make it to?   how is it worded?   can we see this survey or ask to be put on the list for the next round?


    i think its more a matter of 'build it and they will come'.   I'm not saying Adobe will sell millions of cuts,  but for sure thousands,  and that number surely will grow year by year.   There is so much interest out there surrounding the desire for people to migrate off windows in our sector,  but it comes down to P.S and the challenges of providing this tool on linux in an agreeable and workable state.   (which today means investing 10x-20x times the cost of PS in methods to provide the ability to use PS over some sort of virtual or application server solution,  which still doesn't suite eveyrone's requirements due to wacom latency/use issues).


    The unfortunate reality is no one will likely try and develop anything on linux to fill this void as the fear is soon as they start selling volume,  then Adobe will decide to release a port,  and much money and effort will be lost.    

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 19, 2013 3:44 PM   in reply to Greg y!

    Many of the surveys focus on "potential" markets - people who would buy Photoshop, but haven't yet.

    And some focus on existing customers.

    Yes, the surveys are world wide.

     

    All the evidence says that the Linux market for (paying) desktop software is just too small.

    Linux has to develop a real market, or at least lower the cost of entry (seriously: how long can they go without standardizing APIs?), to make it attactive to developers.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 21, 2013 11:07 AM   in reply to Chris Cox

    I am a linux user, switched my desktop to linux from windows around 2009.  I now do pretty much everything on linux.  I run windows 7 in a virtual machine under linux for 4 programs, one is photoshop.

     

    The linux market is the fastest growing market.  In 10+ years of photoshop use, I have only gotten one survey from Adobe; that was about CC and had no mention of linux.   I have many colleagues who use linux and would gladly dump windows and purchase products for linux.  There are many indications that the use statistics are skewed, e.g. web counts rely on paid sites.  Here are my own usage statistics for people visiting my own, non commercial, photo web site, clarkvision dot com, a totally independent assessment and excludes my own use:

              December  December  December
                2010       2011       2012
    Windows     87.2 %     81.1 %     77.0 %
    Linux        1.8       4.9         8.1
    Mac         11.0       14.0        14.9
    

    Windows is dropping fast and linux and macs are increasing fast.  But as soon as a good product for image editing comes out on linux with the tools I need, I'll dump the windows version, whatever that may be (e.g. photoshop).  Adobe could be that best linux photo editor.

    Roger

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Sep 23, 2013 5:09 AM   in reply to Chris Cox

    I find your survey answer incomplete, because just asking people if they would consider purchasing on Linux asks a pointed question about software that many (most?) people have never heard of. And if they have, it's only the old myths from many years ago.

     

    Ask them the same question and insert (just to play dumb) "Android" or for "Google Chrome"... you just might receive a completely different answer.

     

    I mention this because many people don't know that Linux is the underpinnings and base of a lot of the hardware they're using today, they just don't know it.

     

    Maybe Adobe should consider working closer together with Google on technology that has a future, rather than Flash. Ask them about developing for Goobuntu (Google's inhouse baked Linux) or Chrome.

     

    You might also ask them how many of their engineers use Windows at all these days, considering that already 2 years ago it was rumored they were trying to go 'Windows free" including in the admin offices. From everything I've seen of late in their conferences and YouTube presentations, they are using almost always Mac OS X... and their Goobuntu.

     

    If Microsoft doesn't have the balls to move to a UNIX-based system (which they were also rumored to be doing with Longhorn)... then maybe Adobe should give them one more reason to take a look at that, amid their recent struggles.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 3, 2013 9:50 PM   in reply to Chris Cox

    I'be been a long time PS and AI user and the only reason I haven't fully switch to linux is because of these two products. Adobe should take the initiative like Valve and push the industry toward linux and away from Windows.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 4, 2013 7:18 AM   in reply to BTKO

    The hacks will continue till we see a port!

     

    based on the number of customers disclosed during the last operation,  I think there is more than enough budget to do it.

     

    you have till midnight yesterday to comply!  8)

     

     

    -g

     
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  • JJMack
    6,011 posts
    Jan 9, 2006
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    Nov 11, 2013 9:30 AM   in reply to Greg y!

    Some day you and some day Photoshop will die. Will there be a port before Photoshop death time will tell. If not you'll never see a port.  If your young you may out live Photoshop.  Live long my friend.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 4, 2013 7:48 AM   in reply to Chris Cox

    What can you say about photoshop for windows RT? It had zero market share and nothing was changed. MS rolled you some money and you gave photoshop. Are you waiting for some petrodollars from linux now?

     

    PS sorry for my english

     
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  • Noel Carboni
    23,523 posts
    Dec 23, 2006
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    Nov 4, 2013 7:55 AM   in reply to Andrew Aladjev

    Here's a twist on the question:

     

    Does Photoshop CC for PC work under WINE on a Mac?

     

    Given that under the Creative Cloud EULA Adobe allows use on both Mac and PC platforms, it would be useful to if I could suggest to my potential customers with Macs that they can run my PC-only plug-ins under the PC version of Photoshop under WINE.

     

    -Noel

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Nov 9, 2013 4:46 AM   in reply to Chris Cox

    Good Afternoon Adobe, my name is Peter and I am games developer. Valve push Steam on Linux year ago. Since then we have to use Windows or OS X to develop games for Linux even if we prefer Linux to do that. We need tools like Photoshop and othes. Please consider my request. If any other company make tools for us (like photoshop) before you did, you will be hard to break into Linux market. I aware that i dont speak english very well, but i hope you understand me

     

    Best regards and have a nice day,

    Peter

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 14, 2014 2:47 AM   in reply to transportvehicle

    Me no speek english verry well,

    me needs Photoshop and Illustrator on Linux (Ubuntu).

     

    Seriously though, I'm a Web developer for over 10 yers and Adobe products are the only things keeping me on Windowz.

    I hope you guys have a great contract with Micro$$oft for guys like me.

    Really need PS with License on Linux, I'm willing to pay good money for them. I'm aware I can install them with WINE or even with a VM, but I need them native on Linux.

     

    I'm sure 80-90% of the code can be easily used on Linux, you people just need to open your minds and make some small adjustments to the code.

     

    AND, considering that you've already started to loose peoples confidence in you guys, ever since we got our accounts hacked, I think that now more than ever you should reconsider this.

     

    Thanks (if you release a Linux version).

     
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  • Noel Carboni
    23,523 posts
    Dec 23, 2006
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    Jan 14, 2014 9:49 AM   in reply to bv02peu

    Heh, they can barely keep it current on the two major operating systems (see, for example, discussions on high ppi displays, or generation of thumbnails, or GPU problems).

     

    My suggestion:  Get a Mac if Unix really lights your fire.  Seems like the best of both worlds to me.

     

    -Noel

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 14, 2014 10:04 AM   in reply to Noel Carboni

    I agree, your solution is perfect if you take money out of the equation.

     

    Paying for Adobe products, even though they are expensive (for me atleast), it's something that I'm willing to do if I can get them on Linux.

     

    If I have to buy a MAC too, that's gonna be way out of my buget.

     

    And even if I can afford a MAC in the future, learning a new OS is something that I don't curently have time for.

     

    -Andrei

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 14, 2014 12:22 PM   in reply to bv02peu

    It's also the same for the corporate world, which is mostly:

    corporate_machine = windows || ubuntu;

     

    I do not have a choice to get a Mac. Nor do the  500+ other users in my company.

     

    And fontend developer usually means: photoshop/illustator + javascript + html + dealing with a repository. I'm not giving up 90% of my tools which work MUCH better in a Mac/Linux enviornment, just to run Photoshop.

     

    End result? I'm learning GIMP. It's not nearly as good, but at least I can do simple stuff like cut up images for layout, though it's still a PITA to actually make layouts.

     
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  • Trevor Dennis
    5,926 posts
    May 24, 2010
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    Jan 14, 2014 2:04 PM   in reply to Chris Cox

    Chris Cox wrote:

     

    Also, nobody has retired from the Photoshop engineering team (and we keep adding new college hires as well).

    Sounds like the Mafia Chris, or perhaps a kinder analogy might be 'Once a Marine, always a Marine'.  I am also not sure if the Mafia take on new college hires.

     

    Speaking in terms of a Linux/Ubuntu version of Photoshop, I was struck by the huge numbers involved in last year's account hacking incident.  In fact they upped the numbers and it was well into the millions of customers involved.  The possible client base for a Linux version must be a tiny fraction of one percent of those millions, but with (and I am obviously guessing here) the same amount of work creating that Linux version.  Where would the business sense be with that?

     
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    Jan 14, 2014 3:00 PM   in reply to Trevor Dennis

    .  The possible client base for a Linux version must be a tiny fraction of one percent of those millions, but with (and I am obviously guessing here) the same amount of work creating that Linux version.  Where would the business sense be with that?

     

    Treavor,

     

    I'm not sure where you are comming up with "a fraction of 1%",  but i'm fairly confident it would be higher than this.   7-10% would likely be a reasonable number in market share within the first year or so,  and I'd expect that number to climb when people realize its an option,  and time permits them to convert at work (sometimes takes months to get approval for environment changes).   I don't think there is any product out on earth which is available to linux/mac/win where anyone of them have "a fraction of 1%" market share.  this isn't 1980.

     

    based on this,  lets assume the actual market share is less than I had guessed it to be,  lets say 3%,   or better yet lets get closer to what you belive the number would be and call it 1%.  (keep in mind this number will only grow over time).  lets do some math Treavor...

     

    1% x 1000000 = 10000 

     

    10,000 x 600 dollars is 6 million dollars.   how does 6 million not work for a business?  I'd guess the effort to port the product is already 90% there or done already,  but even if it were not,  the cost would be less than 2 million.  

     

    When I worked at Alias/Autodesk we had companies like GM and Ford request some of our products be ported to some  platform we didn't offer the product on,  like HPUX or Solaris.   We would ding them for a million dollars to do so,  then charge them support and product costs on top of that.  it was seen as a great revenue stream.   2 developers were assigned to the account to do bug fixes,  but they were not that busy with this after awhile.

     

    If Alias/Autodesk can port Studio to ONE customer and still be profitable,  I'm sure Adobe can do the same.  lets not kid ourselves,  the effort is not huge as far as ports go.    This is not a ground up, starting at zero effort.  They can pass a few flags to the compiler and spit out a version for linux in a week or less I bet.  I've worked at major software companies for years and can say with a certain amount of confidence this is not far from the truth at all.

     

    Adobe just doesn't want to do it right now,  i'm sure part of that is financial,  but i don't belive that is the only reason nor the largest reason.    That all said,  i'm not an economics person and will not pretend to understand it as well as i may have indicated I do here.  I may be very off base,  its just a guess at it.    Developers don't get paid huge wages and this is a project which would not require senior developers to handle.  This is a project for interns which would be supervised/checked by a lead. 

     

    also Ubuntu is linux,  i'm sure you get that but it intrest's me why people say Ubuntu/linux instead of just linux...  

     

    take care,

    -g

     
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    Jan 14, 2014 3:09 PM   in reply to Greg y!

    As of Nov 2013, Linux is roughly 1.5% of the market, Macs are 7.5% and Windows is 91%:

     

    http://thenextweb.com/insider/2013/12/01/windows-8-falls-6-66-share-wi ndows-8-1-hits-2-64-combined-duo-barely-grows-9-3/

     

    Macs have a large proportion of customers who do media development so it makes sense for Adobe to have products for Macs; however, what proportion of Linux users would use PS?  Even if it is much higher than the proportion of Windows users there are still a lot less people.

     

    Back in 2011, 6% of people use The Gimp but Adobe had the top three spots for a combined total of 65% of the post production market at least in this questionnaire, and people have been moving away from PS and toward Lightroom:

     

    http://digital-photography-school.com/the-most-popular-post-production -software-poll-results

     

    It would be interesting to see the breakdown of PS-CC subscriptions between Mac and PC but a graph for those wasn’t noticed in my Google results.

     
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    Jan 14, 2014 3:29 PM   in reply to ssprengel

    ssprengel wrote:

     

    As of Nov 2013, Linux is roughly 1.5% of the market, Macs are 7.5% and Windows is 91%

    First of all, I wouldn't trust that statistic.

     

    And sencond of all, Linux is "1,5%" of the market because we don't have Photoshop on Linux.

     

    I'm currently on Windows because I need Photoshop, I also need subline text and filezilla (both work on Linux).

    For Office I use LibreOffice, that works great on Windows and Linux and it's free.

     

    Just give it another 10 years and the Open Source comunity will finally have something better than Photoshop.

     
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    Jan 14, 2014 4:34 PM   in reply to bv02peu

    @ssprengel:  part of the challenge is providing tools to linux.  if they existed the numbers would change i suspect.  Why would you use an OS that doesn't have the tools you require?   Which may be why the numbers are where they are.     I can only speak for the industries I've worked within but i can tell you there would be no problem for most to move off of mac/windows if everything we needed was available there.   Artists are paid to do work using tools provided to them,  which OS they are on is much less of an issue.  As an example,  the shop I'm in now is 85% linux,  10% windows (administrative staff/execs) and 5% mac (art department).  it would be much more economical and less administrative overhead to not have to support a 3rd platform.   There is also something to be said about the ability to choose which OS you run on a purchased PC,  linux/windows, hardware standardization,  volume purchase incentives and similar...

     

    @bv02peu "Just give it 10 years"   hopefully it doesn't take that long,  we been waiting 10 already.       "open source community will have something better",  this is likely exactly when Adobe will chose to port and crush this effort.  I think it takes a company with a lot of balls or ambition to attempt to steal this segment away from Adobe.   and that is likely a sad reality.

     

    -g

     
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    Jan 14, 2014 6:35 PM   in reply to bv02peu

    Those market percentages are people who use that OS, not people who want to use Photoshop or are interested in Graphic Design or Photography and have that OS.  And those Linux percentages have been between .5 and 2% over the past decade from what I saw when I used Google to do an Image search for (Windows vs Linux vs OSX "market share").

    http://cdn2.tnwcdn.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/1/files/2013/12/os_market_november_2013.png

     

    Suppose the number of people who want Linux Photoshop is 10% that of Mac Photoshop or Windows Photoshop, would you be willing to subsidize the development effort for 10x less customers by paying 10x as much for the software ($3000/upgrade/18-months like it used to be or a $200/month subscription)--a return-on-investment model, or are you asking that each of us who use Windows or a Mac pay 50% more to subsidize a development effort for those who pay nothing for their operating system--a redistribution model?  Or what is your economic model where Linux development makes sense for Adobe? 

     

    Adobe isn't keeping the open-source community from developing a competing products--The Gimp is an example.  There are smart people everywhere.

     

    Google is an open-source company, to some extent, and has vast resources to spend on developing free products.  Why haven't they competed with Adobe and produced a Photoshop competitor?

     
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    Jan 14, 2014 5:29 PM   in reply to bv02peu

    bv02peu wrote:

     

    First of all, I wouldn't trust that statistic.

     

    And sencond of all, Linux is "1,5%" of the market because we don't have Photoshop on Linux.

     

    I'm currently on Windows because I need Photoshop, I also need subline text and filezilla (both work on Linux).

    For Office I use LibreOffice, that works great on Windows and Linux and it's free.

     

    Just give it another 10 years and the Open Source comunity will finally have something better than Photoshop.

    Who cares if the statistic is off by a large number the number will still be small.  I would think many of the linux machines are more servers then end user machines.  GIMP is an open source Image Processor somewhat like Photoshop and has been around for a long time. In an other ten years GIMP will have been around for ten more years and so will Photoshop. Will GIMP be better then Photoshop in 2024 time will tell. Will Adobe fix the bugs in Photoshop by 2024 time will tell. Photoshop is just one application in a long list of applications the don't support Unix. You can not point to Photoshop as the cause of Linux low stats.  Though Photoshop does run in Apple's OSX Unix Shell. Port OSX Linux.

     
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