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Improvement to 'Nudge Clip Selection Down/Up' commands

Aug 1, 2013 8:54 AM

Tags: #nudge_clips

I love the new 'Nudge Clip Selection Down/Up' commands in PP CC!  But when I nudge selected video clips up/down, I would prefer if any associated audio clips remained put.  I know I can Alt-select the video clips so that their associated audio clips don't get selected, but I still think these 2 new commands would work better this way:

 

1. Select clips

2. Use 'Nudge Clip Selection Down/Up' command while the:

1. Cursor is over any video track = only the selected video clips get nudged

2. Cursor is over any audio track = only the selected audio clips get nudged

 

I can't think of any situation where I would want to nudge both the video and audio clips at the same time, but for those rare occasions, it would simply be a matter of nudging twice, once with the cursor over a video track and once over an audio track.

 

Before I submit an official FR for this, I would love to hear from others on this forum.  Do you agree?  Disagree? Any ideas on further possible improvements?

 

Thanks!

 
Replies 1 2 Previous Next
  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 1, 2013 9:02 AM   in reply to PierreLouisBeranek

    You can that cursor.  Why force folks to move that?  It's one more step we don't have to do now that you want everyone to have to do.

     

    I think the better improvement when both are selected is to move video and audio relatively rather than absolutely.  Meaning 'up' for video should be V2, and 'up' for audio should also be A2, even though it's actually down in the track listing.

     

    For moving one, the current method of selecting one works fine.

     
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    Aug 1, 2013 11:37 AM   in reply to PierreLouisBeranek

    But one could also argue that having to remember to Alt-select the clips is also an extra step Jim.

     

    Not really.  I'd consider both Select and Alt-Select as one step.

     

    100% of the time when a user selects video clips to nudge up or down, the cursor will already be over the video tracks portion of the Timeline

     

    Define curser.  Do you mean the mouse cursor, or the Current Time Indicator?  If the former, it may not be when selecting with the keyboard.  If the latter, it may not be when selecting with the mouse.  So either way, you're calling for people to move something they don't currently have to move to make this work.

     

    I'd further argue that most of the time I need to move a clip, it's to move both video and audio to a 'higher numbered track' (not just 'up') so that the clip can be slid over.  It's very rare I need to move only video or audio.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 1, 2013 12:06 PM   in reply to PierreLouisBeranek

    99% of the time I only ever want to move the video portion, not the audio portion.

     

    I'm curious why?  What are you doing that needs to move only one?

     

     

    In all fairness, how often are people going to select clips using the keyboard, while their cursor is over an audio track

     

    The mouse cursor may simply have been left there arbitrarily, you never know.  Besides, mouse cursor as 'modifier' is just not the best idea for clips.  The CTI I can see, but not the mouse.

     

     

     

    I think the best solution

     

     

    I still think the best solution is the one we have now.  Move only video, select only video.  (You're selecting anyway, right?)  This solution requires no effort on Adobe's part, freeing them up for other features.  It only requires you to get used to the 'selection' method that has been part of PP for a loooong time now.

     

    What might be a good idea is adding keyboard shortcuts for selecting only video or only audio under the CTI, with modifiers to the D shortcut perhaps.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 1, 2013 2:34 PM   in reply to PierreLouisBeranek

    I guess I am puzzled also.  Why would you want a feature that would allow you to nudge a video track left or right out of synchronization with its audio track?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 1, 2013 3:14 PM   in reply to PierreLouisBeranek

    I think 'Nudge' as in Nudge Up and Down was a poor choice of terms.

     

    A nudge is a small movement in a direction.

     

    We have Nudge Left and Right already (and I use it a lot for VID / Aud or each alone)

     

    Raise /Lower or Raise/Drop may have been better more descriptive choices.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 1, 2013 6:41 PM   in reply to PierreLouisBeranek

    'Cleaning' the Timeline to put all final video clips on a single video track for the sake of visual order.

     

    I sort of see that.  I guess I'm just neater as I go along that I don't have to do it.

     

    What I can see as maybe the better feature request is the ability to collapse the video tracks.  I can see this working in two ways.  Collapse All would bring all clips to V1, leaving edit points in tact and cutting off any overlaps.  I've seen editors ask for this, especially when they need to go out to a Colorist.  The second method would be Collapse Down, which would bring all video clips down to the lowest track they can occupy without cutting anything off any other clips.

     

    Of course, since audio tracks can have effects at the track level, the Collapse feature would leave audio untouched.

     

    So you could do your clean up in one stroke.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 1, 2013 6:24 PM   in reply to shooternz
    I think 'Nudge' as in Nudge Up and Down was a poor choice of terms.

     

    A nudge is a small movement in a direction.

     

    Agreed.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 1, 2013 8:30 PM   in reply to PierreLouisBeranek

    FCP fanboy here. That was a feature I requested back in CS4 cause I got used to in in FCP6.

     

    Also, they're not bad decisions Pierre... it takes a while to see what works really and a handful of testers will never encounter the intricacies and problems that the final release users will. Implement > Feedback > Fix/or not > Feedback > repeat is the only thing they can do really.

     

    PS: IIRC nudging was also the FCP term.

     
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  • joe bloe premiere
    4,391 posts
    Dec 6, 2009
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 2, 2013 6:32 AM   in reply to PierreLouisBeranek

     
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  • joe bloe premiere
    4,391 posts
    Dec 6, 2009
    Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 2, 2013 7:45 AM   in reply to PierreLouisBeranek

    Say no more...

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 2, 2013 3:36 PM   in reply to PierreLouisBeranek

    With my FRs, I'm just trying to do my part to undo some of the nonsense we get dished out as a result of bad, and very likely ego driven, decisions.

     

    In your humble opinion ...of course.

     

    Do you have any reason to believe that "editors" are or are not consulted in the Premiere development program?

     

    Do you believe that user feature requests are considered and ever adopted by Adobe?

     

    Are your feature requests any more superior to those that the rest of us hopeless idiots post in?

    (your feature request are largely to do with something that you want individualised for your self)

     

    Who or what kind of person would get an ego trip out of developing a feature in the program?  (Maybe thats you?)

     

    Offer your self as a beta tester and save the world from Adobe.

     
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  • joe bloe premiere
    4,391 posts
    Dec 6, 2009
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    Aug 2, 2013 3:39 PM   in reply to shooternz

    Who or what kind of person would get an ego trip out of developing a feature in the program?

    Pharther Phurther

    Member Since:

    Jan 23, 2011

    Last Logged In:

    Jul 9, 2012 2:26 AM

    Brief Bio:

    Fool

     

    http://forums.adobe.com/people/Pharther%20Phurther

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 2, 2013 3:56 PM   in reply to joe bloe premiere

    Oh...a trip down memory lane. 

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 2, 2013 3:58 PM   in reply to PierreLouisBeranek
    To answer your question Jim, 'nudging' a clip up or down would never throw it out of sync with its audio

     

    Did I ask that?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 2, 2013 9:24 PM   in reply to joe bloe premiere

    This is a very strange thread.

     

    As far as I can tell without looking at lots of projects, I am much more inclined to move video from one track to another than I am audio.

     

    Why would audio have to move? The order in which audio sits on the tracks is in no way relevant to how it sounds. Yet where video sits is extremely relevant to how it looks.

     

    If I want to nudge video up a track or two, or even down, why would I want the audio to move?

     

    I should, at a minimum, be able to press a modifier key to just move the video.

     

    Now, the real problem is that the implementation is seriously warped. If the video is on track one and the audio is on track one, nothing will move. Because to Alt-Up the video would make the audio go to track zero which does not exist. So you can't move anything unless it is already on a higher track. That's just wrong. So the feature is completely useless to me and I don't even try to use it.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 3, 2013 8:43 AM   in reply to Steven L. Gotz
    Why would audio have to move?

     

    For me it's to make room on both V1 and A1 so that I can slide other clips in.

     

     

    I should, at a minimum, be able to press a modifier key to just move the video.

     

    You can.  Hit ALT to select only the video and only video moves.  Done.

     

     

    you can't move anything unless it is already on a higher track. That's just wrong. So the feature is completely useless to me and I don't even try to use it.

     

    Exactly.  It should not be a Nudge Up feature, but a Move to Higher Track feature, because for audio a 'higher track' is actually down.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 3, 2013 9:02 AM   in reply to Jim Simon

    For me it's to make room on both V1 and A1 so that I can slide other clips in.

    I am not trying to be contrary. Really. I get moving the video. But I would prefer that if I moved video from track V1 to track V3, and I wanted to slide a clip on to track V1, to have the audio just find the first available open track. I label my clips in a way that virtually eliminates the need for the video and audio to be on the same track number. I can see what is where. However, I understand why that would be preferable for others.

     

    So OK.

    You can.  Hit ALT to select only the video and only video moves.  Done.

     

    Sorry, but you just confused me. I have to hold the Alt key down to nudge anything. How does that allow me to just move audio or video? What am I missing?

     

    Exactly.  It should not be a Nudge Up feature, but a Move to Higher Track feature, because for audio a 'higher track' is actually down.

     

    Yes. Absolutely. We agree. A "Move to Higher Track" or "Move to Lower Track" feature.

     

    The way it is looks like someone wasn't paying attention. I mean really, come on Adobe, you are making us FanBoys look bad with badly implemented features like this. How can we defend this?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 3, 2013 9:06 AM   in reply to Steven L. Gotz

    I have to hold the Alt key down to nudge anything.

     

    What I mean is you use the standard modifier for selecting only video or audio that's been part of Premiere since it went Pro, hold down he ALT key when selecting.  Once you have only the part you want selected, do with it as you please.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 3, 2013 9:11 AM   in reply to Jim Simon

    AH! Got it. Makes sense now. Thanks. That is actually quite useful. Thanks.

     

    But I should have an option in Preferences that eliminates that need. I never move audio. It would totally negate my track labeling as seen below:

     

    Capture.PNG

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 3, 2013 1:54 PM   in reply to Steven L. Gotz

    You can always just click/drag it with the mouse. I mean, you're clicking anyway to select, right?

     
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    Aug 3, 2013 1:58 PM   in reply to Jim Simon

    Well, yes, but then again, I am a basically a mouse guy anyway, but trying to break the habit. People who are keyboard type editors might have a different opinion.

     

    Besides, the point of the nudge for us mouse users is to prevent having to move the CTI to have something to snap to. The nudge goes up and down, not sideways by accident the way a mouse move might.

     

    I would prefer to click on it without the Alt key first, but then again, it would have to be a preference so it wouldn't bother people who prefer it the other way.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 3, 2013 6:16 PM   in reply to Steven L. Gotz

    "> This topic has been moved to the Video Lounge"

     

    That's what the second post after this will say

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 4, 2013 7:59 AM   in reply to PierreLouisBeranek

    What do you think of the checkbox toggle I suggested in my official FR for this in another thread

    Works for me.

     

    Your last couple of suggestions seem to have been right on the mark. I don't always agree that your suggestions are more important that others I would rather have them work on, but you are hitting the sweet spot for requests lately (in my opinion, of course). Keep it up.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 4, 2013 10:04 AM   in reply to Steven L. Gotz

    People who are keyboard type editors might have a different opinion.

     

    Even they still have to select with the mouse when selecting only video or audio of a linked clip.  The only keyboard shortcut for clip selection will select the entire clip.

     

    I would prefer to click on it without the Alt key first

     

    How exactly do you propose to make that work?  How do you determine if the whole clip, just the video or just the audio will be selected without using a modifier?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 4, 2013 10:04 AM   in reply to PierreLouisBeranek

    If unchecked, it would work the way I'm advocating: mouse pointer over video track = video gets moved, mouse pointer over audio track = audio gets moved.

     

    I think mouse pointer as a modifier is just a bad idea.  It's weird.  If you want things changed, it'd be better to create new keyboard shortcuts to move only video or only audio, even if both are selected.

     

    Of course, I still think the 'Collapse' feature would be more useful to more editors more often than any other change proposed so far.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 4, 2013 6:40 PM   in reply to Jim Simon

    My proposal is a preference setting that tells Pr not to nudge audio. EVER!

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 4, 2013 7:13 PM   in reply to Steven L. Gotz

    My proposal is anytime a clip is dragged vertically from track to another track...it stays locked in time.

     

    My actual reality is..I never ever have an issue dragging a clip and maintaining its position and time on the next track.  I will never need to do this so called  'nudge" with a shortcut method or by use of keyboard alone.

     

    Moving Audio and Video separately is so easy as well in these instances.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 4, 2013 7:26 PM   in reply to shooternz

    Well, to be honest, I have never used the nudge anyway since it doesn't work the way I want it to. And since I have always used the CTI to keep my clips snapped in time, I continue to do so without giving it a second thought.

     

    It just seems to me that it ought to work right if they are going to do it at all. And moving the video up while the audio goes down is just not logical. I can live without the feature.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Aug 5, 2013 3:47 PM   in reply to Steven L. Gotz

    My proposal is a preference setting that tells Pr not to nudge audio. EVER!

     

    So you'd have to change the preference if you ever wanted to move audio with the shortcut?

     

    Seems like a bad idea to me.  An interface button would be better.  (Oh wait, we have that with track locking. )

     
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