At last I've got my project 1½ hrs as m2t file on my hard drive. All 6 days' videos together come in at 19.5 GB. So far every segment of the whole I've done (PAL system of course, for the UK) has been at 1920x1080 25 fps (this is the main natural format of my DSLR).
I've followed Steve's strong recommendation and am going to burn to a folder on my HD and not attempt to burn direct to the Blu-ray.
My question is should I continue with the above procedure or change now to "Use for Exporting AVCHD"? My TV set and tuner can play AVCHD Blu-ray. (I'm talking here about publishing to a folder first on my HD, not direct to the Blu-ray burner.)
I know Steve in the Muvipix Guide refers to publishing as DV-AVI full quality video for pc's and on p 243 has a most useful sidebar with info about AVCHD, but is there any advantage to me now in going to AVCHD considering all my separate saves up to now on this project have been less high quality than that?
You write, Steve, that "m2t's are very similar to the video format produced by AVCHD recorders ..."
I don't suppose, to be honest, there'd be noticeable difference in my Blu-ray copy if I continued doing as I've done for each of the separate video clips before joining them all up in the final product?
Thanks for help ... Hope I've explained what I mean. Help!! On the final lap of this thing that's taken me just on 3 weeks! I've enjoyed it and learned a lot, with the Guide on the table next to my desktop.
My 'updates' to my original dont seem to be appearing ... To be clear, the screenshot is the m2t file of the final version. Should I re-import it into PE11 and burn to Blu-ray from there, or just use ImgBurn? Sorry for all this confusion on my part!
I have not read your references, so I am not sure if my suggestions will be in sync.
But here is my take on what I believed you asked.
If you have this master .m2t file, I would import that in Premiere Elements with the correct project preset and then burn to Blu-ray disc format on Blu-ray disc using the burn dialog's preset of "H.264 1920 x 1080 PAL Dolby". There is no burn to folder for Blu-ray.
There is a burn to folder for AVCHD. And the BDMV Folder from that saved folder can be taken into ImgBurn to give you an AVCHD format on Blu-ray disc. Although the Premiere Elements AVCHD burn to folder gives only the BDMV Folder and not the CERTIFICATE Folder, the burn in ImgBurn will give you a BDMV and create the CERTIFICATE Folder.
I see no reason to implicate ImgBurn in this matter for Blu-ray. If you were going to use something like the Phantom Burn in conjunction with Premiere Elements burn to Blu-ray to get the disc image for the .m2t file, that is another matter.
If your Blu-ray player can play an .m2t file burned to a Blu-ray disc as an .m2t file, then ImgBurn could be used to do that, as well as other burn to programs.
Note that I am making a distinction between Blu-ray and AVCHD here.
Please check it out. If you need clarification on anything that I have written, please do not hesitate to ask.
Just made the final touches and corrections to the final .prel product (I realised I’d made a mistake in one of the rolling text sequences), so I’m about to a really final (I hope!) m2t file of the whole thing, and then I’ll go with your suggestion, ATR. Many thanks again.
Looking forward to your results.
Probably not necessary, but just in case....Timeline stop markers do not function in the Premiere Elements Blu-ray disc format on Blu-ray disc playback. Has always been that way.
Good morning ATR and friends
Well it’s a bit of a long saga I’m afraid. First the good news – all the 1½hr movie is there on the Blu-ray disk. I’ve not yet played it all on the tuner connected to the TV set, but I ran through a lot of it quickly with the search facility and I think it’s all there and the quality is amazingly high.
The Samsung SE-506 Slim Portable Blu-ray Writer (to give it its full name) is indeed slim and light and rather slight (you certainly don’t want to treat this little machine carelessly) and, as you hinted, I could certainly do with a longer USB cable (I have longer ones but wanted to use the one supplied at least for the first go). But it sat on its little corner pads happily enough on the pull-out tray on the pc station just level with one of the USB sockets in front of the pc. Before I used it I downloaded the latest firmware from the Samsung site and that went quickly and smoothly.
Of course I’ve never burned to Blu-ray before so didn’t know what to expect. The encoding took ages and ages (this is after the length of a standard commercial movie, I guess) so I opened up my laptop to do some work to let the desktop get on with it. It got to the 99% mark and it then appeared to reach the dreaded just-hanging-there horror. I waited and waited and (I didn’t count the time, but it was a small age) eventually I took courage and clicked Cancel. Are you sure?, it asked me. Yes, I said with more certainty than I felt. And so it went through the whole process again. Again – 99% just hanging there (seemingly).
This time I left it. Eventually ... the sound changed and I looked up to see it very very slowly beginning to burn. 1% ... long pause ...2% ... long pause, so I thought OK we’re in for the long haul. I went back to the laptop. I looked up ... 2% ... Went back to work. Then to my astonishment, the Samsung door opened, and the message on PE11 said the movie was burned. So it went from 2% to completion in about 2 minutes. Is this the normal thing? My DVDs take longer than that to burn.
Took it out and popped it in the pc drive. Windows came up – Nothing to play contents with. Well, what had happened is that the Samsung came with a whole load of software, as things tend to. All of it Cyberlink, which in various ways seemed to really take over control of my computer. Bizarrely, the stuff seemed to install itself twice as if it was on some neverending loop and when it began to ask me for a third time if I really wanted to uninstall Re: .prel to Blu-ray in order to install the same thing again, I twigged and stopped it.
Did I really need Power DVD 10 + Power2Go + Power Producer + PowerBackup as well as InstantBurn (which seems a very dodgy thing to me) and LabelPrint (I always just use a pen for writing on disks and ordinary ink for the CD case!). My pc had already come with a (now old) PowerDVD which I never use. So I uninstalled everything from the Samsung DVD.
So when I came to try to play the Blu-ray disk, it seemed I’d nothing to play it with! My VLC (Videolan) which I use for pretty much everything didn’t recognise anything on the disk and said it couldn’t play it. So I opened up Windows Media Player which promptly reported that the disk was empty. Panic stations.
So at 3-30 in the morning I crept downstairs to the living room, popped the disk into the player, and marvel of marvels, there it was, all there!
But the other weird thing is that although Windows couldn’t play the disk, it told me that (this is an approximation from memory) the disk’s contents were something under 10GB, I think about nine-point-something, whereas before burning I’d checked and the full video (according to PE11) was to be 19.5 GB. Unless at 4 am I was a bit bleary-eyed by then, and missed a ‘1’ before the ‘9’. I’ll check it later.
I’m afraid I’ve not finished yet. I thought I’d followed all Steve’s instructions in the book for making menus. I chose one of the General templates, one that actually has two frames to it, a sort of diptych I suppose. I laboriously filled in the details, added my own background photo, made sure (I thought) that all the text fitted inside the TV-zone frames, but whatever I did, it wasn’t completely right. Now I confess I don’t watch much TV and rarely use the thing to play DVDs etc on the TV, so I’ll have to ask my wife who knows the gadget better than me, and will also consult the handbook – but although I could get the menus to work, I couldn’t get back to the menu page after stopping in mid-play. This isn’t a problem for this forum of course, so I wont digress further. But what I think is a problem for me is that the second of the diptych frames didn’t seem to appear at all, and my text in one of the lines over-ran hopelessly, and the arrows pointing to each marker were very small on the TV screen.
So it’s back to the drawing board, I’m afraid. But what I found on my computer, having forgotten that I’d downloaded and saved it, was a Steve Grisetti video (either from his Lynda.com series or from the Muvipix site, I forget) on Creating Menus, which of course I should have watched before starting work (even tho’ I followed the book, I thought, hmm...)
Well that’s quite enough from me for a while, sorry to go on at such length. Hoping for some friendly criticisms and advice as ever!
PS I've been doing some research. I'd no idea Blu-rays could be difficult to play on pcs!
Here are two things I've found so far.
What do you and most here use to play Blu-ray disks, if you do?
Focusing on computer playback of your Blu-ray disc format on Blu-ray disc
You need a player that supports Blu-ray. Windows Media Player and QuickTime do not.
What has turned out the best choice for me in this regard is to use the play back software that came with the Blu-ray burner. My case, CyberLink Power DVD 9. You probably have a later version bundled with your new Samsung burner. I would suggest that you download, installed it, and use it for your computer playback. If you have CyberLink Power DVD earlier version, it might not support Blu-ray.
VLC Player should be able to playback your home made Premiere Elements Blu-ray disc format on Blu-ray disc. But, from what I have read, there is a distinction between playback of "Blu-ray movies" and playback of your Blu-ray from Premiere Elements. Unless VLC has upgraded its support, there are special steps you need to go through to get "Blu-ray movies" playback from VLC player.
Am I reading correctly, your Blu-ray plays back on your Blu-ray player? That is great news.
As for burn times for the Blu-ray, that is going to depend on the speed rating of your burner, speed rating of Blu-ray disc, and the nature of what you are burning to the disc. If you are going to explore and experiment with these parameters, then we may want to consider investing in a BD-RE 25 GB disc so that you have a disc that can be reused after the program erases the prior content.
I need to go back on study the rest of the details of your post 7.
Looking forward to your progress.
Hi that’s again very helpful ATR, many thanks. I downloaded the latest version of VLC and it plays the Blu-ray disk on my pc perfectly, except that it doesn’t show the menus at all, it just launches straight into play, although of course it’s possible to jump to anywhere you want.
I had a look at the latest Power DVD on the website and whatever vs “13 Ultra” is, it costs just under 72GBP (reduced from just under 100) and unless it’s going to offer me something really special, I’m not sure that I want to splash out on it, because mostly I’m going to play Blu-ray disks (either mine or commercial ones) on the TV set (or on pc with VLC). But I might reconsider ...
There’s a site that comes up on Ixquick search (ie google without the strings attached!) http://tinyurl.com/n7opg27 offering a “free” download of Power DVD, which I fell for until I realised it came bundled with a whole lot of rubbish, which I then had to uninstall.
I gather that Blu-ray is a Sony invention and that they’re pretty strict about who can play them? Is that fair to Sony? Not sure if this is correct.
I had another look at the software that comes with the Blu-ray burner, and the problem is that it wants to install a whole lot of stuff I don’t want or need – it starts by asking you to click which of 4 icons you want to install, so I click on the Power DVD one (and I’m not sure if that’s something I’d have to pay to upgrade eventually) but you get all this other stuff I mentioned previously.
Probably I’m being naive, but all I want is a simple bit of software to play Blu-ray on Windows, and I think with the latest VLC it’s there (for some reason my existing copy wouldn’t play the Blu-ray, although it was only two minor upgrades out of date. Perhaps I had a corrupted file.
BD-RE 25 is something I’m going to have to look up on the web ...
What I’m going to do now is make 6 DVDs, one for each day, for those family members who don’t have Blu-ray. I have of course still got all the original files.
What I still need to do is get my menu-creating skills up to speed!
After you enter up having to install all the CyberLink program so that you get your PowerDVD installed, can you not go to Control Panel and uninstall all the unwanted ones, one by one. Each of those many CyberLink programs that got installed with my Blu-ray burner are all listed under Control Panel as individual programs.
Getting the disc menus to play in VLC is a frequent complaint. Often the reply to such question seems to be wait for the next version of the VLC player. My version is 2.0.6 and I am still having problems in that regard. Since I depend on the CyberLink Power DVD for the Blu-ray computer playback, I have ignore the VLC problem. I should try to see what is happening with it though.
We will be watching for more news. Sounds like progress.
You are correct that BD is all about Sony. They won the war between BD and HD-DVD some years ago. Their "master plan" was to limit all BD to only commercial releases, such as their own. They tried to kill almost all BD authoring programs, and partially succeeded, in that for any certified BD replication, one had to pay horrendous sums of $ to Sony.
At one time, they even issued firmware updates for their BD player devices, that precluded the playing of any burned BD, but seem to recall that they then lost a user-initiated lawsuit on that.
Another player, which is free, and has worked for me, is MediaPlayer Classic HC. It seems to play Menus, including pop-ups, pretty well, and might be worth a look.
How do you or did you get disc menus for Premiere Elements Blu-ray disc format on Blu-ray disc to play back with the Media Player Classic HC? I think that I have the latest version of player and, so far, it is in the same class with the VLC player in that regard...free, but not menus display.
I have used it with commercial BD's, and also some authored with Encore CS 6, but have not tried any BD's from PrE. I will gather up a test Project, and report either my success, or my failure.
More to come,
Since you have posted your comment about that Media Player Classic HD, I have gone back looking for some option in that player to see if I can find what I am overlooking. So far no luck.
Add On....I have found nothing so far online on "can do" for this player with regard to Blu-ray with menus. What version of that player are you using? We be watching for your follow up results.
Thanks for looking at this. I get good results with the software that came with my Blu-ray burner, so I am not eager to get involved with VLC and Media Player Classic HC. But always good to know that they are there just in case.
I sure will give it a look, Bill, thanks. No one should grudge a company a decent return on investments etc, but Sony looks like sheer greed here! (And unfair anti-competitive practices?) Thanks for the info.
Just tried it out, folks, and Lo! it lets me play chapters, ie the menus I knew must be somewhere! See uploaded screenshot of the MPC-HC with dialog box for navigation. But it didn't work straight away. It told me I didn't have something, I think a codec, to make it work properly and to download the latest, but the Help tag told me I had the latest stable version. So I tried again and this time it worked.
Thanks for your progress updates. Looking good.
My Media Player Classic HC is not showing that Jump to for Chapters nor am I getting menu playback with the player.
What link did you use for the download of the Media Player Classic that you are now using?
Hopefully, Hunt will be back with results and more of a description of the player that he says works for him in this regard.
Just about to call it a day and thought that I would update you on my "progress" with the Media Classic Player HC.
I have downloaded and installed it (64 bit version) from the link that you posted. I went through a green screen situation when I went to play back the Premiere Elements Blu-ray disc menu format on Blu-ray disc., but that got resolved with some options changing.
I did actual see chapter markers on the player's bar at the base of the screen. But as of yet no signs of disc menus. Interesting, maybe even promising, are the grayed out words "Chapter menu" under the Navigation Menu.
Hope Hunt has some input on how to get that player to display menus before the video since he says he has. Unfortunately I do not have any store purchased Blu-ray movie to test out that possibility.
Hi ATR et al
I’ve now worked out, with the spouse’s help, how to operate the gizmo that controls the TV disk player, and to my relief all the menus are there, although not very well done I must confess (and as I said one of the lines runs right off the screen, not good). On the MCP-HC, it does as the screenshot shows indicate Chapters, but not the titles of the chapters, so you have to know in advance what eg Chap 5 is.
I too await eagerly the results of Hunt’s researches. And I don’t have any commercial Blu-ray disks either, but I’m looking into that through a movie rental company here. If / when I get one, I’ll certainly report on what MCP-HC does with it.
Well, I produced and burned a short BD Project in PrE 11, that played perfectly on my Sony BD player (the model on the patio), with Menus.
However, that BD did NOT display Menus in my MediaPlayer Classic HC - something that I had never encountered before. For testing, I have used it with BD's out of Adobe Encore (only available with PrPro from CS 3 to CS 6), and commercial BD's, and it has displayed the Menus on those discs, along with Menus on all DVD-Video's.
ATR is correct.
I am not sure what differs between a BD from Encore, and one from PrE, as they both use many of the same Sonic AuthorCore modules for authoring, though there ARE differences. Apparently, there is some difference between the BD's from PrE and Encore, but I have no clue as to what it is - scratch my rec. for MPC HC, if one is using PrE.
gbrmb and Hunt,
Latest finding in the Media Player Classic HC - plays or does not play menus story.
The Blu-ray part of the question is still pending. But, tonight I tried one of my home made Premiere Elements family movies DVD-VIDEO on DVD disc and an old Bob Hope store purchased DVD movie. Both played back with menus on the Media Player Classic HC (my 64 bit version).
Note: So, did the VLC Media Player.
I have just completed my epic blog post on Blu-ray computer playback for Premiere Elements 11 and store purchased Blu-ray movies, using the VLC player (with and without add ons) as well as with the Media Player Classic x64. There is always more thing to explore, so "completed" is not the most accurate word for the topic's status at this point.
Hope you find it interesting
Thanks for that. MPC HC has played all of my DVD-Videos with the Menus, just fine. It was only with the PrE 11 BD, that the Menus did not play, but then it DID play both commercial BD's and Encore BD's, all with the Menus.
We seem to be in accord with
the PE DVD-VIDEO movie playback, with menus before the start of the movie
PE 11 Blu-ray movie playback, without menus before the start of the movie
But I need to explore with you your
but then it DID play both commercial BD's and Encore BD's, all with the Menus
What do you mean by "commerical BD's"...store purchased Blu-ray movies, and was the playback from the Blu-ray disc in the Blu-ray DVD computer drive?
As you probably noted, with MPC HC x64, my stored purchased Blu-ray movie result was no playback and error message.
So, besides the nature of your "commercial BD's" and whether on disc or not, I would ask if you added any filters to the MPC HC player?
I used the MPC HD as downloaded and installed. I did not attempt to add the multitude of filters that some claim will give this player support for Blu-ray movie with menus before the start of the movie.
As for Encore BD's all with Menus, I cannot comment on that at this point, except unexpected. Your results were unexpected because all online reports of MPC HC playback support is inconsistent with your "commercial BD's" and Encore BD's results "all with menus".
I was surprised to find the MPC HD x64 does support the playback of Premiere Elements 11 AVCHD DVD, but then without menus before the start of the AVCHD DVD movie.
Bizarre, I know how to un-hide folders etc, got to Roaming, tried various entries in Run for %appdata% and nothing shows up. In fact my AppData file doesn’t seem to be where that website says it should be (I’m aware there’s also a mistake on the site, in that Users isn’t within Windows).
I’ve downloaded the extra files OK, but right now they’re just sitting there. It’s even more strange ‘cos I’ve found AppData several times in the past.
"An aacs Folder** (empty) was created and placed in the Roaming Folder according to the path Local Disk C\Users\Owner\AppData\Roaming\"
See uploaded screenshot. Is an aacs Folder more than simply making a new folder in the ordinary way? If not, what is it? What do I call the new folder? Thanks for help.
The aacs folder cited is a new folder created the ordinary way and named aacs.
Before you open VLC, you should have that aacs folder as a folder in the Roaming Folder.
I have just modified the blog post to make that point clearer
- A folder named aacs** (empty) was created and placed in the Roaming Folder according to the path Local Disk C\Users\Owner\AppData\Roaming\
- KEYBD.cfg was obtained from http://vlc-aacs.whoknowsmy.name/ , by clicking on "get the file UPDATED 20-04-2012!"
- The KEYBD.cfg file was then placed in the aacc Folder.
Also see current footnotes
*The KEYDB.cfg file is downloaded and placed in the empty newly created aacs Folder in Roaming Folder. After first operation in VLC player, the aacs Folder then contains a vuk folder, drl file, and hrl file besides the KEYDB.cfg file.
**Create a new folder the usual way and name that folder aacs. Misspelling of folder name can cause failure to playback store purchased Blu-ray movie.
Looking forward to your results. Thanks for the follow up. Much appreciated.
And for “VLC directory” I’m just going to plonk the second file in --
Computer > OS (C:) > Program Files (x86) . VideoLan > VLC which has lots of other files in it that look as if the new file would live quite happily amongst them.
If it works, I’ll know I’ve done the right thing. Altho’ actually I don’t own any commercial Blu-ray videos yet, so I’ll just have to try it on my own PE11-created video, which is not of course what all this is about (I think). So it wont be a test. Had a look online at some commercially available Blu-ray movies – zilch interest to me so far! But there must be something out there!
But watch out for any misspellings.
Once when I was in a hurry I named the folder in Roaming aacc instead of aacs and that resulted in failure.
Another time when I had downloaded the libaacs.dll more than once and used the second copy which the system named as libaacs(1).dll, failure resulted until I removed the (1) so that the file name was libaacs.dll.
Still working on this, ATR, although more for intellectual curiosity than practical need, having completed successfully the burn-to-Blu-ray. I'm relying on Wikipedia so far (?!). I gather that BDAV is container format standard used for Blu-ray discs. It holds audio, video and other streams (I read).
The .m2ts page on Wikipedia says, "Blu-ray Disc titles authored with menu support are in the BDMV (Blu-ray Disc Movie) format and contain audio, video, and other streams in BDAV container (.m2ts), which is based on the MPEG transport stream format. The BDAV container is also used in the BDAV (Blu-ray Disc Audio/Visual) disc format, the consumer-oriented alternative to the BDMV discs. BDAV disc format is used on BD-RE and BD-R discs for audio/video recording ..." So BDMV is what to use if (as I guess we always do) we want menus on our Blu-ray discs.
PE11 presumably always burns Blu-rays using the BDMV format?
I'll have to look up the meaning in this context of 'Certificate' -- but not sure if I'll need one (depending on what it is).
By the way, is it possible to download (ie purchase) additional Menu templates for PE11, either from Adobe or elsewhere?
For additional Menu Templates, you might want to check out Muvipix.com. There are several there, which are for sale, or free to download to subscribers: http://muvipix.com/products.php?subcat_id=47 Some might be DVD-only, and some might be SD DVD-only. Check the specs. carefully.
Muvipix also offers stock footage, original music, and more.
Another source would be PreComposed. Jon Geddes offers some beautiful Menus, mostly done in After Effects (depending on how they are constructed, some might not work with PrE, so check any out very carefully, before buying: http://www.precomposed.com/ PrE has some very specific requirements, that some other, full-featured authoring programs does not. Again, check these out carefully, before buying.
There was a UK source, primarily for wedding Menus, but the link that I had to it, is now dead. IIRC, their Menus were not cheap, and would also probably not have worked directly in PrE, without a lot of editing in Photoshop.
Also, many users will take a stock Adobe Menu Set, and then modify it in Photoshop. They start by finding a Menu Set that is close to what they want, then modify that Template, to suit their purposes. Note here: PrE Menu Sets use some very specific conventions, so one needs to know exactly what they are doing, and then use those conventions 100%, or the Menu Set will not function. Still, with some work, and some care, much can be done, and by starting with a stock Template, a lot of the hard work is done - so long as certain things are not changed, like Layer Set names, etc.
The essentials of what I have consistently found in the basic Premiere Elements experience....
The content of your Premiere Elements Blu-ray disc format on Blu-ray disc with or without menus is:
In that BDMV Folder are several folders and files. In its STREAM Folder, you will find the video represented by the file 00000.m2ts. If disc menus included, the files named 00001.m2ts and 00002.m2ts are the disc menus.
The content of your Premiere Elements AVCHD format on DVD disc with menus is:
BDMV Folder ONLY
In that BDMV Folder are several folders and files. In its STREAM Folder, you will find the video represented by the file 00000.m2ts. If disc menus included, then the files named 00001.m2ts and 00002.m2ts are the disc menus.
If you are working with AVCHD DVD via the burn to folder route, when you take its BDMV into ImgBurn for the burn to DVD, ImgBurn will exit that with both the BDMV Folder and a newly created CERTIFICATE Folder.
I have never encountered a BDAV Folder in Premiere Elements burn to Blu-ray disc format on Blu-ray disc or AVCHD on DVD disc.
Hope that helps to focus on the Premiere Elements experience specifically.