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Creating a poster layout that can also be printed (PDF) as individual pages

Jan 10, 2014 8:33 AM

Tags: #poster_design #layout_multiple

Hello all,

 

I have a poster design that is two sided with four columns on each side. The size is 22" wide by 8.5" high. Now, I have a requirement where I need to print (to PDF) each column as a individual page in a single PDF.

 

What formatting changes are necessary in order to allow a single InDesign document that will print as both the poster design and a page-by-page PDF layout?

 

Thank you.

 
Replies
  • Rob Day
    3,120 posts
    Oct 16, 2007
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    Jan 10, 2014 8:42 AM   in reply to shawninvancouver

    You can place an InDesign documents inside of another InDesign document. So you could design your poster as a one page doc, setup another 8 page doc with its trim size set to the column width and height,  place the poster on those pages and position each accordingly, and export the pages to PDF.

     
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    Jan 10, 2014 8:41 AM   in reply to shawninvancouver

    So it's only one row?

     

    If that's the case you can turn off shuffling in the pages panel and drag individual pages together into spreads for the front and back and place your art. Then export tow PDFs -- one as individual pages, and one as spreads. You can't get the two types of prints from a single file, as far as I know.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2014 8:43 AM   in reply to shawninvancouver

    There is no automatic function to do this in InDesign. The easiest way I can think of doing it is to create new pages for each of the columns and copy the artwork from the poster onto those pages. If you have InDesign CS5 or later, you can mix page sizes in the document.

     

    It would be actually be easier to create this in Illustrator. In Illustrator, you can have one large artboard for the poster, then create smaller artboards within the poster for each column.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2014 8:57 AM   in reply to Steve Werner

    You can move pages around InDesign to create unique spreads.

     

    Untitled-1.jpg

     

     

    You can do this by using the Pages Panel

     

    Untick the Allow Pages to Shuffle

     

    Line up your documents by dragging them beside each other in the pages panel.

     

     

    Then using the Pages Tool - you can move the pages underneath each other.

     

    Resize pages to suit your column sizes

     

    Untitled-2.jpg

     
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  • Rob Day
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    Oct 16, 2007
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    Jan 10, 2014 9:08 AM   in reply to shawninvancouver

    Here's an InDesign inside of InDesign example, where the master poster is setup as two pages for the front and back. The print document on the left has the master placed on full size and column size pages. Any edits made to the master would get updated in the print/export file links.

     

    Screen Shot 2014-01-10 at 11.57.36 AM.png

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2014 10:13 AM   in reply to shawninvancouver

    The whoile point of my suggestion is that you don't need two documents you just need to export the same file in two different ways to PDF.

     

    But it only works if you can set up spreads in ID, and that's limited to single rows of a maximum 10 pages per spread:

     

    Wide Spread.png

     

    This file can be output as 12 individual pages, or two spreads six pages wide.

     
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  • Rob Day
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    Oct 16, 2007
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    Jan 10, 2014 10:44 AM   in reply to Peter Spier

    I think spreads work if the poster grid is uniform, but not if you want the small prints to be specific parts of a non-uniform grid. So this works:

     

    Screen Shot 2014-01-10 at 1.39.17 PM.png

     

    but this doesn't

     

    Screen Shot 2014-01-10 at 1.38.31 PM.png

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2014 11:16 AM   in reply to shawninvancouver

    Show the import options...

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2014 11:18 AM   in reply to Rob Day

    Rob Day wrote:

     

    I think spreads work if the poster grid is uniform, but not if you want the small prints to be specific parts of a non-uniform grid.

    You'd have the same issue placing one page into another.

     

    But I'm pretty sure Shawn said the pages were uniform width.

     
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  • Rob Day
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    Jan 10, 2014 11:55 AM   in reply to Peter Spier

    You'd have the same issue placing one page into another.

     

    Here I have 4 different sized "print areas" randomly placed on the poster linked back to pages matching the poster area dimensions:

     

    Screen Shot 2014-01-10 at 2.52.49 PM.png

     
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  • Rob Day
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    Oct 16, 2007
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    Jan 10, 2014 12:02 PM   in reply to shawninvancouver

    I suppose, the only caveat to importing .indd is that I can never change the name of the source (referenced) document (my document names include version # - which changes). But I can live with this.

     

    You can relink to new versions via Links>Relink All Instances of YourPosterV1.indd

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2014 12:06 PM   in reply to Rob Day

    Rob Day wrote:

     

    You'd have the same issue placing one page into another.

     

    Here I have 4 different sized "print areas" randomly placed on the poster linked back to pages matching the poster area dimensions:

     

    Ok, I see what you're saying, and that might be an advantage if you have non-uniform pages to print individually. But you now have two files to maintain, no?

     

    I'm not a fan of alternate layouts, but maybe setting up multiple page sizes in one file and using the content collector to duplicate stuff would be worthwhile. If the pages are uninform, though, and maybe even if they are not, if you can set it up as two spreads I think that's goiong to be less work in the long run.

     
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  • Rob Day
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    Oct 16, 2007
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    Jan 10, 2014 12:23 PM   in reply to Peter Spier

    But you now have two files to maintain, no?

     

    There wouldn't be any maintenance in the print version other than making sure the links are up to date before you print. I suppose if the print areas were changing all the time you'd have to watch the custom page sizes.

     

    I use it more for step and repeats to my large format printer—I can put something 24-up and edit all 24 from one file.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 10, 2014 12:59 PM   in reply to Rob Day

    I place files n-up for step and repeat, too, especailly if I think they will get edited and reprinted, but for a poster like this I'd do one file that I export two different ways.

     
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  • Rob Day
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    Oct 16, 2007
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    Jan 10, 2014 1:55 PM   in reply to shawninvancouver

    And not lose any of the position settings?

     

    If version 2 is the same size and hasn't been rearranged then nothing will move. This is no different than placing an image, AI or PDF file multiple times.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 13, 2014 3:18 AM   in reply to Peter Spier

    Peter Spier wrote:

     

    The whoile point of my suggestion is that you don't need two documents you just need to export the same file in two different ways to PDF.

     

    But it only works if you can set up spreads in ID, and that's limited to single rows of a maximum 10 pages per spread:

     

    @Peter – there is hope for constructing InDesign files with more than 10 pages per spread.
    Caveat: IDML export. That will ruin such a file.

     

    See  Daveys' scripting problem which, in fact, could be a solution overcoming this limit:

     

    myDavey

    Help with Combine Docs script

    http://forums.adobe.com/thread/1377713?tstart=0

     

    Something I could accomplish after running a script and did some work in the pages panel:

     

    OneSpreadSixteenPages-Rearranged.png

     

    My script presented in the scripting forum  added 10 pages to spread one. But it could be as well 16 pages. After changing the shuffle options from "1-17" to "[1-17]", I could remove the first page and the last page. After that I reordered the pages with Pages Tool. The result is the screenshot above.

     

    But a fair warning here:

    I did not test fully, if all export or print function will work on that file or behave as expected.
    Most important: the pages AND the objects on the pages are not in the same order after export/import IDML!

     

    Script for adding the 10 pages here:

     

    http://forums.adobe.com/message/6006846#6006846

     

    If you want to add more than 10 pages, just change the number in the for-loop.

     

    For starting experiments, you'll need a two pages, single sided document (double sided will work, too, but arranging pages is a bit more restricted).


    It's necessary, that the two pages have different bounds:
    Page 1 horizontal, page 2 vertical in two different spreads will do.

     

    Uwe

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 13, 2014 5:30 AM   in reply to Laubender

    Wow.

     
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    Jan 13, 2014 6:08 AM   in reply to Peter Spier

    Double wow!

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 13, 2014 10:50 AM   in reply to Eugene Tyson

    @Eugene & Peter – yeah…
    Printing and exporting to PDF does work.

     

    However, we have to keep in mind, that there is no spine!

    And it's just a single spread!

     

    That means:

     

    1. The 0/0 x/y coordinate system is a global one for ALL pages.

     

    2. Therefore: Paste in Place does not work as usually expected. Every time  you want copy/paste objects from page to page with "Paste in Plac"e you have to move the 0/0-origin of the coordinate system to the same relative page position as before.

     

    3. Text formatting like "Away From Spine" and "With Spine" does not work as expected.

     

    4. There are no automatic master pages dedicated to "left" or "right" (even and odd numbered) pages. Though you could make 2 single master pages for that purpose and apply them manually.

     

    However, it is a way to have both:

    1. A designers' view on last page/first page in arranging them next to each other AND
    2. PDF-Export with single pages for production purposes

     

    without rearranging pages in Acrobat or renumbering pages' pagination numbers in InDesign.

     

    I think there could be various applications for adding more than 10 pages to a spread.

    Sometimes it's useful, more often it is not…

     

    Exchanging files through IDML unfortunately would bring "chaos" (*).
    I exported the following example to IDML, tried to open the IDML in InDesign CS5.5, but it crashed the app. So we can rule out IDML of that game all together…

     

    Here a view of a more design oriented arrangement of 16 pages:

     

    16PagesArrangedMoreDesignOriented.png

     

    Uwe

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 13, 2014 11:00 AM   in reply to Laubender

    I'm a little confused at this point by the screen capture. Do you see all 16 pages side-by-side in the layout as you do in the pages panel, or do you see them stacked in pairs when you are working?

     
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  • Rob Day
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    Oct 16, 2007
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    Jan 13, 2014 11:17 AM   in reply to Peter Spier

    If you place a Photoshop file in InDesign you have two documents to maintain why's that not a problem? What make placing InDesign inside of InDesign different?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 13, 2014 11:28 AM   in reply to Rob Day

    I just don't see a reason, for a file that is not n-up and that is going to have identical content, to exist in two versions if you can do it with one layout. You don't need to do anything but change the export option. If you place one file ito the other you need to edit the original, export, open the container, update the link and export. That's an extra step or two (not to mention the extra time to import the pages into the second file), and an extra file you don't really need to keep track of.

     

    It might not matter to the OP here because he's already got the original file set up, but I'd never go that route on a new project like this.

     

    And in this case it probably wouldn't show up because there is no scaling going on, but there are some dangers taht users need to be aware of in placing native pages when the size changes. If the text is scaled beyond the point where the kerning tables are active (from very small to large, or from large to very small) text will reflow in the pages. I've seen this happen. It's not a problem with placed PDF, however.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 13, 2014 11:34 AM   in reply to Laubender

    @Peter – I rearranged the pages with the Pages Tool. That means the view of the arranged pages is the actual working area. One spread, 16 pages. Nothing more, nothing less.

     

    16Pages.png

     

    And another thing:
    I opened the CS5.5 file with the 16 pages in InDesign CS6 v8.0.2 on Mac OSX 10.7.5 and the arrangement of pages was stable.

     

    I did a IDML export from InDesign CS6, but could not open the IDML.

    It crashed InDesign as well.

     

    Next tried to open the IDML in InDesign CS4.

    CS4 did NOT crash!

    But only the first 10 pages were created.

     

    Uwe

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 13, 2014 12:28 PM   in reply to Laubender

    Ah. I found a trick to exporting the IDML without crashing InDesign CS5.5 or CS6.

    You have to set the pages in the IDML from "[1-16]" to "1-16".

     

    Just edit the packaged file:

     

    "Spread_uc0.xml"

     

    In the third line of the xml file from:

     

    AllowPageShuffle="false"

     

    To:

     

    AllowPageShuffle="true"

     

    <Spread Self="uc0" FlattenerOverride="Default" AllowPageShuffle="true" ItemTransform="1 0 0 1 0 0" ShowMasterItems="true" PageCount="16" BindingLocation="0" PageTransitionType="None" PageTransitionDirection="NotApplicable" PageTransitionDuration="Medium">
    

     

    However all 16 pages and together with the contents would move to  indvidual spreads. :-(

     

    Uwe

     
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  • Rob Day
    3,120 posts
    Oct 16, 2007
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    Jan 13, 2014 1:14 PM   in reply to Peter Spier

    If you place one file ito the other you need to edit the original, export, open the container, update the link and export.

    Fair enough, although I would simply option double-click page 1 of my Poster&Pages file make the correction and save so the updates are automatic then export both the posters and pages from the file with the placed ID files.

     

     

    I never assumed the limitation of symeterical print areas, I think that's why we are looking at it differently.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 13, 2014 1:26 PM   in reply to Rob Day

    There is no limitiation of symmetrical page sizes in actuality. You can use the page tool to set the pages to any dimensions you choose and still combine them into a single spread.

     

    I'm sure there are cases where your method would be better, but I think they are likely to be less common in the wild, at least for a project described as this one was.

     
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  • Rob Day
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    Oct 16, 2007
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    Jan 13, 2014 1:55 PM   in reply to Peter Spier

    Ok I see what your saying, I didn't realize you could have space between pages on a spread. Although the cluttered workspace and wierd preview mode is tough going.

     
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