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2609 Views 20 Replies Latest reply: Jun 4, 2009 12:41 PM by Printer_Rick RSS
Printer_Rick Participant 1,283 posts since
May 19, 2009
Currently Being Moderated

Jun 1, 2009 3:28 PM

add used colors re-colors artwork

I think I have found a bug in CS4.

 

Say there is an object, its fill color is not in the swatch list. Now make a spot color, with a CMYK definition that matches the fill color of the object

 

DO NOT change the fill color to the spot color, leave the fill as is

 

Now add used colors. Illustrator recolors the object, making it the spot color. I don't think this is supposed to happen. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think Illustrator should add a new process color swatch when adding used colors, instead of re-coloring objects. Any thoughts?

 

This is not a new problem, it happens in CS3 too.

  • Wade_Zimmerman Star 7,101 posts since
    Apr 6, 2009
    Currently Being Moderated
    1. Jun 1, 2009 3:35 PM (in response to Printer_Rick)
    Re: add used colors re-colors artwork

    I think it works that way. In other words it can't read your mind as to what your intent is and if you have a different view point you could say hey why did it not replace the color after all I now confirmed that I wanted it to be a spot color and I made a swatch of it and said this is used color if it is a used color then it must be somewhere in the document so what do you expect?

  • [scott w] Contributor 2,552 posts since
    May 2, 2006
    Currently Being Moderated
    2. Jun 1, 2009 3:33 PM (in response to Printer_Rick)
    Re: add used colors re-colors artwork

    Now make a spot color, with a CMYK definition that matches the fill color of the object

     

    Seems to me it's logical. If you have a fill that is the exact same color breakout as a spot color, Illustrator assumes it's the spot.

  • Wade_Zimmerman Star 7,101 posts since
    Apr 6, 2009
    Currently Being Moderated
    3. Jun 1, 2009 3:36 PM (in response to [scott w])
    Re: add used colors re-colors artwork

    I agree with Scot if you say it is a used color and it matches then it must be being used. Sees logical to me as well. And actually a good feature.

  • Wade_Zimmerman Star 7,101 posts since
    Apr 6, 2009
    Currently Being Moderated
    5. Jun 1, 2009 3:51 PM (in response to Printer_Rick)
    Re: add used colors re-colors artwork

    This is a personalized view point perhaps step back from it and look 

    at the other possibilities and you might think of a feature request as 

    opposed to calling it a bug.

     

    A bug is something that fails to function not some I don't like there 

    is a big difference.

  • Wade_Zimmerman Star 7,101 posts since
    Apr 6, 2009
    Currently Being Moderated
    6. Jun 1, 2009 3:53 PM (in response to Printer_Rick)
    Re: add used colors re-colors artwork

    BTW the Live Color Feature would give you many choices about how you 

    would like this handled and might be a tool you should become familiar 

    with for a more modern work flow.

  • Doug Katz Participant 1,133 posts since
    Aug 11, 2002
    Currently Being Moderated
    7. Jun 1, 2009 7:45 PM (in response to Printer_Rick)
    Re: add used colors re-colors artwork

    With all respect, I agree with Herb. That the object is changed to the exact same color build as another swatch already in the swatches panel is one thing. It's one thing that makes perfect sense as Scott and Wade point out.

     

    But this is not all that's happening in Herb's example. Illustrator is converting a process color to a spot color... without being asked to. So in this case it isn't simply "adding used colors" because the spot color was not, in fact, being used!

     

    It seems risky to claim that, because an already named but unused spot color happens to have the same color build as a used but unnamed process color, Illustrator should feel free to fill objects containing the latter with the former after asking it to Add Used Colors!

     

    The "Add Used Colors" command is supposed to:

     

    1) look for colors actually stroking or filling existing artwork (and stroking or filling existing symbols, brushes and graphic styles) for which there are no swatches in the swatches panel.

     

    2) If and when such unnamed colors are found, add those colors to the swatches panel.

     

    But in Herb's example, the spot swatch he created was nowhere in the artwork or in any symbol, brush or style. In fact it ONLY existed in the swatches panel itself. And it SURELY was not filling the object that Illustrator fills with the spot color once he chose Add Used Colors. It would truly make more sense for the unnamed process build filling the object to be added to the swatches panel. This is not a personalized view. I too would call it a bug.

  • Wade_Zimmerman Star 7,101 posts since
    Apr 6, 2009
    Currently Being Moderated
    8. Jun 1, 2009 9:22 PM (in response to Doug Katz)
    Re: add used colors re-colors artwork

    First of all Doug you arguing about what you think is what it should do and not that it is a bug. Which it is not.
    But back to your thought that since it was a process color it should be replaced by a  process color even if you go through the trouble of opening a color book  library to select a spot color again Illustrator does not read minds, functions very poor in this regard. it is up to you to tell it what to do and if you picked a spot color then you must want a spot color.

  • Doug Katz Participant 1,133 posts since
    Aug 11, 2002
    Currently Being Moderated
    10. Jun 2, 2009 8:29 AM (in response to Wade_Zimmerman)
    Re: add used colors re-colors artwork

    Wade, my dear friend, is it your understanding that the Add Used Colors command is to create swatches in the swatches panel for colors that are used in the artwork but not named in the panel EXCEPT if a spot swatch that happens to have the same process build as an unnamed color used in the artwork exists in the swatches panel and is not used in the artwork?

  • Wade_Zimmerman Star 7,101 posts since
    Apr 6, 2009
    Currently Being Moderated
    11. Jun 2, 2009 8:47 AM (in response to Doug Katz)
    Re: add used colors re-colors artwork

    Herb and Doug we can argue the point but what it comes down to is that we see it differently so we disagree.

     

    I do understand your point of view but I know from experience that it ill not be the only view point and so there will be a disagreement.

     

    It depends on the way the person works.

     

    I don't think this is a really large issue or there would have been more opinions expressed here, I can se there being a users choice in this matter
    but not a change. And that would be a feature request.

     

    I find it hard to believe also that so many things that do not work the way he user wants it is called a bug. A bug is something that does not function the way it was designed not something that does not function the way I think it should or would like it to function.

     

    I was hoping Herb would react in a way that would express a way he thinks he would could work with this if it could not be changed a preference setting
    or a toggle or a new item etc.?

  • Judy_Arndt User 243 posts since
    Apr 23, 2005
    Currently Being Moderated
    13. Jun 2, 2009 10:54 AM (in response to Printer_Rick)
    Re: add used colors re-colors artwork

    Herb, I just tested this in CS4.

     

    It's a bug.

     

    I periodically need both a spot (enamel) and an equivalent process color in my work. This totally unexpected conversion of process to spot could lead to costly errors.

  • Judy_Arndt User 243 posts since
    Apr 23, 2005
    Currently Being Moderated
    15. Jun 2, 2009 12:12 PM (in response to Printer_Rick)
    Re: add used colors re-colors artwork

    Herb, I have just submitted a bug report here:

     

    https://www.adobe.com/cfusion/mmform/index.cfm?name=wishform

     

    If you'd like to reproduce the problem on your own machine and use the report I've submitted, feel free to copy or edit it as you wish for submission.

     

    -----------------

     

    Problem:

    Illustrators 'Add Selected Colors' command converts process color objects to spot color objects, if an equivalent CMYK spot color already exists in the swatches panel.

     

    Steps to reproduce bug:

     

    1. CMYK document color mode.

     

    2. No color swatches in swatches panel.

     

    3. Draw an object. Using the color mixer, fill it with C=0 M=100 Y=100 K=O.

     

    4. Do not add this swatch to the swatches panel.

     

    5. Make a new *spot color swatch* named 'Red Enamel' based on the identical CMYK mix as previously used, C=0 M=100 Y=100 K=O.

     

    6. Draw a new object and fill it with the swatch 'Red Enamel'.

     

    7. Select all objects.

     

    8. In the swatches panel, Add Selected Colors.

     

    Results:

     

    1. No new swatches are added.

     

    2. All process red objects now have the spot 'Red Enamel' fill applied.

     

    3. When printed to separations, objects that were supposed to print on process plates will print on a spot plate.

     

    Expected Result:

     

    A new process swatch, C=0 M=100 Y=100 K=O, should be added to the swatches panel.

     

    Please note that this bug is not limited to the specific CMYK mix used here as an example. It occurs whenever a spot and process color have identical CMYK numbers.

     

    I periodically need both a spot (enamel) and an equivalent process color in my work. If this totally unexpected error is not caught and manually corrected, it will result in costly errors.

  • Doug Katz Participant 1,133 posts since
    Aug 11, 2002
    Currently Being Moderated
    17. Jun 3, 2009 4:25 AM (in response to Judy_Arndt)
    Re: add used colors re-colors artwork

    You go, girl!

  • Judy_Arndt User 243 posts since
    Apr 23, 2005
    Currently Being Moderated
    18. Jun 3, 2009 12:57 PM (in response to Doug Katz)
    Re: add used colors re-colors artwork

    Thanks Doug. :)

     

    Herb, thank you for bringing this issue to our attention. Had I not known about it, it could have cost me dearly.

     

    I've learned that a good way to get software improvements is to submit concise bug reports. I know it takes a bit of time, but unlike rambling discussions on forums, it conveys the problem directly to the engineers.

     

  • Wade_Zimmerman Star 7,101 posts since
    Apr 6, 2009
    Currently Being Moderated
    19. Jun 4, 2009 12:10 PM (in response to Judy_Arndt)
    Re: add used colors re-colors artwork

    If you guys think it is a bug you have done the right thing.

     

    i am however curious are you all former Freehand users? My guess is yes!

     

    You might find this logical but as we see Illustrator users do not

    necessarily see your logic.

    For instance it seems there are old time Illustrator users who do not

    like the new clipping mask behavior.

     

    Some of you might not understand that and though I like it they just

    do not understand why anyone would want this new behavior

    as much as it might be like FreeHand.

     

    This might be another one of those issues. And since there is a way to

    accomplish this already a feature request might be in order.

     

    That is what I suggest.

     

    I posted this last week so I do not know why it is showing u today.

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