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jameskiavi
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Opening InDesign CS5 documents in CS3?

May 11, 2010 2:21 PM

I found this helpful article about how to open a CS5 document in CS3.

 

http://help.adobe.com/en_US/indesign/cs/using/WSa285fff53dea4f86173837 51001ea8cb3f-6d4da.html

 

Unfortunately this does me no good because I need to have CS4 in order to  pull it off. I only own CS3 and CS5. Is there another way to get a CS5 InDesign  document into CS3?

 

Please help!

 
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    May 11, 2010 2:35 PM   in reply to jameskiavi

    The only way to get from CS5 to CS3 is to go through CS4 because CS5 doesn't know about .inx and CS3 doesn't know about .idml. You'll lose any features that are not supported, and you should expect some differences in line endings due to differences in the text engines. Going back is really not a recommended workflow.

     

    What is the compelling reason, and how many files do you need to convert? A number of us would be willing to do one or two for you, but, as I said, this is NOT a good workflow, especially if they are going to make a round-trip.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    May 11, 2010 2:36 PM   in reply to jameskiavi

    If it's one file, you can email it to me and I'll save it back from CS4.

     

    Don't expect miracles. Any new features will be lost or even worse, badly mangled.

     

    Bob (Bob AT theindesignguy DOT com)

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    May 11, 2010 2:50 PM   in reply to jameskiavi

    Maybe we should try to figure out why CS5 is crashing?

     

    Any error messages? Crash reports?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Oct 6, 2010 3:31 PM   in reply to jameskiavi

    Does any one know of a place i can download a demo of an older version of indesign especially CS4.  I need to get this CS5 file down to a client using CS3, nightmare!

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Oct 6, 2010 3:42 PM   in reply to peterorper
     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 16, 2011 12:30 PM   in reply to jameskiavi

    I know this was probably solved long ago, but I thought I might help you prevent it from happening in the future.

     

    2 of the most common reasons for InDesign crashing are:

     

    1. Corrupted preferences file

    and

    2. Corrupted fonts installed

     

    1. Try holding down CTRL+ALT+SHIFT when opening InDesign. From here you can restore it to defualt settings.

    2. If this doesn't work, it might be a corrupt font. If you've installed any fonts recently I'd suggest deleting them.

    (Windows font folder is located under: C:\Windows\Fonts)

     

    I've had both problems before in the past and these sorted it out for me.

     

    Hopefully one of these techniques should help.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 17, 2011 1:30 PM   in reply to jameskiavi

    Not allowing backward compatibility from InDesign CS5 to CS3 is a mistake in my mind. Adobe is creating customer dissatisfaction rather than showing itself as a leader in the field. Some people might think the lack of backward compatibility is being done out of pure greed to force CS3 owners to upgrade. In any event, it makes InDesign CS5 less useful in today's marketplace given that many print shops have CS3 and can't accept a CS5 document.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 17, 2011 1:39 PM   in reply to MrSunny

    Disgree! With everything that would be lost, the same people kvetching about the inability to save back would be kvetching about how their layouts don't look the same in CS3 as they do in CS5.

     

    I've said it before, I'll say it again. If you want to be in this business you need to have all of the tools that your clients require and if that means having 3 versions of InDesign installed that's what it means. If it means you have to use CS3 to create a layout because that's what the client wants then you use CS3.

     

    Finally, I have no idea what version of InDesign any printer I use has. In fact, for all I know they don't have InDesign at all. Any printer worth doing business with will not only accept PDFs they will prefer them. NEVER EVER send a saved back file for printing.

     

    Bob

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 17, 2011 1:45 PM   in reply to MrSunny

    I feel so cheap responding to this flogging of a long-dead horse. No version of InDesign since 4 (aka CS2) has been able to export to a file that can be read by any version older than the previous one. That is, CS2 can export a file that CS can read. CS4 can export a file that CS3 can read. CS (aka version 3) cannot export to a file any older version can read. This is not new. I would rather Adobe concentrate on keeping InDesign close to bug free and the format stable and reliable than have to deal with the complete disaster that in Adobe Illustrator.

     

    Adobe has, at least in this one example, it’s priorities straight and correct. The less noise their over-powerful marketing suits hear from people who wrongly think this is a major issue, the less effort they will put into developing backwards compatibility. It’s called “backwards” for a reason.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jan 17, 2011 1:45 PM   in reply to MrSunny

    Backward comaptibility issues in page layout applications are neither new nor unique to InDesign, and have absolutely nothing to do with greed.

     

    Nor should you be sending native files to your printer. Accepted standard delivery is PDF, and has been since before CS3 was released, so the version of InDesign your printer has chosen to stop on is of no consequence. While choice of printers is largely a matter of personal preference, those that fail to keep up with the current technology in page layout usually have a lot of other problems that make them poor candidates for sending work produced in a modern workflow.

     

    All of that aside, if you have CS3 and are happy working with the printer and feel you must send native files, you should continue to work in CS3. Adobe has a 30-day refund policy.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 16, 2011 3:11 AM   in reply to jameskiavi

    Someone needs to write a programme or widget or something to get round this.

     

    Adobe I posted about this a few weeks ago.

     

    I have one studio with 10 people in Surrey (England) all on CS3 our small studio in London (England) has CS5

    my clinets have CS3. My freelancers all have CS3

     

    This is turning into a nighmare.

     

    My only solution is to go back to CS3 and leave CS5 on the shelf.

     

    When we all moved from QUARK to Indesign you wrote your programme to facilitate this to get people to use Insesign now those very people who converted at great expence and a big learning curve  you have ****on.

     

    Well thank you! You suck!

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 16, 2011 6:04 AM   in reply to Paul Phillips

    How much would you be willing to pay for such a widget?

     

    Bob

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 16, 2011 6:38 AM   in reply to Bob Levine

    Well I don't know how Adobe works but...

     

    Let say you added £20.00 to the end user costs to enable people to 

    back save

    multiply that by x 1000's of products you sell.

     

    Does that work??  Does that cover your costs?

     

    We are just humble designers who most of the time don't use all the 

    new fangled

    bits you add on to Indesign we just need to be able to open documents, 

    have our clients open documents

    and have our freelancers open documents to maximise our work flow.

     

    In Indesign 3 I remember buying something buy Markzware that opened 

    Quark files, (as you dropped that feature after

    Indesign 2?)  That was £60.00 or so.

     

    Thats what I want something like that!

     

    Then the chat rooms would have nothing to talk about. I and my clients 

    and my associated studio and my freelancers

    and all the land in all the word would be happy!!

     

     

    Thanks and regards

     

    Paul

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 16, 2011 6:46 AM   in reply to Paul Phillips

    Paul, I investigated the possibility of converting one version of ID document to another. After several weeks of digging, I decided that this target

     

    function(){return A.apply(null,[this].concat($A(arguments)))}

    .. the chat rooms would have nothing to talk about. I and my clients and my associated studio and my freelancers and all the land in all the word would be happy ..

     

    is just not a feasible one.

     

    You say you don't use all those fancy new thingamagoogies in your latest and newest version, but not everyone does (not), and no matter how much I would emphasize It Wont Work for all types of documents, people will still complain It Doesn't Work for all types of documents.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 16, 2011 7:03 AM   in reply to Paul Phillips

    Your comments show that you've made very little effort to understand how this works or why.

     

    First point. Adobe didn't "drop" anything. The same capability that existed in InDesign 1.0 to open Quark 3.x and 4.x file still exists in InDesign CS5. Quark began to encrypt their file format with XPress 5.0 and Adobe could not legally allow InDesign to open it. Quark depends on Markzware to fill a need in its market and wouldn't dare go after them for developing a way to open Quark 5 and later in ID.

     

    Finally, it's much easier to open old files in new version than to save back to an old one. This has been discussed to death and I will repeat my oft stated advice. If you want to be in this business software upgrades are a cost of doing so. You need every version. It's simple as that.

     

    Bob

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 16, 2011 7:18 AM   in reply to Paul Phillips

    Paul Phillips wrote:

     

     

    I have one studio with 10 people in Surrey (England) all on CS3 our small studio in London (England) has CS5

    my clinets have CS3. My freelancers all have CS3

     

    ...

    My only solution is to go back to CS3 and leave CS5 on the shelf.

     

    And in your particular case it looks like an excellent solution. If you aren't using the new features in the new version and need to work with others who have not upgraded it makes no snse to me to have spent time and money on upgrading a single office. Once evryone is ready to make the leap to a new version, you should all do it together.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 16, 2011 10:22 AM   in reply to Peter Spier

    I'm sure there must be a way to at least make a plugin to be able to down-save.

    Or perhaps a portable program.

     

    I would have a go at making one myself as I have some experience programming, but I don't have a copy of CS3 or CS4.

    I really need something that would allow me to down-save... mainly for Flash.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 16, 2011 10:35 AM   in reply to Jake_Sid

    Jake_Sid wrote:

     

    I'm sure there must be a way to at least make a plugin to be able to down-save.

    Or perhaps a portable program.

     

    I would have a go at making one myself as I have some experience programming, but I don't have a copy of CS3 or CS4.

    I really need something that would allow me to down-save... mainly for Flash.

    I like a guy with self confidence, but do you seriously think that if it was a simple task (or even complicated, but simple enough to justify spending a month or so of programmer time to solve) someone who writes plugins for a living, or Adobe for that matter, wouldn't have done it? There's no conspiracy at work here to keep you from backsaving, it's all about the econimics and feasability of solving the problem.

     

    Good luck, by the way, with the project. I'm sure you'll find a bunch of people willing to pay you $10 for the plugin when it's done, and maybe even a few willing to pay $100.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 16, 2011 10:40 AM   in reply to Paul Phillips

    I can't believe I'm actually responding to this. It gets old really quickly. But I propose the following widget solution.

     

    Take an old tin can.

    Each day, throw loose change equivalent to the price of a cup of coffee into it.

    When a new version of InDesign comes out (approx every 18 months) you'll have enough money to buy the "widget" -- the new version.

     

    If you're a professional, that's the cost of doing business.

    And it is a tax write-off (business expense) so it's even cheaper.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 16, 2011 10:56 AM   in reply to jameskiavi

    I personally don't think it'd be as hard as it seems.

    Programs like Photoshop and Illustrator let you down-save.

     

    I think it's a possibility that Adobe just didn't give down-saving options in order to force people to upgrade, and gaining themselves more money.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 16, 2011 11:43 AM   in reply to Jake_Sid

    So, you've already said you don't have CS3 or CS4, and yet you're convinced that there is no additional complexity in the CS5 file format, nor is it in any way more complex than a pixel grid (Okay, smart objects, 3-d and adjustment layers add a little complexity). I guess you've not done a lot of work with programming page layout and handling text flow.

     

    Where's the eyeroll icon?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 16, 2011 3:22 PM   in reply to jameskiavi

    You can save down from CS5 to CS4 and from there to CS3...

    I'm pretty certain there is an easy way to translate these two actions into CS5.

     

    It's just like saving a CS5 document but without the additional features of CS5 and CS4.

     

    I didn't say it would be easy... but it's definately possible.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 16, 2011 4:10 PM   in reply to Jake_Sid

    Of course it's possible. Although it's by far not as simple as "save a copy but leave out the Span Column definition".

     

    At least you admit that there are new features in CS4 and CS5, something most complainers seem to overlook ... What should happen when those features are used, then?

     

    If there is no way a CS3 document can even remotely look like its original in CS4 or CS5, should the conversion program then just say so and produce nothing? (Imagine lots of complaints here.)

     

    Or should it discard all new features, and let the user figure things out? (Imagine lots of complaints here.)

     

    Or should it "fake" all new features, and, for example, convert GREP styles to fixed layout? (Imagine lots of complaints here. Also from the would-be programmer -- how would you fake multiple page sizes in a CS3 document?)

     

    If you are still shrugging this off as "so it's a nice challenge for programmers, then", do me a favour and save a Word document as Plain Text. Then try to devise a system where Word's Bold and Italic text formatting, its hyperlinks, page sizes, and margins, its footnotes and endnotes, and its tracking changes get back-saved to Plain Text in such a form that you can edit it as if you're editing the original Word file.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 17, 2011 5:41 AM   in reply to [Jongware]-9BC6tI

    While I am in agreement with those that wish Adobe would concentrate on new features rather than down saving I very much disagree with Jongware's last post. Jongware, all those problems you brought up were already considered when they made the ability to save from CS5 to CS4 and likewise from CS4 to CS3.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 17, 2011 6:29 AM   in reply to Fred Goldman

    Fred, I'm returning the favour and I'm disagreeing with you in turn!

     

    The "problems" you mention were solved by Adobe in two ways. First of all, the "downsaves" from CS5 to CS4 and from CS4 to CS3 do not remove CS5/CS4 specific functions. In fact, I'm glad it doesn't because this is Adobe's recommended way of cleaning the debris out of wonky documents. It'd be quite a surprise if part of that cleansing would be the total removal of GREP styles, variables, and-what-nots for your current version!

     

    Second: as you may or may not be aware of, following the release of every new version there always has been an update of the previous one for "forward compatibility reasons". I think that's where the old version gets instructed which new formatting items in inx/idml should be ignored.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 20, 2011 7:01 PM   in reply to Bob Levine

    Bob,

     

    I am in this business—have been for the past 20 years working for companies and solo—and I don't think being a professional means investing thousands of dollars of various versions of the same software because there's a lack of backward compatibilty. As I recall, Adobe Illustrator fares better with backwards compatitiblity, so does Photoshop. I don't think it's too much to ask for InDesign to be backwards compatible beyond one version, regardless of what gets stripped out.

     

    I've got CS5, a fellow freelancer works on CS3. I can't get work from her because of our incompatibility—that's revenue lost for me, and you're suggesting that I should pay for and devote hard drive space for an old CS version that I'll use less than one percent of its capability?

     

    I can see that it's been a topic for a while, and clearly, there's a market for a plugin.

     

    -Robert

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 21, 2011 5:42 AM   in reply to Robert_Ferrer

    The very fact that there is no plugin is proof that there is no market for it.

     

    This forum is frequented by quite a few third party scripters and plugin writers. None of them have seen fit to fill this "market" because it's filled with people who don't want to spend any money.

     

    As I've pointed out before...the upgrade to Design Premium at $599 every 18 months or so is less than the cost of a cup of coffee every day. If you had made that investment (stop thinking about it as an expenditure) you wouldn't be losing that business that you're turning away right now.

     

    Again, anyone in this business that wants to maximize their potential needs to buy, and have installed, every recent version on at least one machine. I have everything from CS3 to CS5 installed on two Win 7 machines and a MacBook so feel free to send that freelancer to me. I'm well equipped to serve her with files that won't be backsaved but will be worked on using the version that she requires.

     

    Bob

     
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    Mar 21, 2011 7:17 AM   in reply to Bob Levine

    That's a kind offer, Bob. I didn't realize you were using this forum to solicit jobs from other designers looking for input from colleagues. Makes sense, I'll keep that in mind the next time I see you in the forums. It may be a coffee-a-day-size investment, but it sounds more like a cigarette-a-day kind of investment. If, for every software I use, I had to maintain two versions deep, I'd be spending more time managing my machine and less time actually designing and working for the client.

     

    If the model you're suggesting is the best practice, then why doesn't Adobe support it by continuing to sell previous versions of CS?

     

    I read one person's response here to suggest that Adobe offer a CS4 license to CS5 buyers, and I'm inclined to agree with that proposal.

     

    Robert

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 21, 2011 7:24 AM   in reply to Robert_Ferrer

    ripley's man wrote:

     

    I don't think it's too much to ask for InDesign to be backwards compatible beyond one version, regardless of what gets stripped out.

    While this is not in the same category as stories about two-headed dogs and sightings of Elvis, "Believe it or not!" is just as appropriate, IMO.

     

    Regards,

     

    Peter

    _______________________

    Peter Gold

    KnowHow ProServices

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 21, 2011 7:55 AM   in reply to Robert_Ferrer

    The fact is they don't and as I've stated over and over again, my opinions on this are based on fact, not on what anybody wants.

     

    Whether you like it or not or agree with it or not, having multiple versions of InDesign is the only solution to this issue at the present time.

     

    Bob

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 21, 2011 8:06 AM   in reply to peter at knowhowpro

    LOL! Yeah, Peter, it sounds naive when I read it back.

     

    The truth is my applications for Indesign have rarely gone beyond workbooks and brochures. They're standalone material, and don't have ties back to the web. I don't layout magazines anymore, and I no longer interact with printers beyond a pdf, and it's rare at that, since clients carry their own color lasers and binders. I do most print collateral in Adobe Illustrator, and I have yet to experience a compatibilty issue there.

     

    This conversation reminds me of one I had with Microsoft, back when my department "upgraded" to Office '98 for the Mac to be compatible with Office '97 for Windows. The save time for ppt documents allowed for a walk down the block for a cup of coffee—which meant a lot of coffee when Fast Save was turned on. When I explained the issue to CSR, he said, "... But we included a lot of bells and whistles in this upgrade, don't you like the bells and whistles?"

     

    What Bob Levine espouses may be the cost of doing business, but I get why my printers swore up a storm whenever Adobe published upgrades. I think it would be good for previous versions to be available to active licenses via Adobe. That's money I could be using toward self-marketing or training to improve my CS skills and gear up for the next substantive upgrade.

     

    Robert

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 21, 2011 8:22 AM   in reply to Bob Levine

    Bob, I think the fact that you have to state your position over and over again says something about the state of the current landscape. Your posts may be fact-based, but it sounds like you're perpetuating a burdensome model, and you're basically saying that this forum about inside-the-box thinking only. We're creatives, why wouldn't we be pitching alternatives, and new ideas while offering solutions to each other?

     

    I love adobe products. That doesn't mean things can't improve.

     

    Robert

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 21, 2011 8:38 AM   in reply to Robert_Ferrer

    I didn't say they couldn't improve, but this is not the proper venue to vent.

     

    This is: https://www.adobe.com/cfusion/mmform/index.cfm?name=wishform

     

    Nobody in any of the threads on this subject has done anything but complain about the situation. Complaining and accusing Adobe of conspiracy theories (seen those over and over, ironically from the same people who say Illy and Photoshop can save back) is counterproductive.

     

    Yes, we can discuss ways around problems here. That's what we do, but the fact is there is no way around this other than to have everyone on the same version or to have every version available for backsaves. Ignoring that reality and complaints won't change that.

     

    Bob

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 21, 2011 1:20 PM   in reply to Bob Levine

    Bob, it's difficult to ignore reality when it stops me from doing more work. I find complaints just as annoying as you do, especially when they're unjustified. In this case, you say "potato" ... I know designers and developers, freelance or inhouse, who leapfrog upgrades—whether it's Adobe CS, finance, productivity, or server software—who work on single platforms. That is to say, there is more than one definition to a professional user of CS.

     

    Despite complaints, one of the best things about company-sponsored forums is that discussions like this can occur. Problems get solved when problems are discussed, and companies look for customer feedback, both positive and negative. I understand that you have invested much money in carrying out this model—that doesn't mean that it's the only way or that we shouldn't look for new ways, cheaper ways.

     

    You can dismiss the people who state their concern about this issue as complainers, but they are part of what helps companies choose where to focus resources, what to prioritize.

     

    Robert Ferrer

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 21, 2011 1:32 PM   in reply to Robert_Ferrer

    I'm not dismissing anything. I'm dealing with reality here.

     

    I'm truly sorry that you're having problems. I know that doesn't come across in the words I've written here, but there's simply no other way around this than to have every version. It's been discussed for the better part of 10 years with InDesign and even longer than that for Quark and Pagemaker.

     

    There is no pagelayout software that can save back multiple versions.

     

    Bob

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 26, 2011 3:22 PM   in reply to jameskiavi

    I would appreciate not being told that I don't need to go back and forth between versions of InDesign.  Each of us works under different circumstances and with a different group of collaborators.  We don't need gratuitous admonitions to "get all the versions" that have ever ever existed in order to operate professionally.  Do these people get paid by Adobe to say such things?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 26, 2011 5:38 PM   in reply to Las CrucesNMuser

    Las CrucesNMuser wrote:

     

    Do these people get paid by Adobe to say such things?

    Not a dime.

     

    Bob

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Jul 8, 2011 11:02 AM   in reply to jameskiavi

    Wow, this is a problem! So Bob's solution is to own and install every single version of InDesign ever released. Are all of those previous versions available for purchase should one choose to take his advice?

     
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