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Audition CS 5.5 and the future of Audition

Apr 14, 2011 12:18 PM

  Latest reply: therealdobro, May 15, 2012 10:48 AM
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    Apr 15, 2011 6:01 PM   in reply to xrickrockx

    Hi Rick,

     

    Thanks for the tip.

     

    Steve

     
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    Apr 15, 2011 6:03 PM   in reply to ryclark

    Hi RY,

     

    Thanks.  I didn't consider this approach and I will be sure to try it.

     

    Steve

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 15, 2011 10:57 PM   in reply to _durin_

    Considering all the comprehensive features in CS 5.5, that it can be installed alongside of 3.01, and is a $99.00 upgrade (if I understood correctly), it seems reasonable at the very least to utilize the power and features it offers.  I presume it works well beside AA 1.5 too then?  I could see that as a possible pairing, as 1.5 is efficient and 5.5 should have what 3.01 does that 1.5 doesn't and vice-versa.  Hmmm....ok, will 5.5 accept rewire?  I'm just turning wheels here.  If it can talk to previous AA versions, or anything else, that certainly opens up more flexibilty too.

     

    I'm sure I speak for more than myself when I say all these examples you've illustrated for us help immensely in understanding the path ahead.  Especially the idea of why 5.5 is what it is at this stage, and that it is indeed a 1st stage, is encouraging.  Under these circumstances, to get the benefits of speed, efficiency, and updated functionality, and still maintain accessability to what works well already in AA is certainly comforting and welcome.  Thank you for giving us the opportunity to exhale, I'm now intrigued!

     

    Or, as HAL once said, "I understand now, Dr. Chandra. Thank you for telling me the truth."  :-)

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 16, 2011 7:34 AM   in reply to _durin_

    Dear Durin,

     

    Thank you for taking your time to post here about the new release, provide screen shot and explainations of what is new and how they work.

     

     

    I am what many would call a relative new comer to Audition, using for about 2 1/2 years. My original intent was for use as my 1 and only DAW in my home project studio.  However over the past 18 months I have developed a small clientele for whom I do voice overs and original music beds. (Nice to get paid for a hobby that I love.) During this time I have found my needs to have grown beyond what 3.01 and now 5.5 can do.

     

    I had hoped that this upgrade(?), would have included some features that would have made my workflow and music creation within Audition even better/easier then it already is. I am disappointed to find out that midi implementation has been dropped completely at this time.  The removal of the ability to group clips is also very problematic. I have not heard if there is now a multitrack overlay grid that can be set to divisions of the projects BMP and turned on and off, with snapping and nudging enabled to this grid. I was hopeful that time signature markers, for mutliple time signatures within a project would be included. I had hoped that when previewing clips/files within Audition you would be able to preview at project tempo.

     

    These are a few of the thing I had hoped to see, or are dissappointed they have been removed. I know, I will probably get jumped on by SteveG because, "it  was never meant to be music creation tool." Maybe not, but programs do evolve beyond original intent.

     

    I intend to give the trial a whirl. But to be honest, I have already moved on to another DAW to make up for that which is lacking in 3.01 and has been left out of CS5.5.  I am lookng forward to future releases in hopes I can come back and have my needs met.

     

    Duff

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 16, 2011 8:14 AM   in reply to SJDuff

    One quick question on the workflow with PPro - let's say I finish my edit, then send everything over to Audition for audio work. I create my mix, and send it back over to PPro and show my client. Clients, being what they are, now want changes in the video...can I re-edit in PPro and then send back to Audition without losing any changes already made in the mix, or do I have to re-do everything?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 16, 2011 9:04 AM   in reply to Eric Addison

    Im ok with cs 5.5 as long as midi sequencer and metronome will be back in Audition 6

    Thanks

     
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    Apr 17, 2011 8:46 AM   in reply to _durin_

    I'm very dissappointed that grouping of clips has been removed.  Grouping is such a natural part of my radio production/journalism workflow (and that of my colleagues).  If I want to adjust some timings in the middle of a piece I'm working on, in the past my clips would have already been grouped and I just have to shift it all over. Now, I have to manually click on each clip *every time.*  In a 7 minute radio piece I might have 50 clips and not having grouping makes it so easy to make mistakes.  Everything else about the Mac version of Audition (in the beta) works so beautifully, I'd hate to have to go back to running Parallels and Windows on my Mac just for Audition 3.0!

     

    Regards,

     

    David Polk

    Producer

    WFMT Chicago

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 17, 2011 9:40 AM   in reply to David Polk

    Wow no grouping is a real disappointment for me too.  I use it daily in radio sessions.  From updating client tags and inserts and just shift the grouped masters and such along with half hour programing that segments change each week too is going to be a pain.  For every day radio work it looks like I'lll be hanging on to AA 3.01 which is our daily work horse for broadcasting anyway.    I'll still play with the new version for sure and will probably upgrade and have both programs in place BUT.... I can already see for Radio Broadcasting production and features it will be AA 3.01 as our reliable work horse.   Too bad no one thought of this as Audition is pretty much the go to daw for broadcasters for over a decade or more.

     

    Cheers

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 17, 2011 3:53 PM   in reply to RJRadio

    Clip grouping must have been one of those less important yet easy to implement things that hit near the bottom of the list.  This is what happens when your on a tight schedule with a lot to do.   But you never know, you might get a patch release that adds in some of those simpler features...  Just don't hold your breath waiting for it...

     

    Honestly though, with all the new features, I think this release will be a very productive one given the heavy use of parallel processing...  I'll have to find a way to slow things down when I'm on an hourly job.  Something like not using groups might just be it.

     
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  • SteveG(AudioMasters)
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    Apr 17, 2011 4:06 PM   in reply to RonNovy

    Well, I suppose you can justify just about anything if you try hard enough!

     

    You clearly missed your true vocation - as a spin doctor!

     
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    Apr 17, 2011 4:19 PM   in reply to SteveG(AudioMasters)

    True, but the harder you try to get them to pay you, the harder they try not to...

     

    I guess Spin Doctor should have been my name here in the forum...  Might have saved people from trying to understand a lot of my confusing posts.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 18, 2011 3:49 PM   in reply to _durin_

    >>>>Durin Replied:

     

    Hi Duff,

     

    No dynamic tempo maps with CS 5.5, but it's definitely something I want to consider when the team addresses tempo improvements<<<<

     

     

     

     

     

     

    Cool Beans. I'm looking forward to it.

     

    Duff

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 19, 2011 10:47 AM   in reply to _durin_

     

    I generally do not comment on big corporate forums, but this time I decided to participate. I hope my opinion will be taken into account.

     

    The matter is that Audition is often used by DSP engineers who do not deal with music/radio/broadcasting/etc, but work with sound and audio analysis in scientific purposes in process of DSP algorithms development, and in audio quality validation for different industries (voice communication, speech codecs, automotive, pro-/consumer, etc).

     

    These people silently use this tool and never appear at music communities/forums/etc., so Adobe team may not know about them. But you can see these people in every audio department of every company somehow involved in audio.

     

    Adobe Audition (and previously Cool Edit) is the only and the ultimate tool for these professionals. Such scientific features of Audition as filtering, signal/noise generation, extended spectral analysis, sample-precise editing, etc . are not replaceable by any other software. Other software editors are not suitable for these operations since they are designed mostly for music and simply do not have such extended tools that are absolutely necessary for the purposes described above.

     

    Lack of such tools as tone generation, noise generation, scientific filtering and others will not allow these engineers to upgrade. By the way, many of them are still using Cool Edit Pro because it is faster than Audition.

     

    I hope Adobe team cares about all its users and will take my scribble as a note in further development of Adobe Audition which is the greatest audio software.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 19, 2011 11:45 AM   in reply to Alex Radzishevsky

    Alex, as a long-time user of the software and member of related communities, I think I'll stick my nose out here to thank you for breaking your silence. and making a great point (and politely!).  Did you see the other thread concerning the release?  Durin invited feedback from the user community directly, as well as through a survey.  Perhaps you could get the word out to as many users you know as possible to let their voice be heard through this survey link:

    http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/auditionfeedback

     

    Meanwhile, AA3, or even 1.5, are great products for many things, and there's nothing wrong with sticking with them if they get the job done!  However, it's been a long time since I've done a job in 1.5 that I thought was faster.  But I know there are definitely some slicker spots.

     

    Good success to you, and thanks again for posting your point of view.

     
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    Apr 19, 2011 11:59 AM   in reply to MusicConductor

    I also think Alex has made a very important point. Those of us who test and maintain audio hardware also need the reliable test tools that the software traditionally provided.

     
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    Apr 20, 2011 4:47 PM   in reply to _durin_

    Hello,

     

    Will the new Audition 5.5 be able to take advantage of any I/O card installed on the system (Blackmagic, AJA, Matrox, etc) that will allow the video to playout to a client monitor?

     

    Thanks

    Ray

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 21, 2011 4:15 AM   in reply to Ray Tragesser

    Unfortunately no it won't. This has been on the requested feature list for some time as many of us working in sound post need external video playback.

     
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    Apr 21, 2011 6:14 AM   in reply to ryclark

    Thats a real shame that Audition will not be able to playout video through a dedicated I/O card. That effectively eliminates it for any serious client session work relating to video post-production. Unless you like them looking over your shoulder at a small video clip on the screen. This is one of the main reasons why I never used Audition for much more than a Swiss army knife for file processing. The program is very nice and offers a tremendous bang for th buck. Not sure why Adobe is really advertising round tripping to Premiere Pro if there is no support for the same I/O hardware that is likely to be already installed on the system and being used with Premiere Pro. Hence the "Pro"

     

    Hopefully this is a high priority for version 6. If it is please contact to beta test that functionality.

     

    Ray

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 25, 2011 9:30 AM   in reply to _durin_

    Hi Durin - you describe Audition CS5.5's speed, arising out of its ability to take advantage of multi-core systems.  Nice.  But is it a 64-bit application now?  I'd like to get a Lexicon plugin (currently 32-bit) to use with Audition, but Lexicon are planning to release a 64-bit version fairly soon.  I'm wondering about compatibility, now and in the future.

     
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    Apr 25, 2011 1:51 PM   in reply to _durin_

    Hi Durin,

     

    I was wondering if you could answer a few questions, please.

     

    1) There are some third-party plugins (Vongengo is one example) that are available in 64-bit.  Does one need to use the 32-bit plugins?

     

    2) Regarding the following

    * A large existing userbase on older and legacy hardware who are unable or unwilling to upgrade their systems at this time.

    * The increased testing hit which would draw time away from feature development for this release

     

    As we get closer to feature parity (and beyond!) to Audition 3, and as our users on older hardware are given time to prepare, I would expect us to release Audition as a native 64-bit application.  It will require updated agreements with many of the partners we license with as well, so it's not as simple as "flipping the 64-bit switch in the compiler."  It will allow Audition to sit a little bit better in the Production Premium suite, and if we approach virtual instrument sequencing in the future, 64-bit memory access allows for loading ENORMOUS sample libraries into RAM.

    2) Wouldn't the odds of the userbase being willing to upgrade increase with a compelling feature set?

    3) Since Premiere Pro is 64-bit and some third-party plugins are 64-bit, what kind of integration can AA CS 5.5 users expect with PrPro running 64-bit plugins and AA CS5.5?

    4) For users that might need to keep AA 3.0.1 for certain functions when they upgrade to CS 5,5, are there any ramifications between moving back and forth between 5.5 and 3.0.1?  Has any testing been done on this and is there a recommended workflow?

     

    Thanks,

    Steve

     
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    Apr 25, 2011 2:43 PM   in reply to _durin_

    Hi Durin,

     

    Many thanks!

    Steve

     
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  • SteveG(AudioMasters)
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    Oct 26, 2006
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    Apr 25, 2011 3:01 PM   in reply to _durin_

    _durin_ wrote:

    4. The only problems you should run into when using Audition 3 and CS 5.5 simultaneously would be if both apps were attempting to access the same ASIO device.  Audition 3 allows you to run multiple instances of the application, but CS 5.5 does not.  You can, however, open multiple sessions at once so this should be less of a concern.

     

    I should point out that I haven't tried this directly with the rest of the CS, but the usual situation with ASIO and more than one app running is that it is only a problem if the apps are trying to access the same ASIO streams on a device - having two apps addressing the same card generally works fine, as long as the sample rate is the same. The no-no is trying to address two sound devices with ASIO - that it can't manage at all. So for instance with my E-Mu 1820m, it's only the ASIO streams that are actually allocated and in use that you can't use with another app.

     
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    Apr 25, 2011 4:52 PM   in reply to SteveG(AudioMasters)

    Hi SteveG,

     

    Thanks.  Also, one thing that I don't think I made clear in my questions - perhaps either you or Durin or anyone else who knows can answer.

     

    When I was talking about workflow between AA 3 and 5.5, what I had in mind was that one probably would close one of the AA's before doing some work (one example is the AA 3 Scientific Filter).  Since the Effects Rack has been replaced, I thought that maybe VST-based effects, depending on when and where they are executed, might have unintended side-effects if one goes back and forth between versions.  Of course, I don't know the answer.  But, I thought it would be a good idea to the answer in advance.

     

    Steve

     
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  • SteveG(AudioMasters)
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    Apr 26, 2011 2:20 AM   in reply to Steve C2

    They shouldn't be any interaction at all between two versions of Audition running at the same time - and if I get a chance later on I'll check that this is indeed the case. As long as the two different versions of AA don't try to access the same ASIO streams, they should both run fine simultaneously, assuming your audio device can cope with that. Dunno what that would do to your processor load though - and there would be no guarantee of any sort of a decent performance!

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 26, 2011 11:06 AM   in reply to _durin_

    Sigh.

    As a developer myself, I understand that seemingly simple features can be very complex under the hood - especially if we've done our job as UX designers - but there was such a clamor for clip grouping here that it's hard to understand why it didn't make the cut.  That and the lack of control surface support scotches my upgrade plans. 

     

    Durin, the gist of a lot of your posts on this thread is that we should regard this release as a preview or a taste of things to come.  Without asking you to commit, can you give us some idea of when an interim *feature* (vs bug fix) release might be expected?  A year or so from now?  Just wondering how long I have to keep my struggling PC running...can't run AA3 under VMWare on the Mac because unfortunately I have a Firewire audio interface.

     

    Anyway, I appreciate all the thought and creativity that went into this first Mac release and hope there will be a future release that works for my sort of workflow.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 26, 2011 11:43 AM   in reply to _durin_

    Thanks, Durin.  Guess I already made my votes clear on features for release 6.

    And now the wait begins.

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 26, 2011 11:50 AM   in reply to _durin_

    Dear Durin,

     

    though you didn't comment on this my reply, I still keep hoping that it will be taken into account. I think the number of Audition users that I'm talking about in my message cannot be ignored by Adobe.

     

    Thank you,

    Alex.

     
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  • SteveG(AudioMasters)
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    Apr 26, 2011 12:06 PM   in reply to Alex Radzishevsky

    Alex Radzishevsky wrote:

    I think the number of Audition users that I'm talking about in my message cannot be ignored by Adobe.

     

     

    How many is that?

     
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  • Currently Being Moderated
    Apr 26, 2011 12:16 PM   in reply to SteveG(AudioMasters)

    I didn't count everyone of them personally yet, but according to my experience (working as audio engineer and developer in voice communication industry) - they are thousands. You can visit any company that deal with voice communication, audio sw/hw validation, etc. and you can see most of the engineers using Audition or its predecessors.

     
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    Apr 26, 2011 1:01 PM   in reply to _durin_

    Durin,

     

    I agree that adding this feature may help Adobe to better understand its customers and their needs.

     

    You can consider my above message about "silent army of users" as written report.

     

    The users I'm talking about are using Audition in audio development and audio validation process.If it can help, here is a brief list of features that are used by them on a daily basis (including myself, each and every day): spectrogram view, spectral analysis, statistics, scientific filters (high pass, band pass, low pass with configureable filter type, cutoffs and order), tones generation (especially with different start/end points, for example to generate sweep tones), noise generation (BTW, could be extended, I think), sample rate/bit resolution/channels conversion, mixing, subtraction, sample-precise editing, batch processing (can be definitely improved by adding scripting). All these functions make Audition absolutely not replaceble by any other tool. MatLAB and Audition - is the ultimate tool chain.

     

    If you say that scientific filters and tone generation are not available in 5.5 - it means that I personally will not be able to use it. The same with many of those who I'm telling you about.

     

    I hope you got my point, and I hope it will help you to make your product only better.

     

    Alex.

     
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  • SteveG(AudioMasters)
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    Apr 26, 2011 4:17 PM   in reply to _durin_

    _durin_ wrote:


    And of course, it won't work on systems that are detached from the internet. 

     

    Which is, of course, most of the serious DAW users.

     

    I'm still not convinced about some of these numbers of users in areas that aren't generally considered to be major markets. Since Adobe control all the sales of Audition directly, they must surely have some sort of an idea as to where they've been sold...

     

    If we assume for a moment that the proportions of users who frequent forums (and we are talking long-term here) represent anything even vaguely like the usage spread, then I'd say that whilst game developers and people who work in the comms industry certainly show up, they certainly weren't anything like a major group. From what we see, it's radio users, podcasters and individual users doing restoration work and sometimes multitrack audio recording who form the backbone of users. One hidden group that we do know about (and they keep quiet about this deliberately, because it's embarassing to them for some strange reason) are the people using Audition for Mastering purposes - it gets used quite a lot for that, one way or another.

     
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