Adobe Community: Message List - Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Mon, 26 Aug 2013 03:00:37 GMT

Ah, the Jos. Phelps Insignia.

Just brought that to a friend's daughter's 40th, and it was well-recieved. It was the '02 ('01 was the "Wine of the Year" according to Wine Spectator), and we enjoyed it nicely, though the Sassica '04 was the hit of the evening.

Being a fan of Jos. Phelps, I have an 18 year vertical (donated two 6-year verticals to a charity, near to my heart), and soon will have a full, 20-year vertical, including two "Wine of the Year," one "Wine of the Decade," and all rated above 90 pts. by many reviewers.

Year ago, I was a guest at Mr. Phelp's "20 Year Tasting," and he pulled out some non-Insignia wines, such as the Arajo and Baccus Vineyard offerings. In a year, or two, I will be able to repeat what he brought, as I have also collected the Baccus Vineyard Phelps wines, plus a few older Arajaho wines. I need a group of worthy winos, to sample those. As the various charity auctions have not yielded what they should, I will give them away, instead of donating them. Some people get great wines, while others just do not.

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Sun, 25 Aug 2013 21:35:34 GMT

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Sun, 25 Aug 2013 18:21:53 GMT

John T.,

Thanks for the tip. I have had several wines from Mirassou, but not their PN - Chards mostly, and nice for the price.

As PN is a tough grape to both grow, and then vintify, I have found most of those, less than US $25 to be disappointments. To date, probably the best of the low-end ones has been the Acacia Carneros PN.

Will keep an eye out for the Mirassou.

Appreciated,

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Sun, 25 Aug 2013 02:05:36 GMT

Found a nice "medium" Pinot Noir... medium price of $8 and medium body... not all "fruit forward" and then thin in the mouth

2012 Mirassou... 1st Mirassou I've had, and will buy another the next time I'm in that store, if they have any still in stock

Label says "Sixth Generation... 150 years"

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Sun, 04 Dec 2011 23:57:38 GMT

Hm-m, Abby Normal... ? Think that I had a blind date with her, back in college.

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Sun, 04 Dec 2011 01:06:38 GMT

>definition of " normal "

I am "normal" when I do what my wife tells me to do... on her schedule

I am ABnormal any other time... according to her

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Sat, 03 Dec 2011 22:21:29 GMT

theres a huge difference ( legally as per state laws etc ) between posting while intoxicated ( PWI ) and posting under the influence ( PUI ).

That said, your laptop, fitted with a breathalyzer (sp?) , is probably at this point in time with current U.S. constitutional social contract (1789) ( with ammendments ) interferring (sp?) with your pursuit of the declaration of independence ( pursuit of life liberty justice and happiness etc ) unless you happen to be a woman, man without owning property, slave, indian ( savage), gay etc.

I would clean the hard drive and get rid of that thing and anything else that tells you that you can't do what you want as long as you are normal.

look at my website for the definition of " normal " if you are confused.

ps ITS BEER THIRTY ! YIPEE !

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Thu, 01 Dec 2011 21:08:39 GMT

Well, I was about to post some TN's (Tasting Notes) to this thread, but got an error message:

The laptop must have detected that I declared Wine-Thirty early, to celebrate getting home from a trip?

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Mon, 19 Sep 2011 03:55:31 GMT

I have experimented with several aeration devices, like the Venturi, and have not found noticeable improvement in a wine, but also have not found any detrimental effects either. When I feel that a wine will benefit from aeration (most often associated with reds, but many big whites do, as well), I just decant (with a white, the term more often used is "caraffing"), and give the wine some time in the decanting vessel. Care should be exercised, as some wines are relatively fragile, say an older red Burg, and much can be lost, too quickly. It depends on the wines here. When decanting, I usually pour a little directly from the bottle, to monitor the decanting process, and the aeration of the wine to air surface of the wine. This can be more "art," than "science," as one wine might need more time, and another, similar wine, less time.

Some like to decant (to aerate and not necessarily separate any lees from the wine) everything. I am a bit less inclined and like to taste along with the process. Just my personal feelings.

Good luck,

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Mon, 12 Sep 2011 03:26:12 GMT

It's pretty cool to know that temperature is one of the main factor on making the wine taste even better.

I also want to tell you that aeration can also enhance the taste of the wine. You can use the wine aerator to aerate the wine. Thank you for the information on temperature and the effects of it on wine.

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Mon, 25 Jan 2010 01:56:40 GMT

Well, I've just done a couple of PN's in the medium to full-bodied category, and both from Stephen & Walker. Their Monterey was a bit bigger, than their Sonoma Coast. Both are in the US$35 range, though they will be hard to find.

Plenty of dark cherry, and a medium to full body. The Sonoma Coast might be better with food, but both are great examples of CA PN fruit.

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Wed, 13 Jan 2010 01:24:31 GMT

Not PN's, but we just did a long weekend of Turley Zins in the snowy Smoky Mountains. Some say that Larry's Zins are over the top. I find them to be balanced, though full-bodied.

I'd have many, and have been following him for years, along with Robert Biale. One tasting that really caught my attention was his '96 & '06 comparison between both the 101 Vineyard and the Hayne Vineyard. These were both new to me, though I have had other Hayne Vineyard bottlings. All four were great. The audience was a bit more heavily into the older versions of each, but I felt that the younger of each was the better wine at that moment. The 101 Vineyard was the winner, and I was surprised, as I was prepared to like either of the Hayne better.

Larry Turley also offered an interesting observation on "bigger wines." He cited the ABV levels of his wines, and how many, who live by numbers, and not by the actual wines, ridicule him for the higher ABV levels. He pulled up a chart of some very high scoring wines from the past, and pointed out their stated ABV vs their actual tested ABV. Most listed ABV at about 12 - 13%, but when clinically tested, showed that they were actually in the 14-15% range, like most of his. Some of these were European, and some US. One theory that he offered was the taxation scale, based on ABV and what the winemaker wanted to be judged on, rather than what the real ABV was - lower taxes then, and now a wide audience hung up on numbers.

For me, too much great Southern food and too much great wine. I am in withdrawal, but will survive, as I do a Stephens & Walker Sonoma Monterey PN.

Hunt

Message was edited by: Bill Hunt - Corrected AVA on the S & W PN.

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Sat, 19 Dec 2009 18:55:46 GMT

I still have the Melville 2007 PN Santa Rita in my wine cooler, but had a Melville 2008 PN Verna this week (added almost nothing to the shipping, so got this with the 2007)

I was not impressed

Yes, it was a "big" wine... I would say full bodied, Hunt might say medium (at least compared to wines he buys on his higher budget)

But... beyond the initial full bodied feel, there just wern't a lot of flavor elements

Oh well... I'm still looking forward to someday having the 2007

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Sun, 25 Oct 2009 03:59:07 GMT

This was a response to an Encore forum subscriber, who had several cases of older Bordeaux wines, and wondered if the time had come to start drinking them, though Robert Parker, Jr, was still suggesting that the wines be held for a bit longer:

"Depending on how many of each you have, I would urge you to go slowly, and keep trying a bottle every year, or so, until you feel that the wines at/near its peak, and then save a few bottles to chart the very slow demise of those wines. I have few full cases of major Bdx, but do this with some of my bigger Cal-Cabs and Barolos. IIRC, ’82 was a pretty “big” year in Bdx. When dealing with Cab/Cab-based wines, I usually decant (for two reasons: separate the lees from the clear wine, and for aeration). Some go by a time-table, but I take an interactive approach. I’ll pour myself a glass, then decant. During the time in the decanter, I’ll sip on my glass. When I think that the wine has opened up, adequately, I’ll declare “wine-thirty,” and pour my guests their wine. Now, sometimes this can really throw a wrench into dinner schedules, if say we’re on the soup-course, and the time arrives. I shout out that I’m pouring now, and my poor wife has to scramble to get the mains on the table. I’ve had a few caterers say that I am impossible to work with. While I try to adhere to the planned pacing, the wine-course with the mains is always important to me, and to most of my guests. Now, these are usually not collectable Bordeaux offerings, as I will try to hold those to the end of the main-course, so we can finish those up, just about the time that the cheese-course arrives. Here, I break from common tradition. I feel that more whites go with more cheeses, than do reds. Even though we’ve all moved on to red wines, I almost always have a white Burg ready to bring out with the cheeses. I’ll try to pick some cheeses that DO go well with reds, but we’ll end up with both (or maybe 3-4) wines, both white and red, for the cheese course. I encourage all guests to try each cheese with each wine and make up their own minds, as to which goes best with which. In restaurants with “sommelier’s pairings,” I give the bussers fits, as I’ll keep a bit of all wines, just waiting for the cheese-course. At the Green House in Mayfair, I had 9 glasses with a little bit of wine left, just waiting for the cheese trolley. The table was getting very full, as my wife still had maybe six glasses. When to fromageier arrived, I instructed her to match the wines left with her selections. All but one was great, and I think that the “off pairing” was because this was a really strong older French cheese – very ripe indeed, and not really our thing. Most of all – enjoy these wines with great friends.

That is just my personal take on great wines with an aging window. Now, if your palate runs parallel to Mr. Parker’s on most things Bordeaux, then adhere to his schedule, though taste for yourself along the way. For Bordeaux, I like his recs.. For Burgundy, not quite so much. This is just a difference in palates. I also like his “style” of New World reds, even though I also enjoy some to the lighter, lower-alcohol offerings too. Zinfandel is a great example: I love the full spectrum from light and spicy to big, bold, in-your-face fruit bombs. As long as the wines are in balance, regardless of the “numbers,” I love all well-made Zins. Just got my Turley and Biale allocations, and cannot wait. Just wish that I was higher up their lists, ‘cause I’d be doing a case of each."

I thought that some others might have similar cases (instances and of wine... ), so I tacked it onto this thread.

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Sat, 24 Oct 2009 03:06:48 GMT

you will understand, you mentioned Tattinger's Champers in another post. Well let me tell you that is a great Champagne, as you know. As well as Moet Chandon, Bollingers ...................etc.

While I do enjoy my Champagne, I have to admit that I like the yeasty offerings, such as Tattinger's, and also Veuve Clicquot Ponsardine Yellow Lable (it looks orange to me, but what do I know - I am from Mississippi), and a bit less so, for some highly vaunted offerings of a lighter style, like the Veuve Le Grand Dame, regardless of the price differential. I like the "toast," and the yeast, and appreciate a clean version of these aspects. Many years ago, we did a vertical of the Bollinger RD Champagnes. They were great, but I have to admit that many were lost on me. Luckily, my wife is a real bubbly freak, and she held my hand through this. While I enjoyed it, I have to admit that some was lost on my palate, but that is wine.

must confess I am a great lover of fine wines, but your knowledge does intimidate me somewhat.

Bite your tongue. Remember, I am from Mississippi, hardly a bastion of fine wines. However, immediately post-Katrina, my brother in Gulfport, had walked down to the beach, just 4 blocks south of his home, to see the damage. He encountered a man, who was digging in the ruined foundation of his home, right on the waterfront. The man was crying and loading a wheelbarrow with fine Bordeaux wines, from his ruined wine cellar. My brother stopped to help him, though he did not know him. They dug out many cases of wines, and carted them to the man's station wagon. He was trying to save these and was taking them to a friend's cellar up north. They worked, side-by-side for hours, and my brother made some mental notes. When all of the bottles, that they could find, were retrieved, my brother left for a walk home. He shared some of the labels and the dates, and he'd handled about US$10,000 in wine that day. The man left, still in tears, for his friend's cellar. What a shame! A good friend on the Coast lost over $200,000 in rare Bordeaux, though he had his family, and his life, so all was not lost.

My cellar, though overflowing, is minimal to most other's. Also, I have no children to leave it to, so my hope is to drink all but one bottle in my lifetime. I then hope that my wife and my wino friends will drink that last bottle as a tribute to me... Then she can sell the home to a nice Mormon family and claim that that room is a food storage facility, that has a temp control unit, plus a backup.

Now, if I could only stop finding great wines, that I must drink, and just empty that cellar!!!!

In the end, it's all about one's enjoyment and I happen to be a hedionist to the Nth degree.

Enjoy,

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 21:16:41 GMT

Bill

Sorry to jump threads, but you will understand, you mentioned Tattinger's Champers in another post. Well let me tell you that is a great Champagne, as you know. As well as Moet Chandon, Bollingers ...................etc. I must confess I am a great lover of fine wines, but your knowledge does intimidate me somewhat. Your cellar far exceeds mine; well my cellar is not so much a cellar, more of a cupboard, containing 5 or 6 bottles at a time.

The description of the good old "screw top" up post is brilliant, well written (of course), but also, so well informed. OK, I'm away to sample some Plymouth Gin, with lime and a lot of ice, topped up with as much tonic as will fit in the glass. Well, it is that time of evening here.

John

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Thu, 08 Oct 2009 21:28:41 GMT

Charles,

Wine is for enjoyment, regardless of what some critics seem to think by their writings. It's only about what one enjoys. I love older Bdx, and Burgs, and my wife likes 'em better in their youth. No problem, so long as she doesn't drink them ALL, before they get some years on them...

Now, as to the screwcap - things are changing and pretty rapidly. There is a potential problem with wines under cork. A bacterial interaction can take place and ruin the wine. The terms used most often are "corked," and "TCA-tainted," referring to the chemicals produced by this interaction. In really general terms, TCA-taint strips out much of the fruit flavors in the wine, raises the acid levels and yields a "musty" smell and taste. I typify this as smelling like a damp, musty hymnal. The smell of mildew in New Orleans is not too far off, though this is a bit sharper. Some people cannot detect this, though they do usually find something objectionable in the wine. That is usually the loss of the fruit and the higher than normal acids. I can often smell TCA from a waiter carrying a glass of wine, behind my back. My wife is also very sensitive to it. Others, well not so much.

Now, vintners have been working for centuries on other forms of closure. Almost everything has been tried. Recently, a few companies, Stelvin being one, have come up with a screwcap that does some of the good things that corks do, but are impervious to TCA. More wineries are bottling under Stelvin, or similar, and many are replacing cork altogether. Don't be surprised to see more good wines under Stelvin.

Now, I'm an old traditinalist. I like the cork, and the ceremony involved in its extraction. However, I am finding many more good wines under a screwcap. It's not quite as much fun, but I have to admit that I have never had a TCA tainted bottle, when a screwcap was employed. With cork, the figure is between 4 and 10% of all bottles will have some level of TCA contamination.

Caymus produces a white blend, Conundrum. It is our "house white." Under cork, we were returning about 1 btl./case. That's ~8% and falls on the higer side of that earlier stated figure. They went to Stelvin in about 2000. I have not had one bad bottle, since they did.

Though I still love my corks, I worry about some of those wonderful bottles in my cellar. Most retailers will accept returns, as they will be covered by the distributor, who then gets credit from the winery. In my case, I just cannot image finding a receipt for a bottle of wine bought in 1985, and cellared properly, that is corked! Ain't gonna' happen. Fortunately, I've only found two rare older wines with TCA. Still, the odds are against me.

I've heard of Ch. Elan, but have never had their wines. We vacation up in the Smokies fairly often, so maybe we can make it down for a tasting.

Thanks,

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Thu, 08 Oct 2009 00:55:01 GMT

Hunt:

Enjoyed reading about your wine recommendations. My wife and I enjoy a glass or two on most nights. My knowledge of wine quality is limited to buying what I personally like and avoiding anything with a screw top.

We have a vineyard here in Georgia about an hour from my home called Chateau Elan. Nice place and I think their wine is pretty good:

Chateau Elan

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Mon, 05 Oct 2009 02:39:08 GMT

Beringer, Napa Valley [California] ‘06 Pinot Noir.

There is the most minuscule amount of "barnyard" on the nose. I am getting slightly stewed prunes and darker cherry on the nose.

This wine is a more concentrated darker red, with only a hint of a clear meniscus at the rim. This is a darker wine, than the Third Generation. The nose, and the first taste belie that it is more heavily extracted, or from riper fruit.

The mouthfeel is medium weight, and the finish is longer, though my wife tells me that this is the more-expensive of the two.

I get more dark fruit, such as plum and darker cherry, plus maybe a hint of blackberry. There is no spice, and I am getting fewer tannins, than on the other Beringer PN. I’d give this one about 50% ML fermentation, but that is a guess.

In general terms, this is a "bigger" PN. It’s a tad single-dimensional wine, but still fun. I’d pair it with smokier salmon, and maybe even a maple glaze, which is a fav. around our house, especially done on a cedar plank.

For the price, about US$22 on sale, this is one of the best examples of the PN grape, that I have had. It does fall short of some Santa Rita Hills, and other close-by properties PN’s, but it’s quite good. I’d definitely drink this one in a heartbeat. It does not have the fruit-forward characteristic of the Acacia, but is more like that wine with about 5 years on it.

My wife tells me that this one would be about US $15, were one to buy 6 btls.

Again, this wine was tasted in a Riedel Burg balloon.

My wife actually says that given the price differential between this wine, and the Brewer-Clifton Melville, she’d likely go with this wine. Considering that I just got my allocation of Brewer-Clifton, I do not know how to take this input. I think that she'll be heading back to Safeway and getting a case, to get the best possible price. Hey, for me, it's a win-win situation.

Going back to the Brewer-Clifton Melville, just to qualify a US $40-50 PN vs this Beringer wine, as a bit less than half the price.

Thanks to John for the rec.

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Mon, 05 Oct 2009 02:14:38 GMT

Beringer, Third Century, Central Coast [California] ‘06 Pinot Noir.

Interesting label, with a largish gold "III" above the Beringer name. There is a circular sticker, with "Ten Time Winery of the Year." This appears to have been added, as it does not look like it is integral to the actual label.

Medium garnet in color, and free of any cloudiness, the wine appears to be of a medium weight.. There is a small, clear meniscus around the rim.

The first impression is a tiny bit of "barnyard" on the nose. I’d guess that there was a hint of Bret in this wine, whether natural, or introduced for a more "Burgundian" flavor. Note was made of Burgundy on the back of the bottle. This barnyard blows off after a few moments, and is now absent. Now, I am getting light chocolate (milk), and maybe some raspberry, or a light cherry.

On the palate, the taste is light cherry, with a hint of spice. I cannot define the spices, but have found a hint of star anise. There are some other spice elements, but I cannot pull them out.

The wine is slightly on the lower end of "medium-bodied," and the finish is rather short. The mouthfeel is to the lighter side, but this is not bad, in any way. It’s just not as "chewy," as many more heavily extracted PN’s, especially some of the other Central Coast/Monterey/Santa Barbara wines. Though an ‘06, there were still some light tannins. These were felt, rather than tasted. This is akin to licking an oak spoon. You do not notice it at first, but then your tongue and upper palate, plus the inside of you lips, feel a bit like damp felt. I would guess that this wine spent some time in new French oak, but the "liner notes" do not talk about such. The oak aspect is feel only, as it does not seem present on either the nose, or the taste.

I see no reference to malolactic fermentation, but the sharper acid (malic) seem to be down a bit. I’d guess about 25% ML, but could be wrong. Some of the bigger PN’s from this area undergo

more heavily applied ML, and they display a creamy (lactic acid) mouthfeel and finish.

Rather than Burgundian, I’d have typified this as an example of OR PN’s of the normal style - not the newer heavily-extracted style.

This is a nice wine, and would probably go well with salmon, provided that one did not go too heavily on the smoke, or any sauces. With the cherry aspect and also the slight anise, I’d guess that a lighter dill sauce would work well too.

I could also see this as an evening "sipper."

Tasted in a Riedel Vinum Burgundy balloon, at about 65 F.

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Mon, 05 Oct 2009 01:47:59 GMT

OK, wife found Beringer PN's at another Safeway, across town. Both were on sale, but I do not have the price that she paid.

The first was the Beringer Third Century Central Coast '06 Pinot Noir with a large gold "III" above the Beringer label. The other is the Beringer Napa Valley '06 Pinot Noir.

I'm tasting the Third Century CC PN '06 now, and will report on it first. Unfortunately, I just finished off a Brewer-Clifton Melville '07 from last night. I am trying to clear impressions of that, obviously "bigger" PN, to give a fair evaluation of this PN.

Will look to the other Beringer, the Napa, later.

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Fri, 25 Sep 2009 00:12:00 GMT

Well, my smaller, local Safeway did not have it, but we've got some larger stores near by.

We also have several stores like Total Wine and BevMor, but have been to neither. This is mainly based on their advertising, which features a lot of "plonk," IMHO. However, maybe it's time to get by and see just what they DO have. The "sale" price is not that big an issue. I just want to taste this wine, based on your recs. Now, I do not mind if it IS on sale, but that ain't the deal breaker. I'm always on the lookout for good PN's.

Just scored a case of '06 (mixed vineyards) Brewer-Clifton and will be picking it up on Sat. This was wine set aside for a tasting by the distributor, but it got cancled, so they had this wine in stock and well-stored. If my records are correct, I should now have a 3 year vertical on a few of these vineyards, so it'll be time for a tasting dinner!

BTW, did I mention Whitcraft PN's up thread? They are rare, but really fairly priced, compared to the Brewer-Clifton and Melville, and have great body. If you can find them, give them a try too.

Well, it's officially wine-thirty, so I'm off to the wine fridge upstairs to see what this evening holds for me.

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Tue, 22 Sep 2009 22:51:05 GMT

>Going to Safeway this PM, and will report

Sadly, must report that I can't be a personal shopper/shipper... went out @lunch to their Deli, and wandered by the wine section

The space where I found the Beringer now has a different wine... I guess whatever the buyer ordered (looked like about a case worth on the shelf) sold out

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Tue, 22 Sep 2009 20:47:47 GMT

Seems there is a "sea of unsold wine" in Europe, and some American companies are buying "raw" wine in bulk (I wonder how well they clean the oil tanker before filling it with raw wine? <grin>) and putting the finishing touches in oak barrels here.

This has happened many times in the past. It's the original basis for the negotiant system in FR, along with the "co-op" aspect.

Bronco Wines has been doing similar for some years with their $2 Chuck (and others).

In the US, there are several ATF laws, that would preclude directly putting FR wine, regardless of any domestic treatment, and still using any US AVA designations, such as California, Napa, etc. What usually happens is that a winery will come up with a new lable, name and designation for the wine. Some will list the country of origin, but some might skirt that with a proprietary name, with the country being in the "fine print."

Going to Safeway this PM, and will report.

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Tue, 22 Sep 2009 02:37:11 GMT

>Great time, and now I have to "drink down" that cellar

Grin... 5,500 bottles would be just about 15 years, if you never buy another bottle... maybe a bit less time if you have 2 on Saturday

If you can't find the Beringer in your area, ping me offline and I'll see if it is still in stock locally, or sold out, and I'll let you know the current price and what it would cost for Ups to you... I have the 2 bottle box from KLWine still here (nice formed styrofoam case inside)

Price, if they still have it, is $11.98 plus 8.5% tax (price is $2 more when not on sale)... I don't know weight, so have no idea of Ups cost, but can't be all that much... of course, best is if you find it in your area... both Safeway and Albertsons grocery have it here

I also noticed a Beringer Founders' Estate 2007 Provincia Di Pavia PN for $7.98 (reg $11.99) so Googled

Seems there is a "sea of unsold wine" in Europe, and some American companies are buying "raw" wine in bulk (I wonder how well they clean the oil tanker before filling it with raw wine? <grin>) and putting the finishing touches in oak barrels here

The review I found said this one is a "light" version, so I won't be buying one to test... but it was interesting to read about how wine is now a bulk commodity and US companies can't keep up with demand with their own grapes

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Tue, 22 Sep 2009 01:43:18 GMT

John,

Just got back from Sonoma. Lot of fun and some great wines.

Along the PN front, I will strongly recommend the Benovia Cohn Pinot Noir. It is not a "budget" wine, but worth the $. I upped my allocation 2x (had to wheel and deal), just for this one.

Most of our tastings were other varietals, as we were up valley a bit for most of them. I ended up with about 16 cases, and I have no clue where I'll store these, as my 3700 btl. cellar is now up to about 5500 btls. Still, these were all great wines.

I also made several contacts with folk, who have some of the same philanthropic interests, that I do. Three offered their wines for some of my charities. One cannot ask for more than that. One even offered a trip to their vineyard, accommodations for two couples on site, plus a full dinner and VIP tasting of all of their wines, plus autographed magnums! I can see this one as an auction item. I'll try to dove-tail it with one of our hosts' jets to get the travel from PHX to Sonoma.

Did not get as many PN's, as I had anticipated, but then there were so many other great wines, and generous folk.

Great time, and now I have to "drink down" that cellar...

Hunt

Re: Wine Storage Temp Question

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Tue, 22 Sep 2009 01:35:11 GMT

John,

Fifty-five F is ideal for personal, long-term consumption. If one is investing, and hope to sell at a high profit maybe 20 years down the line, then 45F might be better. That is for investment, and not for personal consumption.

I'll check out our Safeway here, and also look to a few other sources, just to try this one.

Hunt

Wine Storage Temp Question

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Sat, 19 Sep 2009 18:16:16 GMT

>Thanks for the tip on the Beringer PN. Gotta' find it and try it.

I don't know how long the special will last, but right now it is $11.98 at a local Safeway

Since I don't have a CAVE for wine storage, my long term cellar is s Vintotemp 'fridge set to the factory default of 55 degrees F

Is that a good temp for long term storage of red wine?

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Thu, 17 Sep 2009 01:08:50 GMT

Regarding the LH Gewertz, with wines like this, vintage can make a world of difference. The same goes of icewine (Eiswein in GR). The temps, the hang time, and several other factors can play a very big role in the individual wines.

Regarding the Beringer, we're not going to get over to Napa, as all events are in Sonoma, just miles from our hotel. However, I will keep my eyes out for this one. I've done a lot of events with the Beringer folk (before Beringer-Blass), but have never been to the winery. Now, I do hang out next door at the St. Clement winery (now part of Beringer-Blass). Great wines, that are not often seen, and wonderful tasting room staff. I try to hit them on foggy, cold, rainy mornings, when I can spend a few hours actually talking. After a few moments, all sorts of "library" wines seem to find their way up from the cellar and onto the tasting room counter. That indicates to me that they really care.

Though most people decry the costs of tastings in Napa, I have never paid for a one, regardless of the wines poured. My AMEX card is on the counter, and I seldom buy from the wineries, unless I cannot get them in AZ (or I want a nice bottle for that night). Every tasting has been gratis. Maybe it's because I really care about their wines, and want to learn as much as I can, or maybe I have a "tell-tale scar" that I am not aware of. Actually, Sonoma is the only area that I have been charged for tastings, and also the only AVA that I have had issues with. Amador, Sierra Foothills, Napa, Santa Cruz, Livermore, Temecula, Central Coast/Santa Barbara - never any charge, regardless of what the sign over the counter says.

This time I am a guest of several wine makers, but the AMEX card will still be handy - just in case.

Thanks for the tip on the Beringer PN. Gotta' find it and try it.

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Thu, 17 Sep 2009 00:35:23 GMT

Enjoy and drive carefully

Wife and I have driven around some of the wineries just outside Portland a couple of times... south and east... can't remember the names right now

Found some good wines... her favorite was a Montinore late harvest Gevurtz about a dozen years ago... a bit sweeter than I care for very often, but that year the Gevurtz ZING really came through... they did another one 2-3 years ago that was not nearly as good, then I heard the place was up for sale (don't know why) and haven't seen much about that brand since then

I also stopped on the way home and bought another Beringer 2006 Central Coast PN... it's in the wine 'fridge with the 2 Melville bottles... I try it again in a couple years and see if it developed anything more than the bottle I had last week

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Wed, 16 Sep 2009 23:39:08 GMT

I'm headed off to a couple of events in/around Healdsburg. The host of one is a new PN producer. I've followed his wines, since he started and they are great. I'll give you a report, when I return. BTW - in many years he's done a killer Chard too.

We hope to sample a bunch of his neighbor's wines, while there too.

Back after the weekend,

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Wed, 16 Sep 2009 14:28:29 GMT

Ups just called to make sure someone would be here to sign for the wine... so the 2 Melville bottles will be here today, and then off to the cellar (small wine 'fridge) for a couple years until they are old enough to drink

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Mon, 14 Sep 2009 14:18:20 GMT

>better than the Acacia

Had the 2006 with steak last night... good, with just a hint of too much tannin (if I buy another bottle, I'll shelf it for a couple years) but actually, the Beringer I had a few days ago (just under $12 compared to just under $20 for the Acacia) was just a bit better... at least to my taste buds

I've always been interested in how the same grape, from different areas and different vintners, can be so different

Since the Melvilles I ordered will be young (2007 and 2008) I think I'll put them in the wine 'fridge for a couple years

We have a recipe we call "Sizzle Salmon" where I put a dressing/marinade in a big pan (usually Ranch dressing with sometimes a drizzle of Yoshida's Terriyaki) and then spices to suit (just a SMALL amount of a big jar of steak seasoning I buy at Costco and then "Cajun-style" seasoning of some sort) then cut the Salmon into 3-to-4 bites-size chunks and cook high so the outside gets a bit crusty (wife really likes "blackened" fish) but the inside is still tender

Stir fry bite-size Asparagas in another pan, in the same sauce, and my wife gives me great cooking points!

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Sun, 13 Sep 2009 23:30:06 GMT

I love ahi with a bigger PN. Salmon is nice too, but I tend to head to OR/WA, or FR, for PN's with it. Much probably depends on the exact prep. We do a lot of "plank" cooking, and my wife has some great rubs and coatings. If we choose one of the spicer rubs, then the fruit in a Melville will work well. I would omit her maple drizzle on that one though.

Good luck, and let us know what you go with,

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Sun, 13 Sep 2009 23:25:40 GMT

I am a fan of all of the Melvilles. The Santa Barbara is a nice PN. It is normally a tad less concentrated, than is the Santa Rita, but good none the less. I think that the Santa Barbara is better than the Acacia, with more black fruit and a tighter structure. That is a good price from K&L. I need to call "Uncle Ralph," and get some shipped in, when the heat abates here.

Thanks for the tip,

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Sun, 13 Sep 2009 14:45:26 GMT

Wore out my dialing finger yesterday, and could not find a single store in my area that carries Melville... so went to KLWine

Have one 2007 Santa Rita and one 2008 Santa Barbara on order... now I need to figure out a meal recipe... sigh, so much to do!

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Sat, 12 Sep 2009 16:58:32 GMT

Well, the retail wine business must be really hard to survive

I called all 6 wine retailers in the Yellow pages for Vancouver (as well as other places that I knew had wine)... 1 retailer does not carry Melville, 4 were out of business, and the last one switched from being a wine store to a resturant

It looks like KLWines is going to be my best choice... and since the 1st bottle shipping is so high, I might just get a bottle of the 2008 Santa Barbara as well... after I check at a couple other places locally that I know carry a "fair" selection of wine

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Fri, 11 Sep 2009 19:25:46 GMT

Looking back at my notes, I paid $15 for that1997 Chartron Et Trebuchet at a place called Natures, which has since moved to a larger place and changed their name to Wild Oats (I guess the idea of natural food and a large wine selection is profitable)

The CeT Pinot had an outstanding bouquet, was VERY full bodied but still with all the flavors you'd expect in a Pinot/Burgundy, and I gave it a 9 out of 10 rating... the only reason I didn't give it a 10 was it was (at that time and still) the best Pinot I've ever had, and I wanted to see if I ever found anything better to award a 10

Comparing back in my memory, the Beringer I just had has a "good" bouquet and is full bodied and flavorful... so my personal score is 7.5 to maybe an 8 (which is still WAY more than the 4-to-5 I give an average, thin Pinot)

I have a couple T-Bones thawing for Sunday grilling, and plan to open the Acacia then to see how it compares

In the meantime, I may just call Wild Oats to see if they have Melville in their inventory

Added

Wild Oats doesn't carry Melvile, but the "wine guy" I talked to recently moved here from Santa Barbara CA so knew the brand

He said that for the full bodied syle of Pinot, Melville is in a "special class" of its own and he HIGHLY recommended it

Now, I'm going to have to do some searching in my area to find a store that has Melville, or check the http://www.klwines.com/ site

Added2

Klwines has Santa Rita for $28 http://www.klwines.com/detail.asp?sku=1041627

Klwines has Santa Barbara for $20 http://www.klwines.com/detail.asp?sku=1041627

Hunt... I know you said Santa Rita... but how is their Santa Barbara compared to the Acacia that was just a few cents under $20 at a local store?

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Thu, 10 Sep 2009 01:36:48 GMT

Wow, the Acacia for less than US$20! That is a deal in my book. I've had the "A," but was less than impressed. I would not put that one into my stock.

I also hit when the Wine Steward was on duty, and she also likes a BOLD Pinot, so pointed me at a Beringer Central Coast 2006 for $11 which I have open now...

I have not had this one, but do like many of the Beringer-Blass wines. Yes, they produce thousands of gallons of plonk, but one of my favorite domestic Merlots, their Howell Mtn. Bancroft Ranch, is great. I rate it in the top 5 US Merlots, and up there with some of the best Merlot-based Bdx. wines. Even in "bad years," this is a wonderful wine and a great example of what Merlot can be, in the right hands. [Dan Duckhorn's Napa is another such example.]

Please let me know about this one. Though I try to keep an ear to the ground, I cannot keep up with them all. Every time I travel to the Central Coast/Montery/Santa Barbara, there are new guys and gals doing great PN's and Chards. Cannot keep up!

Back in the good-ole-days, I could do the WS Grand Tasting, plus a few ZAP events, and the requisite number of tastings and dinners and have a good idea of what was out there. Not so any more. Now, I feel like a wine newbie, as there seem to be new producers monthly.

Picking up my 3 cases of mixed Brewer-Cliftons on Friday. Gotta' order my Biale and Turley Zins this week. Heck, gotta' get my order in for Diamond Creek Cabs. Too many wines, and too little time.

Thanks for starting this thread,

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Thu, 10 Sep 2009 01:02:01 GMT

Haven't made it to Costco yet, but had to stop at Safeway for fresh produce on the way home

They have Acacia (bought one at just under $20) and also an "A by Acacia" for $15 that I didn't buy

I also hit when the Wine Steward was on duty, and she also likes a BOLD Pinot, so pointed me at a Beringer Central Coast 2006 for $11 which I have open now... she said it "drinks like twice the price" and she's right... good nose and NOT a wimpy Pinot like so many I've tasted

Next time I'm ready for a Red, I'll open the Acacia and see how it compares at "almost" twice the price of the Beringer

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Wed, 09 Sep 2009 23:55:19 GMT

Jerry.K,

We do the same thing. I've had wines from TN, NC, VA, AZ, TX, CO, NM, MS, LA, as well as most of the more "popular" locations. Yes, there has been lots of plonk, but some real gems in there too. Just had a CO Cab Franc with some good friends. It was one of the higher-end wineries on the Western Slope. I had the remainder of a case, that I cellared for almost 10 years, and finished it off recently with friends, who had toured that winery with us, back when we lived in CO.

One of the better sparklers, that I have had, is from NM. We buy quite a few really, really good AZ wines, as odd as that sounds. TX also surprised me, as the areas around the Big Bend do produce some really good wines in the right hands.

As for price vs quality, I do have a difficult time finding good wines below a certain price-point. Though the scale slides by varietal, a very good Chard under about US$10 is hard to find. Same for PN's under about US$20. Now, I have had a great Cab-blend at US$13, so that is my one super "find." BTW - Glen Carlou Grand Classique from South Africa. Sauvignon Blanc is about the only "value" wine that I have enjoyed much below that varietal's "median" price, though some of those are pretty bleak.

Heading off to Sonoma next week for a big wine event. We'll be doing a VIP tour of several producers there. One is a new, big PN producer (his 60th birthday), and many of his neighbors and friends do some nice PN's too, like Williams Selyem. One of the original principal's daughter did her wines from his vineyard for some years. I'll keep my eyes open for some big, bold PN's for this thread, especially if some are at a good price-point.

Cheers,

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Tue, 08 Sep 2009 23:31:56 GMT

Hi Hunt --

Whenever we visit a region or another country we try to taste the local wines produced there. Whether in Virginia, Michigan, New York, North Carolina, Alsace, Canada or almost anywhere, we've found wines that are drinkable and often quite good. Plus, in a restaurant or a wine shop, the locals are more likely to know what they are talking about when discussing local wines.

I do prefer the Oregon PNs over California products, and even over what's available here at a reasonable price from Burgandy. But I've been tending more toward Cabs lately. There is not so much variation among the cab grapes from different regions, compared to the very wide differences among pinot grapes. So, whenver I see an unfamiliar red wine, which is quite often nowadays, I feel safer going for the cab than the PN.

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Tue, 08 Sep 2009 22:54:28 GMT

Jerry.K,

Welcome to the thread.

While I do admit to spending more of my budget on wine, than many, our "house white" is a US$19.98 blend.

We do not really have a "house red," but that Acacia PN that I mentioned is usually around US$25 at Costco. For the bucks, it is the best that I have found. Now, along the lines of WA and OR, there are some good PN's from both, and the price is good for many. The style is a bit lighter, in general, though these are still great wines and good for the $.

I've never had any Canadians, except for some late-harvest and icewines from the Eastern Provences. In all of those cases, I found them to be rather one-dimensional. Now, I only tasted the portfolios of a couple of importers, but did so at 3 different events over several years. I just probably missed some really good ones.

For the more common GR varietals, I am usually more a fan of the GR, or FR (Alsace) versions, but that's just me.

Thanks for the comments,

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Tue, 08 Sep 2009 22:39:14 GMT

Had one with dinner last night... at 13 years old this is NOT a happy teenager! I've had better Cab's for half the price.

I understand completely. The Cinq Cepages is a very, very nice wine in youth, and with a couple of years on it. I've had most vintages, since its introduction, prior to the WS Wine of the Year award, and have followed most fairly closely. I have mounted an effort to tap deeply into my collection, hoping to catch most as they peak - a bit early for such a prestigious wine.

Now, I like most well-made Cabs and Cab blends with some years. Even some bigger Merlots hold up well, both US and FR. Still, the Ch. St. Jean just does not age all that well. Did not want you to have a bad surprise.

If you have a Costco, you should have the Acacia. They do two, Central Coast and Beckstoffer Vineyard. The CC is the bargain in my book. The Beckstoffer is fairly priced, but does not really offer that much more, at twice the price.

Good luck, and I'll beat the bushes to see if any of my sources have recs. on good wine shops in your area.

Hunt

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Tue, 08 Sep 2009 20:33:20 GMT

Plum wine -- sounds good. We do have wine grapes growing in the yard. My wife puts her sour dough starter under them to catch the natural yeast, but I've never tried making my own wine. I did make beer for a few years, and enjoyed that very much. Now, with a local mini-brewery making a dozen different beers, I've given that up.

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Tue, 08 Sep 2009 15:26:57 GMT

Welcome JK and, as I sometimes tell my wife... "that's my opinion, and I'm sticking with it!"

Once upon a time I "dabbled" in making wine, usually by buying juice since I really didn't have a way to process grapes

I made a couple really good batches, one or two that were not good at all, and maybe a half dozen that were "drinkable" but not worth any great accolades

One of my "good" batches... actually, my best effort... was made from really ripe plums from a tree in the back yard

It turns out that I bottled it before it was ready and had just a "bit" of CO2 to give some "zing" to the wine... a couple bottles where the cork wasn't as tight as it should have been popped off and made a mess on the floor next to the wine rack

I was never very consistent with my efforts, and moved out of that house later so didn't have the space, so my wine making only lasted 4-5 years

My wife really likes a Gevurtz with residual sweetness... but her current favorite is a StChappelle Soft Chenin Blanc that is good with the right food, or just to sip with nibbles

I'll make my sorta-weekly stop at Costco in a few days, and plan to take my new list of "possibles" past the wine display to see what's there

I do agree with Hunt, that finding a good "bold" and full-bodied Pinot is not easy... as well as being expensive

I agree with you... a $20 bottle of wine is rare in my house, so it had better be really good

I rarely believe what it says on the wine label, and even take what a magazine review says with several "grains of salt" so the discussion here is good for me... people that have to pay their own money, so are more honest in their opinion

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Tue, 08 Sep 2009 14:55:19 GMT

There can't be only two wine snobs here, can there? So I'll jump in, although I have to admit I am sort of a cheap snob in that anything over $20 is a very special event in our family.

Still, I do have some favorites, and Washington State wines are among them. Gewurz wines from Washington are quite good, almost as good as from Alsace, which I prefer to those from Germany. In Washington the gewurzes from Covey Run, Canoe Ridge and Chateau Ste. Michelle come to mind.

Also, whenever we go north of the border I've found Canadian wines can be surprisingly nice. The Mike Weir cab/merlot blend is quite good, as is the Sauvignon Blanc.

Finally, although I may be rejected from the snob list for what I am about to say, I've found the fruit wines of mid-Coast Maine to be astonishingly good. Blueberry and pear are my favorite of these for red and white. Contrary to what I first expected they are not at all sweet, actually quite dry. There is just a hint of the fruit taste, enough to get your attention without interfering with whatever you happen to be pairing the wine with. I really like red wine with dark chocolate, and the blueberry adds a interesting twist. There, i said it and I'm glad.

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Tue, 08 Sep 2009 14:16:09 GMT

>As for the Cinq Cepages, you might want to crack one bottle now. I still have two of the '96, but have been a tad disappointed

Had one with dinner last night... at 13 years old this is NOT a happy teenager! I've had better Cab's for half the price

In fact (this was about a year ago, so I don't remember the price) I had a FAR better Cab from http://www2.canoeridgevineyard.com/

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Sun, 06 Sep 2009 14:34:54 GMT

Vancouver WA just north of Portland OR, so I am familiar with Costco... I'll look for Acacia next time I'm there

I'm also going to browse around K&L a bit to see what I find

Thanks, John

Re: Wine Thread - Sort'A Started by Hunt

forums_noreply@adobe.com — Sun, 06 Sep 2009 02:44:04 GMT

John,

Where are you located? Maybe I can get some recs. from other winos on your area. I have some contacts in the US distribution networks, and they know the various markets. Maybe we'll get lucky?

Here in AZ, where prices are not that good to begin with, the Pine Ridge is usually at the US$9.50 to $10.50 range.

Depending on which single vineyard Melville, or Brewer-Clifton you get, they run from about US$40 to $80. Sea Smoke Southing Vineyard is about US$50, but the Ten can run up there. Both are great, but not inexpensive. I also like the Whitcraft PN's. They are fairly priced, but tough to find. Many are locally allocated in the Central Coast area of CA, and most never get to AZ, even though we are just "down the road."

For a fun little CA PN, I like the Acacia. At Costco (Western US, but expanding), I normally pay ~ US$25.00. It's good young, and can age well for about 5 years. It is very food-friendly, though is less concentrated than the others mentioned. I have yet to find a really enjoyable PN for much less. It's a tough grape to grow and then to vinify.

For most of my online purchases, I use K&L Wines and deal with Ralph Sands in the Redwood City store.

Hunt