Import TIFF file in InDesign loses its transparency

[marcZ89]

Hi everyone,

I created a barcode in RGB with a library in Objective-C. Then I convert it to CMYK colorspace using ImageMagick.

The converted graphic shows transparency when putting it in Photoshop, but not in InDesign..

It has the alpha channel. If I open it in Photoshop, save it FROM photoshop to TIFF and import in InDesign, then the transparency appears.

[BobLevine]

Did you select the save transparency option when saving the TIFF?

[marcZ89]

My TIFF file is created from a library in Objective-C so there is not really a save transparency option, but when I preview the created barcode in Mac Preview or open it in Photoshop or Sketch, I can see the transparency. It just does not show up in InDesign when importing it.

[rob day]

You'll have to Save As as from Photoshop. The PSD format has the advantage of Object Layer Options in InDesign.

[marcZ89]

Yes, but ideally I would like to not have to open it in photoshop and save again.. as I have hundreds of graphics to process..

My question is more like why opening the original .tiff file in photoshop shows transparency while it does not in InDesign

[Jeffrey_Smith]

You can batch process hundreds of files in Photoshop without opening the file.

What kind of barcode are you creating? i.e. Code 39, UPC, QR, etc. There may be a better way to create the barcode.

[marcZ89]

I'm creating Data Matrix barcodes.

Do you think it would be possible to batch process the Photoshop file from my code written in Objective-C/Swift?

[Jeffrey_Smith]

What is the format from Object-C? If it is a format Photoshop can open, then an action and batch process could be used for the things mentioned: convert RGB to grayscale, flatten image, save to specific format, etc.

[marcZ89]

It can be: TIFF, JPEG, PNG, GIF..

It's just that I'm trying to do everything in one go, the user input the barcode and it gives you a CMYK Data Matrix barcode.

I have all this so far, just the transparency that is gone when importing to InDesign.

[Jeffrey_Smith]

For this to happen in one go, create an action and droplet in Photoshop:

1. The action can be accomplished by opening an image, using the action record button and perform all necessary transformations, click stop and save.

2. Then use Create Droplet, this will associate a folder to the action, and then files can be saved directly from Object-C to the droplet folder, perform conversions, and be ready to place into ID.

[Jongware]

Photoshop, as a dedicated graphic image file processor, supports more file types, and more variants of each file type, than InDesign does. If InDesign does not support alpha transparency in CMYK TIFF files natively (*), then you must indeed open then and re-save with other software into a format that ID does support.

An alternative to open and close everything with Photoshop (you know PS can make it a batch process so it can run overnight?) is to use a command line utility such as ImageMagick, or, as you are in control of the source software, have that output something more compatible so you don't need to convert anything later on.

(*) I searched around a bit for confirmation but was unable to verify this with a casual google, but I think InDesign never has supported CMYK + alpha transparency for TIFF images.

[marcZ89]

But InDesign does support CMYK with TIFF if you save it from Photoshop just not directly from the conversion done by ImageMagick it looks like?

I can switch to another format if needed, I only need the CMYK ColorSpace for printing AND transparency.

"as ImageMagick, or, as you are in control of the source software, have that output something more compatible so you don't need to convert anything later on."

--> Does that mean there is an option I could use to have the transparency correctly in ID?

Here is the command I use with ImageMagick:

convert /path/to/RGB_GRAPHIC.tiff -profile /path/to/cmyk_profile.icc /path/to/CMYK_GRAPHIC.tiff

[rob day]

Here is the command I use with ImageMagick:

convert /path/to/RGB_GRAPHIC.tiff -profile /path/to/cmyk_profile.icc /path/to/CMYK_GRAPHIC.tiff

That would have to create a 4-color black—open one of the barcodes in Photoshop and check the values.

Why not grayscale set to Multiply? You don't need a transparent background.

[marcZ89]

I do need a transparent background, I have barcodes that are black on transparent or white on transparent, taking the color of the background.

EDIT:

What do you mean by check the values in Photoshop?

[rob day]

I have barcodes that are black on transparent or white on transparent, taking the color of the background.

I think I understand what you are trying to do, but it can be done via InDesign's Blend Modes or by simply assigning the [None] swatch to a 1-bit image's container frame.

These barcodes are grayscale tiffs with no transparency

These are 1-bit tiffs where I've set the barcode's container color to [None]. This page has no transparency:

[rob day]

What do you mean by check the values in Photoshop?

Normally if you make a conversion from RGB to CMYK your barcode wouldn't be black only, which would be a problem on an offset press. Open one of your barcodes and set Photoshop's Info to Actual color.

This is a default conversion from RGB to CMYK in Photoshop. If you need the barcode to be on the black plate grayscale or 1-bit would be better:

[marcZ89]

Here is what I have when opening the converted barcode from ImageMagick in Photoshop:

[Laubender]

Hi,

how did you open this in PhotoShop?

You could open it in Grayscale mode if you like.

You could even do a color conversion to CMYK where R=G=B values are converted to 100% Black. Provided you are using the right ICC color profile. See into two profiles here:

ISOcoated_v2_grey1c_bas.ICC

Grayscale with maximum Black = 100%:

colormanagement - ISO Profile

ISOcoated_v2_sw_bas.ICC

CMYK profile where R=G=B will convert to Black. Maximum Black = 100%:

colormanagement - ISO Profile

Regards,
Uwe

[marcZ89]

I just drag and drop the file to Photoshop.

I converted to CMYK using: USWebCoatedSWOP.icc

[rob day]

alexandrel16871950  wrote

Here is what I have when opening the converted barcode from ImageMagick in Photoshop:

Right converting to CMYK is going to be a problem. Even if you used a max black profile as Uwe suggests, there’s no reason to do it. InDesign puts grayscales on the black plate.

[marcZ89]

Hmmm interesting!

It seems that I just found a way to do it programmatically! Instead of using ImageMagick to convert from RGB to CMYK. I used "sips" which is a built-in macOS tool, and with this, the graphic opens directly with transparency in InDesign!

sips - scriptable image processing system.

This tool is used to query or modify raster image files and ColorSync ICC profiles.

Its functionality can also be used through the "Image Events" AppleScript suite.

Try 'sips --help' or 'sips --helpProperties' for help using this tool

[rob day]

Instead of using ImageMagick to convert from RGB to CMYK. I used "sips" which is a built-in macOS tool, and with this, the graphic opens directly with transparency in InDesign!

You would still have the 4-color CMYK problem with a conversion to SWOP.

[marcZ89]

I am not sure I follow what's the issue? I just needed a CMYK barcode with transparency in InDeisng and that's what I got? Or InDesign is doing something under the hood? It's for a printer so unless he tells me there's an issue?

It's only black and white colors.

[rob day]

I am not sure I follow what's the issue?...

It's only black and white colors.

But it's not—with typical CMYK color profiles the conversion from 0|0|0 black to CMYK will be a 4-color mix and not the black only 0|0|0|100 you need. With SWOP it would be  something like 75|68|67|90.

If the output is to a composite printer there wouldn't be a problem, but then you may as well place RGB.

If the output is to an offset press you will likely have a registration problem:

[rob day]

You can also check the barcode's output values in InDesign via Separation Preview. Here's an RGB barcode converted to SWOP.

Is there a technical reason  for the CMYK mode?