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Librairies vs Symbols

Explorer ,
Jun 11, 2018 Jun 11, 2018

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Hello,

It's been a few years now that despite the growing migration waves towards the newcomers (Sketch and Invision to be precise) I managed to keep finding my Adobe tools powerful enough to stick to it. But I'm actualy encountering big issues related to collaborative practices which encourage me to maybe look elsewhere.

My main question is : Why does illustrator have 2 ways to create reusable elements, each having interesting features but none of them being complete ?

Symbols are editable in context and support variations in their instances while library items are shareable and dynamics. I need both in one single type of object, otherwise I can't be efficient in creation and teamwork and production in a single lean process.

Does anyone know if there is a solution in the dev. pipeline regarding this or eventually if it could be solved in the short term with some script or existing plugin ?

I'm waiting for good news ...

Thx

Seb

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Adobe
Community Expert ,
Jun 11, 2018 Jun 11, 2018

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One of the major benefits of CC Libraries is that they are not confined to just Illustrator or your computer. If you open InDesign or Photoshop, your Libraries are available there too. You can sign into your CC account on any computer and use your Libraries on that machine. You can also share your Libraries with other designers anywhere.

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Community Expert ,
Jun 11, 2018 Jun 11, 2018

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Library items are shareable and dynamic as long as you place the library item without breaking the link to it. You can also share edit privileges to contents of a library so multiple team members can update the contents.

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Explorer ,
Jun 12, 2018 Jun 12, 2018

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Yes, I understand the benefits of using library items. But not being able to modify an item in the context of the global document is a real drawback. It's a burden to the creative process compared to the way it works in Sketch for instance.

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Community Expert ,
Jun 12, 2018 Jun 12, 2018

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Explorer ,
Jun 12, 2018 Jun 12, 2018

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Participant ,
Jun 12, 2018 Jun 12, 2018

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Why not just 'File>Place' and just edit the linked file if you ever need to.. anyone on the network can use it and if you need to email the project just package it and send it off. Otherwise stick to the other app 'sketch' you refer to

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Explorer ,
Jun 12, 2018 Jun 12, 2018

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There's no interest to use embeded .ai vs libraries. You still can't edit in context.

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Participant ,
Jun 12, 2018 Jun 12, 2018

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you ever use this tool before with your symbols? you can edit this way or edit the source symbol in isolation mode... but I am guessing the symbol sprayer tool is more context-friendly to your need

sprayer.PNG

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Explorer ,
Jun 12, 2018 Jun 12, 2018

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The symbols could be a possible option but symbol libraries are not collaboratives.

The symbol sprayer is useless in my case. My need is UI/UX design oriented.

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Community Expert ,
Jun 12, 2018 Jun 12, 2018

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sébastienc21868522  wrote

There's no interest to use embeded .ai vs libraries. You still can't edit in context.

Can you clarify exactly what you mean by "edit in context"?

I ask because I think I understand your original statement to be one seeking the functionality of Symbols in a share-able library. Do I have that right? But the thing is, Symbol function is of a document-specific nature. Wouldn't share-ability render it a non-Symbol? Or, is it indeed Symbol behavior across any number of documents that you want? You already know Illustrator can't deliver it. No one has identified a plugin that delivers it. While I understand Illustrator's Symbol feature, I rarely use Symbols in my work, so I'm no expert, but I'm inclined to believe that what you want is contrary to the nature of Illustrator Symbol function such that the plugin you'd need isn't possible.

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Explorer ,
Jun 12, 2018 Jun 12, 2018

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By "edit in context", I mean modifying the symbol while keeping the other artworks around visibles so I can immediately see the impact of my graphical changes on the rest of the composition. I want it to be fully WYSIWYG.

Symbols have this ability but as you said are document specific.

I actually imagine very complex solutions using JS/VBA scripts but it would bother me to get to such extreme solution : I'm planing for instance to load all of my library items instances in symbols at the opening of the document and to load the symbols in my library the other way around anytime I save my document. Of course lots of other issues happen when thinking that way...

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Community Expert ,
Jun 12, 2018 Jun 12, 2018

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sébastienc21868522  wrote

By "edit in context", I mean modifying the symbol while keeping the other artworks around visibles so I can immediately see the impact of my graphical changes on the rest of the composition. I want it to be fully WYSIWYG.

Symbols have this ability but as you said are document specific.

If I edit a symbol, it goes into isolation mode and I cannot see the artwork around it.

How do you edit a Symbol while keeping other objects around it visible?

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Explorer ,
Jun 13, 2018 Jun 13, 2018

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I add a scrshot to be sure we're talking about the same "symbol" notion. When you double click on a symbol instance it happens the same as when you double click on a group. Everything around fades a bit but you're still able to see the other objects.

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Community Expert ,
Jun 13, 2018 Jun 13, 2018

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Yes, you are right.

If I double click a Symbol in the Symbol Panel, it opens a new window.

But if I double click the Symbol instance, it dims the surriunding artwork.

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Explorer ,
Jun 13, 2018 Jun 13, 2018

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If it helps, Sketch is the same way. If you want to edit a symbol instance in Sketch then it takes you out of your design and into the symbol page. So, unfortunately, this is just a common editing paradigm that you'll have to be okay with. Everything you're looking for is what Libraries gets you. It's collaborative, global, and can be used in any Adobe app. Change an element in libraries and it is edited in every document in which it exists. It's like Ai's symbols on steroids but without the 9-slice options, if that matters.

What I'm gathering is that you're not a fan of the inner-workings of symbols and libraries, and I'm not sure any of us can give you a solution to that.

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Explorer ,
Jun 13, 2018 Jun 13, 2018

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You're right, it's not possible to edit in context with Sketch. You can do it with XD though ... so it's not a absolute paradigm.

Sketch is not THE solution in the end.

Anyway Symbols, Libraries, Smart objects, ... So many stuffs that could be harmonized accross the CC apps. Put upon it a little bit of user friendlyness and it will make Adobe be great again !

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Explorer ,
Jun 13, 2018 Jun 13, 2018

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Hey, you're right! XD does indeed let you edit in-context, which is nice. And on that note I would recommend using either Sketch or XD if you're designing interfaces, not sure I caught what your end-goal was. You're so right though, those three elements you mention are all strikingly similar, yet different. I do wonder if a little engineering can somehow unify them to make things more...unified. Alas, we're at the mercy of Adobe devs in the meantime.

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Participant ,
Jun 12, 2018 Jun 12, 2018

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if its for UI specifically... I'd keep using 'sketch' until adobe listens to feature reqs more

sorry couldn't help more

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