LR images become muddy/darker after rendering in correct/captured exposure

[bowbenie]

Hi everyone. I have a problem that has been plaguing me for the last day. I was on a marketing/commercial shoot last week and when my friend was working on the images in LR, suddenly the images to the right started turning dark...as if the exposure had been dialed down quite a bit (all the history in LR only showed 'import' no changes to the images were done and no presets applied). We were using a 5D Mark IV, profoto lights, and editing in Lightroom Classic CC. When he called me telling me of the problem, I pulled up the same images on my computer (running a slightly older version of LR) and they were perfectly fine.  When he came over and had me open his catalog, I had to update my LR version and the images started turning dark and muddy like he was experiencing.  I've since uninstalled the newer LR Classic version and using the version I had used before, but the images are STILL changing and turning muddy/dark after a few minutes.  I'm trying to figure out if it is a camera profile issue etc. It's been so frustrating not knowing what is going on.   Image included is of two back to back photos taken at basically the same time, but the photo on the right has been darkened for some unknown reason.  Thanks!  

[SeanMcCormack]

Without seeing the settings in Develop, it'll be hard to tell.

[bowbenie]

[bowbenie]

[SeanMcCormack]

Flat as a pancake, so this leads me to ask is Highlight Priority enabled in camera?

[bowbenie]

no.  it is off.

[SeanMcCormack]

There's a second option on Canon which underexposes the raw and pulls it back in post in DPP, but I can't remember what it's called. Lightroom doesn't do the pull back.

[bowbenie]

Sean, here is a dropbox link to a couple images.  Could you open it in your LR and see if you experience the same darkening?

Dropbox - Zion RAW - Simplify your life

[Per Berntsen]

The two images on Dropbox are clearly underexposed, which is confirmed by the histogram - it's bumped up to the left with little information in the upper midtones and highlights.

Lightroom Classic has an option in the import dialog to use the embedded jpg previews instead of creating it's own Library previews, and there is also an option in Preferences > General to Replace embedded previews with standard previews during idle time.

When you use a camera setting that lifts the shadows (Nikon calls it Active D-lighting, and Canon probably has something similar), and choose the two settings I mentioned above, the Library previews will change like you described.

Note that this does not affect Develop, which has its own previews, so in Develop you will always see the actual image.

The jpg previews are also displayed on the LCD screen on your camera, and when using the camera setting I described above, it will give you the impression that the image is correctly exposed, which it is not.

So I suggest that you turn off any setting in the camera that changes the appearance of the image. (and camera settings do not affect raw files)

Unless you want to use the embedded jpg preview, do not use the Embedded & Sidecar option under File handling in the import dialog (choose any other option), and/or turn off the option to replace embedded previews in Preferences.

[Just Shoot Me]

When initially importing and viewing the 2 raw files you posted on DB I see them much brighter and then a second or 2 later they become darker. That is because the initial view is of the embedded JPG image included in every RAW file. Then LR builds its own Preview from the actual RAW data and the images darken.

As stated above the histogram is to the left which means they are underexposed.

Converting them to DNG using the free Adobe DNG converter and opening in LR 5 they look the same as they do in LR 7.5 (C CC), Underexposed.

[elie_dinur]

>>" When you use a camera setting that lifts the shadows (Nikon calls it Active D-lighting, and Canon probably has something similar), and choose the two settings I mentioned above, the Library previews will change like you described.

Note that this does not affect Develop, which has its own previews, so in Develop you will always see the actual image."

Canon cameras actually have two different functions that do this; Highlight Tone Priority and Auto Lighting Optimizer. The metadata of the supplied CR2 files reveal that although HTP is disabled, ALO is on and set to Standard, which affects the processing of camera jpgs, probably by trying compensate for underexposure .

This is how Canon describes ALO:

Auto Lighting Optimizer (ALO) was introduced as a feature on the EOS 450D DSLR in 2008. It is found on all current Canon EOS DSLR cameras, from the entry-level EOS 1100D to the professional EOS-1D X, with the exception of the EOS-1Ds Mark III. The aim of ALO is to provide in-camera processing that will improve the look of your images.

ALO is designed to even out contrast by selectively adjusting areas of the image. It is especially useful when using flash or with backlit subjects as it can detect faces in the frame and brighten those areas to achieve a better result.

ALO analyses contrast in captured images and modifies both shadows and highlights via tone curve adjustments to minimise loss of detail in contrasty light conditions. There are three levels of setting strength as well as the ability to turn the setting off (known as Disable). The levels are Standard, Low and Strong and these can be used at any ISO speed setting.

Auto Lighting Optimizer - Canon Professional Network

[SeanMcCormack]

Yep, that was the one I couldn’t remember the name of.

[Jao vdL]

In this mode the camera will dial in an underexposure depending on the

scene content. So the effect will not always be as strong. It applies to

all exposure modes including manual. It’s generally best to turn off these

sort of automatic modes if you shoot raw for use in Lightroom or other

non-canon apps.

On Sat, Sep 15, 2018 at 8:58 PM SeanMcCormack <forums_noreply@adobe.com>

[Jao vdL]

elie_di hits the nail on the head. Bowbenie is using auto lighting optimizer as exiftool reveals from the raw file:

Auto Lighting Optimizer         : Standard

This will automatically underexpose the raw image and Lightroom does not know how to read this tag nor how to emulate what it does. Also Bowbenie uses the neutral picture style in camera which will also make the camera render somewhat greyer. This means that to emulate in Lightroom what both these settings do, you need to select the camera neutral profile in the profile browser and dial in about +1 of exposure. It is best to not use any of these modes in camera.

[bowbenie]

Thanks everyone!  I'm looking into each of your responses.  I think it might be the auto lighting optimizer.  It was on Standard in my camera, but not sure if it was disabled during M mode, which is what we use.  We were wirelessly tethered to an iPad so the images coming over to it were the jpg files, which were lighter (with the auto lighting optimizer enabled).  I'm thinking that might be the problem.  The one frustrating issue is that it only happened in this one part of the day, so I'm still a bit confused and will go through the other ideas you've given.