develop presets buggy in LR and Camera Raw

[wheel264]

I’m have several problems with trying to manage the  Develop Presets .

I have LR Classic CC 8.0. and Camera Raw 11.0 , and the latest version of Photoshop CC. 

I am using Mac OS Mojave 10.14.1.

I have all purchased presets from well know professionals.  The last couple that I bought were XMP format.  I used the ‘ + import ’ command in LR develop preset.  The last two sets were in zip file format.  They seem to easily import into LR , and also  Camera Raw, and also created a folder , with the name matching the name of the download folder.   So far so good.  When I view presets, the folder is there , and ‘most’ of the presets are in that folder. Some are missing. 

I used the import command , on many older presets that are in the ‘lrtemplate’ format,

And they converted to the appropriate ‘xmp’ format.  All of these are in the ‘User Preset’ area of the LR develop preset. There are between 50 and 100, in a jumble, terrible order.   However , none of them are User created, I simply imported them into lightroom.

I look in the Camera Raw – settings – user presets folder, and there are only 11 xmp files.  Which ones, who knows? 

Almost all the imported files are in the Camera Raw – Imported Settings folder , at least 100.

And inside that folder is a  single folder called All-Profiles, which has another 50 or 100 files inside it.  So obviously not “All’ presets are inside it. !!  

There are some presets in the ‘imported settings’ folder which do not show up anywhere in LR presets,  or in Camera RAW, although they are in the ‘imported settings’ folder ???

I used the ‘import – create preset ‘ tool in LR, made a dummy preset, and created a new folder.  The dummy preset is in the new folder ‘viewed in the finder’ .  But I used the ‘move’ command in LR or Camera Raw to move preset that is in ‘User Presets’ to organize it into a folder .  that I created.   In Camera Raw and LR that are moved to the folder that I wanted.  BUT inside Camera Raw – settings folder,  the new folders are empty.  The assigned presets are still in the ‘imported settings’ folder.  

THIS IS A TERRIBLE MESS !! Adobe should be ashamed of this.   Also the move command only works on a single preset at at time, so do I do this 100 times to move the pointers for these presets, and put them into a useable place to work in LR and Camera Raw?

1. I think the purchased presets that are .xmp files install correctly, and the .lrtemplate files are scattered everywhere, and seem to be unfixable.   Is there a tool to convert .lrtemplate files to xmp files before trying to import them into LR ??

1. Can I specify where the presets go when they are installed??

1. Should I delete all the contents in the ‘settings’ folder and the ‘imported settings’ and start over, installing presets just a few at a time, and organize them.   

1. Should I just uninstall LR and start all over.??

1. I’m a very experienced LR user, of many years

[JohanElzenga]

No, don't uninstall Lightroom because that will do nothing.

You can manage your presets by right-clicking on them. Choose 'Move' from the contextual menu. You can move them to any preset group you want this way. Local folders are irrelevant for how presets are organised. The old presets used to be organised by folders on your hard disk, but the new presets are organised by information stored inside the preset itself. So either simply ignore these local folders, or use this plugin to restore the old behavior.

[wheel264]

Thank you for the reply and info.  you're right, I guess that I would have to uninstall Camera Raw ( if that's possible)

, or actually just delete all the contents of the 'settings' and 'imported settings' folders.   I know how to use the "move" command to put a preset into a folder that I create.  THE PROBLEM is that I have to move 200 presets, one at at time,  after I figure out which creator  or style folder that the preset belongs in.  So I have to look at each preset name, then look at all the downloaded presets to see where it came from , then put it into the correct folder.   I think that is hours and hours of work.  

And there is still an 'Import bug "  I have some presets that imported into the 'settings' or 'imported settings' folders BUT they do not appear anywhere in the Camera RAW or Lightroom user interface.... but they are sitting in the folders. 

Perhaps it is just easier to delete all the contents of the 'settings' folder and 'imported-settings' folder and start over a few at a time.

BUT that doesnt fix the problem of the presets that don't appear in the user interface.  I have imported some presets several times, and  they are in the folder, but not in the user interface for either LR or Camera Raw.   :-(.  that is definitely a bug.

I appreciate any advice that others may have or sharing their experiences.   Thank you

[JohanElzenga]

If a preset does not appear, it is usually for the following reason: the preset applies a raw profile (among other things) and you have selected a non raw file. Or the preset applies a camera specific profile and you’ve selected a file from a different camera.

[wheel264]

thanks, but I have all raw picture files.  and no camera specific files.   for example, I have presets that I purchased from Nicolsey.  for example, there is:

Contempo 01 Contrast.xmp

Contempo 01 Matte.xmp

Contempo 01.xmp

. . .

Contempo 05 Contrast.xmp

Contempo 05 Matte.xmp

Contempo 05.xmp

all are in the  settings or importsettings folders inside Camera Raw.   BUT the Contempo 01.xmp, Contempo 02.xmp  thru Contempo 05.xmp  do not show up in the user lists in Camera Raw or LR.  All the "matte" and "contrast" presets show up in the preset listings.  These are all part of the same preset package.  All work on Raw files and jpeg files.  it doesn't matter whether I have select a raw file or a jpg file.   The missing presets are still missing, and all the 'contrast' and 'matte' presets are available. 

Separately,  in the  Camera Raw - importedsettings  there is a sub folder called 'All-Profiles' .

**.

All the Contempo *** .xmp  files are in  'settings' in a subfolder 'Nicolesy Contempo', which I did not create, but it's there.    I have just discovered that the 'Contempo 01. xmp. thru 'Contempo 05.xmp' files , which are also in this same folder and not showing up in the Develop Presets,  is in the Develop Profile Browser area !!

I know profiles and presets are different, and presets can call profiles.  But this is all messed up.

I guess that Adobe looks at some specific attributes  of an 'adjustment'. and determines if it is a preset or a profile, as all the 'Contempo'  set were all sold and identified as presets, but Adobe now seem to think differently.    IF there are rules about this,  maybe Adobe could share. 

it's just a random mess that Adobe has made.   I have no idea how to clean it up.   One at a time, to move all the presets where they need to be.  But the future looks bleak.

I have purchased professional LUT ( look up table ) profiles and others from photographers and they seem to be nicely organized in the profile browser in the tool area on the right side of LR develop module.  The profiles are automatially and nicely organized by name / or type / or creator in  separate folders,   yet I have probably 200 presets in the User-preset area. BUT I did not create any of them, so they are not My user Presets. 

I would like to be spending  this time editing my photos that I recently took. BUT i'm spending days trying to cleanup this preset mess.     I've used LR since the very very versions,  and am quite disappointed about this. 

Again,  thank you JohanEL54, don't mean to complain, but this isn't what I wanted to be doing.   I'm reinstalling many of the presets I used to us, as I  installed a new SSD drive in my macbook a few months ago, and started from scratch.    so it's dishearting to find files all over the place.  if I had know everything ends up in one large bucket, I would only install a few at a time, and clean them up.    Adobe should as least modify the  import tool, to allow the creation of a folder to put the files in , instead of forcing everything into User-Presets.

If I do create a dummy preset, and put it into a new folder, it appears inside the 'Settings' folder in the new subfolder I just created.  If I  then 'move'  presets from the 'user-preset' folder, they are in the 'settings ' folder or the 'importedsettings' folder, and remain there  and not in the newly created folder in 'settings'.  obviously this is just a pointer that is changing,  but this isn't really a database.   There is absolutely no understanding of what is happening when new presets are installed..  sometimes it creates a subfolder in the 'settings ' area, and other times it puts files in 'user presets' ( but rarely). and most of the files go into 'importedsettings'

i'm tired of writing.  :-(.       Merry Christmas to all.  

[bhousto90]

I just downloaded the preset bundle below from the Nicolesy site called:

Nicolesy Contempo Creative Profile presets

Following the install from the zip file, I have 10 new presets listed in the Develop Presets panel listed under the title 'Nicolesy Contempo'

(01-05 Contrast and Matte)

Then in the 'Profile browser' in the Basic Panel there are 5 new 'profiles' listed under 'Nicolesy Contempo' named Contempo 01-05

When I check the ..../Adobe/Camera Raw/Imported Settings directory all 15 .xmp files are in the same location.

Does this help explain what is going on for you?

Edit: missed typed the folder path:  they are in ..../Adobe/Camera Raw/Imported Settings/ Nicosely Comtempo Presets/

I also see re-reading your message again that this looks to be the same for you.

It all follows to be a correct location for me. There is a new folder containing the complete preset pak nice & tidy together.

As JohanEl54  indicated the profiles now have folder/location info embedded in the .xmp file to let LR know where to use them.

While previous use of folders to sort presets before may have been simpler for organizing large collections of presets.

It looks like this new method will make install/uninstall simpler as everything is kept together instead of scattered across multiple folders.

[wheel264]

to bhousto90,

wow.  i would like to thank you for all the effort you went to with the Nicolesy presets .  Yes, I discovered that some of the NIcolsey are located in the Develop Preset section on the left, and I guess the 'main' ones are found in the 'profile browser' on the right panel.

i also find all 15 files are in one folder in camera raw - settings - Nicolsey Contempo.   very neat and tidy.  slightly different than you said, but I installed them a while back, prior to version 8 of LR.

It still seems to me that Adobe and everyone else is using the  term 'preset' very loosely.   I understand the basic difference, but not how  to exactly create profiles.  I do have some profiles from Matt K, that I think are created around 'Look Up Tables'.

Even the Nicolsey  tools, that are sold and discussed at 'presets' , are in my simple understanding,  ten, 10, presets, and five,5, profiles.

so how do I know if a preset is just a preset, or it is really adjusting a 'profile'.  Yes, I know that a preset can 'call' a profile.

I have to do some more research to understand what a 'Look Up Table' is , and how to make a profile.

Also, I have to discover if I need a new workflow,  to look at the 'profiles' First, before applying 'presets'

I believe that I have also discovered the source of  the 100 + presets in my LR Develop panel that are installed as 'User Presets'.

They are not my user presets, but in fact third party presets ( in my case , all from On1, who also writes presets into Camera Raw' )

Adobe must somehow detect that they don't have a 'lightroom tag', and assumes they are user presets, and discards all the creator and folder info,

and just puts all of them in the giant  basket , they call 'User Presets', and are only sorted by  alphabetical  order, and not how they affect the photo, or there intent.

So now I have a better chance of finding their original source, and making some subfolders to organize them.

Maybe Adobe will make some changes to help capture the information from third party 'presets' in Camera RAW  that also show up in LR as User-Presets, but they are not.   Or create another sub area, and keep the creator and folder name info.  They are already xmp files, so the info must be there, as they are organized nicey in on1. 

ff

Thank you again, for you kind effort to help me.

regards,

[Rob_Cullen]

FYI

This link provides (a download) tutorial instructions for making your own profiles.

I found it to be easy once the steps in the method were (mostly!) understood.

PROFILE MAKER INSTRUCTIONS

And Matt Koslowski has a video here-

https://mattk.com/make-lightroom-photoshop-profiles-luts/

[wheel264]

WobertC,

thank you very much for the profile links.  I'll definitely study them. 

and Thankyou to everyone who has taken time to try and make me a better LR user.

Merry Christmas. 

[GoldingD]

Another member found this excellent article:

Updates in Lightroom Classic: How to Install Presets and Profiles April 2018 - YouTube

Note that it starts talking about profiles, but it then gets into presets.