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1. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Ann Shelbourne Sep 6, 2008 6:33 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)Sounds good but I am always VERY wary of firmware updates because they usually can't be reversed if there is a problem.
You go first !
8/ -
2. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Fred Nirque Sep 6, 2008 10:33 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)Done and done, Ann.
No problems. Done and done, camera working fine.
Just follow the overly comprehensive directions on the site;
or - fully charge battery, insert CF card with part A, turn camera on, go Firmware Version>Upgrade>Yes and hit OK button.
Wait until told to turn camera off.
Remove CF card with part A on it.
Insert CF card with part B.
Repeat first part.
Done. -
3. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Ann Shelbourne Sep 7, 2008 9:15 AM (in response to Fred Nirque)Done and done here too, Fred.
All seems to be OK so far
:) -
4. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Fred Nirque Sep 7, 2008 2:53 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)Next time I'm out in the forest any improvements in auto white balance will become instantly apparent - or not.
Nikon must have hired someone from the Adobe CS3 printing development team to fix what wasn't broken in the D2x when designing the D3. -
5. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
R Popham Sep 9, 2008 4:15 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)This is kind of cool...
http://regex.info/blog/2008-09-04/925 -
6. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Ann Shelbourne Sep 9, 2008 5:58 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)VERY Cool and instructional too because you can see exactly why part of your frame will bet blanked-out if you choose a shutter speed that is too fast to synchronize with your Flash. -
7. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Fred Nirque Sep 10, 2008 5:51 AM (in response to Fred Nirque)I don't know what the firmware is supposed to have done to the auto white balance, but it is still woeful compared with the way the D2x handled things with its ambient light sensor. <br /> <br />I took this today in the forest being careful not to overwhelm the scene with green - plenty of wood and earth in frame but still the AWB over-reacted to the predominance of greens and yellows. The pic at left is straight AWB, at right my custom "forest profile" applied in ACR, which is a lot closer to the way the scene is in real life. <br /> <br /> <a href="http://www.pixentral.com/show.php?picture=12ebDDB6GetUPwBfABf0DONAK4KPmc" /></a> <img alt="Picture hosted by Pixentral" src="http://www.pixentral.com/hosted/12ebDDB6GetUPwBfABf0DONAK4KPmc_thumb.jpg" border="0" /> -
8. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Hudechrome-sd9sPI Sep 10, 2008 7:31 AM (in response to Fred Nirque)Which is why I use a fixed (in my case, daylight) WB. No fuss, no muss, no danger! -
9. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Nick Decker Sep 10, 2008 7:39 AM (in response to Fred Nirque)A little off topic, but might be of interest. Has anyone else tried the public beta of the new profiles for ACR 4.5? If not, you might want to read about them here:
http://blogs.adobe.com/jnack/2008/08/the_dng_profile_editor.html
I've been using them for a week or so, and find that I really like several of them. -
10. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Ann Shelbourne Sep 10, 2008 7:44 AM (in response to Fred Nirque)Fred:
If you have a colour temperature meter, take a reading in your forest.
My guess is that the high °K reading there is beyond the range that is handled accurately by "Auto".
(You will also get inadequately corrected colour under low-wattage tungsten light
with the Auto setting.)
How does the D3 react if you choose the "Shade" setting?
Or if you select a custom color temp.? -
11. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
(clifford_hager) Sep 10, 2008 11:22 AM (in response to Fred Nirque)I don't have a D3 but I find that I get very accurate WB on my D300 by using
presets. I have paper or napkins or anything white with me (I carry a
notebook which works fine) shoot a preset image in the conditions I'm
shooting in and use it. It's fast, very simple to do and appears very
accurate to me. -
12. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Fred Nirque Sep 10, 2008 2:34 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)What I'm pointing out is that, despite Nikon's claims, the D3's auto white balance is a
i huge
step backwards from the D2x.
The D2x, 99 times out of 100, would render the "as shot" white balance correct in ACR, with no need to fiddle around with WB sliders later. The D3 gets it wrong 99 times out of 100.
Not what you'd expect from this uber-expensive top-of-the-line Nikon.
I was suspicious when Nikon dropped the D2x ambient light sensor to replace it with software with an "image-recognition" data base. Obviously few or none of the comparison images in this data base was shot in Australia, or in particular Tasmania. We have very clear air here and the depleted ozone layer is at its thinnest over us, so UV light is far stronger than in the northern hemisphere (as the WB bias in my sample will attest).
The ambient light cross-check in the D2x took account of this very well indeed, however the D3 is hopeless because it doesn't appear to actually place any importance on measuring the light temperature itself, but instead tries to recognize what I'm pointing the camera at.
Too smart, too tricky, doesn't work.
I understand and use WB presets. I have a "forests" preset in the camera, and of course I always use a preset when doing a pano series. But presets still invariably require fine-tuning later. This is fine in a "normal" shoot, but I'm dreading the next wedding - 600 or more shots all taken in wildly differing lighting conditions. The D2x excelled at getting auto WB right in that scenario, particularly in the mixed lighting so often encountered during a wedding.
Initially I suspected that maybe (though unlikely) ACR was the culprit with the D3 update (given Adobe's recent obsession with fixing things not broken), but I checked in Nikon Capture NX2 and the white-balance is still all over the place. You'd think that NX would be able to decode the D3 properly.
If it was consistent I'd put it down to the basic camera setup defaults and make the appropriate fine-tune in the menu, but it varies constantly, even during a shoot in the same location as the sun comes out or goes in - which never phased the D2x at all.
Obviously the D3 has a great deal of trouble "recognizing" what I'm photographing. -
13. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Nick Decker Sep 10, 2008 3:16 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)I agree, Fred. The D2x (which I still have) was the best at auto WB. The D300, IMO, is not as good as the D200, which was not as good as the D2x.
Nikon needs to re-institute that ambient light sensor from the D2x. Of course, doing that will mean another five or six grand. Better, me thinks, to stick with gray cards or presets.
In most of the work that I do, there is almost always a neutral area that I can find within a set of photos shot under the same light. Probably not so in the forest. -
14. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Fred Nirque Sep 10, 2008 4:57 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)That's my problem, Nick - there is no neutral in the forest (only clouds if I can see them, but nothing in the forest itself). I have tried taking readings from a neutral card, but that still is nowhere near as accurate as the D2x is by itself (I also have the D2x still, but the D3's high ISO is a godsend in the forest and more than makes up for the dodgy AWB).
Taking neutral card readings during a wedding is also not an option - things move too quickly. I guess I'm griping because Nikon are claiming this auto WB to be a great advancement, just like Adobe lauded CS3 printing as such. In both cases they are just plain lying to cover their own goofs. I'll wager that this new system proves to be permanently flawed and the little white sensor reappears on the prism of the D4. -
15. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Ramón G Castañeda Sep 10, 2008 5:02 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)As per note in Dpreview:
Today Nikon pulled the [firmware] upgrade as in certain circumstances (shooting at maximum speed in 14-bit RAW mode) it can 'in rare circumstances' cause corruption of some images.
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/nikond3/
Scroll down to the hideous green-on-black text. -
16. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Fred Nirque Sep 10, 2008 5:10 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)And it's not reversible (i.e. you can't retrograde to 1.1).
Just as well I don't use maximum speed shooting, but it just underlines that Nikon is totally crap at software.
For instance NX2 is only slightly less of a dog than NX was, but in comparison to Photoshop it reduces my computer performance to that of a 386 using Windows 3.1. Open windows can take half a minute or more to refresh - something that is virtually instantaneous in Photoshop. -
17. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Ann Shelbourne Sep 10, 2008 5:32 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)Re::
>(#1 of 16)
>Sounds good but I am always VERY wary of firmware updates because they usually can't be reversed if there is a problem.
>You go first !
Fred:
Do you know what it might feel like to be fed slowly to a voracious Australian crocodile?
I thought for a moment that you were just about to find out.
VERY luckily for you, my D3 seems to be perfectly all right even when shooting 14-bit RAWs at the extended !SO 25,600 in an unlit darkened room with just a glimmer of light coming through a half-opened doorway!
So you might have escaped being Croc. Dinner this time but don't you EVER tell me about a Firmware upgrade again until you have used it for at least six months!!!
8/ -
18. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Hudechrome-sd9sPI Sep 10, 2008 5:39 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)If the firmware is crap, Nikon should make good at it. All modern devices storing firmware like BIOS is Flash capable, meaning Nikon should be able to offer you the 1.1 version as an .exe (or what extension is used by Nikon for firmware) which should load with no problems. No retrograde means no file available, not that going backwards is impossible technically.
Outside the studio, I fail to understand the angst over WB. How did we ever get along with only Daylight and Tungsten in the past? -
19. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
<shep> Sep 10, 2008 7:24 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)>How did we ever get along with only Daylight and Tungsten in the past?
Kodak Wratten gel filters.
;) -
20. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Ozpeter Sep 10, 2008 8:11 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)Such upgrades are indeed fraught with danger if the supplier makes an error with the software. I believe Sony Playstation 3 devices all over the world were rendered like unto doorstops by a recent defective upgrade (like this, rapidly withdrawn), requiring them to be returned to service stations to be fixed. But I would have thought that a week would normally suffice to see what howls are heard on the net. -
21. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Fred Nirque Sep 10, 2008 8:14 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)Whatever the technicalities, Larry, Nikon specifically pointed out on the download page that returning to V A1.0 &V B1.1 was impossible after the update.
Ann, my desire for a fix for auto white balance overtook common sense in this case. I never had any problems with previous updates on the D70s and D2x, but I guess I should know better by now than to believe in Nikon software (I'm particularly annoyed because the auto WB is still very much NOT "improved").
Their software really is awful stuff. I can't believe how slow NX2 is on my admittedly aging computer, but for heaven's sake, CS3 - and everything else I run - just races away in comparison. Only the very largest Photoshop brushes can't keep up with my hand on the Wacom, but it's taking NX2 15 seconds or more to make a simple WB correction. That sort of delay renders the concept of sliders useless. -
22. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Hudechrome-sd9sPI Sep 10, 2008 9:01 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)i returning to V A1.0 &V B1.1 was impossible after the update.
Really stupid! That used to be true of BIOS as well, but that's history now.
So their only recourse is an update for the update. In the meantime.... -
23. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Fred Nirque Sep 10, 2008 9:27 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)Luckily this is not going to be a major problem for most of us, but I agree - really stupid.
Hopefully the update for the update won't cripple something else, or mess auto white balance up even further.... -
24. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Ann Shelbourne Sep 10, 2008 10:06 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)Interestingly, I checked on the nikonusa site a little while ago and there is absolutely no mention of any problem with the Firmware Update; and it is still listed as being available for download.
I have shot numerous frames (including continuous bursts) tonight at various High ISO settings and there doesn't appear to be anything wrong with my camera.
Is it possible that the D3s that are sold in the UK are different from those that are sold in the USA in some way? Might they originally had slightly different Firmware installed in them or is it possible that the Updater available to them differs in some way from the one that I downloaded here? -
25. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Fred Nirque Sep 10, 2008 10:19 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)Well, the qualifier was "in rare circumstances" that the problem was seen, so I guess you just haven't been lucky enough (?!) to replicate those rare circumstances. I doubt the cameras or firmware differ from market to market - that might be true of amateur or pro-am models, but you'd think the pro line would be the same beast the world over.
Nikon have enough trouble writing one version of software, I can't see them trying for two or more versions for something that is a relatively low volume item in the scheme of their overall business. -
26. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Hudechrome-sd9sPI Sep 11, 2008 5:44 AM (in response to Fred Nirque)Don't let the low volume fool you.
The "rare circumstances" probably already has been experienced, or the software validators saw the problem after release. Or they knew it but didn't realize it's possible severity, like corrupting files!
It's really an eye opener to be doing this kind of work at Intel. Like Nikon, Intel is a HW company, not software. -
27. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Wade S Zimmerman Sep 11, 2008 7:11 AM (in response to Fred Nirque)Auto WB Go to White Balance>Auto>then go one more step and then select the adjustment you wish to make to it.
I found I like i a little warmer as well. -
28. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Ann Shelbourne Sep 11, 2008 8:48 AM (in response to Fred Nirque)I do wonder if the problems arising for some after the D3 Firmware Update is due to User Error?
One was supposed to follow a fairly stringent routine when installing the upgrade.
I followed Nikon's instructions to the letter I wonder if those that have run into problems did the same? -
29. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Hudechrome-sd9sPI Sep 11, 2008 4:37 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)Probably not. Installation errors are not very subtle. And if it was, Nikon would (should?) flag it. -
30. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Ann Shelbourne Sep 11, 2008 5:08 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)Nikon USA are not even mentioning the issue as far as I can see and the software is still listed for downloading:
Firmware 2.0 Updaters
You were supposed to do the upgrade in a very particular way with each module of the software on a freshly re-formatted memory card. Then you have to leave the camera entirely alone while a module installs until you get the "All Clear" message.
I wonder how closely people followed those instructions; AND if they reformatted their cards again before trying to use them for picture-taking.
I honestly think that if the Firmware software itself was faulty, then every D3 would have been affected.
Fred:
Have you tested your D3 on the high ISO speeds since updating it?
And is all well? -
31. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Hudechrome-sd9sPI Sep 11, 2008 8:10 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)i I honestly think that if the Firmware software itself was faulty, then every D3 would have been affected.
They are, but the conditions which trigger the problem are quite specific.
I fought that one most of today!
To tell the truth, that upgrade methodology sucks! Very clumsy! Sounds like maybe a very junior programmer was given his/hers first assignment. With little supervision at that.
With no recourse to the original, I probably would have not installed it, given the instructions. Yet, it seems far fetched that an installation fault is responsible, but anything can happen these days! -
32. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Fred Nirque Sep 11, 2008 8:58 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)>Sounds like maybe a very junior programmer was given his/hers first assignment
That's Nikon software for you - I don't think there
i is
anyone senior to supervise. The upgrade sequence, and the dire warnings of possible camera self-destruction that accompany the upgrade are guaranteed to cause elevated stress levels.
Ann, I shot at 6400 ISO last night and it was all fine, no corruption of images. As for high shots per second - no I haven't tried that and I doubt my camera will ever have to do that. -
33. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Ann Shelbourne Sep 11, 2008 10:39 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)I have tried it right up to H2 (ISO 25,600) and also tested with high speed bursts and there is no evidence of any corruption here either.
I suspect that the problem is being over-stated and a hefty dose of PEBCAK is probably involved! -
34. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
(Andrew_Pietrzyk) Sep 11, 2008 10:52 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)Geezzzz.....
This article (Ramon linked to) is dated APRIL 2008 and refers to firmware 1.00 to 1.10 update.
Take a deep breath and RELAX folks... it is SEPTEMBER 2008 and current firmware update is V2.00
No D3 cameras have exploded due to this update... as far as I know... -
35. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Wade S Zimmerman Sep 11, 2008 11:33 PM (in response to Fred Nirque)LOL! -
36. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Fred Nirque Sep 12, 2008 12:27 AM (in response to Fred Nirque)All that adrenalin wasted! My father always told me to read the fine print.... -
37. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Nick Decker Sep 12, 2008 5:16 AM (in response to Fred Nirque)I checked in at the DPreview Nikon forums yesterday, and thought it odd that I didn't see any threads about this. :) Those folks would have been howling to high heaven. -
38. Re: D3 Firmware Upgrade
Hudechrome-sd9sPI Sep 12, 2008 5:30 AM (in response to Fred Nirque)Since I don't own a D3, I don't have access to the upgrades, but I did notice that the only info I could find was that earlier one Andrew pointed out. I was also going to say something but as I noted, I have no actual access to the upgrades.
My general comments still apply concerning upgrades that are cited irreversible. Bad policy, IMO. -


