1 2 3 Previous Next 164 Replies Latest reply: Dec 8, 2009 3:11 AM by warrioruk RSS

    ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued

    Günter Schenk CommunityMVP

      Dear fellow ADDT users,

       

      Adobe has now officially announced ADDT´s discontinuation on the product page - quote:

       

      **************************

      Adobe Dreamweaver Developer Toolbox development to end effective April 9, 2009

       

      After careful consideration, Adobe has decided to discontinue development of Adobe® Dreamweaver® Developer Toolbox 1.0.1 software effective April 9, 2009. Sales of the product will end through the Adobe Store on April 23, 2009, and sales across all channels will end on May 1, 2009. Existing customers are encouraged to consider the development environment of Adobe Dreamweaver CS4 software.

      Read the FAQ for additional information about the discontinuation of Adobe Dreamweaver Developer Toolbox.

      We value your feedback. Please post comments on  the Dreamweaver forums or the Dreamweaver product blog.

       

      **************************

       

      As I expect this announcement to certainly stir up very emotional reactions, please allow me to ask you guys for 2 things:

       

      1. if you want to comment on this in the ADDT forums, please post your reactions as replies to this very thread only and not spread them across other threads in the ADDT forums

       

      2. please let the overall tone remain halfways civilized

       

       

      Cheers,

      Günter

       

       



        • 1. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
          Albert S. Community Member

          Adobe quotes:

           

          Existing customers are encouraged to consider the development environment of Adobe Dreamweaver CS4 software.

           

          ------

           

          Show me one tutorial that creates a Dynamic List and Dynamic form with all the same functions and control of ADDT but without ADDT.

           

          Then I will consider the "development environment of Adobe Dreamweaver CS4 software" as a serious tool that makes my life easier.

           

           

          AND

           

          One tutorial that allows easy image manipulation same as ADDT but without ADDT.

           

          -----

           

          I wait for some good links.

          • 2. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
            Günter Schenk CommunityMVP

            Albert S. wrote:

             

            Adobe quotes:

             

            Existing customers are encouraged to consider the development environment of Adobe Dreamweaver CS4 software.

            yep, I honestly had to scratch my wig while wondering about the informative value of this attempt of consolation

            • 3. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued

              Wow. So sad. An amazing set of tools. I hope there is some sort of effort made to move ADDT back to the world of the living - maybe some other business entity will see the wisdom in purchasing and rebranding it? I dunno - grasping at straws here.

               

              I REALLY hope all the years of Interakt/ADDT forum help posts are retained and kept alive - such a huge despository of knowledge should not be allowed to disappear.

               

              I know this has been asked - but (seriously) what are the closest alternatives to this toolset? Webassist?

               

              One other thought - Adobe! Listen up! I'm a creative professional who works with others in various disciplines from Video Editors to Graphic Designers and Web Developers. With the release of CS4 I hear a lot of grumbling and it seems like Adobe is dropping the ball more and more when it comes to it's core user audience. Editors are not overly pleased with Premier Pro CS4 and are seeing more and more the benefits of Final Cut. Developers are actively searching for alternatives to DW. Illustrator's feature set is becoming more and more outdated. I don't wish Adobe any ill will - but if someone comes out with a viable alternative to PS or Flash you guys are going to slide off into irrelevance.

              • 4. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                slog70 Community Member

                What a sad news!

                Adobe is definitely going the wrong way.

                I know there is money in between, but now? what about the aquired interakt team?

                Will they go somewhere else or will they be able to rebuild the glorious interakt?

                 

                Who knows?

                 

                I am a Coreldraw user and I see here the same thing I've seen about Corel Ventura 10: it is still, today, the best DTP application around.

                But Corel killed it; at least, it seems that no one at corel knows that Ventura exist any more. But ask to any Ventura user why it continue to use it and you'll be surprised.

                 

                I'll continue to use DW8+Kollection 3.7.1 until current website developement will require other (non-adobe) tools.

                 

                 

                 

                Tony

                • 5. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                  David_Powers CommunityMVP

                  sweetman70 wrote:

                   

                  what about the aquired interakt team?

                  Will they go somewhere else or will they be able to rebuild the glorious interakt?

                  Many of them have been working for a long time on other Adobe products, including Dreamweaver, InContext Editing, and Flex. I assume they will continue to do so.

                  • 6. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                    Nancy Gill CommunityMVP

                    Holy crap .. why on earth did they bother to update it for CS4 only to discontinue it a couple of months later?

                     

                    Here was my favorite part of the announcement:

                     

                    Visit the Adobe Developer Connection for resources on building  web applications and dynamic websites with Dreamweaver, JavaScript, Ajax, PHP, and ColdFusion.

                     

                    Looks like ASP is also out in the cold in the next version of Dreamweaver.  Good grief!

                    • 7. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                      Albert S. Community Member

                      Nancy wrote:


                      Holy crap .. why on earth did they bother to update it for CS4 only to discontinue it a couple of months later?

                       

                       

                      ---

                       

                      Actually be glad that they did it. There were a few issues that needed to be fixed and I for one am happy that even though they knew they were going to trash it that they at least fixed the version that was already circulating. But the whole thing is very sad. In my jaded opinion I think Adobe should just stick to their flagship programs, Photoshop, Illustrator and Acrobat. NOTE this is just my opinion. Leave the web programs to the experts.

                      • 8. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                        Günter Schenk CommunityMVP

                        NancyG wrote:

                         

                        Holy crap .. why on earth did they bother to update it for CS4 only to discontinue it a couple of months later?

                        whatever the reasons may be, it´s certainly a positive outcome having a version which runs with CS4 and which comes with a handful of significant bug fixes like making the MultiUpload components work with Flash Player >= 10 -- if the ADDT developers hadn´t implemented the last-mentioned thing in version 1.0.1, at least those users who develop ADDT driven applications for paying customers would have to face serious issues.

                        • 9. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                          Community Member

                          Honestly, I'm pretty disgusted that Adobe bought out interakt only to discontinue all their products. I have been an interakt/developer toolbox user for years now. I'm EXTREMELY dissapointed. And now there will be nothing. I use webassist too, but Interakt/developer toolbox is far superior. I know that this reply isn't going to do any bit of good, but I really wish they wouldn't do this.

                          • 10. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                            921creative Community Member

                            Is there any indication that the functions of ADDT will be folded into a future release of DW - say, CS5?

                             

                            Being a designer and not a programmer, ADDT is the sole reason I can consider myself a "developer" now. I am now able to build the web apps I had always dreamed about doing. This reminds me of when Adobe stopped developing the built-in database tools that were part of GoLive. Why in the world would they stop developing such useful tools??

                            • 11. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                              David_Powers CommunityMVP

                              Is there any indication that the functions of ADDT will be folded into a future release of DW - say, CS5?

                              No, there isn't. But nor is there any indication that they won't be.

                               

                              I don't know what Adobe's plans are, but the FAQ about the decision to discontinue ADDT gives some pretty strong hints. For example, it says this about ADDT:

                              . . . it was far from ideal for many reasons, including complexity, intrusiveness, and inability to customize.

                              It also says this about the future direction of Dreamweaver:

                              . . . in order to help our web professional customers take advantage of the functionalities brought by the rising use of CMS frameworks and the strong web design capabilities of Dreamweaver, we have decided to focus our efforts on delivering features in Dreamweaver that will help developers easily and quickly integrate, brand, and customize prebuilt components, instead of going through a separate tool.

                              Dreamweaver has an 18- to 24-month release cycle, which makes it difficult to respond to the rapidly changing web environment. I take this comment to mean that Adobe wants to focus Dreamweaver on being a development environment that works with your CMS framework of choice, rather than locking you into a single framework as ADDT does.

                              • 12. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                Purple Edge Community Member

                                I think that's a fair summation. Anyone starting major development with ADDT now needs their head read. CMS have replaced tools like ADDT because ADDT is too complex, and too vulnerable to hacking.

                                 

                                Dreamweaver's future must also be questionable for similar reasons?

                                 

                                Losing ADDT is a major pain for those of us with major projects written with it.

                                • 13. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                  mcantera

                                  Does anyone know where to download a PDF/HTML/CHM version of the ADDT Help File?

                                   

                                  The one here: http://help.adobe.com/en_US/Dreamweaver/9.0_ADDT/help.html

                                   

                                  Would hate to lose access to this when the product is discontinued.

                                  • 14. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                    Postmast

                                    Hi

                                    I'm one disappointed in the demise of ADDT also.

                                     

                                    Gunter wrote:

                                    it´s certainly a positive outcome having a version which runs with CS4

                                     

                                    Can anyone tell me where I can get the update for CS4, can't find it on Adobe's site

                                     

                                    Cheers

                                    • 16. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                      mcantera Community Member

                                      The ADDT online documentation link appears to be dead:

                                       

                                      (help.adobe.com/en_US/Dreamweaver/10.0_ADDT/help.html)

                                       

                                      Does anyone know of anywhere else to download documentation for ADDT and/or the 1.0.1 update?

                                       

                                      Message was edited by: Günter Schenk (subsequent correction of the Link´s URL)

                                      • 17. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                        Günter Schenk CommunityMVP

                                        mcantera wrote:

                                         

                                        The ADDT online documentation link appears to be dead:

                                         

                                        [incorrect link here...]

                                         

                                        Does anyone know of anywhere else to download documentation for ADDT and/or the 1.0.1 update?

                                        this one works for me:

                                        http://help.adobe.com/en_US/Dreamweaver/10.0_ADDT/help.html

                                        • 18. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                          Albert S. Community Member

                                          Works for me also.

                                          • 19. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                            RWCoco Community Member

                                            Purple Edge - I have to ask since I still intend on using ADDT for the next 12-18 mos - do you know what the vulnerabilities are in terms of hacking? I've not seen anything on this subject other than a reference to uncontrolled image/type uploads. I'd love to hear you expand on this if you don't mind (I'm not looking to flame - just professional interest on this). I've used ADDT to create some pretty cool CMS and I always thought it's complexity (and ability to enhance with my own code) a strength of this product.

                                            • 20. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                              Purple Edge Community Member

                                              Hi RWCoco,

                                               

                                              I'm no expert on website security, which is one of the reasons I am nervous about it. Two issues of concern for me however are that...

                                               

                                              1. All requsts are posted as GETs rather than POST - this can be coded around, but is a major PIA and not worth the effort since it breaks so many things in the way that the ADDT code handles forms. Using GETs also makes it hard to code user friendly URLs. This is a relatively low risk threat from the security perspective, but it does make it easier for amateur hackers to start attempting hacks on a site, and changing GETs to POSTs is often the first suggestion for increasing the security of a site.

                                               

                                              2. CSRF - I'm not aware of any code in the ADDT templates to circumvent this, yet every mainstream CMS codes to prevent it.

                                               

                                              3. The code in ADDT is at least three years old, and no-one at Adobe is changing the code to eliminate threats as/when they arise. Compare that with the major CMS templates which have thousands of people contributing to making these products more secure.

                                              • 21. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                                Albert S. Community Member

                                                Hi Purple Edge,

                                                 

                                                You stated that:

                                                ---

                                                1. All requests are posted as GETs rather than POST - this can be coded around, but is a major PIA and not worth the effort since it breaks so many things in the way that the ADDT code handles forms. Using GETs also makes it hard to code user friendly URLs. This is a relatively low risk threat from the security perspective, but it does make it easier for amateur hackers to start attempting hacks on a site, and changing GETs to POSTs is often the first suggestion for increasing the security of a site.

                                                ----

                                                 

                                                I don't think this is accurate as the only time I've seen GET being used is when you are going from a dynamic list to a dynamic form. But when your at the dynamic form all updates/inserts are POSTs. Also when you do stand alone insert or update they are POST. When you do an email form they are POST. The only GETs I've seen would be the same GETs when the user has to call on a specific value, all other ENTRY is typically POST.

                                                 

                                                May I ask what does CSRF stand for? I'm not hip to all the acronyms. I always thought ADDT/MX Kollection was pretty secure as far as web applications go. I am curious to know of security holes also since I do have some forms that are not behind standard authentication. I have an e-card system running on one website and there have been attempts by hackers to hack the form but after several tries they give up since all the entries are processed and any code entered is escaped and removed.

                                                 

                                                Thanks

                                                Albert S.

                                                • 22. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                                  Albert S. Community Member

                                                  Hi,

                                                   

                                                  I have a pretty strong opinion to what Adobe wrote here on the FAQ page for the discontinued ADDT.

                                                   

                                                  ---

                                                  However, it was far from ideal for many reasons, including complexity, intrusiveness, and inability to customize.

                                                  ---

                                                   

                                                  Instead of getting into all the emotions that this statement makes. I think I would rather just ask if it can be removed. I think its opinion based and is not 100% factual or accurate.

                                                   

                                                   

                                                  • 23. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                                    veematics

                                                    This is terrible... when Adobe say "NO".. everyone must obey... can someone contact people from Adobe Romania (Aka interakt) to share they thought here...

                                                     

                                                    ADDT saves times a lot... if Adobe doesn't like traditional PHP, then they may also remove their PHP server behavior.. now i can quit dreaming that there will be Kommerce/Cart version...

                                                     

                                                    To Community, one feature that very important to me is MX Includes, this advanced version of required_once function is the core backbone of my apps..

                                                    do you have any information regarding similiar extension...

                                                     

                                                    It will be a miracle to see ADDT continue to lives as we are (ADDT Developer) only very minority community... and might be just a tiny spot in Adobe's perspective...

                                                     

                                                    WebAssist... i think there's no choice but you...

                                                    • 24. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                                      Purple Edge Community Member

                                                      I'm not going to argue with you Albert.

                                                       

                                                      I suggest you start here... http://www.owasp.org/index.php/Main_Page

                                                      • 25. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                                        Albert S. Community Member

                                                        Hi Purple Edge,

                                                         

                                                        I'm not looking to argue. I have no problem being told Im wrong. I just was looking at a lot of my forms and they have POST all over them thats all. I hope you did'nt take any offense.

                                                         

                                                        Sorry,

                                                         

                                                        Thanks for the link.

                                                        • 26. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                                          Purple Edge Community Member

                                                          No offense taken Albert, I'm just not going to argue ADDTs use of GET

                                                          • 27. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                                            Mindvision Media Community Member

                                                            Adobe - You are dropping your customers in it...

                                                             

                                                            If you continue to pull stunts like this your loyal customer base WILL start looking for alternatives.

                                                             

                                                            For simple applications for smaller businesses with smaller budgets, this software has enabled 'Creative' designers to become developers. It enables them to design user friendly applications in a very techie based world. Take this away from them and businesses will suffer.

                                                             

                                                            You should not bite the hand that feeds you, especially when you have been getting it so wrong in recent months.

                                                             

                                                            Please listen to your users - DO NOT STOP DEVELOPING THIS SOFTWARE

                                                            • 28. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                                              veematics Community Member

                                                              Interakt was launched Ajax Toolbox... Kollection 4 is about to release.... and adobe shut it down...

                                                              ADDT was a good sign that Adobe would see Kollection's potential... we all began to hope there will be a new KTML, Navigation Pack, MX Calendar, etc..

                                                               

                                                              but now...  everything will be gone with the wind... especially when adobe said "However, it was far from ideal for many reasons, including complexity, intrusiveness, and inability to customize." .. ADDT user.. let slap Adobe's face.."You whatt ??!!!"

                                                               

                                                              Interakt's acquisition was a creativity killer... now everything just memory..... Let's evolve to Spry, Flex, and a whole lot more "according" to Adobe.. yeah.. he is our boss...

                                                              • 29. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                                                Nancy Gill CommunityMVP

                                                                "Interakt's acquisition was a creativity killer."

                                                                 

                                                                 

                                                                No .. you're wrong.  Interakt's acquisition was to (a) establish an Adobe presence in a part of the world where they did not exist and (b) bring aboard some very talented, albeit predominantly PHP, programmers and they have contributed to Flex, to AIR, to Dreamweaver and to other projects and will continue to do so, no doubt.

                                                                 

                                                                I would imagine some of the functionality of ADDT will come into Dreamweaver in the future.  That is just my opinion.  What I hope will NOT come in is the horrid creation of dozens of includes and files that you don't want and don't need .. which is, IMO, the biggest problem with ADDT.

                                                                 

                                                                Nancy

                                                                • 30. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                                                  veematics Community Member

                                                                  yes, i see your good perspective.. that's good...

                                                                  in developer perspective, there's a lot of potential for developer to extend ADDT.. i spend hours to study the transaction engine, build custom trigger, etc... the concept is good...

                                                                   

                                                                  well enough is enough .. ADDT will soon be discontinued.... life must go on isn't ?

                                                                  • 31. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                                                    Günter Schenk CommunityMVP

                                                                    veematics wrote:

                                                                     

                                                                    yes, i see your good perspective.. that's good...

                                                                    in developer perspective, there's a lot of potential for developer to extend ADDT.. i spend hours to study the transaction engine, build custom trigger, etc... the concept is good...

                                                                     

                                                                    well enough is enough .. ADDT will soon be discontinued.... life must go on isn't ?

                                                                    I find it amazing that, now that ADDT´s demise has been announced, users come up and start publicly praising its virtues. Is this the "you don´t know what you got until it´s gone" effect ?

                                                                    • 32. Re: RIP ADDT, RIP Interakt

                                                                      Gunter, I think something's been missing since Adobe bought Interakt (no offense to you!).  The Interakt Forums were a wonderful place to learn and help each other, the Adobe Forums, not so much.

                                                                       

                                                                      I don't post on these Forums because ADDT does what I need it to do on my older sites, and I have been trying to use it as little as possible on new sites I develop.  I've been trying to wean myself off of ADDT since Adobe bought it, figuring this was the inevitable outcome.  Not quite there yet, and as others have said, I'm glad to have the CS4 update before it got killed.

                                                                       

                                                                      Still, it's a sad day. A lot of software and scripts I've loved over the years have been bought and killed (anyone here remember Creature House's Expression software?).

                                                                       

                                                                      One question I have -- is Spry really an option?  Development there seems to be practically non-existent.  I thought about using it to do some of things I do with ADDT, but I'm afraid the same axe is going to fall on Spry one of these days.  It's ridiculous that it's still at 1.61 and still labeled a "pre-release."  But that's another rant for another forum. Sorry.

                                                                      • 33. Re: RIP ADDT, RIP Interakt
                                                                        Brad Lawryk CommunityMVP

                                                                        Gunter, I think something's been missing since Adobe bought Interakt (no offense to you!).  The Interakt Forums were a wonderful place to learn and help each other, the Adobe Forums, not so much.

                                                                         

                                                                        I suspect that the new format of the forums here will be better for some of us  that were very frequent on the old InterAKT site. Like me for instance.

                                                                         

                                                                        I really hated the old Adobe forums. I'll certainly be on these much much more now.

                                                                         

                                                                        And yes, the old InterAKT forums were a wonderful place. Miss them alot.

                                                                        • 34. Re: RIP ADDT, RIP Interakt
                                                                          Brad Lawryk CommunityMVP

                                                                          One question I have -- is Spry really an option?  Development there seems to be practically non-existent.  I thought about using it to do some of things I do with ADDT, but I'm afraid the same axe is going to fall on Spry one of these days.

                                                                           

                                                                          I think (or would hope) that we are just starting to see Spry be developed a bit more. I personally like many of the Spry features in DW. These current features I t hink will be the future building basis of some good Spry features to come in CS5(?).

                                                                          • 35. Re: RIP ADDT, RIP Interakt
                                                                            Günter Schenk CommunityMVP

                                                                            harootun wrote:

                                                                             

                                                                            Gunter, I think something's been missing since Adobe bought Interakt (no offense to you!).  The Interakt Forums were a wonderful place to learn and help each other, the Adobe Forums, not so much.

                                                                            well, the Interakt forums saw a regular participation from the developers, and it´s much harder to establish the same quality when the forums are user-to-user only and when the willingness to exchange ideas might depend on the presence of the developers -- what would actually be a wrong assumption for the ADDT forums IMO, because folks like Albert, Waleed and quite some others have (and thankfully still do) contribute a lot to the user community. However I have the impression that many former Interakt customers most probably did not embrace the idea of a user-to-user forum.

                                                                            • 36. Re: RIP ADDT, RIP Interakt
                                                                              Günter Schenk CommunityMVP

                                                                              Brad Lawryk wrote:

                                                                               

                                                                              I suspect that the new format of the forums here will be better for some of us  that were very frequent on the old InterAKT site. Like me for instance.

                                                                               

                                                                              I really hated the old Adobe forums. I'll certainly be on these much much more now.

                                                                               

                                                                              And yes, the old InterAKT forums were a wonderful place. Miss them alot.

                                                                              it´s definitely more fun now to use some of the new features like attaching images or post PHP and/or HTML code fragments which don´t get crippled any longer -- but then again the old forums were usable enough to get some work done as well.

                                                                              • 37. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                                                                eokorie Community Member

                                                                                I for one am extremely disappointed.  ADDT is still very capable and I am certain it could not taken Adobe that much time to update the code on ADDT to current standards and add new features. Having been a hand coder for several years, ADDT did save me a lot of time and allowed me to take on more projects.  The very last update is still full of bugs and this is a big oversight on Adobe's behalf (i.e. the download file feature does not work). Nevertheless, I have started looking at other options.  I am considering Joomla and Wordpress.  I hear Drupal tends to be overly complicated so I will be avoiding that.  If all else fails, probably go back to hand coding.  But at the moment, ADDt is still useful and still does the job that I need it to do.

                                                                                • 38. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                                                                  Albert S. Community Member

                                                                                  Hi All,

                                                                                   

                                                                                  Services will be held at http://graphicssoft.about.com/od/whathappenedto/p/formeradobe.htm

                                                                                  on 01/01/10.


                                                                                  Please wear appropriate attire and flowers will be greatly appreciated.

                                                                                   

                                                                                  Life is but a stopping place,
                                                                                  A pause in what's to be,
                                                                                  A resting place along the road,
                                                                                  to sweet eternity.
                                                                                  We all have different journeys,
                                                                                  Different paths along the way,
                                                                                  We all were meant to learn some things,
                                                                                  but never meant to stay...
                                                                                  Our destination is a place,
                                                                                  Far greater than we know.
                                                                                  For some the journey's quicker,
                                                                                  For some the journey's slow.
                                                                                  And when the journey finally ends,
                                                                                  We'll claim a great reward,
                                                                                  And find an everlasting peace,
                                                                                  Together with Adobe

                                                                                   

                                                                                   

                                                                                   

                                                                                   

                                                                                   

                                                                                   

                                                                                   

                                                                                   

                                                                                  FYI -> This is just simple humor.

                                                                                  • 39. Re: ANN: ADDT will soon be discontinued
                                                                                    twoinaroom

                                                                                    "I for one welcome our new Adobe overlords..."

                                                                                    haha NOT!

                                                                                    ADDT will be missed. I thought it was a great development tool for the designer looking to code more complex sites. Isn't that the whole point of Dreamweaver?

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