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1. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
John Joslin May 15, 2009 10:27 PM (in response to Phos±four dots)In any forum it should be required of the host to explain any deletions or locked threads.
Otherwise how are we to learn how to mend our evil ways?
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2. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Q Photo May 16, 2009 12:07 AM (in response to Phos±four dots)I think it has to be someone that really hates women, for whatever reason.
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4. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Zeno Bokor May 16, 2009 12:17 PM (in response to Buko.)i'm sorry that i don't allow you to make off-topic threads in the main product forums. If i was heavy-handed as you suggest then i wouldn't have bothered to post and just deleted your off-topic threads, all of them, but i didn't, only those from the Photoshop Windows and Macintosh forums. Though if you keep at it i'm going to delete them outright so please stop it. Keep discussions like those in the proper forums, thanks
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5. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Kath-H May 16, 2009 12:22 PM (in response to Zeno Bokor)Hmm, the question originally was about the deletion of a Lounge Basement thread containing SFW but attractive pictures of various 'clad' women. Since the similar thread about attractive men remains, I deduce the censor is not both straight and male. Does that give us any clues?
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6. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
John Joslin May 16, 2009 12:24 PM (in response to Zeno Bokor)Zeno Bokor wrote:
i'm sorry that i don't allow you to make off-topic threads in the main product forums. If i was heavy-handed as you suggest then i wouldn't have bothered to post and just deleted your off-topic threads, all of them, but i didn't, only those from the Photoshop Windows and Macintosh forums. Though if you keep at it i'm going to delete them outright so please stop it. Keep discussions like those in the proper forums, thanks
Buko thinks you might have been the one who killed the wenches.
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7. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Zeno Bokor May 16, 2009 12:31 PM (in response to John Joslin)I got mod powers on the 14th while the first post complaining about the disappearance of that thread appeared on the 12th so try blaming someone else
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8. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Buko. May 16, 2009 12:53 PM (in response to Zeno Bokor)Zeno Bokor wrote:
i'm sorry that i don't allow you to make off-topic threads in the main product forums...I got mod powers on the 14th
Methinks your power has gone to your head.
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9. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Zeno Bokor May 16, 2009 12:59 PM (in response to Buko.)think what you will of me but that doesn't change the fact that those 3 threads of yours that i locked had nothing to do with the Photoshop Win/Mac forums. Discussions about the forums themselves should be kept in this forum and not the product forums
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10. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Q Photo May 16, 2009 4:39 PM (in response to Zeno Bokor)Can we please stay on this topic, which is: Why did wenches thread get pulled? I do not care who did it, just would like to know why. It was harmless. And fun...
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11. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Ramón G Castañeda May 16, 2009 6:40 PM (in response to Zeno Bokor)Zeno Bokor wrote:
I got mod powers on the 14th…
Another absurd decision in the seemingly unending chain of bad decisions taken in the new forums. They might as well grant "mod powers" to L_Todie and J_Oblak.
Above answer was futilely deleted by the heavy-handed censorship in this forum earlier this afternoon. Too late. It's cached in Google already.
Insert Ghandi quote here.
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12. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Ramón G Castañeda May 16, 2009 6:42 PM (in response to Zeno Bokor)You must realize, Zeno, that you ceased to be "one of us" the instant you acquired "mod" or host powers.
Now the Gandhi quote is fully applicable to you too.
This is a genuine, well-known quote by Mahatma Gandhi, the Indian spiritual leader and activist:
• A customer is the most important visitor on our premises, he is not dependent on us. We are dependent on him.
• He is not an interruption in our work. He is the purpose of it.
• He is not an outsider in our business. He is part of it.
• We are not doing him a favor by serving him. He is doing us a favor by giving us an opportunity to do so.
Employees of any entity, whether in government or in private business, will do well to keep it in mind and at heart.
The recent post by Kathy Nguyen, universally well received here, shows that she knows this principle and puts it into practice—and so does John Cornicello, of course.
However, a few Adobe staff and associates seem somehow to think that Adobe's customers are lowly adversaries in some sort of Internet game or in a newsgroup. Those who manifest that misguided and poisonous attitude in this forum and in their blogs are showing their incompetence and their ignorance of basic business principles. To them I say: you're dead wrong! You are far from being our superiors, you are our servants.
They should know well who they are—and we certainly do.
Message was edited by: Ramón G Castañeda
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13. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
John Joslin May 16, 2009 10:30 PM (in response to Ramón G Castañeda)You must realize, Zeno, that you ceased to be "one of us" the instant you acquired "mod" or host powers.
That is not at all true. You know very well that many hosts in the old forums managed to moderate the more unruly or verbose members without being "one of them".
The position of moderator is difficult: he is not serving the customer – he is serving Adobe.
Moderators are granted certain powers, which we all know are necessary to maintain factual correctness and to suppress undesirable wrangling and personal attacks.
Zeno is a young man who, although new to the forums, has shown a deep knowledge of Photoshop and I guess his appointment was made for that reason. He will have to feel his way in the first weeks and we should be guiding him not casting aspersions.
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14. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Ramón G Castañeda May 16, 2009 11:42 PM (in response to John Joslin)JJ,
Alas, I'm familiar with our Hungarian Mr. Bush residing in Romania. Yet, I'm quite capable of putting aside my intense dislike for him and give him the benefit of the doubt, despite his extremely confrontational demeanor, irritating attitude and brashness.
Incidentally, Bush translates into Bokor in Magyar. No insult there.
This issue is not worth a lengthy debate.
Otherwise, I disagree with you. In order to serve Adobe, any host, moderator or forum associate, MUST serve Adobe's customers. Otherwise, he would be doing Adobe a disservice.
This issue is not worth a lengthy debate to me. You're entitled to your opinion, and I'm equally entitled to disregard it as you are free to disregard mine.
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15. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Ramón G Castañeda May 16, 2009 11:37 PM (in response to John Joslin)John Joslin wrote:
That is not at all true. You know very well that many hosts in the old forums managed to moderate the more unruly or verbose members without being "one of them".
That statement of yours is a non sequitur.
What I had pointed out that being a host takes anybody out of the rank and file. It's like being in public life, where all celebrities are open to criticism.
Please don't bring up the three English moderators I'm ware of, namely Len, Ozpeter and Ian Lyons as examples of anything. I never objected to their exercising their full host privileges. The model host for me was and remains Neil Keller.
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16. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Kath-H May 16, 2009 11:39 PM (in response to Ramón G Castañeda)So Zeno has locked some OT threads, what's the problem, Ramón?
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17. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Ramón G Castañeda May 16, 2009 11:55 PM (in response to Kath-H)Kath-H wrote:
…Zeno has locked some OT threads…
Not any thread I was following, so they must have been among the many I mark as read these days to make up for the slow navigation here.
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18. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Zeno Bokor May 17, 2009 12:22 AM (in response to Kath-H)Thanks for the support John.
He has deleted posts of mine, including the one in this thread which I had to re-post as #11
haven't deleted any post/thread, the sole exception being posts about selling shoes and stuff like that.
Edit: Ramón, do you prefer "i became a host"?
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19. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Ramón G Castañeda May 19, 2009 10:19 AM (in response to Zeno Bokor) -
20. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
John Joslin May 17, 2009 1:24 AM (in response to Ramón G Castañeda)Ramón G Castañeda wrote:
JJ,
This issue is not worth a lengthy debate to me. You're entitled to your opinion, and I'm equally entitled to disregard it as you are free to disregard mine.
OK – let's leave it there. Time will tell.
Now then:
WHO KILLED THE WENCHES?
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21. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
D Fosse-QDEaQ1 May 17, 2009 2:26 AM (in response to Ramón G Castañeda)Although in principle I'm never a fan of shutting down threads (I simply don't believe it will accomplish anything), I think we should give Zeno room and time to find his place.
He certainly knows his Photoshop, and he seems level-headed and calm when the sh!t-storms hit.
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22. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
greenjumpyone May 17, 2009 6:05 AM (in response to D Fosse-QDEaQ1)not that I have read the thread through it's entirety, but I can't help but notice that no one is coming forward to answer the, obviously burning, question of: WHO KILLED THE WENCHES?
Zeno,
the only suggestion I can give you with regards to being a moderator ... walk softly and carry the smaller keyboard (I paraphrased badly here! ). If you are going to make deletes/close threads etc, make sure to be fair across all the areas. Indicate you were there, out of respect for the others who might not have seen some of the changes. I do believe that if a mod were to leave their name behind when making changes mentioned above, they might think twice or thrice before making them.
Anonymous is too easy to hide behind.
hopper
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23. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
D Fosse-QDEaQ1 May 17, 2009 6:39 AM (in response to greenjumpyone)Hopper: It wasn't Zeno. He said so very clearly. And the threads he did close, he said so there too.
Nobody here knows about the wenches, apparently. I'm not even in the lounge, so I don't know what that's about.
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24. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
greenjumpyone May 17, 2009 6:55 AM (in response to D Fosse-QDEaQ1)D Fosse wrote:
Hopper: It wasn't Zeno. He said so very clearly. And the threads he did close, he said so there too.
Nobody here knows about the wenches, apparently. I'm not even in the lounge, so I don't know what that's about.
No, no, no, I understand it wasn't Zeno and I apologize if my post implied that. I was simply giving Zeno some suggestions because of some of the negative comments he has encountered.
hopper
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25. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Zeno Bokor May 17, 2009 7:54 AM (in response to greenjumpyone)thanks for the suggestions, i agree with what you said and don't plan on using the delete button very often (hopefully never)
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26. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Kath-H May 17, 2009 8:35 AM (in response to Zeno Bokor)We-elll, maybe the shoe salesmen. Pity Oz isn't around any more to demonstrate - he policed the Lounge with great courtesy, humour and aplomb and little in the way of mutiny
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27. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Buko. May 17, 2009 8:49 AM (in response to Phos±four dots)Well in my opinion Zeno is taking us back to the Nanny state which caused the uprising that created the lounge. I was not off topic I was giving out free points in the Photoshop forum. My post even mentioned Photoshop.
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28. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Buko. May 17, 2009 3:25 PM (in response to S.D.A.)That is disgusting.
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29. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Q Photo May 17, 2009 4:27 PM (in response to Zeno Bokor)I'm sorry, perhaps I didn't ask properly. Will someone please tell me Why is the wenches thread gone?????
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30. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
~graffiti May 17, 2009 6:24 PM (in response to Q Photo)I've got a funny feeling that we will never know the answer.
All that work...
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31. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Claudio González May 17, 2009 7:11 PM (in response to Buko.)Buko. wrote:
Well in my opinion Zeno is taking us back to the Nanny state which caused the uprising that created the lounge. I was not off topic I was giving out free points in the Photoshop forum. My post even mentioned Photoshop.
I may be misunderstanding you, Buko, because of my limited knowledge of the English language, but as I see things, you have been offering free points in this forum. And in more than one thread. So maybe, just maybe, Zeno is not the alone in taking us back to nanny state -if he is. And this is not the Lounge, although some/many are acting as if it were.
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32. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
JayJhabrix May 17, 2009 8:21 PM (in response to Phos±four dots)Unless i'm wrong, Version 2 of the "Free Points! Get your free Points!! Free points!" thread seems to have been removed.
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33. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Chris Cox May 18, 2009 10:54 AM (in response to Q Photo)I know there were complaints about the wenches thread, and a bunch of bad content did have to be deleted.
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34. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Kath-H May 18, 2009 10:57 AM (in response to Chris Cox)Do you mean the post that was throwing up a password request? That was in another thread and is fixed (thanks Zeno).
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35. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Claudio González May 18, 2009 11:30 AM (in response to JayJhabrix)JayJhabrix wrote:
Unless i'm wrong, Version 2 of the "Free Points! Get your free Points!! Free points!" thread seems to have been removed.
And very justly; we have one too many as it is.
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36. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Chris Cox May 18, 2009 11:42 AM (in response to Kath-H)Kath - nope, I mean stuff specific to the wenches thread.
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37. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
Kath-H May 18, 2009 12:07 PM (in response to Chris Cox)Ah, OK. Haven't visited it for a long time.
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38. Re: Anonymous, heavy-handed host...
dave milbut May 19, 2009 10:17 AM (in response to Chris Cox)[Image removed}
you mean stuff like this that's been there since day 1 of these forums, reported and commented as "OK" by john?
http://forums.adobe.com/people/SnakeSK
at least in the wenches thread you pretty much know NOT to click on it from work where a passing boss might be more than a little upset to see something like the above on your screen.







