22 Replies Latest reply: May 13, 2013 10:40 AM by Vijay_usa RSS

    Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth

    Terrachild Community Member


      Here is a tutorial that will allow you to create a fully mastered surround sound project by only using Premiere and Soundbooth.  No need to buy Audition, or the Surcode plug-in.  It will get around the flawed Premiere audio mixer LFE channel issue, and also the Soundbooth export limitation.  You will end up with a 5.1 channel suround AC3 file.  If you have the Surcode plug-in, this workflow will also benefit you.  You'll just skip my tutorial on Audacity.

       

      ****Disclaimer****

      For commercial purposes, this free method is not recomended.  However, for non-commercial, private use, there is nothing wrong, or unethical about creating AC3 files for free!

       

      A word on the Soundbooth issue first: Adobe clearly wants us all to buy Audition, that's why they removed it from CS4, prevent you from editing individual surround sound file tracks in Soundboth, and limit Soundbooth's export options.  They let Premiere output an uncompressed surround sound Wave file, but not Soundbooth.  In their online tutorial by Adobe evangelist Jason Levine, he mentions this limitation, but doesn't offer a work-around.  He moves right on to Audition, as if we all have it.  Well after much experimentation, I have a solution.

       

      You might want to read my other tutorials first:

      Free AC3 encoding: http://forums.adobe.com/thread/511930

      and

      Surround sound ASIO fixed: http://forums.adobe.com/thread/511934

      and

      my help to TheShamsMan here: http://forums.adobe.com/thread/514546

       

       

       

      Workflow:

       

      Layout all your audio tracks in Premiere, mix them, apply keyframes, animate the surround "Puck", etc.  Create a mix that would induce dizziness in even the most steady test-pilot.

       

      Let's keep things organized from the start so you don't mix up the exported tracks later.  Create a folder, not a bin, where your Premiere project file is saved.  If you want to put all your Audio files for your project there, so much the better.  Give it a name matching your project name.  If your project is named "Next Blockbuster" then name the folder "Next Blockbuster Audio."  Inside this audio folder create another folder and call it "Premiere exported audio."  Lastly, create another folder next to that one and title it "Soundbooth mastered audio."

       

      Now with your Premiere mix done, go to File>Export>Media, click on the Hottext next to "Output Name" and browse to the folder you created named "Premiere exported audio," and store the output there.  Under Format, select "Windows Waveform."  Under "Audio Codec," select "Uncompressed."  Under "Basic Audio Settings," select 5.1 for Channels.
      It should look like this:

       

      Tutorial 3 Help 1.jpg

       


      Now, let's open up the file in Soundbooth. You should see six tracks laid out before you like this:

       

      Tutorial 3 Help 9.jpg

       

      You can't edit them individually in Soundbooth (you can in Audacity), so this is pretty much useless.

       

      Let's fix that.  Go to File>Export>Channels to Mono Files.  Select the folder you created earlier named "Premiere exported audio" for the storage.  You should now see this in the "Files" panel:

       

      Tutorial 3 Help 2.jpg


      The top file is from your Premiere export, it is 5.1 surround.  The next six are the separated channels, all file names nicely appended for you: ..._L.wav, _R.wav, _Ls.wav, _Rs.wav, _C.wav, and _LFE.wav.  Now select your original Premiere .wav file at the top of the list and select File>Close.  We don't need that one anymore.  You should now have six tracks in the Files panel.  Select the top file "..._L.wav" and either right-click on it and select "Insert Waveform into New Multitrack File," or go to Edit>Insert>Waveform into New Multitrack File.  Now drag the next file "..._R" into the empty area under the first track.  Do the same in order for the other 4 files.  When you finish, you should have all 6 layed out in the Multitrack file in this order: L, R ,LS, RS, C, LFE.  We'll use Adobe's track order just to stay consistent.

       

      Tutorial 3 Help 4.jpg

       

      The bottom track is cut off a bit in the photo.

       

       

       

      Okay, let's clean things up a bit.  Select the top file in the Files panel "Untitled Multitrack" and save it as an .asdn (Adobe sound) file inside the folder you created earlier, "Soundbooth mastered audio."  now select the bottom 6 files (not the ones in the mulititrack), and right click>Close Selected Files.  You should now have 1 multitrack file with 6 tracks indented under it.

       

      Mastering:
      Soundbooth will let you play a 5.1 surround file through your computer surround system, but it won't let you assign the tracks in a multi-track to specific output channels.  So you won't be able to hear your changes in surround while working in Soundbooth.
       
      You can't make global changes to all the tracks, so correct them one at a time.  To select an individual track, click on the little downward pointing triangle next to "Editor: Untitled Multitrack 1.asnd."  Apply volume keyframes, fades, effects, etc., Just don't change the timing of any of the tracks.  Don't delete sections, time shift sections, or use the "Change Pitch and Timing" "Time Stretch" filter.  If you do, then the audio tracks will no longer sync up with the video.  If you need to remove a section, select it and use Edit>Insert>Silence instead.  Adjust the audio on the tracks to your heart's content.

       

      The LFE track:
      The LFE track is not a subwoofer channel, it's only supposed to be used for low-frequency effects.
      Take a look at the first 20 minutes of the movie IronMan:

       

      Iron Man LFE.jpg

       

      As you can see, it's empty except for select sections mostly involving explosions.
      With this in mind, select your clip in the LFE track, at the bottom of your multitrack file, and press delete.  Now let's make a proper one.  Position the CTI (Current Time Indicator) where you want the effect to start, and right-click in the bottom track (Audio 6), and select "Insert File..."; Now select one of your pre-prepared, low-frequency, rumbly effects files.  It will be inserted into the track at the CTI.  If necessary, adjust the position of the clip so it plays at the proper point.  Continue inserting your effects clips as needed.

       

      The LFE track should look something like this when you are done:

       

      Tutorial 3 Help 8.jpg

       

       

       

      Export:
      Your tracks should be all mastered now.
      Now let's export the multitrack as an interleaved surround wave file so we can load it back into Premiere.

       

      Tutorial 3 Help 3.jpg

       

      Ooops...Adobe must have forgotten to include the 5.1 option as a type under Channels, and since the Premiere Audio Mixer is flawed with regards to the LFE channel, I guess we'll all just have to buy Audition since it's not included in the Creative Suite anymore.

       

      Soapbox mode on>  Adobe...This sort of thing is so annoying to customers, you guys really need to put down the marketing textbook for awhile, and focus on customer satisfaction.  At least provide an upgrade path for CS4 owners!  After all, you gave it to CS3 owners.
      Soapbox mode off.<

       


      Here's the workaround: On the Audio 1 track, click the "S" button (Solo) and go to File>Export>Multitrack Mixdown.  Select the Windows Waveform as the type, and the folder "Soundbooth mastered Audio" for the location.  Name the file "Mastered Left" and click Save.  Under Save As Options>General uncheck "Add To Files Panel."  Under Audio, select Uncompressed, Mono, and click Okay.  Now uncheck the "S" button for that track.

       

      Now do the same for the other five tracks, and name the files: "Mastered Right," "Mastered LS," Mastered RS," Mastered Center," and lastly, "Mastered LFE"

       

      Alternately, if you haven't added any clips to a track, you can right-click on a track's Clip and select "Export Clip Mixdown as..."  Just be careful not to slide the clip around on the track.  You'll throw off the audio sync if you do.  This won't work for our LFE track because we want to export all the clips on it into one file.  Just use the previous export method for the LFE track.

       


      We have two options now.  One for those without the Surcode plug-in, and one for those who have purchased it.

       

      Option 1) No Surcode.  Read my tutorial for creating an AC3 file with Audacity.

       

      But instead of dragging a single interleaved file created by Premiere and dropping it in Audacity, you are going to drag the clips in the following order into the Audacity workspace: L, R, C, LFE, LS, RS.  That is the proper order for an AC3 file, and Audacity will use that order to create your AC3 file correctly.

       

      If you choose this option, follow along with Option 2 below, because there is a work-around for the flawed Premiere Audio Mixer.  Plus, you will still be able to make editing changes to your Premiere sequence (If you're careful), and you will also be able to export selected sections of your sequence either to the Media Encoder, or to Encore.

       

       

       

      Option 2) You have Surcode, or you want to have the editing option I just mentioned.

       

      Back to Premiere:

       

      Create a new Bin in your Project tab and name it Mastered Soundbooth Audio.  Drag the six mono files we exported from Soundbooth to that folder.  Now to stay consistent with Premiere's Master volume meter display order, drop the sound files one at a time past the last audio track (In the dark gray unlabeled row) in the following order: Left, Right, LS, RS, and C.  Don't put the LFE channel in a track yet.  Now rename each audio track so it matches the file next to it.

       

      Now, as I explained, the Audio Mixer in Premiere has a flaw.  You can't assign a track only to the LFE channel.  And because we can't make a surround file in Soundbooth we need another trick to get our LFE file into our sequence.

       

      Select the file "Mastered LFE.wav" in the project tab.  Now click on Clip>Audio Options>Source Channel Mappings..., now under "Track Format" select 5.1, and repeatedly click the Channel tile until the Bass Clef appears.

       

      It should look like this:

       

      Tutorial 3 Help 5.jpg

       

      You just converted your mono LFE file into a virtual 5.1 surround file, with the LFE audio only on the LFE channel.  This is the only way to achieve this in Premiere.

       

      Now drag the LFE file from the project panel to the same place you dragged the other files, and rename the track "Mastered LFE.  Notice that Premiere shows the track as a 5.1 surround track even though it's really mono.

       

      The bottom of your Audio track section should look like this now:

       

      Tutorial 3 Help 6.jpg

       


      We're almost done.
      Mute all of your original audio tracks, but don't delete any.  You may need them for editing later.

       

      Now open up the Audio Mixer panel for your sequence.  We're going to assign each of our mastered tracks to play only in the proper channel.  Notice the position of the small black circle (the "Puck") in each surround mixer.  Make sure the Bass Clef knob is full CCW (Left) on each track so nothing bleeds over into the LFE channel.

       

      It should look like this:

       

      Tutorial 3 Help 7.jpg

       

      Now export using your Surcode plug-in.

       

      If you are an Audacity user, and you didn't already make your AC3 file using the individual tracks, then Export again from Premiere into a 5.1 surround wave file.  Drop it into Audacity and export your AC3.

       


      One last thing, you have the ability to export only a section of your sequence by setting the "Work Area Bar."  You can also cut out sections of your sequence if you want, without messing up the audio sync, by doing the following:  select all the tracks in the sequence (video and audio); position the CTI at the start of the section to remove; select Sequence>Razor at Current Time Indicator, position CTI at the end of the section to remove; select Sequence>Razor at Current Time Indicator, Marquee select all the clips you just created, and right-click>Ripple Delete.  All the Audio and Video will get shifted over, without any loss of sync.

       


      There you have it.  Full surround mastering with proper LFE channel creation.
      And because we exported uncompressed every time, we didn't lose any audio quality.

       

      I hope you all find this useful.

       

      Maybe if I quit knocking Adobe they'll give me a job writing tutorials for them.
      I really do love their products!

        • 1. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
          JSS1138 Community Member
          Free AC3 encoding

           

          From Neil Wilkes, Encore guru:

           

          "I would strongly advise against using any form of freeware AC3 encoder.

          They will be either reverse engineered or a hack, as this is not free technology.

          Your finished discs would not be able to use the Dolby logo either as the title would fail verification because none of these hacked encoders can produce guaranteed compliant streams.

          The list of licensed encoder manufacturers is located

          http://www.dolby.com/professional/technology/licensing/dolby-digital-pro-encoders.html"

          • 2. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
            Terrachild Community Member

            Well,  have to say I STRONGLY DISAGREE with that "strongly disagree,"  and in addition, I'll raise you a STRONGLY OBJECT, while I'm at it.  HeHe.

             

             

            Let's take the points one by one.

             

            1) "Free encoders are either reverse engineered or a hack."

             

            Not necessarily.  The Dolby surround format is old, old, old.  It has been published repeatedly, and is readily available to anyone who bothers to look for it.  It is also available to any company that makes a product that needs to incorporate a decoder.  It is not rocket science..., it's computer science.  Is that a slap at computer science?... Anyway, any Advanced computer programmer could take the time to write a "compliant" version.  Also, reverse engineering, as any engineer knows, can produce an identical product.  Some of the best software engineers in the world are part of the open-source movement, many work at major corporations, and some of them may even work at Dolby for all we know.

             

             

            2) "This is not free technology."

             

            The main reason it's not free is because Dolby cleverly tied their Trademark to the file format.  So if you want the right to use the Trademark, you have to go through their certification process.  And that cost money.  Very clever.

             

            The use of the word "free" sort of implies that, if you use the file format without paying, you are doing something wrong.  For non-commercial work without the Dolby logo, this is kind of silly.  Taking your audio and putting it in a file format is a little like taking a story you wrote and putting it in a particular type of book binding and typeset, to use an analogy from another era.  Most people would say that no one should have the right to own a format.  The right to own the Trademark, yes.  The right to own a software encoder that makes the format, yes.  But not the format itself.

             

             

            3) "You would not be able to use the Dolby logo either as the title would fail verification."

             

            Wrong!  The reason you can't use the logo is because it's a trademark, and you have to go through their process to get that right.

             

             

            4) "The title would fail verification because none of these hacked encoders can produce guaranteed compliant streams."

             

            Also wrong!  That is an assumption.  An "open-source," (not "hacked," which implies inferiority) encoder could easily pass verification if it's written correctly.  A software engineer doesn't need a license from Dolby to write good software!  They can't make "guaranteed" compliant streams because Dolby isn't going to give you a guarantee unless you pay them.  That doesn't mean it won't work correctly!

             

             

             

            Now I can't guarantee that the FFmpeg library, which is what Audacity uses to make the AC3 file, would pass verification with Dolby Labs.  It might.   I'm sure Dolby Labs would never, ever, ever, tell you if it did.  They are trying to make money after all.  They wouldn't admit that any open-source encoder would do that.  I wouldn't either if I were them.  But that's not the point.  The point is it works,  sounds great, and plays in software-based decoders on computers, and also in hardware-based decoders in DVD players.

             

            Now if you need the Dolby TM on your product, I'm sure paying for the Surcode encoder is the right way to go.

             

            However, 99 percent of the users of Premiere probably don't fall into that category.

            And even if you do fall into that category, I read in a post here that the Surcode encoder license only works on one of your 2 allowed CS4 installations.  So if you want to create AC3's on both systems then use this method.

             

            I have too much free time don't I?

            • 3. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
              JSS1138 Community Member

              The Dolby surround format...is also available to any company that makes a product that needs to incorporate a decoder.

               

              Firstly, we're talking here about encoders, not decoders.  Secondly, Neil's right.  The technology is patented and carries a price.  You cannot legally use it without paying.

              • 4. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                JSS1138 Community Member

                The main reason it's not free is because Dolby cleverly tied their Trademark to the file format.

                 

                That's not quite accurate.  The technology is patented.  The logo is Trademarked.  Two different things.  And you can get a licensed encoder without applying to use the Trademarked logo.

                • 5. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                  JSS1138 Community Member
                  Taking your audio and putting it in a file format is a little like taking a story you wrote and putting it in a particular type of book binding and typeset, to use an analogy from another era.

                   

                  Well, if the binding materials used a patented process and the typeset was Copyrighted, then I agree it would be equally as illegal.

                   

                  Most people would say that no one should have the right to own a format.

                   

                  "Most people" don't write (or often even understand) the laws.  Legislators do that.  So what "most people" think here is irrelevant.

                   

                  But not the format itself.

                   

                  The US Patent office would seem to disagree with you, since it apparently has granted Dolby the appropriate patents.

                   

                  An "open-source," (not "hacked," which implies inferiority)

                   

                  Hacked is correct in this case.  Open Source would be the wrong term here.

                  • 6. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                    Terrachild Community Member

                    Three replies in about 15 minutes.  WOW!!!
                    I must have touched a nerve.  You must be one of those people who never exceeds 55 miles an hour.  Because if you do, you are going to be tracked down by the Overlords.  I don't mean to scare you, but hey, the law is the law!

                     

                    First a little background on the Patent system.  It was not intended, nor is it implemented today in a manner to stop people from using a technology.  In the real world, it is implemented to protect the commercial interests of patent holders.  Not to stop the use of the technology.  If you are using any patented device, process, etc. for non-commercial use, you have little to fear.  Unless, of course, you like fearing little things.  We're talking about the real world here, not some obscure case history.

                    In one the most famous patent cases ever, Armstrong v. RCA, Armstrong (The sole inventor of FM radio technology, among other things) before killing himself, after an endless patent fight with RCA, said "Lawyers replace reality with words, and then argue about the words."

                     

                    On that note, on to your responses...

                     

                    Response #1)
                    I wrote "The Dolby surround format...is also available to any company that makes a product that needs to incorporate a decoder.

                     

                    You responded:  "Firstly, we're talking here about encoders, not decoders."

                     

                    I counter:  The purpose of my original statement was clearly that the specs are not locked away in a vault somewhere.  This is a fact.  Any competent engineer given the specs for building a decoder, coupled with the readily available published format information can build an encoder.  You missed the broader point.

                     

                    You responded:  "Secondly, Neil's right.  The technology is patented and carries a price.  You cannot legally use it without paying."

                     

                    I counter:  "Wrong!" and parry with a firm "Maybe."  As history has proved, using patented technology without permission is usually only litigated in the case of commercial use.  Moreover, the United States Patent office doesn't rule the world.  Software patents are not even recognized in many countries around the world, and in many others, patents on algorithms are not recognized at all.  Translation: you can usually protect a finished product, like a piece of software that does encoding, from piracy.  But you can't always stop people from writing their own software that uses their own implementation of a similar, or even identical algorithms.  There is a huge difference between the two.  Do some research!
                     
                    The "Maybe," above, refers to the issue of what your local jurisdiction is.
                    So the absolute statements that you and Neil are making are simply dead wrong!  You must be a Yank.      

                     

                     

                     

                    Response #2)
                    I wrote: "The main reason it's not free is because Dolby cleverly tied their Trademark to the file format.

                     

                    You responded: "That's not quite accurate.  The technology is patented.  The logo is Trademarked.  Two different things.  And you can get a licensed encoder without applying to use the Trademarked logo."

                     

                    I counter: I said "main" reason, not only reason.  If you really want to quibble over the strength of the qualifier "main," then feel free.  Also, as I already said, US Patent law doesn't rule the world!  And by tying the logo to the file format, they are able to enforce it in countries that protect Trademarks, but not software patents.

                     


                    Response #3)
                    I wrote: "Taking your audio and putting it in a file format is a little like taking a story you wrote and putting it in a particular type of book binding and typeset, to use an analogy from another era."

                     

                    You responded: "Well, if the binding materials used a patented process and the typeset was Copyrighted, then I agree it would be equally as illegal."

                     

                    I counter: I'm not sure why you included this, unless you think I made a bad analogy. 
                    You conveniently leave out my preceding sentence.  "For non-commercial work without the Dolby logo... 
                    In addition, I'm not sure, but you may have doubly missed the point, because I, knowingly, used an analogy that included possibly patented technology, from another era, to make the discussion more accessible to people.  The analogy is apt, because, again, for non-commercial work, no one I know, or probably anyone who existed in the past, would say you can't copy a bookbinding and typeset format for your own use.  The implication being that the same is true for other, more modern, information storage formats, like AC3.  Maybe I'm being too clever by half for you. 

                     


                    I wrote: "Most people would say that no one should have the right to own a format...But not the format itself.

                     

                    You responded: "The US Patent office would seem to disagree with you, since it apparently has granted Dolby the appropriate patents."

                     

                    I counter:  Honest to god, you can't even quote properly.  I said most people, not necessarily me!    

                     


                    I wrote: "An "open-source," (not "hacked," which implies inferiority)"

                     

                    You responded: "Hacked is correct in this case.  Open Source would be the wrong term here."

                     

                    I counter:  Wrong again!  Remember we're talking about FFmpeg here.  It is an open-source library project.  Period! 
                    And once again you missed the point.  The use of the word "hack," in common parlance is meant to diminish something.  Certainly the gist of your quote from Mr. Wilkes makes plain the fact that he thinks they are inferior.

                     

                    Moreover, specifically to computer programs, "hack" often means to alter something.

                     

                    From a common dictionary:
                    "hack 1    (hāk)  
                                Informal, To alter (a computer program): hacked her text editor to read HTML."

                     

                    FFmpeg libraries are built from scratch, they not a hacked (altered) version of other programs.

                     

                    Also, FFmpeg is used by dozens of programs.  Many of which are used by people on this forum.  Most notably, the VLC media player.  And since VLC also does encoding, why don't you go flame anyone who uses it.  It must be violating dozens of patents!

                     


                    In conclusion, I think I have clearly showed that your quote from Mr. Wilkes is wrong on many points.  I'm sorry you can't acknowledge that.  In addition, your responses were, not only pedantic, but with the possible exception of my use of the qualifier "main" instead of "one" (as in "one of the reasons..."), also mostly wrong.  Both of you guys need to watch the absoluteness of your statements!

                     


                    Lastly, I did say: "Now if you need the Dolby TM on your PRODUCT, I'm sure paying for the Surcode encoder is the right way to go." 
                    The implication clearly being, that for commercial purposes, this free method is not recomended.  However, for non-commercial, private use, there is nothing wrong, or unethical about creating AC3 files for free, even in the US!

                    Now, clearly I took a lot of time to put together these tutorials to help people who can't afford to buy Surcode and Audition.  These folks should get to use surround sound also.  Hopefully, scare mongering about patents won't stop them.

                    • 7. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                      Jeff Bellune CommunityMVP

                      Terrachild,

                       

                      First, nice tutorial.  Thanks for making it available.

                       

                      I'd like to jump in the middle here and say that you and Jim make some valid points, but you are each working from a different perspective.

                       

                      You said:

                      Now if you need the Dolby TM on your product, I'm sure paying for the Surcode encoder is the right way to go.  However, 99 percent of the users of Premiere probably don't fall into that category.

                      I think you significantly underestimate the percentage of Premiere Pro users that deliver content to paying clients.  Those folks need to know the potential hazards to their business from using freeware AC3 encoders.

                      you are going to be tracked down by the Overlords.  I don't mean to scare you, but hey, the law is the law!

                      Even more important than this concern, however, is the concern for ethical business practices.  Using a Dolby logo on your deliverables without paying for licensed encoder is wrong.  Not to mention very misleading to your clients.  However, you also said:

                      for commercial purposes, this free method is not recomended.  However, for non-commercial, private use, there is nothing wrong, or unethical about creating AC3 files for free

                      Using free and open-source tools, I whole-heartedly agree!  Please consider making the above statement a disclaimer at the beginning of your tutorial.

                       

                      More perspective.  Neil and Jim are businessmen who make their living by providing their clients with quality products.  When a client sees the Dolby Digital logo on a delivered DVD, that client must be able to rest assured that the audio has been mastered and encoded to Dolby's stringent quality standards.  (The analogous video situation would be THX-certified DVD or BD discs).  I'm sure Neil and Jim wanted to make it clear that commercial entities can't afford to put their reputations at risk, or their livelihood, by using something other than fully-licensed versions of Dolby encoders.

                       

                      I'm a big believer in open-source software, licensed under the GNU.  One just has to be careful how they are used in commercial endeavors.  For personal use, there aren't any such concerns, IMO.

                       

                      -Jeff

                      • 8. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                        Terrachild Community Member

                        Thanks Jeff, for the voice of reason, and for carefully reading my disclaimer.  I tried to take your advice and put the disclaimer at the top of the AC3 tutorial, but alas, there is no edit button for it anymore.  It appears I can only edit my last response.  I'm sure after that ridiculously long response by me, people get the point now.

                         

                        I just wanted some positive feedback after the time spent on the tutorial, not a wet blanket.

                         

                        Of course I don't know the actual percentage of non-commercial work done, so that 99% was a bit of hyperbole.  I bet it's pretty high though.  Most people buy premiere for home use.  I bet the percentage of FCP users doing comercial work is much higher.  That should change.  I think the cross-platform nature of Premiere, couple with its integration to other Adobe products, makes it unmatched.

                         

                        However, I spent years working in the entertainment industry, in Hollywood, and those people are like religious fundamentalists when it comes to Macs.  I can't tell you how many times I discussed PC's only to be met with visible nervousness, as if even discussing the matter with me might infect them, and/or their Macs with some kind of virus.  The Mac only nature of FCP is probably a source of security to them.  Cross-platform to them probably sounds like two female impersonators swapping shoes.  Good look making inroads into that industry Adobe.  Maybe dynamic link is the key to sell them.

                        • 9. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                          Jeff Bellune CommunityMVP

                          I tried to take your advice and put the disclaimer at the top of the AC3 tutorial, but alas, there is no edit button for it anymore.

                          Done.

                          • 10. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                            JSS1138 Community Member
                            Using a Dolby logo on your deliverables without paying for licensed encoder is wrong.

                             

                            Just to add some further clarification, using a licensed encoder is a separate thing from entering into a Trademark agreement.  The first is expected for all users of Dolby Digital.  The second is optional (only necessary if you want to use the logo.)

                            • 11. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                              JSS1138 Community Member

                              ****Disclaimer****

                              For commercial purposes, this free method is not recomended.  However, for non-commercial, private use, there is nothing wrong, or unethical about creating AC3 files for free!

                               

                              I would disagree.  Even for personal use, there is an ethical matter to consider.  People will do it, I'm sure.  Hell, even I watch free movies online sometimes.

                               

                              I will leave it to each individuals conscience to determine which course to follow.  But it is still wrong, and I feel it important for anyone using this method to be aware of that fact.

                              • 12. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                                Harm Millaard Community Member
                                I feel it important for anyone using this method to be aware of that fact.

                                 

                                I feel it is even more important that your PPBM results are shared among us.

                                • 13. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                                  Terrachild Community Member

                                  Harm, you're a man of few words.  I like your style.

                                  • 14. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                                    Diamond Community Member

                                    Very many thanks for an interesting and informative tutorial - while I had come to many of the same conclusions as you did, your workflow is better.

                                    • 15. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                                      the_wine_snob Community Member

                                      Thanks for locating this old tutorial for me. I had been looking for it for some time now, as the 5.1 SS question comes up, from time to time, and my searches had come up empty.

                                       

                                      While I use, and highly recommend the Minnetonka Audio SurCode DD 5.1 SS Encoder plug-in, there are others, who are looking for another solution.

                                       

                                      Appreciated,

                                       

                                      Hunt

                                       

                                      PS - Now that the forum Search has been fixed, it would probably have been easier the next time - but you saved my having to do so.

                                       

                                      PPS - Though I will probably link to this in the future, I have never used the methods outlined, so there is a big disclaimer on my part.

                                      • 16. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                                        Richard M Knight CommunityMVP

                                        I convert 6 mono channels to 5.1 all the time. For the sub channel put it on the time line twice, send one to centre and sub and the other to just centre but put the invert effect on that track. that will cancel out the centre feed from the first track. Just make sure that you keep the levels the same.

                                         

                                        Richard Knight

                                        • 17. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                                          Diamond Community Member

                                          Hi Richard

                                           

                                          By "Sub", I take it you refer to the LFE channel? Why do you put it on the timeline twice and does this mean you actually have seven tracks on the timeline?

                                           

                                          D

                                          • 18. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                                            Richard M Knight CommunityMVP

                                            Yes sorry I used the wrong term I meant LFE.

                                             

                                            As you know you can't send a mono track to just the LFE so to get round this limitation send it to centre and turn the LFE send to max. This will give you the feed to the LFE but you will have an unwanted signal going to the centre. To loose this unwanted signal send the same mono feed to just the centre but phase invert the track using audio 'invert' effect. This will cancel out this centre feed.

                                             

                                            I film classical music dvds and my sound mixer gives me the surround mix as 6 mono tracks from his Sadie LRX. I take these tracks and put them on their own timeline as follows.

                                             

                                            1  Left                   sent to    Left

                                            2  Right                 sent to    Right

                                            3  Surround Left     sent to    Surround Left

                                            4  Surround Right   sent to    Surround  Right

                                            5  Centre               sent to    Centre

                                            6  LFE                  sent to     Centre and LFE

                                            7  LFE                  sent  to    Centre with 'Invert'

                                             

                                            I then export to a 5.1 wav file that I then use as the master sound track for my edit.

                                             

                                            I know it is not accepted as correct to use the LFE for anything other than effects but we got complaints from our dvd customers that their LFE meter wasn't moving on low organ pedal notes. It was easier to put a little on that track than try to explain why it should not be needed!

                                             

                                            Richard Knight

                                            • 19. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                                              Diamond Community Member

                                              I see. That does sound like an excellent strategy although in the original tutorial Terraknight shoed us how to extract the LFE and set it up as such in the 5.1 premiere timeline as follows:

                                               

                                              ============================================

                                              Select the file "Mastered LFE.wav" in the project tab.  Now click on Clip>Audio Options>Source Channel Mappings..., now under "Track Format" select 5.1, and repeatedly click the Channel tile until the Bass Clef appears.

                                               

                                              It should look like this:

                                               

                                              Tutorial 3 Help 5.jpg

                                               

                                              You just converted your mono LFE file into a virtual 5.1 surround file, with the LFE audio only on the LFE channel.  This is the only way to achieve this in Premiere.

                                               

                                               

                                              =======================================

                                               

                                              I think this has the possible advantage of being able to master the LFE exclusively in Soundbooth or Audition. Thanks for the insight, nice to speak to fellow professionals as 5.1 mixes are a rarity where I live :-)

                                               

                                              Dave

                                              • 20. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                                                Terrachild Community Member

                                                Glad people are still finding this tutorial useful.

                                                The 'invert' trick to get around the problem that Knight mentioned with the LFE placement will work, but it is not a 'clean' solution.

                                                I recommend you stick with my method.

                                                • 21. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                                                  Diamond Community Member

                                                  What do you think of this. I am a documentary producer therefore my requirements differ from Richard's whose focus is on re-creating the feel of a concert whereas mine is to lend interest and dimension to a soundtrack.  Usually I am  taking a Music Track, Voice Over and sound effects to the 5.1 mix and I've settled on the following -

                                                   

                                                  All mastered as mono tracks

                                                   

                                                  L - Left track of stereo music Score + front FX sent to Front Left (Primary mix down with FX panned to maximise spatial feel)

                                                  R - Right track etc. to Front Right

                                                  C- Voice Over

                                                  Ls - Rear Left as Mono

                                                  Rs - Rear Right as mono

                                                  LFE - All bass effects

                                                   

                                                  This is the only way I can think of to get the music where I want it without using stereo track for the L & R front channels.

                                                   

                                                  Dave

                                                  • 22. Re: Tutorial: Surround sound mastering with only Premiere and Soundbooth
                                                    Vijay_usa

                                                    You are doing great work. I can use Audacity to make 5.1 file. But I have to do it repetitvely. I have three folders. One has 500 stereo files good for L, R channel. Second folder contains another 500 stereo files good for C, LFE. Third forlder again 500 stereo files good for SL, SR. Is there any way a computer program can pick them in order and make 500, 5.1 files. Batchprocessing?