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1. Re: Production Premium 4-Making Dolby Digital 5.1 Discs in Encore
Jeff Bellune Feb 5, 2010 4:32 PM (in response to BJBBJB1)Your $200 full package editor is most likely not Dolby logo-certified.
That means when you master your disc and have it replicated, you can't
legally include the Dolby Digital logo on the packaging. You can't
include the logo in the disc packaging or on the disc if your burn the
discs yourself, either.
For a business, especially a DVD Authoring house, logo certification is
very important, whether it's Dolby Digital, DTS or any other licensed
technology.
-Jeff
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2. Re: Production Premium 4-Making Dolby Digital 5.1 Discs in Encore
BJBBJB1 Feb 5, 2010 6:25 PM (in response to Jeff Bellune)Thanks for that.....however on the video side, my projects are for personal use.
I am very sensitive to copyright and logo issues being involved in music, photos, and video.
Can I assume correctly that I have to purchase the plug-in even if for personal use?
If so, are there any recommendations? Any one better than others? Does Adobe offer one or are they all third party?
Are there different prices based on different uses?
After install, does it just add an option in Encore or does it add another step to the video workflow?
Thanks,
BJBBJB1 -
3. Re: Production Premium 4-Making Dolby Digital 5.1 Discs in Encore
Giorgio1957 Feb 6, 2010 3:34 AM (in response to BJBBJB1)Personally I use Minnetonka since I used Premiere Pro and EncoreDVD 1.0, and, as Jeff says, is not a 200$ plug-in.
As far as I know you can use it three time freely as demo in PPro .xx and Encore (automatically) will not trascode it, leaving as original.
Installed this, you'll have an option to mark in the Premiere audio panel.
If you want to take a look: www.minnetonkaaudio.com
Hope this helps
Ciao
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4. Re: Production Premium 4-Making Dolby Digital 5.1 Discs in Encore
BJBBJB1 Feb 6, 2010 7:11 AM (in response to BJBBJB1)Giorgio,
Thanks, that also helps. Somehow I missed this older thread when I was searching that expresses the same frustration I had and have and also provides some additional discussion:
http://forums.adobe.com/message/1807771#1807771
I assume the discussion also applies to PP4? Between the comments here (thanks to you both) and this thread, I think I am almost there. I do think that there should be a "non-business" license for personal use like many other consumer NLE's provide but I understand that PP is not designed for that user-base.
After reading through all this, I think the step-by step I was looking for is:
1) Run 3 projects throught the trial version included in PP by selecting that codec from within PP (not encore as I understand it). Then send the project to encore that (based on the comment above) will STILL not make a DD 5.1 disc for these trial versions.
2) On the 4th project, follow the link to buy the add-in for $249 as you get a discount on the "click-thru". THEN, Encore will burn a 5.1 project???
3) An option will appear within PP that I can select and it will encode DD 5.1 if I select it.
4) Encore THEN will just accept this rendered video and DD 5.1 encoded audio?
I guess the only thing I am still not 100% clear on is Adobe keeps talking about the integration between PP and Encore..and how you can send things "directly" in version 4.....If I go straight to Encore from PP without encoding, does Encore pickup on the fact that I have this plug-in and make a DD 5.1 or must I do it in PP?
Again, thanks to all for their help here.
BJBJB1
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5. Re: Production Premium 4-Making Dolby Digital 5.1 Discs in Encore
Jeff Bellune Feb 6, 2010 7:52 AM (in response to BJBBJB1)For multichannel audio, you must export the audio separately from Pr, and then import the multichannel audio file into En. If you're using Dynamic Link to send your Pr sequence to En, then you'll need to replace the sequence audio in the En timeline with the imported multichannel audio file.
-Jeff
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6. Re: Production Premium 4-Making Dolby Digital 5.1 Discs in Encore
BJBBJB1 Feb 6, 2010 8:50 AM (in response to BJBBJB1)Jeff,
Thanks...
For someone that is usually GIVING friends the help in CS4 and LR, and in my current NLE, I must admit it is frustrating being an egg at the wrong end of the learning curve with PP and Encore....
I will fight through it and figure it out.....and I appreciate the patience. I guess it makes me understand how people that don't know CS4 and LR feel that I help out!!
With my limited understanding, I found a tutorial for PP titled "Create a 5.1 surround audio sequence" here:
http://www.adobe.com/ap/tips/prepsurround/
However I could not find a similar tutorial on the encoding process.
So if I already have a 5.1 surround sequence in PP per the above, AND I am utilizing that sequence as I perfrom my edits, transitions, fades, etc....applying all of those in lock-step to my video tracks and my 5.1 audio sequence....
Do I then understand that I would NOT have to replace my sequence in PP, but indeed, I would need to export this 5.1 sequence audio track separately to Encore for encoding?
And of coures all of this assumes that I have purchased the plug-in and have checked the appropriate magic box...
Thanks,
BJBBJB1
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7. Re: Production Premium 4-Making Dolby Digital 5.1 Discs in Encore
Jeff Bellune Feb 6, 2010 9:24 AM (in response to BJBBJB1)Do I then understand that I would NOT have to replace my sequence in PP, but indeed, I would need to export this 5.1 sequence audio track separately to Encore for encoding?
Almost. You would keep your sequence as edited in Pr. Then export just the audio portion from Pr using the SurCode encoder. That will produce a 5.1 AC3 audio file. Import that audio file into En and make sure it's set to Don't Transcode in Encore's Project panel. Use the 5.1 audio file to replace the audio in the En timeline.
-Jeff
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8. Re: Production Premium 4-Making Dolby Digital 5.1 Discs in Encore
Giorgio1957 Feb 6, 2010 9:34 AM (in response to BJBBJB1)As I'm undertanding (sorry but being italian, I've sometimes problems in translation) I hope this will help:
-In PP, you import all your clips (audio or not) and, of course your dolby files (example .ac3)
-when everything is done (effects, transitions, etc.), PP'll encode your project giving you one customed video (as you wish) and your dolby audio file.
If you have put in this project some stereo audio file, PP will give you anyway a Dolby encoded file (it will be a "pseudo" dolby).
- Now you can:
- import them in Encore as assets dragging them in the timeline later
-import them as timeline, so you'll already find them in the new timeline
-use DinamicLink from Encore (File\Project\DinamicLink\import a Premiere project) as Jeff says
If you already have a dolby audio file imported in Encore, you'll choose the audio option "do not Trascode" so the audio project you've created in PP will not be modified and you'll output a brand new Dolby audio file.
Hope this will help you
Sorry in advance if I missed any in translation
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9. Re: Production Premium 4-Making Dolby Digital 5.1 Discs in Encore
Giorgio1957 Feb 6, 2010 9:36 AM (in response to Giorgio1957)Ops, Jeff has already answered.
I know, he's faster than me
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10. Re: Production Premium 4-Making Dolby Digital 5.1 Discs in Encore
Bill Hunt Feb 6, 2010 11:20 AM (in response to BJBBJB1)I believe that all questions have been answered.
However, I have one "cost-saving" tip. Do not buy the Minnetonka SurCode DD 5.1 SS encoder plug-in from the Minnetonka site. They have a special price just for PrPro users. To access this, choose Export>Adobe Media Encoder (exact syntax and location differ by version number), and choose the settings for the MPEG AC3 DD 5.1 SS (the same one that you use for your 3 trial Exports), and beside the Audio CODEC (with SurCode for Dolby Digital), there is an Options button. Click it and you will be transported to a pop-up window for SurCode. Buy from there, and you will save ~ US$50 over the price on the site. This is a special price just for PrPro users. Last two times that I purchased, the price was ~ US$150, but it might have changed slightly.
Also, the main cost of that plug-in encoder goes to the licensing fees paid to Dolby Labs. Minnetonka makes very little on the PrPro sale. When I bought my second copy, I asked about "additional licenses," and Minnetonka "opened up their books for me." They make about US$30 per sale, and for that price, they offer excellent customer support. Price is the same for 1, or for 100. I liked it so much, that I bought a second copy, just to have that on my laptop too. Over the years, I've gotten much more than my money's worth out of them. I also use their DTX stand-alone encoder too, though not as constantly as the DD 5.1 SS.
One little caveat - when you set up your Project/Sequence, you will want a 5.1 Master to effectively use the SurCode encoder.
Addressing some of the "other" DD 5.1 SS encoders. Only a very few are certified, as Jeff points out. Besides the "certification" aspect, the results vary across the board from absolutely horrible to passable, for most of the un-certified ones.
There are also some workarounds using a handful of other programs (mostly freeware), but that workflow would quickly exceed my US$150 in a heartbeat. False economy for me.
Good luck,
Hunt
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11. Re: Production Premium 4-Making Dolby Digital 5.1 Discs in Encore
BJBBJB1 Feb 6, 2010 12:29 PM (in response to Jeff Bellune)Jeff Bellune wrote:
Use the 5.1 audio file to replace the audio in the En timeline.
-Jeff
Thanks to all....my question is answered......I guess you have to be very careful that all the transitions between the audio and video line up after you replace my "5.1 sequence audio" with the "5.1 encoded audio". I've done this before with some outboard sound board and audio mix/editing and have had issues with lining up video and audio.
I've got that even with the encoder (which I am just going to buy from within PP, thanks Bill H), and even if I have a 5.1 sequence setup, I need to run the encoder and export the 5.1 mix. So either within PP, or within Encore I need to replace my audio track with this newly encoded 5.1 track. If I replace from within PP, I can use dynamic link to send to encore and I am good to go. Or import the video and audio into En, my audio will be stereo, delete the audio and replace it with the encoded 5.1 audio.
Am I correct that after this point I cannot or should not do any additional editing with video or audio transitions from within PP? So if I want to make subsequent edits, I go back to my saved pre-5.1 encoded project, make the changes, and then I need to re-encode my 5.1 audio, etc. etc.?
It sure would be nice if this was more seemless....I guess this is one downside to this move to PP, all the rest that I have seen is upside.
Thanks,
BJBBJB1
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12. Re: Production Premium 4-Making Dolby Digital 5.1 Discs in Encore
Bill Hunt Feb 6, 2010 12:53 PM (in response to BJBBJB1)So either within PP, or within Encore I need to replace my audio track with this newly encoded 5.1 track. If I replace from within PP, I can use dynamic link to send to encore and I am good to go. Or import the video and audio into En, my audio will be stereo, delete the audio and replace it with the encoded 5.1 audio.
With ADL (Adobe Dynamic Link), you will NOT be able to "transfer/link" your DD 5.1 SS Sequence to Encore. It will be back to the old-fashioned way - Export from PrPro, and then Import to Encore.
However, if you have a 5.1 Master Sequence in PrPro, and both the Audio and Video are edited, as you wish. All you would have to do is Export the Audio as DD 5.1 SS AC3. Now, Jeff will be a better source for this next step, as he knows ADL in CS4 far better than I do, but... In Encore, just Delete your existing Audio, and replace it with the Exported AC3 file. The Transitions, and other editing will be the same (unless you alter those), but the encoding will now be in DD 5.1 SS AC3. I'd like to hear Jeff's take on this, due the the use of ADL initially. I do not want to get you into a mess, by mixing ADL links and other Exported Assets.
Also, you will very likely want to go into Audio Mixer in PrPro, and make adjustments for the surround stage in each Audio Track. One of the things that I end up doing often is "creating faux 5.1," by taking a duplicate of say a music Clip and placing it in alignment on another Audio Track. Now, going back to Audio Mixer, I'll control the spatial aspects of the now two Clips on separate Audio Tracks. The original will be biased towards the front channels with probably a little Center and the dupe to the rear channels with no Center. Then, I'll usually apply a bit of Delay and Reverb Effects to the dupe Clip, which will have been located to the rear channels. The levels of these Effects will be dictated by the "space" that I wish to create in 5.1. Now, we get to do faux 5.1, but in the music industry, such mixing is VERY heavily frowned upon, when doing a re-mix of none 5.1 original recordings.
Hope that this is helpful,
Hunt
PS - as for the seamless transport via ADL between the programs, as soon as AC3 DD 5.1 SS is added, it WILL be seamless. Maybe CS5?
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13. Re: Production Premium 4-Making Dolby Digital 5.1 Discs in Encore
BJBBJB1 Feb 6, 2010 1:17 PM (in response to Bill Hunt)Bill,
I do EXACTLY what you are doing with your audio with my other NLE with good results. The key in my mind is to stay subtle. I was going to use that tutorial link I mentioned earlier to help setup my 5.1 sequence in PP. I use my main video stereo tracks and music tracks and mix into a faux 5.1 surround stage. Or even with stereo music, I'll pan a little ambient music into the surrounds.
I will wait to hear from Jeff his additional instructions RE: exporting.
Thanks X2 again!
BJBBJB1
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14. Re: Production Premium 4-Making Dolby Digital 5.1 Discs in Encore
Bill Hunt Feb 7, 2010 11:03 AM (in response to BJBBJB1)Since I am still on EncoreDVD 2.0, and PrPro 2.0, I do not use ADL. That is a gray-area in my knowledge, as I still do things the "old-fashioned way," but it works fine. [Now, having to Export every bloody Sequence twice (Audio to AC3 and Video to either DV-AVI, or MPEG-2) is a bit of a hassle, but it DOES give me time to hang out in the fora, while the workstation crunches things... ] I know a few of the limitations with ADL and DD 5.1 SS, but certainly not all of them. That's why I'd love to hear Jeff's take, and read his warnings and instructions.
Good luck,
Hunt
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15. Re: Production Premium 4-Making Dolby Digital 5.1 Discs in Encore
BJBBJB1 Feb 7, 2010 7:47 PM (in response to Bill Hunt)Thanks. Can't wait for his pearls of wisdom!
I don't mind doing it "old school" though. I just want it to come out right!
BJBBJB1




