11 Replies Latest reply on Apr 17, 2010 1:45 PM by Steve Grisetti

    Premiere Elements 8, Canon 7D, Windows 7 PC - what am I doing wrong?!

    Ben_Darvill2

      I'd be extremely grateful if someone could help me solve a problem that seems to be impossible for me to fix at present.

       

      I am a stills photographer with no knowledge of video terminology, so if you could explain even the most basic things that would be great!

       

      I have:

      Canon 7D

      Adobe Premiere Elements 8

      Intel Core 2 Duo 1.83 Ghz

      3 GB RAM

      Windows 7 64 bit

       

      I have added, in an attempt to get this working:

      MPEG_Streamclip

      AVID DNxHD (recommended codec to use in mpeg_streamclip)

      CineForm Neo Scene

      Editing presets for Premiere Elements 8 supporting 24p, 25p, 50p and 60p (described here: http://forums.adobe.com/message/2694134#2694134)

       

      Okay - so hopefully that provides some background.

       

      My problem: Seemingly whatever I do, when I import a video and put it on the timeline, render by hitting enter and then press play, playback is jumpy/stuttering. Note that I can watch the movies on this PC just fine - smooth playback, even before I convert them using Neo Scene or MPEG Streamclip. But, when I put them on the timeline, render, and play - stuttering playback.

       

      I feel like I've read every forum thread about this out there, and had so many "oh, maybe that will work" moments, and yet still I can't get smooth preview playback in Premiere Elements 8.

       

      This happens with 1080x720 clips at 50 fps, which is what I'm trying to work with just now. Same problem with 1080x1920 at 25 fps.

       

      Any help you can give would be great.

       

      Ben

        • 1. Re: Premiere Elements 8, Canon 7D, Windows 7 PC - what am I doing wrong?!
          the_wine_snob Level 9

          You might get some useful info from the links in this ARTICLE. Be sure to see the replies from Richard Crook.

           

          Good luck,

           

          Hunt

          • 2. Re: Premiere Elements 8, Canon 7D, Windows 7 PC - what am I doing wrong?!
            the_wine_snob Level 9

            Here is another ARTICLE with links. I do not recall if these are covered in the first reply, or not.

             

            As for the playback, have you Rendered the Timeline - hitting Enter, so that the red line above the Clips turns green?

             

            Also, simple playback is totally different than being able to playback in an editor, as it is designed to edit the material and has done a great deal more to it, to get it ready, especially if the source is GOP to begin with, and the editor is frame-accurate.

             

            Good luck,

             

            Hunt

            • 3. Re: Premiere Elements 8, Canon 7D, Windows 7 PC - what am I doing wrong?!
              Ben_Darvill2 Level 1

              Dear Bill,

               

              Reading through all of these threads, which I have done, suggests that the stock response to this question is just to refer everyone back to all of these threads.

               

              Please note, I HAVE Neo Scene, MPEG Streamclip etc etc etc and I am rendering by hitting enter.

               

              I am after some advice over and above "you might like to search the forums".

               

              Thanks

               

              Ben

              • 4. Re: Premiere Elements 8, Canon 7D, Windows 7 PC - what am I doing wrong?!
                the_wine_snob Level 9
                I am after some advice over and above "you might like to search the forums".

                 

                 

                Ben,

                 

                Sorry to have let you down. What those articles are, is my having searched the forums for you. Yes, they do link to other threads, but they are a compilation of those many threads. I have also taken the time to gather source material from B&H Photo, and several other sources, to try and help users of 5D/7D cameras. Though I do not have any of these Canons (being a Nikon-guy), I have done as much heavy-lifting, as I can, for Canon users.

                 

                Good luck,

                 

                Hunt

                • 5. Re: Premiere Elements 8, Canon 7D, Windows 7 PC - what am I doing wrong?!
                  the_wine_snob Level 9

                  Here's a fresh THREAD on the PrPro forum. Seems that some users like Richard Crook's suggestions and Web site.

                   

                  Good luck,

                   

                  Hunt

                  • 6. Re: Premiere Elements 8, Canon 7D, Windows 7 PC - what am I doing wrong?!
                    John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                    >Intel Core 2 Duo

                     

                    A quick Google says the 7D uses H.264/MP4 codec for your HD files... and that takes a Quad Core CPU and AT LEAST 2 hard drives (you don't mention how many you have) so you have...

                     

                    Boot drive for all software

                    Data drive for everything else

                     

                    Optional is to have a Scratch drive for temp files

                     

                    I will eventually be using Canon HFS10 AVCHD files, and the computer I will build is listed on my notes page

                     

                    http://www.pacifier.com/~jtsmith/ADOBE.HTM

                    • 7. Re: Premiere Elements 8, Canon 7D, Windows 7 PC - what am I doing wrong?!
                      Mika Järvinen Level 1

                      Hey Ben!

                       

                      I have almost same bunch of toys including camera, rendering software and computer (AMD Athlon 64 x2 almost same megahertz and same amount of memory) and  I think I know what the problem is.

                       

                      We both need a faster computer. As happy I was when the custom presets were released, the truth is that editing FullHD material needs much faster cpu, more and faster memory, faster bus, etc...

                       

                      So I am stuck still with 720p 25fps, which seem to work best if you convert your 7D material with NeoScene or MpegStreamclip to a FullHD, non interlaced, 10bit footage. Then you import your converted footage to a HDV-720p preset and let the program render it one time. Remember also check the "Maximum Bith Depth"-option. Only after that I am able to somehow edit HD footage, but its still not playing as smooth it should, but it is editable. And you preserve the richness of the footage as well as you possibly can when editing 720p.

                       

                      There is no way I could do larger project FullHD with those wonderful custom settings, I have only tested that they seem to work well. I am just torturing my computer, myself and my family if using those presets. But please try HDV 720p preset, and let us know if that will work somehow for you. At least it still is the best solution for me.

                       

                      Mika Järvinen

                      • 8. Re: Premiere Elements 8, Canon 7D, Windows 7 PC - what am I doing wrong?!
                        Ben_Darvill2 Level 1

                        Many thanks for your help Mika,

                         

                        I think you're right - a faster PC is the only solution to get close to editing the HD footage even after conversion in Neoscene/MPEG streamclip.

                         

                        However, I have discovered two other things which I think readers of this thread should be aware of:

                         

                        1. Upon install, Premiere Elements 8 automatically enables "Auto-Analyser" which takes up a massive proportion of your CPU (if you have lots of media files already on your PC). Run Task Manager (Ctrl+Alt+Delete) to see if it is running on yours, guzzling up resources.

                         

                        To switch off (highly recommended!), open the 'Organiser', and go Edit>Preferences>General>Auto-Analyser Options

                        Switch OFF Run analyser on start up and then also Analyse all media in catalogue automatically. Your PC will breathe a sigh of relief!

                         

                        2. Real Proxy editing. I must admit I've tended to scan past discussions of proxy files because it sounds either complicated or a pain. This method however sounds straightforward. I've yet to try it on my machine, but it's worth a go:

                         

                        http://forums.adobe.com/thread/486598?tstart=0

                         

                        He writes:

                         

                        "

                        Whenever proxy editing is discussed here, reference always seems to be made to an FAQ outlining a method which doesn't really involve proper proxy files.  So I've devised a very simple method whereby actual proxy files are used for editing, then for the final render the real files are substituted.  I don't know whether I've simply not found a previous mention here of such a method, or whether my suggestion is actually original, but in case I've indeed come up with something new, I'll outline how it can be done.   And if it's old hat, please ignore!

                         

                        My reason for needing a proxy files method is that here at least, my quad core XP PC does not like using 720p files from my Panasonic GH1 in Premiere Elements 7.  It goes very slow and tends to hang when simply putting the clips on the timeline.  It's not too bad with full HD AVCHD, but even so it's obvious (and well known) that such footage adds a big load to the system.  Perhaps in the next version Adobe will add 'Cuda' support so that some of the load can be handled by the Nvidia card, but meanwhile, working with AVCHD can become a problem even on a reasonably powerful system if the project is complex.

                         

                        So the idea is that I want to use lower-resolution mpeg2 files for the editing, and then use the real AVCHD files just for the final output.

                         

                        I have to admit that to use this method, you need to use a third party program to create the proxy files in the first place.  There is at least one freeware AVCHD > MPEG2 program "Free AVCHD Converter" at http://www.koyotesoft.com/indexEn.html which seems to be ok but a bit slow.  Elecard also do AVCHD conversion software, and several other programs are available - personally I've found that Cyberlink's MediaShow Espresso does a very fast job on a system with Nvidia Cuda, and it's very simple to use.  Whatever software you use, it has to be able to take the batch of files you want to work with and convert them to files in the desired format with the same name but a different extension.  Using MediaShow, for instance, to convert the AVCHD files here, the source files are named (by the camera) 00000.MTS, 00001.MTS, 00002.MTS etc, and the converted versions are call 00000.mpg, 00001.mpg, 00002.mpg and so on.  Remember that you won't be using the transcoded files for final output, so if their quality is a bit reduced it doesn't matter.

                         

                        Method:-

                         

                        1 - Using the third party software, create proxy versions of your original.  The converted files should be in a format the PE7 can handle (of course) and which will not impose a big processing load on your PC, while providing adequate quality when you are editing.  Here, 720x576 mpeg2 16:9 is a good compromise between appearance and performance.

                         

                        2 - Now start up Premiere Elements, and choose a project preset which would be what you would use with the normal files, not the proxy files.  Import the proxy files, not the real ones, and edit in the usual way.

                         

                        3 - When you've finished editing, save the project in the usual way and exit.

                         

                        Now you need to replace the proxy files in the project file with the real ones in order to output the completed project.

                         

                        4 - Open the .prel file for your project using the windows "Notepad" program (or even better, a program like "Notepad++" which is a more powerful freeware alternative that will do the replacement much quicker if the project is complex).

                         

                        5 - Using the "Replace" function in Notepad (or alternative software) replace the extension of the proxy files with the extension of the real files.  In my case I'd be replacing .mpg with .MTS so that the project will use the original AVCHD files.  Now save and exit (it would be prudent to use "save as" so that you are not over-writing your edited project in case something is amiss).

                         

                        6 - Then open the de-proxied project, and use "share" to output as required in the usual way.  Here I find that some kind of preliminary processing tends to happen before you see much movement of the progress bar - probably PE7 is having to redo some stuff that it did with the proxy files now that it "sees" the real files in the project.  This is a situation where the freeware utility "Bmem" - http://badmofo.org/bmem/ - is very handy because it shows you that something's going on, and it takes up very little space on screen.  I have it running all the time and couldn't live without it!

                         

                        This procedure has been tested a couple of times on my system with fairly simple test projects and seems to work.  Your Mileage May Vary - I would strongly suggest you try it first on a test project before you commit a lot of time and effort to using it "for real"."

                         

                        All the best

                         

                        Ben

                        • 9. Re: Premiere Elements 8, Canon 7D, Windows 7 PC - what am I doing wrong?!
                          Steve Grisetti Adobe Community Professional

                          Instructions for doing proxy editing in Premiere Elements have, of course, also been in the FAQs to the right of this forum for the past year.

                          http://forums.adobe.com/message/1763853#1763853

                          • 10. Re: Premiere Elements 8, Canon 7D, Windows 7 PC - what am I doing wrong?!
                            Ben_Darvill2 Level 1

                            Oh, yes Steve, of course. Although, of course, your proxy method, of course, isn't as good as the method I linked to, of course, is it...  Ben