1 2 3 4 Previous Next 240 Replies Latest reply on Jun 21, 2012 1:58 PM by Harm Millaard Go to original post Branched to a new discussion.
      • 40. Re: What PC to build?
        Bill Gehrke Most Valuable Participant

        Rowby, here is my first cut at my tuning list for Win 7 64 Pro

        You may have to make your own decisions on each of these services based on your usage of your computer.  My goals were to set this up as a second (actually third) almost only editing and really primarily benchmarking machine.

        • 41. Re: What PC to build?
          acgold777 Level 1

          Note that many people have reported problems with the LG GGW-H20L BD burner disappearing under Win7, never to return.  I'm one of them.  It worked perfectly under Vista 64 but none of the fixes proposed on the web have worked for me.  Device Manager reports a problem with the driver but the Microsoft troubleshooters say they can't find a better one.

           

          Fixes proposed on the web and in various forums include uninstalling and letting the system reinstall, hacking the registry, running the Microsoft Auto-Fix program and disabling AHCI on the mobo.  The drive is not listed in the Win7 compatibility list and the LG website includes drivers and SW only for XP and Vista.

           

          Others are recommending the Pioneer BDR-205.  I've just ordered one.

          • 42. Re: What PC to build?
            Bill Gehrke Most Valuable Participant

            acgold777 wrote:

             

            Note that many people have reported problems with the LG GGW-H20L BD burner disappearing under Win7, never to return.  I'm one of them.  It worked perfectly under Vista 64 but none of the fixes proposed on the web have worked for me.  Device Manager reports a problem with the driver but the Microsoft troubleshooters say they can't find a better one.

             

            Fixes proposed on the web and in various forums include uninstalling and letting the system reinstall, hacking the registry, running the Microsoft Auto-Fix program and disabling AHCI on the mobo.  The drive is not listed in the Win7 compatibility list and the LG website includes drivers and SW only for XP and Vista.

             

            Strange, That is what I have and never any sign of a problem and I imagine that I have burned well over a hundred successful DVD's and a few assorted BR's.  Here is what Device Manager reports for me.

             

            LG-BG.jpg

            • 43. Re: What PC to build?
              acgold777 Level 1

              Thanks for posting that, Bill.  It's the same driver mine shows.  Hmmm....

               

              Here's another thought.  I think the drive is connected to an IDE controller, not SATA.  Could this be the problem?  All the Device Manager data talks about IDE and I'm pretty sure the burner is not connected to any of the internal SATA ports on the mobo.  But if that's the issue, why did it work ok in Vista but not Win7?  And do you know if there's a setting I can tweak if Explorer cannot see the drive?  Or should I bite the bullet, kill a Hard drive and use that port for the burner?

               

              Thoughts, anyone?  This is puzzling.

              • 44. Re: What PC to build?
                Bill Gehrke Most Valuable Participant

                Adam, can you see your burner in your BIOS?  You are confusing me with this statement

                 

                acgold777 wrote:

                 

                I think the drive is connected to an IDE controller, not SATA. 

                 

                IDE is the old 40 pin Parallel ATA interface and that would be impossible to connect to this drive which is SATA.  Are you sure it is even connected to anything?  I am not sure what motherboard you currently have but if I remember right you also had an X7DWA-N is that correct?  I believe that to use SATA ports 5 and 6 you have to have ACHI enabled.  Now it is not going to be easy to enable ACHI.  While I have heard of a few successful people enabling ACHI after you have Windows loaded it is not easily or normally do-able.  A sure way is to start all over and reload the OS and yes I know that was the last thing you wanted to hear.

                • 45. Re: What PC to build?
                  acgold777 Level 1

                  Yes, sorry, this is just me being stupid.  I opened up the box and it is the old Asus drive that is connected with a wide IDE cable.  The OS drive and the LG are connected via SATA to the SATA ports on the mobo (and yes, you remember correctly -- it is the X7DWA-N).

                   

                  I already have AHCI enabled; I went through that whole soap opera, including the BSOD and registry tweaks, a year ago.  So we had all six SATA ports working under Vista 64, but now under Win7 we're having the problem with the LG.  (It is connected to channel 2).  The Intel Matrix RAID storage manger does not at the moment see the drive at all, but I think it is because I've been messing around inside the case and did not properly re-seat the connector; Device Manager does not even see the drive either, but it used to.  Up until the last reboot I did have a blue flashing light on the LG, but not now.

                   

                  I'm on the Intel website now and I see they have an updated Matrix Storage Manager available; I'm going to try that.  In the meantime, all other thoughts are welcome.  Thanks for everything so far, Bill.

                   

                  EDIT:  Reseated the power cable (duh!) and drive powers up but same problem persists as before.  Downloaded and installed latest Intel Matrix Storage Manager found here http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Detail_Desc.aspx?agr=Y&DwnldID=17882&ProdId=2101&lang=eng

                  and lo and behold.  It works.

                   

                  Here's an interesting thread which discusses the problem, and from which I got the link:

                   

                  http://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=132422.0

                   

                  It theorizes that Win7's AHCI drivers are funny and should be replaced by Intel's.  Maybe so.  Ironically, it may have been the clean install of Win7, which everyone recommends over the "Upgrade" install, which did me in.  Formatting the OS HDD wiped out the Intel Matrix Storage Manager app, which was needed in order to see all the drives.  I'm not sure it was installing the newest version that helped, but just installing a version, period.

                   

                  Hope this helps others if they are having the same problem.

                  • 46. Re: What PC to build?
                    LaciG Level 1

                    Reading the thread (the first time), I put together (also using some of the 'Videoguys' suggestions) a plan for an editing 'workstation' to be used for editing HD hobby videos, and would appreciate any comment:

                    Thanks, LaciWorkstation.jpg

                    • 47. Re: What PC to build?
                      Harm Millaard Level 7

                      Skip the GTX-295, go for the GTX-470/480

                       

                      Get a better PSU: eXtreme Power Supply Calculator Pro v2.5

                       

                      No floppy needed. Have you seen a shop that still sells them?

                       

                      Have a look at some of my articles, like

                       

                      Adobe Forums: A PC buying guide for NLE (mainly Intel)

                       

                      Adobe Forums: Storage rules for an editing rig. Some...

                       

                      and various others.

                      • 48. Re: What PC to build?
                        LaciG Level 1

                        Thanks! Started reading your publications...

                        • 49. Re: What PC to build?
                          LaciG Level 1

                          Read the two articles: they are very useful. In the meanwhile, I have two more questions: 1. What about a solid state 'drive'  for system 'disk' (I was told that they are faster, but rather small - and probably expensive). 2. This is about the case: Antec P183 looks good, has 120 mm top fan, 120 mm rear fan and 120 mm lower chamber fan. Is this enough for the system described above, or do I need the P193 with 2 x 140 mm top fans, 120 mm rear fan, 120 mm lower chamber fan and a 200 mm side fan? How does one calculate the needed fan 'farm' based on the power dissipation of the system? Also, would a slight over-clocking change the picture (other than an extra CPU fan)? Thanks, Laci.

                          • 50. Re: What PC to build?
                            Harm Millaard Level 7

                            First the case: neither is very good, because both are too limited in width to allow a large CPU cooler to be installed. Maximum height of a CPU cooler is 140 mm and that precludes the use of modern coolers like the Noctua NH-D14. I would always opt for a big tower, because of the easier installation, the better expansion capabilities, better cable management and better cooling capabilities.

                             

                            SSD's as a boot disk will probably shave of a couple of seconds from the boottime. For instance reducing it from 70 seconds to 65 seconds. It will also make the loading of applications like PR faster, reducing the load time from 6 seconds to 2 seconds as an example.

                             

                            Look at the time required for POST, the staggered spin-up of the disks, the initializing of raid BIOS and network connections, before Windows starts to load and realize that a SSD will have no impact on all that time at all, and that is by far the largest wait. Realize further that a SSD has no impact at all on the editing performance of your machine, that you normally only boot your machine once per day and load PR once per day, and the question is justified whether a 80 GB SSD for € 192 (current local prices) is worth it in comparison to a 1 TB F3 for € 60. Per GB a SSD is € 2.40 and the F3 is € 0.06, about 40 times more expensive. And the performance gain will be negligent.

                             

                            For notebooks it may well be worth considering, because there is usuallly only 1 disk, no raid controller to initialize, no staggered spin up and multiple times per day to boot again and battery use, but not for an editing workstation.

                             

                            All those  claimed high read and write speeds are great on paper, but does it make  your editing faster and more efficient? Testing has not proven that to be the case.

                             

                            It  all ranks under pennywise, pound foolish IMO.

                            • 51. Re: What PC to build?
                              Harm Millaard Level 7

                              In addition to my previous post, let's assume you plan a new system and are considering:

                               

                              SSD 80 GB for OS & programs and 2 x 1 TB F3 disks. Total cost at current local prices € 192 + 2 x € 60 = € 312

                               

                              The alternative is 5 x 1 TB F3 disks, one for OS & programs / page file and 4 x Raid5. Cost 5 x € 60 = € 300

                               

                              You will gain a significant performance boost during editing, as well as more storage space from the alternative at less cost. QED.

                              • 52. Re: What PC to build?
                                LaciG Level 1

                                Harm, Thanks for the advice. I haven't really considered the SSD (a salesperson suggested at Fry's which was already suspicious) but it is good to know for sure.  The last 15 years of my professional life, before I retired last year, I worked for a design house and after that for Intel as a quality/reliability engineer using my physics background. I (used to ) know a lot about device physiscs/reliability but next to nothing about design and the computer inner workings - or about RAID for that matter. I got the more serious movie making and computer building 'bug' may be a year ago, and dived into it more seriously just a couple of months ago.

                                 

                                As for the computer case, I will look further (I liked the smooth design of the P183/193 mostly probably due to my age   -  I do not like all the flashing lights, etc. on a computer case). But what the most important for designing my new computer is after my 7 year old Dell Dimension (and a first I will build myself) is the PC 'architecture': Processor, mother board, graphic card, and the storage. The first three have been decided (after your last reply), the only remaining issue is the storage.

                                 

                                So, I read your tutorial and the discussion chain ("To RAID, or not to RAID...") and a good article in Wikipedia, yesterday. I like your advice on the 5 x F3 1 TB disk (one for OS/programs/page file, and the other 4 for all else in a RAID 5 configuration). Please, let me know if I am right: 1. The OS (and the user) will see the four disks in RAID as one drive. (From Wikipedia.)  2. The data can be restored after one disk failure. (Automatically?)  3. I do not need any extra hardware for RAID 5 - the OS will do it for me. 4. I can ('manually') back up the 'system drive' to an external drive periodically. (I do it right now with my old computer.)  5. However, this arrangement doesn't make it possible to use some of the other suggestions in the discussion after your article (use separate disks for projects and indexed/conformed files; for cache, previews; for media, etc. Is this a real disadvantage?

                                 

                                Please, consider that presently I am using PrE 7.0 on a 7 year old computer (with regular 'manual' backups with Acronis) and only for hobby (family/trips, etc.) With the new computer, I would like to edit AVCHD movies taken with Panasonic AG-HMC150 (my 'retirement present' for myself ) but still for hobby at least for the time being. With this new computer for editing I would like to use PrPRO CS 5 (and may be ENCORE CS5).

                                 

                                P.S. 1. What is F3? 2. I like that you have a 'space' between the numerical quantity and the unit unlike in most manuals and Internet comments nowadays (If I search for 1 TB on Google, it asks me: Did you mean 1TB?" Of course not! It might save a few bits but this is not even conforming with the American NIST style manual's suggestions (http://physics.nist.gov/Pubs/SP811/sec07.html).

                                • 53. Re: What PC to build?
                                  Dave514 Level 1

                                  LaciG & Harm:

                                  As to your computer case I lean toward an Antec 1200. It's large lots of space and plenty of fans. What say you Harm?

                                  • 54. Re: What PC to build?
                                    Harm Millaard Level 7

                                    F3 is the shorthand version of the Samsung Spinpoint F3 hard disk, one of the fastest and quietest disks on the market.

                                     

                                    It is in a different price bracket, but you get what you pay for and there is nothing better than the Lian Li PC-A77. Fabulous space, build quality and without all those ostentatious lights. The Antec 1200 is a good alternative, but since it is a gamers case, it includes all the LED fans and the transparent side panel. In comparison to the Lian Li is has no ventilation opening for the PSU, it misses the drive cage for 3 x 3.5" disks at the rear top, and misses a 1394 firewire port on the front and has only two USB ports versus 4 with the Lian Li.