18 Replies Latest reply on Dec 13, 2010 5:01 PM by Colin Brougham

    Third Party Encoders

    fnub

      the Media Encoder is not performing up to par so I am looking for a professional third party encoder. Anyone have any suggestions? Which one

      and why? Thanx in advance.

        • 1. Re: Third Party Encoders
          shooternz Level 6

          Whats the issue with the AME?

          • 2. Re: Third Party Encoders
            dradeke Adobe Employee

            My first suggestion is to dive into AME and see if you can solve the problem through your settings.  For the most part, AME provides very good output and most people are very happy with it.  Share what your goals are here in this thread and I bet you'll get a lot of help.  Screen shots and specific settings will help everyone.

             

            Barring that, most people look at Sorenson Squeeze or Telestream Episode as products with a lot of control.  There are also some decent free encoders out there, though I've never used them myself.

             

            Hope this helps a bit...

             

            Dennis

            • 3. Re: Third Party Encoders
              Jim_Simon Level 8

              There are two very good free options.

               

              HC Encoder for MPEG 2 produces noticeably better results than the included MainConcept encoder Adobe licenses for it's products, especially when used in the more professional CQ mode.

               

              Handbrake for MPEG 4 (H.264) uses the generally acknowledged superior x264 encoder, and also comes with a CQ mode.

              1 person found this helpful
              • 4. Re: Third Party Encoders
                Orytek Level 1

                How do you emplement a 3rd party encoder into the workflow?

                If say I wanted to use Squeeze, would I have to output through AME first, encode it and then re-encode it with Squeeze or is there a way

                to export it after editing it without double compression?

                • 5. Re: Third Party Encoders
                  Colin Brougham Level 6

                  How do you emplement a 3rd party encoder into the workflow?

                   

                  Why, it's funny that you should ask that! --> Adobe Forums: How to frameserve from Premiere CS5?

                   

                  We're soon to have a robust and full-functioning frameserver plug-in for use in Premiere Pro CS5 and AME CS5. An old, out-of-date plug-in has been adapted to the newish manner in which PPro and AME work, and for the 64-bit platform. We could use some help raising the funds to pay the developer, so if after you view the two demo videos I did (bottom of the thread) you're feeling generous, please consider donating a few bucks to the cause--we're very close!

                   

                  If say I wanted to use Squeeze, would I have to output through AME first, encode it and then re-encode it with Squeeze or is there a way

                  to export it after editing it without double compression?

                   

                  Without the frameserver, that's exactly what you'd have to do, though you could use an uncompressed format or losslessly-compressed format. I demonstrate the frameserver in Squeeze, so it might be interesting viewing for you.

                  • 6. Re: Third Party Encoders
                    Averdahl Level 3

                    I use and prefer Grass Walley ProCoder 3 because it is better and has more options and gives me better and more vibrant colors than AME when i encode to MPEG2's for use to burn DVD's. I use it mainly for MPEG2 encoding, so i cannot say anything about H.264, etc.

                     

                    Yes,  Procoder 3 is an old encoder with an ugly UI.

                    Yes,  Procoder 3 is an end-of-life encoder.

                    Yes, Procoder 3 offers CQ encoding.

                    Yes, one can encode multiple files simultaneously.

                    Yes, it is better than AME.

                    Yes, AME is faster.

                     

                    I compared AME/Sorenson Squeeze/ TMPGEnc/ProCoder 3 recently, and ProCoder 3 gave the best results in all tests. (Sorenson Squeeze and TMPGEnc looked really bad when fading up from/to black.)

                     

                    /Roger

                    1 person found this helpful
                    • 7. Re: Third Party Encoders
                      fnub Level 1

                      I'm assuming that you think that I chose a preset and that's it.

                       

                      My question is who wouldn't mess around with the settings..?

                       

                       

                       

                      Also, I want nothing that's free.

                       

                      In the end, you get what you pay for...

                       

                       

                      But thanx for the names of some third party companies - muchly appreciated.

                      • 8. Re: Third Party Encoders
                        fnub Level 1

                        Most helpful - thanx.

                        • 9. Re: Third Party Encoders
                          fnub Level 1

                          Have you messed around with Procode 4 yet? If so, is it giving you bet

                          ter results? Thanx again in advance.

                          • 10. Re: Third Party Encoders
                            Jim_Simon Level 8
                            I want nothing that's free.  In the end, you get what you pay for...

                             

                            Not always.

                             

                             

                            "[HC Encoder] offers quality comparable to commercial alternatives..."  Meaning the bog boys like Scenarist.

                             

                             

                            x264 [used by Handbrake] has won awards in the following codec comparisons:

                            • Doom9's 2005 codec shoot-out
                            • Third Annual MSU MPEG-4 AVC/H.264 Video Codec Comparison, 2006
                            • Fourth Annual MSU MPEG-4 AVC/H.264 Video Codec Comparison, 2007
                            • Fifth Annual MSU MPEG-4 AVC/H.264 Video Codec Comparison, 2009
                            • Sixth Annual MSU MPEG-4 AVC/H.264 Video Codec Comparison, 2010

                             

                            I've certainly noticed both producing superior results to what MainConcept [used by Adobe] delivers.

                             

                            In fact, x.264 is so good that a commercial license has recently been developed, and TMPGEnc will soon start using it over the current MainConcept encoder.

                            • 11. Re: Third Party Encoders
                              Colin Brougham Level 6

                              My question is who wouldn't mess around with the settings..?

                               

                              Oh, probably only about 98.3% of the people using any particular encoder. Most people are not tweakers, and they don't have the inclination to learn what each and every single parameter does for each and every codec they might need, nor the time to do appropriate testing. I'd suspect that the overwhelming majority want to pick a precooked option and be done with it; if this were not the case, McDonald's would not own every corner of the planet.

                               

                              That's not saying that tweaking isn't a worthwhile endeavor--it is and it can help you understand a codec and its capabilities better, and squeeze every drop of performance and quality out of your exports.

                               

                              Also, I want nothing that's free.

                               

                              In the end, you get what you pay for...

                               

                              If only that were true. Many--maybe even most--of the higher-priced encoders are incapable of providing the same level of quality output that the free tools can. For example, x264 is the most feature-rich and capable H.264 encoder around, and it doesn't cost a dime. I've put it up against encoding application that cost more than $500, and it wins, hands down, without even trying. Combine an encoder like this with tools such as AviSynth or VirtualDub, and you have a powerful encoding toolbox that didn't cost you one penny. Of course, these programs require a certain amount of study to get the most from them, so there is that "cost."

                               

                              In the end, I use expensive encoders and I use free encoders. I use the expensive encoders when I'm in a hurry and don't want to think about getting an output file; I use the free ones when I want top-notch quality.

                              • 12. Re: Third Party Encoders
                                Colin Brougham Level 6

                                ...TMPGEnc will soon start using it over the current MainConcept encoder.

                                 

                                That's interesting; I quite like TEXP4. The noise and sharpening filters are excellent, and the fact that those filters are CUDA accelerated makes processing rather snappy. I hope that'll be a free update, but I'll probably drop the coin for it, if necessary.

                                 

                                I'm sort of a dork for encoders

                                • 13. Re: Third Party Encoders
                                  fnub Level 1

                                  Here's the problems I have with this encoder.

                                   

                                  The one on the top of my list is that I used to be able to make nice looking movies by shooting with AVCHD, edit and send to encore via dynamic link. But this last project, (which there are NO differences in the project settings and related settings) my project looked very blurry and pixalated in the encore timeline.

                                   

                                  But I burned it anyways to see if it's just a graphics issue with Encore. Tryng to crunch one off at 29.97, 2 VBR passes, quality 5 (highest), render at max quality - check. No matter what, this dvd looked like crap.

                                   

                                  So buddy on the forum sais try using AME to crunch one off encoding first to mpeg2 to dvd. I did that and for the most part it looke dmuch clearer. Much clearer...

                                   

                                  But here my complaint using this method, which leaves me hunting for a 3rd party encoder. Picture this...

                                   

                                  Here's a shot looking at a walk way in front of some water. There's a couple of benches in the center of the walkway. On the top edge of the bench there's this flickering line. It's like the computer is having a tough time defining this line and it flickers. Also, the looking through the cracks of the dock, looking down into the water. Instead of seeing water through a crack, you get these flickering lines. And my last complaint was that on shot of our DVD release there was a shot of some foliage. A bit of greenery mixed with some purple flowers. 30 second shot - over time the shot pixalates itself into these vertical rectangles - MOST bizzare...

                                   

                                  So I'm done with the random fnubbery AME is injecting into my work - I need a professional, broadcast quality Encoder.

                                   

                                  I paid about $1800, when it was all said and done, for my Adobe CS5 Production Premium. I'm sick at the thought of spending more money for something that I thought I was going to get with my original purchase of CS5.

                                  • 14. Re: Third Party Encoders
                                    fnub Level 1

                                    I use the free ones when I want top-notch quality

                                     

                                    Please what do you recommend for encoding DVD's? Is it the combination of things or is there one encoder that can handle this?

                                    • 15. Re: Third Party Encoders
                                      Huntrex Level 2

                                      If you're shooting HD, using a combination of Dan Isaacs' HD2SD (here is a tutorial by Jeff Bellune) and HC Encoder can produce EXCELLENT results with the proper settings.

                                      • 16. Re: Third Party Encoders
                                        John T Smith Adobe Community Professional & MVP

                                        The low cost version is CCE Basic for coding http://www.cinemacraft.com/en/

                                         

                                        Their high cost version costs several thousand and does several passes

                                        • 17. Re: Third Party Encoders
                                          tfi productions 44 Level 1

                                          hello

                                           

                                          for Collin:  how do you go about getting the frameserver?

                                          i checked out the link and it seemed to be only a video tutorial

                                          not on how to get it...(i didn't watch the whole thing, though)

                                          maybe i missed something, maybe it's not ready for the public

                                          maybe a person needs to donate first....?

                                           

                                          please help...

                                           

                                          thanks,

                                           

                                          jeffrey

                                          • 18. Re: Third Party Encoders
                                            Colin Brougham Level 6

                                            It should be released Real Soon Now TM

                                             

                                            There are a few wrinkles being worked out yet, and the programmer is actually attempting to rewrite the frameserver from scratch; apparently there are some inefficiencies and other issues in the existing codebase (which was written for the 32-bit universe). The goal is to make it as efficient as possible, so that an external application will be able to access the frames from Premiere Pro as fast as possible.

                                             

                                            I'll update the main thread as developments warrant.