29 Replies Latest reply: Mar 11, 2015 2:03 AM by Azzam Daaboul RSS

    Improve Footnotes Please

    Eugene Tyson MVP

      I'm sure this is coming up all the time - but news from every site I read is that Footnotes is once again untouched or improved, they are still the same since CS2.

       

      Please please improve this feature. The most important one for me is to allow footnotes to span the width of a text frame, and not just the column widht, when working in a 2 column or more layout.

       

      You only have to search this forum for footnotes to see all the great ideas and features that should be added to footnotes.

       

      http://forums.adobe.com/search.jspa?communityID=3274&resultTypes=MESSAGE&q=footnotes

       

       


      And if you really want them improved please report it in the wishform here

      https://www.adobe.com/cfusion/mmform/index.cfm?name=wishform

       

       

      Thanks for your support

        • 1. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
          [Jongware] MVP

          Yay!! Come on, everyone, support the Improve Footnotes Rally 2010!! (Following the Improve Footnotes Rally 2005 (CS2), the Improve Footnotes Rally 2007 (CS3) and the Improve Footnotes Rally 2008 (CS4).)

           

          Necessary improvements for me are be the ability to set numbering and numbering style per footnote, rather than per page/section/document (for Numbering) and not at all (Numbering Style).

          It would also help if they comply to Text Wrap, and if you finally could have footnotes in tables as well -- remember, when you import text from Word, footnotes in tables are silently "converted" to end notes, totally throwing off the numbering. (While we're on the subject: it's not just footnotes that don't get imported correctly; end notes also are imported very badly...)

           

          (And none of that cr*p of "well I don't need footnotes because I do everything in flash. TIA.)

           

          Here is that link again: https://www.adobe.com/cfusion/mmform/index.cfm?name=wishform. Click it, fill in the form, and Add Your Vote. It's long past due -- it's overdue.

          • 2. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
            Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

            By all means fill out the form. And add concrete examples of how any changes to behavior will be of benefit. Requests with demonstrated workflow benefits carry a lot more weight than "wouldn't if be nice if..."

            • 3. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
              [Jongware] MVP

              Whenever I'm requested to set footnotes in a book, I run into problems virtually right from the start. Some of my books require a star footnote with author details on the first page per chapter, followed by regular notes -- starting at "1". This already needs one or two dirty tricks -- that's where the "numbering per footnote" comes in.

              Yet even more tricks are needed to fake notes inside tables -- sometimes bordering on the idiotic, such as having to conceal the "real" footnotes in 0.1 pt invisible text somewhere in the middle of a paragraph.

               

              Adobe has this uplifting message when you post a Feature Request:

               

              "Thanks for your feedback! Requests and suggestions from our customers are what help us to continue creating cutting-edge, world-class software."

              -- it's about time they live up to that.

              • 4. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                peter at knowhowpro Community Member

                P Spier wrote:

                 

                By all means fill out the form. And add concrete examples of how any changes to behavior will be of benefit. Requests with demonstrated workflow benefits carry a lot more weight than "wouldn't if be nice if..."

                Also wish for the ability of cross-references and text variables to capture paragraph autonumbers. Even if no table footnotes are implemented, if autonumbers could be captured by cross-references, it would be possible to simulate table footnotes. They wouldn't be as simple to create as inserting a footnote into main text, but not much extra effort is necessary, and they would work as you'd expect.

                 

                 

                HTH

                 

                Regards,

                 

                Peter

                _______________________

                Peter Gold

                KnowHow ProServices

                • 5. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                  Eugene Tyson MVP

                  As interesting an idea as including paragraph numbering for variables, I fully support it, but it's nothing to do with footnotes. If you want to start your campaign in that area I'll gladly support it. I have 3 books over 500 pages each that require auto numbering and the lead paragaph on each page to include the paragraph number in the running head variable.

                   

                   

                  As for everyone else - great ideas for the footnotes. I support all of them. Especially the ability to include a footnote within a table. I have to insert a footnote outside the table and change the colour to NONE and make a new paragraph style for this footnote number so that there is no extra space around the table. But when it comes to updating the fake footnote in the table, that is very manual. And if you have 100 tables with a 100 footnotes in there it's very tedious to keep updating.

                  • 6. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                    peter at knowhowpro Community Member

                    Eugene Tyson wrote:

                     

                    As interesting an idea as including paragraph numbering for variables, I fully support it, but it's nothing to do with footnotes. If you want to start your campaign in that area I'll gladly support it. I have 3 books over 500 pages each that require auto numbering and the lead paragaph on each page to include the paragraph number in the running head variable.

                     

                     

                    As for everyone else - great ideas for the footnotes. I support all of them. Especially the ability to include a footnote within a table. I have to insert a footnote outside the table and change the colour to NONE and make a new paragraph style for this footnote number so that there is no extra space around the table. But when it comes to updating the fake footnote in the table, that is very manual. And if you have 100 tables with a 100 footnotes in there it's very tedious to keep updating.

                    Hi, Eugene:

                     

                    I mentioned paragraph numbering for variables because it could be a beneficial side effect of making paragraph autonumbers accessible by cross-references. I assume that paragraph autonumbering is the problem that needs to be fixed, rather than the cross-reference or variable mechanisms.

                     

                    If cross-references could capture paragraph autonumbers, then cross-reference based fake table footnotes would update without manual attention.

                     

                     

                    HTH

                     

                    Regards,

                     

                    Peter

                    _______________________

                    Peter Gold

                    KnowHow ProServices

                    • 7. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                      Eugene Tyson MVP

                      Yeh I guess it could be a way. But I don't know why they just don't have the option to "Span columns" "Don't Span Columns"

                      • 8. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                        Claudio González MVP

                        This may help to understand how and why requests about footnotes got ignored:

                         

                        http://indesignsecrets.com/michael-ninness-answers-indesign-cs5-critics.php

                        • 9. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                          Eugene Tyson MVP

                          Thanks - I've read that and replied with discontent.

                          • 10. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                            jutaipeter Community Member

                            This explanation is ridiculous and simple balderdash. If a software is designed to creat books with it, it HAS TO deal with footnotes. I have typeset and edited and translated many books written by historians, university students in various fields, musicians, classical philologists, linguists, etc. I can't recall if I have ever typeset a book that had no footnotes - of course I don't mean belles-lettres. Footnotes are essential in scientific (and in not so scientific, but thorough) writing, be it a book or a periodical. I want to get rid of InDesign, but I cannot, because LaTex is difficult and hard to handle, and Quark has less features (if I am right -- but I have to admit that I have never seen the latter one). If anyone could recommend me another good typesetting software, I would switch to it immediately. But there is no other.

                             

                            Péter Jutai

                            • 11. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                              Eugene Tyson MVP

                              This was just posted in the CS5 thread on the InDesign forum, which seems to faux span footnotes using cross references

                               

                              http://www.kahrel.plus.com/indesign/foot_to_column.html

                               

                              Quite cool, but it's not the same as real footnotes unfortunately.

                              • 12. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                elliot_the _little_monkey Community Member

                                Adding my voice to the post.

                                 

                                This is a major and costly gripe for me and my my company.

                                 

                                If we didn't spend so long fixing text frame problems we might actually turn a profit one of these days.

                                 

                                Thanks, Adobe, for listening to the consumer and rectifying this problem in the next installment of your popular software.

                                • 13. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                  Eugene Tyson MVP

                                  Thanks for registering your interest, I hope you filled out the request form in the orignial post

                                   

                                  I really hope there is a solution for this in the future

                                  • 14. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                    KarynRH Community Member

                                    I added my voice to the cause. I hope it helps!

                                    • 15. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                      Drz4007 Community Member

                                      Me too. I think these are must features for InDesign...

                                      • 16. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                        HansGrifontwerp Community Member

                                        Just filled in the form. Better footnotes for the InDesign World!

                                        • 17. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                          Kalavinka Community Member

                                          Just formalized the feature request per the form. Thanks for mounting the effort. Not holding my breath, though.

                                           

                                          Dharmamitra

                                          • 18. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                            fiddles5 Community Member

                                            I just added to Adobe feature request for footnotes too.

                                            • 19. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                              duozmedia Community Member

                                              I also have added a request to improve footnotes in InDesign.

                                              • 20. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                                OlafNelson Community Member

                                                I've been wishing for spanning footnotes since CS2. Other wishes include the ability to insert non-numbered (asterisk, etc.) footnotes amidst numbered footnotes without messing up the numbering, the ability to select all footnotes (or any number of consecutive ones), and of course footnotes in tables!

                                                Heading for the wish form now.

                                                Olaf

                                                • 21. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                                  ArcRaj Community Member

                                                  Also converting footnote contents into XML also one of the long-time requirement from my end i.e., the current footnote option not allowing any XML tag.

                                                  • 22. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                                    circleB Community Member

                                                    I want to add my voice to the effort! I NEED numbers and *† on the same page without messing up the mumbering. Adobe PLEASE HELP!

                                                     

                                                    I'm headed to the request form...

                                                    • 23. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                                      [Jongware] MVP

                                                      If you have another footnote before or after that one, you can stuff its text into one of these, and put the marker manually in the text. It's a work-around -- you'll have to check them if your text re-flows.

                                                      • 24. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                                        cramik Community Member

                                                        Somehow I never got around to adding my name to the feature request list for footnotes. I guess I kept believing that in the next upgrade things would look more cheerfull (I guess most of us do...). Since today it's no longer my fault if the request-list for decent footnotes is not long enough. Only yesterday I imported a word-file with about 1500 footnotes. Indesign lost about 1100 of them leaving me with only one option, convert them to endnotes first. (For those getting the wrong idea now: no, endnotes don't work in indesign (at all), but at least they all get converted to text).

                                                        • 25. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                                          Pandora.wolfdog Community Member

                                                          Oh yeah. Lost a client because I couldn't make the footnotes he wanted :-(

                                                           

                                                          It must be such a simple task for Adobe to ad features like run-in (it's there in TOC for instance).

                                                          It breaks my heart, my favorite prograqm of all times is failing.

                                                          • 26. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                                            Sjouke Noordenbos Community Member

                                                            I'm new to this site, so I will simply reply to the last post. I did have similar problems and it took me some time to find a temporary working solution:

                                                             

                                                            1     Create an index for text or part of the text that should appear as endnote

                                                            2     Edit the index-entry and have each entry precede by a number; you can also append text here

                                                            3     Insert same number in the text & apply superscript if you so desire

                                                            4     Finish the book and generate an index; place index anywhere you want

                                                            5     Add additionoal text to the final placed index

                                                             

                                                            When you generate the index, you can choose any paragraph style you like

                                                             

                                                            Upside of this approach: it really generates proper endnotes, with lots of possibilities for finetuning

                                                             

                                                            Downside: if you want to insert additional endnotes later, you will have to renumber them all. Therefore I find it better to underscore text that needs to appear in a footnote first, and then, when the book is finished, to change these bits of text in footnotes as I explained above.

                                                             

                                                            Hope this helps, it works for me anyway.

                                                            • 27. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                                              datzebaoroma Community Member

                                                              Yes, we badly need this improvements. And also it's important that you solve the problems of corrupted or missing footnote links when importing Word files!

                                                              • 28. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                                                carlaspinheiro Community Member

                                                                Improve Footnotes Please

                                                                 

                                                                In a long book its not very practical to have all the text in one story.

                                                                Please improve, so we can have consecutive footnote numbers through a document, but also have each chapter in a separate story.

                                                                • 29. Re: Improve Footnotes Please
                                                                  Azzam Daaboul Community Member

                                                                  Improve importing footnotes in tables from a Word document, PLEASE!