sorry, forgot to mention: using AE CS5.5, and audio is 16-bit integer little endian. I've seen the other posts with regard to the same warning, none applied to me. As I already said, I have enough disk space, and it's not a matter of clearing the media cache as it happens even when that folder is empty.
I also submitted a feature request for an option to discard the audio when importing your footage (seems logical to be able to do so, as conforming is very time consuming, and most of the times I don't need audio when doing post work, much less the audio from the footage), if anyone has the same problem, please submit a request too https://www.adobe.com/cfusion/mmform/index.cfm?name=wishform&promoid=EWQQL
I'm not aware of any good reason for that kind of behavior.
What happens if you open the clips in question in a different application? Does the audio play?
What happens if you convert the clips to a different codec (e.g. a Quicktime PNG movie with audio)?
Are the clips in question on a network? What happens if they're on a local drive?
Do you have a audio sample rate mismatch like 44.1 kHz vs. 48 kHz?
Are you current on your AE updates?
Have you tried using a different method to import the clips? For example, if you use Cmd+i, have you tried dragging them into the AE project Window?
It baffles me too, as there's no obvious reason for this behavior.
All files are on an internal hdd, all updates are current, and there's no sampling rate mismatch.
It shows up no matter how I import them, and usually I get this warning for about 10% of the files. I checked, and it's always different files, so it's not a case of corrupt files.
I haven't tried with converting, if I transcode the footage I discard the audio anyway. However, I don't remember seeing the warning when importing files with audio generated by other programs, like Avid or Audition.
Oh, the audio from the footage behaves itself in any player or editing program, not even Media Encoder has a problem with it.
I'll try importing the footage in PrPro, see if it has any issues conforming the audio.
I've been nerve-racked over a conforming issue, myself. If conforming is the inherent problem... I get the same behavior no matter what. And I've been fighing with this obsessively for weeks. Trying everything under the sun. Bitrate matches, at 44100 from the original WAV file in the composition on to the sequence I've been trying to place it in. Toggling between WDM/ASIO drivers, completely removing the package & cleaning the registry, clearing all temp folders (including AppData\Roaming\Adobe if you folks have overlooked it), stripping out Red Giant plugins as someone mentioned, graphics drivers are current (Quadro 2000, not the gaming toy boards), nVidia Phsyx software, system is only 4GB at this time, twin Xeon (Irwindale) 2.8GHz CPUs running on an ultra-stable server platform. Using successfully as a workstation. Windows 7 Ultimate x64 with all the available updates & HotFixes related to DirectX, memory management, CPU microcode updates, etc. Absolutely clean event log. This machine with a mere 4GB ECC Registered memory just laughs at Crysis 2. So there's my hardware summary.
My project uses a long-running audio file in WAV format - generated by Audition. Uncompressed, native media... I have shrank its bitrate down to see if it was a resource problem, ie sensitive to the file size. It is 1.25GB & I cannot shrink it any further.
This single WAV file exists as a layer in a nested Ae composition. That composition is nested into one other - the one that's linked to the Premiere project.
I end up with almost exactly HALF of the original audio after Premiere conforms the AEP file. Interesting to note is that the uncompressed, 'raw' wave file is 1.25GB in size, but the conforming process produces a CFA file of 2.5GB from the composition it's in!
After conforming, I end up with a half-missing waveform in Premiere:
The structure of the composition in After Effects looks like this:
In the above composition intended for nesting, the Audio Waveform effect is applied to a solid & is modulated by the WAV file. Needless to say, the audio is intended to be audible as well as a visual.
Now, the above composition is stationary without any other animation. It's nested into the following composition only to put a layer beneath it, a couple above it, & giving it some slide-in/slide-out motion. Audio is carried into the 'Comp for Sequence' which is the one linked with Premiere & that I'm attempting to use in a final sequence for rendering:
Audio preview is limited due to RAM, however it plays normally in After Effects...
As I'm satisfied with the comps & while trying to troubleshoot, I leave Premiere open (project closed) & clear the media cache. Media cache is on my RAID5 with plenty of free space...
The audio source is 1.25GB:
The conformed file that Premiere generates upon importing it is 2.4GB!
And I end up with an incomplete waveform after conforming in Premiere:
...no matter what. Interesting to note, & making it a greater mindjob to figure out is that its complete absence of audio from zero to about 50% - if not exactly 50%. It's very close to center. Audio plays normally from this point to the end of the sequence[comp].
Fully understood - I concede. But respectfully - that is a default response to anyone still at the 4GB threshold. Memory is en route. Was difficult to find this older ECC Registered type in the right speed & DRAM layout that this board requires.
That said, I'll return to this string to assert that the issue is still occuring, because it is clearly [to me] a programmatic issue with the apps. I should note that my system is not paging to disc while loading the compositions/conforming. Memory usage is 'in the blue' while observing system monitor
I went looking for a file-sharing host in order to post my 'little' project for download, in the hopes one of you fine gentlemen would download it, load up the project & be able to observe this, yourself. I have my own FTP server but don't have sufficient upstream to offer it up from home.
Any ideas to where I can upload an estimate 700MB (compressed zip) for public download? SendSpace.com is capped below that...
My project is concise, file names logical & there are very few assets, would be easy to interpret by a non-author of it. Really want someone to at least open it & observe the waveform on the timeline at minimum.
If you guys with contemporary multi-core Xeon's & 16GB+ of RAM encounter the same - This can be confirmed as a real 'bug' & will be easily repeatable. I suspect having such a long-running uncompressed audio file, running the entire length of one composition, also being referenced for an Audio Waveform effect is unusual & Adobe has a fundamental problem with huge audio files in After Effects. This problem is not confined to WAV files, however. It's happening with any long-running (2 hours, here) composition, using AAC audio files, MP3's, you name it.
I'll be pleasantly surprised & satisfied, also apologetic if I found that it can be conformed normally - by anyone else. More so if that person has only 4GB.
Ideas on where to upload? Thanks in advance.
Dave, like I said it shouldn't be happening even with 4GB. Even if I was thrashing the RAID with paging due to RAM limitation, from a programmatic standpoint the system should just 'deal', lol. Albeit with an impatient user & a wait cursor But seriously, I've composed, sequenced & rendered successfuly a number of huge comps with files of varying sizes, but cumulatively much larger that what I'm dealing with here. What's unique to this (I think) is having such a long-running single audio file. May also be related to the fact that composition nesting is involved. The numbers...
"Thank you for all the detailed information.
It sounds like you have a different issue than the cuda related one we have been chasing.
I know there was another person who reported similar issue like yours (not cuda related) and it had to do with RAM or Pagingfile on his system. He added more RAM (2GB to 8GB) and that solved his issue. But of course, this shouldn't happen to begin with and with your help, hopefully we can track it down and fix it.
Anyhow, I need the following info to send you invitation for pre-release program.
~ Two compositions in Ae project
~ PEK file generated for the imported AEP file seem to be half the size of the PEK file generated from the original WAV file
~ Problem isn't in the digital data of the wave, as I've run it through mixdowns, cut out silence areas around the 50% mark & mixdown again.
~ I've ran the audio through another vendor's app (Roxio) just to output the same file from a different program - no problemo.
~ Audio has no audible problems.
~ Because the original source was probably only 32k stream, I've converted that huge PCM wave down to 320kbps MP3 -
~ ...and subsequently output that MP3 to a wave - just to ensure there could be nothing in the data for the apps to halt on.
I 'feel' a relationship between this 'half audio' problem (only starts at 50% in timeline) to these generated PEK files for the Ae comp being half the size of the PEK file for the audio file. But I don't know, speculating...
I'd also like to know if when Premiere is conforming an imported asset, be it a 'raw' file asset or an Ae comp, does it begin this process at the end-of-file or at the beginning-of-file?
If it processes the end of file first, that would partly explain why I have audio in the latter half of it & not the first part, from 0% to 50%. That would be even though I'm observing audio only in this second half, the system is halting processing the waveform when it's 50% along. The inverse of what one might assume.
I could by observation assume that it's not starting the audio conform until 50%. If the above weren't true. All depends on whether it begins conforming the end of file or the beginning of file, first... Thinking like a coder.
Sorry but you must have missed the fact that I am using a native, uncompressed WAVE file generated by Audition.
Subsequent usage of an MP3 in its place was only for the sake of testing. ONLY.
This is occuring for me with ANY audio format - any. It is the single file size and/or running length that is presenting the problem.
sorry for chipping in so late, but here goes in order:
- WeTransfer.com has a 2GB limit
- as I understand, your problem appears only on long audio files. Split your file in 2 or 3 pieces, precompose in AE and use the precomp as source for the waveform effect
- can't tell you much about dynamic link, I don't use it, too slow for my taste (as long as it's slower than using a rendered file, it's too slow for editing)
- having only half of your audio after conforming might be due to software not able to handle files over a certain size, and no fallback implemented, to split the files (like Red does with it's footage, you can record for all your HDD's worth, but splits the files at 2GB. You'll still get a single shot though)
- as for only the last part of the audio being kept, I see another approach: when the file size is reached, it begins to shift the oldest data, leaving you only with the end of your recording. Splitting your audio source would solve this too.
- make it easier on Premiere and put your audio on the timeline, not through dynamic link from AE. Don't even think about doing audio editing in AE and use that. It's a terrible idea on so many levels.
- I opened another thread on the audio conforming issue (http://forums.adobe.com/message/4042936#4042936) pointing out that something went wrong with it from CS5 to CS5.5, as it's MUCH slower (up to 8 times slower in my tests)
It has been uploaded... is available.
I have split the file in 2-3 pieces, laying them sequenced in layers, in Ae. Bear in mind that by virtue of it's runtime (not necessarily size), it still produces a massive, 2.5GB CFA files.
Tested that theory, to no avail. Splitting the recording has no effect on the issue. If the Ae comp's runtime is this long - same issue arises.
Does not matter how many little pieces I bust the original wave file into. And I'm not 'editing' audio in After Effects. I don't even understand what you mean by that. I'm simple using ONE audio asset in the Ae comp - which is generated by Adobe themselves (Audition).
And you're right about the speed loss from CS5 to CS5.5, I think. Even though I was using CS5 for perhaps just a month prior to using CS5.5 now. Something very fundamental in their coding math has changed & introduced these issues.
'Half Conforming Audio' Project
(740MB Zipped/Appx 1.25GB Uncompressed)
I tried that as well, was actually one of the first things I tried. I'd replace the AEP audio with the same asset (but brought into Premiere, not Ae), the waveform would then be complete - but rendering would hang - right at that 50% position.
Even upon replacing the AEP's audio (half conforming), the sequence halts AME or Premiere, doesn't matter whether I attempt render in Pr or send it out to AME. It halts. At 50%. And you'd think that's odd, because we're replacing the audio piece in question, that's problematic to conform.
Still halts. At 50%.
Prior to V10... Adobe has a HUGE problem with any files. Especially if your audio system output is set differently than audio source.
Your problem has NO soluttion other than reporting it as bug today and paying for it in CS12.....
My suggestion is to use a different software that actuallu works
V10. Well, their version numbers are all out of whack that's apparent. And lest you're in their programming teams, you cannot say it has no solution. Of course it does. And if my repeatable issue is successfully resolved, they'll enter the coding changes in a coming update, I'm confident. For one thing, I submitted a bug report, got a relatively prompt reply from an Adobe employee & I explained this problem consisely. Offered up a download URL for the project itself & Adobe has brought it into their testing environment. As a consequence of people like me pushing the envelope, & if they're as attentive as they seem to be on [repeatable] issues, I'm betting one of them will e-mail me a pre-release dll replacement or some kind of code change to see if it works. And my issue occurs cross platform, hightening its priority, I would think. And how many people in these forums ***** & moan about their issues when they cannot even give direct, detailed & methodical answers when an Adobe employee pops in to ask a question. How many of them make their problems easy to understand by Adobe & actually provide the project themselves to test. They'll fix it.
I've never had a big software maker actually take on one of my problems directly, so that in itself is some awesomeness. Plus - consider how brain-racked these guys are programming this stuff, the mathematics of video manipulation if mind boggling. Make that times 10 when you consider what it must take to develop the software that creative people use to be... creative. Using assets of all kinds, containers & codecs. etc. etc.
Well, that's weird.
I tried seeing the waveform in AE, and all I got was this error: "After Effects error: could not allocate sound memory". I got 24GB of RAM, and disk cache is set to 30GB :-|
Opened the Premiere project, and after conforming for a few minutes, the audio waveform looks the same as your screencap. Imported the original audio, and waveform is complete, no conforming needed.
I'm exporting the movie now, will get back to you with the results
I don't think I'll wait for the whole thing to export, it takes about 4hrs
I'll try other approaches though, see if the file size of the audio is the culprit or the length.
- split the audio and import them into Pr
- export the whole thing to segments and stitch them somehow
- render out of AE the comp and skip DynamicLink. It's a 32-bit process, so it might not handle big files very well.
I just exported the Pr project with the original audio placed on the timeline and a placeholder image instead of the dynalinked composition. Got it all out no problems, so it looks like dynamiclink program is to blame. I'll leave AE over night to render the entire comp (will take about 6hrs), and use that instead of the linked comp in Pr to export. If everything goes well, then it's deffinitely dynamic link manager's fault.
giving up is easy. bi***ing & moaning even easier. Giving a constructive feedback, not so easy.
My problem doesn't have a solution yet, but it has a workaround. I can live with that. And for me, AE does work, as those audio problems are just a setback and not a game stopper, as I don't use audio from footage in AE.
Thanks for testing, more the better. We've established it as a genuine issue, always repeatable & cross-platform. One other gentlemen encounteres the exact same on the Mac platform. 'Half conforming' audio - bringing in the AEP to Premiere. Bringing in the audio asset directly does not exhibit the 'half missing' audio, but it does in fact hang the encoder at 50% - right at that position - even if the AEP audio has been replaced directly by the audio asset.
G'luck on splitting the audio, I've tried that as well. I tried busting it into several parts, ie SEGMENT01, SEGMENT02.WAV, etc & then dropping those parts into the Ae comp as a sequence. They then appear on multiple layers in the comp (of course), but are lined up beginning to end.
Issue with audio 'half conforming' in Pr still occurs. Seems to be that the length of the comp presents the problem, even if we chop the large asset up inside of it.
This is a show stopper - because again, I can replace the AEP audio with the original asset brought into Premiere - everything then looks okay - but then it will predicatably fail to render at that 50% mark. It will halt either Premiere encoding directly or AME if sent to the queue.
Even though we 'replaced' the audio, it hangs, right there...
If you think 4 hours is a long render for a 2 hour sequence, LOL... Try waiting 12-24 hours, that's how long my twin single-core Xeon 2.8GHz 4GB RAM system takes to chomp on it, & this thing is pretty stout, even being on a 6 year old server platform (used as workstation). RAM is my obvious limitation, but obviously this issue isn't contingent upon RAM. You & the other tester both have stellar hardware specs.
Can you give a brief-brief on your hardware? Most interested in graphics adapter & audio card, if not integrated. The Mac user seeing this same issue (with my project has a Quadro 4000 in MacOS, also 24GB RAM, etc. I have a Quadro 2000D 1GB VRAM...
And splitting it presents a functional problem in the Ae comp. The Audio Waveform effect is applied to a solid, & references the audio layer to modulate it. But if the audio's split on multiple layers end-to-end, the audio effect can only reference one source layer so the waveform animation will only run the length of one of those parts. Know what I mean... Thus the audio asset must remain whole.
It's okay, Adobe downloaded the project as I offered it in a bug report, with reference to these discussions, in it & they've brought it into their testing environment. I've not heard back yet but it's only been a couple of days & we're in the weekend, now.
When you help people help you by giving detailed & concise information & an easy to interpret project to test with, you give them alot better chance to solve it than with sketchy answers with insufficient background information. Anxious to see what they come up with. I'm thinking by virtue of solving this one, they will have further refined the product & possibly solve some other elusive issues related to audio conforming. Because this project is always repeatable, not an intermittent thing, & the project is consistent in its content from beginning to end, making analysis much easier.
Maybe a 64-bit native Dynamic Link package is forthcoming!
You could be dead-on in suspecting 32-bit dynamic link, as 2-2.5GB files are a key threshold. AAC's have a file size limit, about 2GB. If I recall, there was such a 2GB barrier in the FAT32 file system, too. But NTFS here. Still, could be a remnant piece of code inhibiting this. I'm sure they'll find the solution & the product will become that much better after.
FAT32 is limited to 4GB per file, but most apps that split the files (Avid when it was using OMF as media files, RED cameras, etc) at 2GB.
As I said, I managed to render out of Premiere the entire length of the audio, but with a placeholder image instead of linked comp. So, as a workaround, I suggest rendering your comp in AE and bringing that output into Premiere. You could also render only the waveform in AE and composit the smoke and the waveform over your stills in Premiere, cut some render time.
For my specs, look at my profile, you'll see I don't have a high end workstation, it's more of a gaming/workstation hybrid, but it does the job