37 Replies Latest reply: Nov 12, 2014 5:00 AM by station_two RSS

    CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)

    uhnaeokaoeu Community Member

      I just upgraded my macbook pro to a new drive and 10.6, and chose 'case sensitive' HFSX, 'cause I'm a heavy command line user and wanted the maximum BASH experience.

       

      I'm trying to install the CS5 demo to try some web design tools, and the installer immediately says "Installation to case-sensitive drives is not supported. Please choose a different drive location to install." So case-sensitive drives aren't supported; crappy but fair enough.

       

      The error message leads me to think that I can just choose a non-case-sensitive drive to install to, but I never get a chance to pick one - I click on the installer and it goes straight to the error message.

       

      So - how do I pick a different drive to install to? Am I just an idoit, is there no way to select a different drive, or will it not install on a system that even BOOTS from a c.s. drive, regardless of the format of the drive that CS5 is installed to?

       

      I called the support number, and the poor fellow on the other end suggested I re-download the demo, and if the new download fails call Apple support to report my 'drive error'.

       

      I'm hoping to avoid an entire backup-reformat-restore and lose CLI compatibility just to try some demo software.

       

      ch

        • 1. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive
          Community Member

          All Adobe applications should be installed on the boot volume, the same volume where the OS resides.

           

          If you absolutely want to avoid a reformat of that drive, then you have to create a separate, dedicated bootable volume on a different drive where you can install and run Photoshop.

           

          Probably not what you wanted to hear, I know.

           

           

           

          Wo Tai Lao Le

          我太老了

          • 2. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive
            uhnaeokaoeu Community Member

            I'm not happy about it, but figured it'd be fastest to just suck it up and reformat the drive. Sucks.

             

            I used the Snow Leopard install disk to create a backup image on an external drive, formated the internal as NON case sensitive, then did a restore COPY (not ERASE, which just changed the internal drive back to case sensitive and made me have to start over). What a waste of time.

             

            :-(

             

            ch

            • 3. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive
              therealgeeves Community Member

              Another reason to NOT buy this crappy software.

              • 4. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive
                MScherzer Community Member

                i can only aggree... crappy software!! I just blew couple of hunred euro on a eclipse plugin from adobe same ****!! stupid company policy.Cause last version worked flawless on case sensitive drive.

                • 5. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive
                  Ingo vB Community Member

                  I guess I can be happy that I actually first downloaded the trial version despite having tested the software on other computers already. Having it completely fail to install on a case sensitive file system sadly needs to turn my choice from a "definitely buy" to a "too buggy to spend money on".

                   

                  All the "good" reasons given for case insensitivity still don't render void all the good reasons other people have to use exactly that. And I find it quite "interesting" to be told as a (potential) customer that it's my fault when a customer makes the perfectly valid request, that the product should run on the system it is advertised to work with...

                  • 6. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive
                    Chris Cox Adobe Employee

                    Photoshop clearly states that it can't be installed on a case sensitive file system.

                    We are still working with Apple to resolve the tool chain problems that prevent us from doing so.

                    • 7. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive
                      MScherzer Community Member

                      it however does NOT clearly state the "boot" volume must be case insensitive. cause otherwise you could just throw in a extra drive or sparse bundle and you would be good to go.

                       

                      I mean seriously requiring a complete re-install of the OS to run an application is bat **** crazy.

                       

                      well I moved on and abandoned flash / flex for HTML5.  so long adobe and good riddance.

                      • 8. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive
                        Ingo vB Community Member

                        Chris Cox wrote:

                         

                        Photoshop clearly states that it can't be installed on a case sensitive file system.

                        Where does it say that my root directory has to be of that type? Providing a free partition is much easier than requiring the whole OS to be modified.  Subsequently tried to install it on an additional HDD - but I don't even get that choice.

                         

                        If I go by the system requirements description no such limitation is mentioned. Only after I downloaded the trial package and ran into that problem I even became aware that such problem can exist - something I'd not have thought of possible before actually seeing it.

                         

                        http://store.adobe.com/store/de/popup/software/creativesuite/designstandard5/systemreqs.ht ml also mentions the case insensitivity requirement after the required hard disk space. It probably could and should get its own separate main entry in that list for its severity.

                        • 9. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive
                          Chris CoZi Community Member

                          This was originally posted 5 years ago.

                          You reported a year ago 'toolchain' problems.

                          Adobe does not care about end users.

                          Period.

                          • 10. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                            mauriciocuervo Community Member

                            In 2012, adobe does not support case sensitive file systems? wow.

                            • 11. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                              mauriciocuervo Community Member

                              I had my credit card ready, fortunately I downloaded the trial first, and discovered the case sensitive install issue.

                               

                              There is no exuse to not have fixed this by 2012!

                               

                              Another adobe fail

                               

                              I am not going to reformat my drive just because of you.

                              My deployment enviroment are linux servers, so my development machine (mac) requires case sensitivity!

                               

                              Will start looking for an alternative.

                              • 12. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                Chris Cox Adobe Employee

                                Please note that the tool chain in question, is supplied by Apple.

                                Not all issues are in the developer's control.

                                • 13. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                  MScherzer Community Member

                                  yeah, as that maybe but the beta and previous versions did nor care. still pissed that I paid for a piece of software I was never able to use. On the up

                                  side I did not waste time on this dead technology. flash is dead and good riddance adobe.

                                  • 14. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                    DeepYogurt Community Member

                                    Mr. Cox,

                                     

                                    Would you mind explaining a bit more about the "tool chain" problem and why it's an Apple issue? Thanks...

                                    • 15. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                      Chris Cox Adobe Employee

                                      Apple suppplies the build tools: compiler, linker, package building code.

                                      Apple supplies the OS loader that loads the code.

                                      Those parts are not under the control of the third party developer.

                                      And those parts, don't always get it right, especially when building larger applications that have to be built in parts on multiple systems by multiple teams.

                                      We're still trying to work with Apple on this, but it's always 2 steps forward and 1 (or more) steps back.

                                      • 16. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                        DeepYogurt Community Member

                                        Could you be specific about what the real issue is/are? Is it an Xcode issue? I would really like to understand what exactly the problem is, if that's possible. Other than Adobe, do you know of any other applications that have this problem with case-sensitive file system installation and correct running.

                                         

                                        Even at the 2 steps forward and 1 back, you will evenually get where you want to go, as progress is made every step of the way - just half as much as you would hope ;-)

                                         

                                        Thanks again...

                                         

                                        -Bob

                                        • 17. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                          Chris Cox Adobe Employee

                                          Yes, we know of other cases. No, we can't say much because of NDAs.

                                          And yes, we are still trying to make progress.

                                          • 18. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                            Aerospark1861 Community Member

                                            Mr. Cox, as a developer, that excuse is a really bad one.

                                             

                                            If a toolchain is inhibiting you from preforming a function in some way, you work around it. That's one of the fundamentals of good developent.

                                             

                                            I know I don't have all the information, but bottom of the line, you dont put a problem like this into a released product of a multi-milion dollar corporation.

                                            • 19. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                              Noel Carboni Community Member

                                              These are just my wild *** guesses...

                                               

                                              Photoshop is incredibly complex, not only because it's a huge, feature-rich app, BUT ALSO because it's built to run on two different operating systems (or 3 times that if you consider all the ones released during its lifetime), AND ALSO because it's been maintained at a feverish "add new gee whiz features as quickly as possible for the next major release" pace through 13 releases, NOT TO MENTION it's been maintained over 2 decades by hundreds (thousands?) of different programmers, not all of whom speak the same language.

                                               

                                              It just might not be *quite* as simple as you think.  Times ten.

                                               

                                              Okay, maybe my guesses are not so wild.  This is 35 years of solid software engineering experience talking, much of which was in big companies.  Yes, I already had 15 years experience when Photoshop was first invented.

                                               

                                              And c'mon, Chris is certainly not allowed to tell us all the "dirt" about Photoshop - we're privileged he expresses as much as he does.  Most big companies would not say anything at all (most don't), and those others would just toe the line "it's perfect, what's the matter with you?".

                                               

                                              -Noel

                                              • 20. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                                Lundberg02 Community Member

                                                What is a valid reason for trying to install on a case sensitive drive, besides some arcane developer crotchitiness?

                                                • 21. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                                  SjaakieWTF Community Member

                                                  Never, ever have I encountered such a major mistake by such a big company (no not even MSFT) in my 15 years as a software developer. There really is no excuse possible for this. There is always a workaround, be it ugly, or a redesign of the code that so desperately needs case insensitivity. Gladly I first tried to install the trial and concluded after that, that if the install fails that hard then the rest will probably even fail harder.

                                                  • 22. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                                    MScherzer Community Member

                                                    Because some of us arcane developers write software for UNIX systems, also if you develop on a case-sensitive drive by default all your code will ALSO run on an insensitive system. Also very usefull to find issues in web applications that get deployed to NIX system.  Looks like adobe sacked there arcance developers and left all there products as steaming piles of **** I don't buy the toolchain line (well maybe for photoshop) but definately NOT THEIRE ECLIPSE PLUGIN which worked flawless in BETA then the final release would not install. BASTARDS!

                                                    • 23. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                                      therealgeeves Community Member

                                                      I'd like to add that I finally found an upgrade that cost like 230USD, converted.

                                                      This was OK.

                                                       

                                                      I am pleased to say that CS6 is quite fast, and stuff like that, and some of the UI is nice too, crop seems quite intuitive, with the new 'way'.

                                                       

                                                      However, I am still bitter about the case-insensitive problem.

                                                      I've upgraded machines over the last 5 year stand off with Adobe, but now that I found that the work-around I had (load off a disk image) was so slow compared to a real install, I finally let go and reverted to case-insensitive.

                                                       

                                                      I'd prefer Adobe not be the only software maker that could not sort this out in a subsequent update, but then again, they're still trying to offload Flash on the remaining unsuspecting plebs on the net... So there.

                                                       

                                                      I still like Photoshop but that's about all. (bring back Freehand!)

                                                      • 24. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                                        wu.yang Community Member

                                                        I don't buy the excuse!

                                                         

                                                        Here is the hacking:

                                                        http://arcticmac.home.comcast.net/~arcticmac/tutorials/cs5instructions.html

                                                         

                                                        There is nothing related to toolchain.

                                                         

                                                        Now I understand how Adobe hates Apple. And I see why Flash is dying.

                                                        • 25. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                                          Chris Cox Adobe Employee

                                                          The toolchain is the problem - the case of many frameworks doesn't survive the tools, can't be updated correctly, etc.

                                                          We keep trying to make it work, and the tool supplier (Apple) keeps coming up with new ways to prevent it from working.

                                                          • 26. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                                            Noel Carboni Community Member

                                                            Just a bit of friendly advice:

                                                             

                                                            Given that no two companies use the same tools, nor is there only one solution for any given task, perhaps the confusion would be averted and people would accuse you less of trying to dodge responsibility if you more accurately stated it as "our toolchain is the problem". 

                                                             

                                                            But even at that your users don't really care - they just want the software to work.

                                                             

                                                            That several someones, following the link above, have found a way to make it work by doing things to the installed products after the fact says that you could create tweaks to your installer that would make it work.

                                                             

                                                            You should really try to get past the "someone else's subsystem is broken so it's not up to us to make it work" mantra.  Your customers don't want to hear it.

                                                             

                                                            You get big bucks to engineer the best software in the world. You should be proud that people are expecting great things from you, and you should be trying ever harder to exceed their expectations.  Hungrier companies do.

                                                             

                                                            -Noel

                                                            • 27. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive
                                                              mattridge Community Member

                                                              Its 2014, this has not been resolved, is there a reason?

                                                              • 28. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                                                station_two Community Member

                                                                mattridge wrote:

                                                                 

                                                                Its 2014, this has not been resolved, is there a reason?

                                                                 

                                                                Sure.  Apple has not resolved the issues Adobe engineers need to work around the problem. 

                                                                • 29. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                                                  skw33k Community Member

                                                                  Is there any update on this bug? I just purchased a license for this, and I can't install this software. My network admin doesn't support case in-sensitive file systems.

                                                                  • 30. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                                                    station_two Community Member

                                                                    It's not a bug, i.e. not a programming error; it's a limitation imposed by Apple's OS.

                                                                     

                                                                    If there are news from Apple, it's not public knowledge.

                                                                     

                                                                    If you just bought the license, you can get your money back in the first 30 days after the purchase.

                                                                    • 32. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                                                      Neeneko Community Member

                                                                      I am glad I found this thread since I was pondering upgrading to CS6 but slammed into this issue when first trying to put my old copy of CS5 on my new Yosemite install.  But this really gives me pause regarding further investing in Adobe products.

                                                                       

                                                                      Though what I find perplexing is that I have been using CS5 for a number of years now, moving it from machine to machine as I tend to wear though my laptops disturbingly quickly, and I have never encountered this install problem till now.   I guess it never even occurred to me that Apple initialized drives defaulted to case insensitive, I always assumed it was some kind of backward compatibility option for legacy software that no one in their right mind used.

                                                                       

                                                                      This thread did give me some possibilities for how to get around the issue at least, so gratz to people with good advice.  And although it is a curiosity that will probably forever go unsated, I would be REALLY curious to see what issue Adobe is encountering.  The only toolchain issues I am familiar with in OSX are the exact opposite, you have to fix your FS and set it to case sensitive for the tools to work and they are known broken if you try to run them on a case insensitive drive.

                                                                      • 33. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                                                        station_two Community Member

                                                                        neeneko wrote:


                                                                        …some kind of backward compatibility option for legacy software that no one in their right mind used…

                                                                         

                                                                        I've been using Macs for thirty years, I think I'm in my right mind, and yet I have never used case-sensitive drives for the simple reason that I have never had a reason to do so.

                                                                         

                                                                        So, be careful about your pronouncements.

                                                                        • 34. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                                                          Neeneko Community Member

                                                                          Sorry about that.  It was intended to be humorous but tone gets lot in text.

                                                                           

                                                                          It do find it rather perplexing though.  Case insensitive filesystems are kinda like the 8:3 pre vfat setups or the ones that could not handle spaces or special characters.  People instinctively work around it, but part of the point is there is not a 'reason' to use case sensitive, any more then there is a reason to allow file names longer than 8 characters.  Why would one actually want their filesystem to be unable to tell the difference between two different characters?  As I said, I was always under the impression that the case insensitivity was there as a backwards compatibility thing.  I am also unsure why they defaulted journaling on but case sensitivity off since both updates were introduced around the same time.  In a way they are rather similar, things mac users had been accustomed to working without for a long time and there were die hard defenders not wanting them switched on, but one became 'you can not turn this off' and the other 'you have to take extra steps to turn on'

                                                                           

                                                                          Though now I am getting flashbacks to a project where it was decided that users were too easily confused by characters that 'look' the same so we made things like '1' == 'l'.  I guess people never really needed a reason for having both (among other reductions) and got along fine without them.

                                                                          • 35. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                                                            station_two Community Member

                                                                            What good is being able to name your files with special characters if they won't work when you move them to a server or share them with a third party?

                                                                            • 36. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                                                              Neeneko Community Member

                                                                              That is part of why I would prefer case sensitive by default.   I know some server packages do the folding for you, same as some web servers do not differentiate between 'htm' and 'html' when people type in requests, but most of the time the backend server is going to be case sensitive and it is not safe to assume (or hope) that the service will fix things.  Compensating for mistakes is fine, but allowing such silent corruption is not a terribly laudable things and it encourage people be careless.

                                                                               

                                                                              Every once in a while I do encounter someone submitting some work where their configuration values and file names do not match, and 'well my laptop silently fixes it for me since it does not care' is a poor excuse.  And if I sent broken filenames upstream or even worse commit them to be used on a server, that is a pretty significant professional failure.

                                                                               

                                                                              Back to Adobe specifically, I have been trying the suggestion on poster mentioned in where one installs the Adobe applications to a case insensitive drive then copy over the installed files.  This does not quite work out of the box, but for reasons I would be hard pressed to believe are Apple's fault.

                                                                               

                                                                              For instance the first error I encounter is the inability of Bridge to load:

                                                                               

                                                                              "@executable_path/../Frameworks/WRServices.framework/Versions/A/WRServices"

                                                                               

                                                                              When I go look inside the app directories I can see that in Bridge the file has been named 'awrservices', but in Illustrator it is correctly named AWRServices.   So it looks more like a problem in whatever version control they are using.  The only way I can picture (which my adminitialy limited knowledge of what I am sure is a large and complex project with all sorts of legacy issues) that the installer toolchain factors in as a problem is if they have mismatches in their own scripts/packaging and have been depending on HFS's bad behavior to hide the problem.  I can understand not wanting to invest the time to pay down the technical debt on such an issue, but having such errors in your configuration causes long term headaches.

                                                                               

                                                                              And I say this as someone who worked on just such a project, moving a software suite that had legacy code stretching back longer than Adobe has existed as a company.  This conversion included moving from a case insenstive filesystem to a case sensitive one and yeah, there were lots of problems that the old FAT32 system hid from us, but it really paid off over the long run to fix them rather than try to twist the code to compensate.

                                                                               

                                                                              Having said that, if the problem is really that they do not want to go update their filenames (in version control or config files), then you can always add folding to your loaders.  I have had to do that a few times due to upstream people developing on case insensitive systems and sending data files with incorrect file names.  This is an old class of problem, and while I can empathize with the struggles project managers have trying to get approval for paying down technical debt, the problem never gets better on its own and usually gets worse.

                                                                               

                                                                              Which is why I responded with so much grump to the 'I never needed it' argument since that is exactly the type of customer comment that marketing tends to point to in order to push such things off the schedule.  This is the type of thing where the customer does not really know what they want because they are already accustomed to broken behavior and most of the problems are hidden from their immediate view.  It is easy to cover up the limitations since modern UI (and their search capabilities) can handle this. 

                                                                               

                                                                              It is not just arcane developers stuff, and it is the same transition that people have made with things like spaces, quotes, and parentheses, where years ago users believed they had no need for them since they were not using them, but they were only not using them because they did not work.   Today try to tell a modern user they can not put (, ", ) or even ' ' in their filenames and they would rightly question why this piece of obvious functionality is not working since today they are used to it working and no longer automatically compensate for it.

                                                                               

                                                                              I also find it ironic that by default OSX hides a number of file extensions, so from the user's perspective you can have multiple files with the exact same name displayed to them, so you can get display issues where 'foo' is the same as 'foO' if both have .txt, but 'foo' and 'foO' are not the same if one has .txt while the other is .pdf.  Add to this confusion cases like 'foo.txt' and 'foo.pdf" both being shortened to 'foo'.

                                                                              • 37. Re: CS5 install on case-sensitive file system - can't choose different drive (Mac OS)
                                                                                station_two Community Member

                                                                                Sorry, I could not read your entire newspaper.