28 Replies Latest reply: Jan 14, 2012 3:01 PM by Peter Spier Branched to a new discussion. RSS

    Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.

    SteveLCooley

      I've recently upgraded to 5.5 (from CS4) and notice that type looks horrible. I can set something with InDesign CS4 and it looks great. Type is smooth with no jagged edges. Then when I try to set the exact same text at the same pointsize and in the same font in CS5.5 it looks jagged. Even when I import an .ai file where the text has been converted to outline, it still looks horrible. Even when I convert to outline in InDesign 5.5, it looks horrible. I've tried to select Display Performance-High Quality, but it doesn't change the way the type looks at all.

       

      Is there some new setting in 5.5 that I'm missing? I've been working fine in CS4 without this issue for years. As soon as I try to work in 5.5 I see the jagged edges. It's so distracting that I can't really work in CS5.5.

       

      Any advice?

        • 1. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
          SteveLCooley Community Member

          I don't know if this has anything to do with my problem or not, but the 5.5 file I'm working with was originally created in CS5 so I convert it when I open it in 5.5. I tried to copy the text block from the converted document and paste into a new document that I created fresh in 5.5 and the type no longer looks ragged.

           

          Is there something that happens to text when you convert a CS5 document to CS5.5?

          • 2. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
            John Hawkinson Community Member

            A screenshot would help a lot.

            It sounds like a font problem through. High Quality display only affects images -- text should always be perfect.

             

            What operating system? What revision of CS5.5? (7.5.0?)

             

            Try exporting your CS5.5 document to IDML and reopening htat in CS5.5.

            • 3. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
              SteveLCooley Community Member

              Thanks John. I'm using version 7.5. I tried to export the 5.5 document as IDML and then reopening it but the type looks the same. I'm beginning to suspect the font is my problem. I'm using a legitimate copy of Garamond Premier Pro and while it doesn't look great in CS4, it does look better than using it in CS5.5.

               

              I just tried to export it as a high-res PDF and the font looks fine when viewed with Acrobat.

               

              One other weird font thing that is happening: I have a placed .ai file that contains outlined type and it too looks terrible when viewed in InDesign, even with High Quality display selected. And even in the high resolution PDF, this .ai file looks terrible.

               

              I should amend my previous reply to myself in that when I copy the type from the converted 5.5 document and place it in a newly created 5.5 document, it still has that ragged quality but not as bad as in the converted document.

               

              Being a graphic designer who works with type all day, it's a bit frustrating to look at jagged type. Unfortunately most of my clients are moving to CS5 or 5.5 so working in CS4 will soon not be an option.

              • 4. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                John Hawkinson Community Member

                Steve: Please upload a screenshot!

                Also, you didn't answer my two questions.

                 

                1. What operating system?

                2. What revision of CS5.5? (7.5.0?)

                 

                Now there are three diffrent levels of type quality -- good in CS4, horrible in CS5.5, and ragged-but-not-asbadin CS5.5?

                Wowsers.

                • 5. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                  SteveLCooley Community Member

                  Hi John,

                   

                  Regarding your second question, I did say I was using version 7.5. Am I misunderstanding something?

                   

                  Also, my operating system is Mac OS 10.6.8. I am using an old Apple Cinema Display monitor (the ones with the clear plastic tripod legs) but I've never encountered this issue before.

                   

                  And, it does look very bad in CS5.5 but a bit better in CS4. I don't have plain old CS5 so I can't say how it looks there. At any rate, I've never run into this problem in all the time I've been using CS4 with other fonts. This version of Garamond Premier Pro is new to my system (it came from a client).

                   

                  I did open one of the other jobs I created in CS5.5 and took a look at the type and it looks fine. Sorry I can't be more helpful or descritpive. As I said before, maybe I have a funky version of Garamond Premier Pro. The next time I go into my client's office, I'll check it out on their system and see how it looks.

                   

                  I'll put together some screen shots when I have a moment so you can compare. Right now I have to try to wrap up this project, jagged type and all!

                  • 6. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                    John Hawkinson Community Member

                    Regarding your second question, I did say I was using version 7.5. Am I misunderstanding something?

                    Yes! I asked what revision of CS5.5. CS5.5 is the same as 7.5. That is, "What revision of 7.5?" is an alternative way of asking. The answer would something like 7.5.0, 7.5.1, 7.5.2, etc. It should tell you in "About InDesign."

                    • 7. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                      SteveLCooley Community Member

                      When I select "About InDesign" it says "Version 7.5". There are no other numbers after the "0" in "7.0". Has it been upgraded from my version?

                      • 8. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                        SteveLCooley Community Member

                        I just selected "check for updates" in InDesign and see there is a 7.5.2. I'm updating now. Thanks!

                        • 9. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                          John Hawkinson Community Member

                          Sorry, Steve, I thought that it actually said "7.5.0" in that screen -- it's been a while. I guess it only does that if you hold down Cmd while you open it. The non-zero revs do specify the 3rd component of the version number in the regular About box.

                          • 10. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                            SteveLCooley Community Member

                            Wow. I didn't know you could hold down the command key when checking the "About" menu feature. When I do this, it says 7.5.0.142.

                             

                            I haven't completed updating InDesign as I just experienced a power outage in the middle of the updating. Boy, when it rains, it pours!

                            • 11. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                              Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

                              John says that type should be crisp at all display qualities, but I frequently see jagged type associated with Typical Display, though I'm not certain it isn't associated with a bug we've recently discussed elsewhere where the High Quality Previews revert to typical after using the scroll wheel. Try switching to the hand tool for a moment, or use one of the thumb sliders to scroll the page slightly and see if it clears up.

                              • 12. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                John Hawkinson Community Member
                                John says that type should be crisp at all display qualities, but I frequently see jagged type associated with Typical Display

                                Well, gosh, that sucks! I think that's unambiguously a bug.

                                Not only does it not happen to me, but I don't think it makes much sense (though I spend most of my time in CS5).

                                The performance win from Typical Display is that ID doesn't have to read all the data in from the image files and blit it out to the frame buffer repeatedly. But for type, the OS and graphics hardware are optimized so full high quality type doesn't pay any real performance penalty...

                                • 13. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                  Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

                                  Suck it does. And yes, I've reported the bug, but I don't have a lot of hope for a fix, at least not until CS7 or 8.

                                   

                                  At least I finally figured out the cause, and a way to restore the view quality.

                                  • 14. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                    John Hawkinson Community Member

                                    Is this your Logitech mouse problem? It sounds like maybe you should go shopping for another mouse, after all, a few bucks to save all this aggravation...

                                     

                                    Steve: Do you also use a Logitech mouse?

                                    • 15. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                      SteveLCooley Community Member

                                      Peter, I've tried using the hand tool to move the page around and the sliders. I didn't notice any difference. However I did notice that on occassion when a block of text is grabbed and moved with the cursor, the text will become extremely jagged while it's in motion. Sometimes it does this, and sometimes it does not. The best solution I've found is to take my glasses off so the entire screen is equally fuzzy!

                                      • 16. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                        SteveLCooley Community Member

                                        John, I'm using an Apple Magic Mouse. I don't notice any changes when using it to scroll around on the page. But as I mentioned, sometimes when I grab text and move it, the type becomes really ragged while in motion. Other times it does not become ragged while in motion. Go figure.

                                        • 17. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                          John Hawkinson Community Member

                                          Peter, I've tried using the hand tool to move the page around and the sliders. I didn't notice any difference.

                                          It sounds like your problem is not at all the same as Peter's bug.

                                           

                                          Is there a reason you cannot upload a screenshot? I'd really like to see what this problem looks like. Words are just not sufficient.

                                          • 18. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                            SteveLCooley Community Member

                                            Here is a screenshot of some type set in CS5.5. Notice the jaggies along the bottom of the footers, especially obivous in the larger type. I just don't ever recall seeing this type of anomoly before. Some may not think it is that bad but I find it really annoying.Screen shot 2012-01-12 at 9.43.38 PM.png

                                            • 19. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                              SteveLCooley Community Member

                                              Now that I've placed an image and view it here, it doesn't look as bad as viewing it directly in InDesign. So I'm not sure if it's helpful.

                                              • 20. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                                Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

                                                John,

                                                 

                                                I'm  not convinced the problem is isolated to Logitech mice, but I have no basis for comparison. I happen to like Logitech mice better than other brands, which is why I buy them.

                                                • 21. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                                  Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

                                                  SteveLCooley wrote:

                                                   

                                                  Now that I've placed an image and view it here, it doesn't look as bad as viewing it directly in InDesign. So I'm not sure if it's helpful.

                                                  Could be a monitor problem. As you say, it doesn't look all that bad here on the forum. Any time you are dealing with curved (or sloped) lines on a device that displays by lighting up square pixels (your monitor) you can only approximate the curve by using stair-steps -- pixels are either on or off -- and using antialiasing to smooth the appearance. The nearer the slope is at any given point to horizontal or vertical, the fewer the number of steps available to use in simulation and the more you see the jagginess.

                                                  • 22. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                                    SteveLCooley Community Member

                                                    Peter, I'm starting to believe it may be my monitor. I'm using an 8-year-old Apple Cinema Display set at 1680 x 1050 resolution. It's also connected to a Mac Mini that is connected via a DVI to ADC adaptor.

                                                    • 23. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                                      John Hawkinson Community Member

                                                      Now that I've placed an image and view it here, it doesn't look as bad as viewing it directly in InDesign. So I'm not sure if it's helpful.

                                                      Well, in of itself that may be interesting.

                                                      So, I assume when you view it in an image editor on your machine (not after uploading to the forum), you see the same thing as in the forum upload?

                                                       

                                                      So either that means the screenshot is not a faithful representation of what InDesign is displaying (that sometimes happens!), or the problem is not as severe as you thought it was?

                                                       

                                                      (It's more effort, but you may find it useful to go to QuickTime Player and use File > New Screen Recording and record a screencast, and then review it and see if you can see the problem. That is more likely to be a faithful representation, but you never know.

                                                       

                                                      Peter:

                                                      I'm  not convinced the problem is isolated to Logitech mice, but I have no basis for comparison. I happen to like Logitech mice better than other brands, which is why I buy them.

                                                      Well, you wouldn't want to put all your mice in one basket, would you? Might want to give another brand a try, just for kicks....

                                                       

                                                      I don't think Steve's problem could be inherent to monitor resolution if CS4's display is better.

                                                      • 24. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                                        SteveLCooley Community Member

                                                        John, on second glance, the same type set in CS4 doesn't look any better. I don't know what I was seeing before when I claimed it looked better in CS4. Maybe I had it set in a different typeface or something. Here is what it looks like in CS4.Screen shot 2012-01-12 at 9.45.25 PM.png

                                                        • 25. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                                          John Hawkinson Community Member

                                                          Well, it sounds like the path forward is probably fairly clear to you, but in addition to trying other monitors (or TVs with graphics input) and messing with the resolution of your current monitor, you might also play with the Universal Access (System Preferences) Seeing/Zoom feature, i.e. Cmd-Opt-Plus and Cmd-Opt-Minus (which must be enabled with Cmd-Opt-8, which is a toggle).

                                                          • 26. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                                            Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

                                                            John Hawkinson wrote:

                                                            Peter:

                                                            Well, you wouldn't want to put all your mice in one basket, would you? Might want to give another brand a try, just for kicks....

                                                            I also like the brand of car I drive. Are you suggesting I should buy something else?

                                                             

                                                            One minor annoyance is hardly worth switching to another mouse that I find more annoying most of the time (I do use other mice on other systems, just not with ID very often).

                                                            • 27. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                                              John Hawkinson Community Member

                                                              I also like the brand of car I drive. Are you suggesting I should buy something else?

                                                              If you drive a $10 car, yes!

                                                              • 28. Re: Indesign 5.5 displays text with ragged edge.
                                                                Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

                                                                I try to keep the cost of mice under $40, but can't remember the last time I found one for as little as $10. But price has nothing to do with the driver.