1 2 Previous Next 48 Replies Latest reply: Mar 6, 2012 11:11 AM by Eruditass Go to original post RSS
      • 40. Re: LR3 Fill Light vs LR4 Equivalent? With examples
        Simon Full Community Member

        How do you think full slides of 2010 fill and blacks would look on most other colour images?  The argument goes both ways it's futile.

         

        Why not go to this same driveway at night with a bucket of water and a strobe and actually try and create a nice photo from the get go.

        • 41. Re: LR3 Fill Light vs LR4 Equivalent? With examples
          areohbee Community Member

          Simon Full wrote:

           

          How do you think...

           

          I have compared the results of PV2012 to PV2010 on lots of photos by now.

           

          I'm not in the business of tutorial examples, but if you want to post your own, I'd be glad to comment.

           

          PS - While tips on taking photographs are relevant, this discussion is more about what to do after depressing the shutter release. (Jargulator may not have had a bucket of water and strobe handy at the time this photo was taken...)

           

          The issue being raised here is:

          - How does one create pleasing shadows in Lr4b1, with strong local area contrast, like (but not necessarily exactly like, nor perfectly like..., nor otherwise matching) we used to do in Lr3 with the fill slider.

           

          Well, how do you do it? (or can you?)

           

          If this were my photo of a brick driveway, I would feed it to the DNG Profile Editor and tweak the tone curve there to reshape the tone (especially blacks/shadows) before it hits the PV2012 sliders, so I'd have a fightin' chance.

           

          I'm using "brick driveway" metaphorically. As has already been noted, often times the best answer in real life is just to use the locals. But the bigger issue in my mind is how to get close without (or before) resorting to the locals.

           

          Rob

          • 42. Re: LR3 Fill Light vs LR4 Equivalent? With examples
            Keith_Reeder Community Member

            Aaronm87 wrote:

             

            There is no substitution for the old fill light tool. It was simply great. The new shadows adjustment makes photos look terrible.

             

            Absolutely disagree - I'm using the new shadows adjustment far more that I did the old fill light tool, precisely because I'm able to get better results with the new tools.

            • 43. Re: LR3 Fill Light vs LR4 Equivalent? With examples
              Keith_Reeder Community Member

              Rob Cole wrote:

               

              When things are different but better, people will get used to the changes. Its when things are different but not as good that will ultimately draw the most "complaints".

               

               

              But "better" is entirely subjective, and I am very, very satisfied with the new way of doing things - yes, I think 2012 is better than 2010.

               

              It may mean different-looking results, but they're better results.

              • 44. Re: LR3 Fill Light vs LR4 Equivalent? With examples
                Simon Full Community Member

                Since I pretty much have to control every part of a shoot there's no point in debating this with you because as always it's entirely subjective, especially when changing pretty much the entirety of an originally bland photo to make it something interesting. 

                 

                I mostly use LR for painted adjustments and colour correction to save some steps into an inevitable leap inside PS as I predominately shoot beauty so fixing skin and shape are my issues.  Fill light wasn't great and took control of a large range of darks and mid-tones which have now been addressed and split into something a little more professional.

                 

                 

                Rob Cole wrote:

                 

                The issue being raised here is:

                - How does one create pleasing shadows in Lr4b1, with strong local area contrast

                 

                Sounds like the answer is in the question here... 'local' (adjustments)

                 

                I'm glad for the 2012 process it has a much better set of tools than before for fine tweaks. However I'm far happier that whatever you say won't change it in the slightest.  It's a minority thing you see.

                • 45. Re: LR3 Fill Light vs LR4 Equivalent? With examples
                  hillrg Community Member

                  I just wanted to pipe in as a user that is extremely pleased with the 2012 process.  I am concerned that the continual criticisms by a small number of users is taken out of context.  Users that are happy are unlikely to speak up.  I understand this is a discussion forum and I in no way am suggesting people should not speak up, only that their comments be put into perspective.  This all strikes me as a tempest in a teapot.

                   

                  In my experience, in order to get the look I am after using 2012:

                   

                  • I can usually nail it with the basic sliders
                  • Sometimes I also tweak the tone curves to suplement the basic controls
                  • If there is a part of the image that isn't right then local adjustments does the trick

                   

                  All this adds up to a happy user.

                  • 46. Re: LR3 Fill Light vs LR4 Equivalent? With examples
                    Cornelia-I Community Member

                    hillrg wrote:

                     

                    I am concerned that the continual criticisms by a small number of users is taken out of context.  Users that are happy are unlikely to speak up. 

                    Why do you think so? I have read many positive posts and comments what works for people in PV2012.

                     

                    hillrg wrote:

                     

                    This all strikes me as a tempest in a teapot.

                    Why so judgemental?

                    I think we have established that there are some cases for images which benefitted from PV2010-imperfections. Or which are so extreme that they get new halos.

                     

                    Personally I put good faith in Adobe's approach, to ask exactly for such cases to investigate if further finetuning to the algorithms is possible w/o other collateral damage. I would never expect that they might get discouraged with PV2012.

                    Some things may end on a technical roadmap for 4.x-releases or even 5, or traded for another priority.

                    But collecting feedback is good, no?

                    What are you afraid of?

                     

                    Cornelia

                    • 47. Re: LR3 Fill Light vs LR4 Equivalent? With examples
                      Eruditass Community Member

                      Keith_Reeder wrote:

                       

                      Rob Cole wrote:

                       

                      When things are different but better, people will get used to the changes. Its when things are different but not as good that will ultimately draw the most "complaints".

                       

                       

                      But "better" is entirely subjective, and I am very, very satisfied with the new way of doing things - yes, I think 2012 is better than 2010.

                       

                      It may mean different-looking results, but they're better results.

                      As I stated above, I think 2012 is better than 2010 in general and overall, but there are some things that 2010 did better.

                       

                      hillrg wrote:

                       

                      I just wanted to pipe in as a user that is extremely pleased with the 2012 process.  I am concerned that the continual criticisms by a small number of users is taken out of context.  Users that are happy are unlikely to speak up.  I understand this is a discussion forum and I in no way am suggesting people should not speak up, only that their comments be put into perspective.  This all strikes me as a tempest in a teapot.

                       

                      In my experience, in order to get the look I am after using 2012:

                       

                      • I can usually nail it with the basic sliders
                      • Sometimes I also tweak the tone curves to suplement the basic controls
                      • If there is a part of the image that isn't right then local adjustments does the trick

                       

                      All this adds up to a happy user.

                       

                      Try to read the comments in this thread instead of making such leaps of judgment.  I think most/everyone here is in general happy with the 2012 way of doing things.

                      • 48. Re: LR3 Fill Light vs LR4 Equivalent? With examples
                        Eruditass Community Member

                        Simon Full wrote:

                         

                        Since I pretty much have to control every part of a shoot there's no point in debating this with you because as always it's entirely subjective, especially when changing pretty much the entirety of an originally bland photo to make it something interesting. 

                         

                        I mostly use LR for painted adjustments and colour correction to save some steps into an inevitable leap inside PS as I predominately shoot beauty so fixing skin and shape are my issues.  Fill light wasn't great and took control of a large range of darks and mid-tones which have now been addressed and split into something a little more professional.

                         

                         

                        Rob Cole wrote:

                         

                        The issue being raised here is:

                        - How does one create pleasing shadows in Lr4b1, with strong local area contrast

                         

                        Sounds like the answer is in the question here... 'local' (adjustments)

                         

                        I'm glad for the 2012 process it has a much better set of tools than before for fine tweaks. However I'm far happier that whatever you say won't change it in the slightest.  It's a minority thing you see.

                        We've already discussed the answer of local adjustments.  As I've said, the 2012 process does have a much better set of tools.  No one here cares to change your opinion on the tools, but you've come to this thread to change ours.  This thread was about spreading information.  The bland photo was taken as a case study to show an extreme example, but applies in many other photos I've taken.

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