21 Replies Latest reply: Apr 23, 2012 2:19 AM by inquestflash RSS

    conditional text export to post script and distilled

    inquestflash Community Member

      hello indesigners.

       

      i have a bit of a task asked to be done!i have never came across and issue like this one,so id like your help please.

       

      i have been asked to make a brochure with 3 different languages,so i set up conditional text and made up 3 conditions in the contitions panel

      each language has a spot colour applied to it,in order to be separated when posted scripted and distilled.but when the post script is distilled

      i can olny see one language.is there a way all languages can appear on a colour seperation with out one language overlapping the other

       

      u2a.jpg

      u2a2.jpg

        • 1. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
          Manish-Sharma Employee Hosts

          How have you applied the Pantone color on the conditional text , as if I know there are defined color set and you can create the custom color but how to apply the pantone color?

          • 2. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
            Eugene Tyson CommunityMVP

            Have you tried a direct export to PDF using File>Export>PDF (print)

             

            ?

            • 3. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
              Peter Spier CommunityMVP

              I don't think you've approached this correctly. First, I don't use conditional text on a regular basis, but my understanding is the color you assign to the condition has nothing to do with the color assigned to the text. It's just a reference color, like a layer color, to make it easy for you to keep things sorted when you look at the page. To separate the text onto individual plates you'll need to assign a spot color to the text itself under Character Color in the style definition (and you'll need a set of styles for each language).

               

              Second, I think you are trying to output all the different plates in one go. Unless you have overlapping frames, your conditional text is not going to overlap one language with another. The normal usage for conditional text is to put it into the same running text and show or hide, causing the text to reflow. In order for all the languages to separate at once, they all need to be visible at the same time, and if they are all in the same frame they can't overlap. If you need overlapping frames, it might be easier to use layers. A further complicatioin is that if all if the text is overlapping, all of it needs to be set to overprint, not just the Black plate that overprints by default.

               

              Ultimately this probably comes down to you need to output once for each language. You can hide your conditions for the languages not needed and output just the set of text plates for each language one at a time, or personally, I'd probably forget the conditional text and probably the spot colors, and either make separate files for each language (which I think is what Joel would recommend and he's the translation expert) or use layers and show or hide the language layers as needed.  I've seen files where the text was set in a spot black so it wasn't on the same plates as the graphical elements, but the value of this would depend, I think, on the printing workflow and only be of use if the text was not being laid down at the same time as the color, and again, you 'd have to set the spot color text to overprint.

              • 4. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                Peter Spier CommunityMVP

                Eugene Tyson wrote:

                 

                Have you tried a direct export to PDF using File>Export>PDF (print)

                 

                ?

                In this case it appears that he's trying to make the separations himself (at least that's the way I nterpreted it) directly from ID, and you can't do that when you export.

                • 5. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                  Manish-Sharma Employee Hosts

                  @ Peter ..I sill have the question how one can select spot color while creating the condition for the conditional text?

                   

                  As if I know we have to define the custom color which would not be a spot color , hence seperation want work in this case.

                  • 6. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                    Peter Spier CommunityMVP

                    Manish,

                     

                    If I understand your question, you can't assign a spot color to the text by adding a condition, you have to do that as a separate task -- text color and condition are not related. However, if the conditions will be mutually exclusive and not all visible at the time of output, there is no requirement that each language have a unique color because you are manually separating them onto different plates by hiding the ones you don't want.

                    • 7. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                      inquestflash Community Member

                      hello gentlemen.

                       

                      yes i am trying to make the seperation myself,so i think ill go with putting each language on a seperate layer,saving as pos script one laungaue at a time.

                      and then dargging each post script file into distiller.and see what happens.

                      • 8. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                        Peter Spier CommunityMVP

                        Looks like you are using Windows, so you can shortcut by Printing to PDF (it automatically prints to postscript and invokes distiller so you don't need to do it manually).

                        • 9. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                          Manish-Sharma Employee Hosts

                          @ Peter

                           

                          Exactly...I tried to replicate the issue but was not able to apply the spot color on the text and even was not able to select the spot color for teh condition , but the OP said that the spot color is used in the condition and based on that the seperation is done.....at that time I got confused as I believe we can only choosed RGB color for Conditions not the spot color of our wish and specially Pantone.

                           

                          As you said it is for the representation purpose only like in layer color,  I had the same understanding  but I thought better get my fact clear before posting anything.

                          • 10. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                            Peter Spier CommunityMVP

                            I think I may be responsible for some confusion here. Looks like I misread the original message a little. It doesn't say he applied the spot color as part of the condition or applied the spot color to the condition (that's waht happens when I start reading complicated posts as soon as I wake up), and if you look closer than I did at the screen shots you'll see the condition colors don't match the spot colors assigned to the languages.

                             

                            My apologies for that.

                             

                            Doesn't change the strategy, however.

                            • 11. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                              inquestflash Community Member

                              hello gentlemen

                               

                              as im trying to work around this problem.another method im experiment with isi got rid of the conditional text and simply having each language in its own text frame

                              so im putting each language one on top of each other,and each language has its own spot colour.ofcourse since each language overlaps one another its a mess.

                              so when i do the postscript file and then distil it,this is the result im getting,the top text frame is readable and the other 2 have been overlapped looking like a mess.

                              so is there a way in indesign i can use some command to ge tthe desired result?

                               

                               

                              spansish is on top,then german then english. so spansh prevails in the distilled file.

                               

                              u2a.jpg

                              • 12. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                                Manish-Sharma Employee Hosts

                                this is something which would happen....because when you are creating the Postcript that means you will be creating the file for print and while printing the color overlapping doesn't happen..

                                 

                                create 3 different layer , and DRAG the "spanish" and "english" in the layer to the new layer you will create.

                                 

                                When making the PDF or postscript , show the layers for the language which you want and hide the other, and then create PDF or postscript.

                                • 13. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                                  inquestflash Community Member

                                  hello manish,thats what i thought,to make 3 seperate layers and exporting as a seperate language to postcript meaning i will have 3 psds in total.upto here good.

                                  so once i have doen this,i have seen that i can make a native pdf file using adobe acrobat file,and i see an option

                                  combine files into pdf,so i have draged and droped them,so im getting each language seperate with its spot colour,the only bad thng is it doesnt name each file like it was from the disttiled file:cyan magenda yellow black and then each page with its spot colour value,rather than just page 1 2 3 4 5 and so on,so is there a way maybe for acrobat to keep the naming of its pages?would it matter to the printer?or should he be able to view the spot colours on each page?

                                   

                                  u2a1.jpg

                                  • 14. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                                    Peter Spier CommunityMVP

                                    Perhaps I wasn't clear enough in my original response. To do the layer method you must TURN OFF ALL BUT ONE LANGUAGE (hide the layers) and make separate PDFs of the language plates,

                                     

                                    OR you must set EVERY language frame to overprint to get separations where the languages higher in the stack have not knocked out the text on lower layers (or knocked out any background they might overlap).

                                     

                                    I think it's easier to leave all langiuages set in [Black], which should overprint by default, and hide layers.

                                     

                                    No matter what method you choose, if all language layers are visible at the same time it will be difficult to work, and a composite PDF will be a mess.

                                    • 15. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                                      inquestflash Community Member

                                      Hello peter.

                                       

                                      The way i finaly over came this issue,was to simply add overprint to each text frame,since each text frame had a spot colour assigned to it.i finaly exported it as postscript distilled it

                                      and each colour pallet has its own seperation and the text is INTACT!

                                       

                                      "set EVERY language frame to overprint to get separations where the languages higher in the stack have not knocked out the text on lower layers (or knocked out any background they might overlap"

                                       

                                      Best regards

                                       

                                       

                                      just for the inofromation,this method in general postscripting and distilling is it for graphic designers to do so?,or is it for the pre press departments job to do all these seperations etc etc?

                                      • 16. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                                        Peter Spier CommunityMVP

                                        In general, it is the responsibility of the pre-press department at the printer to make separations and impose the file for printing. It is the designer's responsibility, however, to provide a document that will separate correctly.

                                        • 17. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                                          inquestflash Community Member

                                          hello peter

                                           

                                          just one more detail i need to point out,my pdf document i have distilled,all my images and text appear in black and white

                                          so is that the way the colour seperations are supposed to appaer?

                                          • 18. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                                            Peter Spier CommunityMVP

                                            When you make separations you are creating a grayscale image of what will print in each ink color. This represents either exposed or unexposed areas on the plates. The darker the gray, the darker the color.

                                             

                                            For a good understanding of what you are seeing, go to Window > Output > Separations Preview... and turn ON the separatations preview, then turn off the visibility of all but one plate at a time.

                                             

                                            Have you talked to the printer to determine that they really want you to be making separations? That would be a very unusual request.

                                            • 19. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                                              inquestflash Community Member

                                              good evening peter.

                                               

                                              that was awesome that seperation preview command.Since this is a classroom exercise there is no printer.just for us students to be aware of

                                              pantone seperations within an idesign file,and also how to use postscript and distiller.

                                               

                                              Best Regards

                                              • 20. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                                                Peter Spier CommunityMVP

                                                I guess I would have to say it's a valuable lesson to learn about how separations work. I used to take the film and plates for a four-color job into my classroom, along with the finished print, but the probabilty that you will need to actually make your own separations (using the separtions preview is very common, though), or need to print to postscript and distill, are both pretty slim in this century unless you work in pre-press.

                                                 

                                                I used to have to make seps from my Windows files for the printer who only had Macs, but I haven't done that in more than ten years, and not at all since printers started accepting PDF.

                                                • 21. Re: conditional text export to post script and distilled
                                                  inquestflash Community Member

                                                  I guess anything we learn will be valuable even if not used these days.

                                                   

                                                  ill be asking heaps of more questions as were getting into the advanced semister soon.

                                                   

                                                  Regards.