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1. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
John Hawkinson Apr 24, 2012 10:11 PM (in response to posterns)Are you running maintenance revsion 7.0.4?
What operating system?
Have you tried turning off Live Preflight?
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2. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
posterns Apr 25, 2012 6:14 AM (in response to John Hawkinson)Running the latest version. On Mac OSX 10.7.3. Have not tried shutting off Live preflight, although just turned it off and tried opening file. Got a bit further in opening but still hung. Did try one thing that kind of works -- moved the ID file out of the collected folder and that seems to work.
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3. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
John Hawkinson Apr 25, 2012 6:20 AM (in response to posterns)Running the latest version.
Respectfully, this does not answer the question.
Many people make this statement and happen to be wrong
What is the precise 3-dotted version number reported by holding down Command and selecting About InDesign?
Moving the file out of the collected folder suggests the problem relates to opening a link. Not too surprising...
Depending on the version information I may have additional advice.
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4. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
AMreso Apr 25, 2012 6:22 AM (in response to posterns)hi !
jfreestern
Try this, delete the Mark II folder
location of Mark II folder :
Mac OS: [Startup Disk]/Library/Applications Support/Adobe/SING/Mark II
Windows 7/Vista: C:\ProgramData\Adobe\SING\Mark II
Windows XP: C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\Adobe\SING\Mark II
thanks
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5. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
posterns Apr 25, 2012 6:28 AM (in response to John Hawkinson)Sorry. Version is 7.0.4.553
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6. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
posterns Apr 25, 2012 6:30 AM (in response to posterns)What does this folder handle??
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7. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
John Hawkinson Apr 25, 2012 6:37 AM (in response to posterns)Thanks for clarifying (7.0.4.553)
With that in mind, when you experience a hang, there are two diagnostics you can gather that can help us determine why InDesign is hung,
both long files from Activity Monitor. So hang InDesign and start Activity Monitor.
1) Select InDesign, choose Sample Process, and save the file. Upload it to http://pastebin.com/ and post a link here.
2) Choose View > Send Signal: Abort (SIGABRT). This will force InDesign to crash, and generate a crash report. Upload the crash report to http://pastebin.com/ and post a link here.
Ashutosh's suggestion hypothesizes the problem is SING, Smart Independent Glyphlets. See http://helpx.adobe.com/indesign/kb/hang-freeze-open-create-file.html. It certainly could be, and his suggestion will do no harm otherwise.
With the above diagnostics we could certainly tell if the problem was SING, but there's not enough information to know at this point.
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8. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
AMreso Apr 25, 2012 6:43 AM (in response to posterns)jfreestern
Mark II folder :
In some cases, this is caused by corrupt data related to the Smart INdependent Glyphlets (SING) component, which handles use of single glyph font files used to represent custom glyph needs to extend standard font glyph sets. This is primarily used in Chinese, Japanese, and Korean (CJK) documents.
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9. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
Peter Spier Apr 25, 2012 6:59 AM (in response to posterns)jfreestern wrote:
Did try one thing that kind of works -- moved the ID file out of the collected folder and that seems to work.
This suggests to me that the problem may be realted to a linked file, but you should run John's suggested diagnostics to verify.
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10. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
posterns Apr 25, 2012 8:49 AM (in response to John Hawkinson)Ok.
Here are the links (if I did this correctly):
The Sample Process Link: http://pastebin.com/CWuQHNkw
The InDesign Crash Report: http://pastebin.com/TtjhSe7G
Thanks for looking at this.
Jeff
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11. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
Manish-SharmaApr 25, 2012 9:44 AM (in response to posterns)
Do you have any Font management software installed?
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12. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
AMreso Apr 25, 2012 9:48 AM (in response to posterns)jfreestern
Have you tried to remove the Mark II folder .
try it now, It will work.
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13. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
posterns Apr 25, 2012 9:53 AM (in response to Manish-Sharma)Yes Suitcase Fusion 3, but also had turned that off and tried FontXplorer X due to the Fusion 3 problems with hangs after sleep. The hang occurred under both.
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14. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
John Hawkinson Apr 25, 2012 9:59 AM (in response to posterns)Here are the links (if I did this correctly):
The Sample Process Link: http://pastebin.com/CWuQHNkw
The InDesign Crash Report: http://pastebin.com/TtjhSe7G
Jeff, yes, those are correct.
The first indicates that InDesign is stuck in font manipulation code, and the second is somewhat more precise about where:
Thread 0 Crashed:: Main Thread Dispatch queue: com.apple.main-thread
0 AdobeCoolType 0x009060cc CTCleanup + 338232
1 AdobeCoolType 0x009046d2 CTCleanup + 331582
2 AdobeCoolType 0x008ab7cd 0x855000 + 354253
3 com.adobe.InDesign.Font Manager 0x14c4d7ea 0x14c42000 + 47082
4 com.adobe.InDesign.Font Manager 0x14c4dfc0 0x14c42000 + 49088
5 com.adobe.InDesign.Font Manager 0x14cd53cf GetPlugIn + 440303
6 com.adobe.InDesign.Font Manager 0x14c873a7 GetPlugIn + 120775
7 com.adobe.InDesign.Font Manager 0x14c90dfe GetPlugIn + 160286
8 com.adobe.InDesign.Font Manager 0x14c752d8 GetPlugIn + 46840
9 com.adobe.InDesign.Font Manager 0x14c76e28 GetPlugIn + 53832
10 com.adobe.InDesign.Font Manager 0x14c7708c GetPlugIn + 54444
11 com.adobe.InDesign.Font Manager 0x14c76c83 GetPlugIn + 53411
12 com.adobe.InDesign.Font Manager 0x14c77249 GetPlugIn + 54889
13 com.adobe.InDesign.Font Manager 0x14c9bdc4 GetPlugIn + 205284
14 com.adobe.InDesign.AppFramework 0x0e1323cf GetPlugIn + 54943
Unfortunately, this signature is not consistent with either SING problems or problems with third-party font management tools, both of which have easy fixes.
The best we can say is probably "sounds like a corrupt font or group of conflicting fonts."
So, start by removing all non-system fonts and seeing if ID will open your document.
Assuming that works:
Then, divide the set of removed fonts in half and put half of the back -- see if it works.
If so, add another half set back, etc., etc. until you pinpoint the bad font.
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15. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
posterns Apr 25, 2012 10:08 AM (in response to John Hawkinson)Thanks John. Any idea why it will open if I move the file outside of the folder?
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16. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
John Hawkinson Apr 25, 2012 10:15 AM (in response to posterns)Thanks John. Any idea why it will open if I move the file outside of the folder?
Oh, gosh, I got that detail mixed up with someone else's question and lost track of it.
If you move it out of the folder, it may have difficulty finding linked content.
If that linked content depends on a font, then it can trigger the problem.
You could also try to divide-and-conquer approach on the links associated with the file. This might be trickier because of how InDesign remembers file paths...
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17. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
posterns Apr 25, 2012 10:20 AM (in response to AMreso)Ashutosh
Tried moving the MarkII folder to my desktop (and renaming just in case) and then opening the file -- still got the same hang.
Jeff
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18. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
posterns Apr 25, 2012 10:22 AM (in response to John Hawkinson)Also one other related question. If it's font related, why is it that after the hang and force quit, when I start up ID again, the file automatically opens (with all fonts in doc. loaded)?
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19. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
John Hawkinson Apr 25, 2012 10:26 AM (in response to posterns)Well, we're guessing. but it's a font-related BUG.
Bugs are tricky things. Their behavior can change depending on the precise path that they are approached from.
Perhaps ID treats opening a new document a little differently than crash-recovering a document and the problem fails to manifest...perhaps there is an ordering dependency?
It's definitely a bug. What is triggering it is hard to say. I suspect a corrupt font, but I could be wrong.
Certainly not everything in your story lines up perfectly with that theory...
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20. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
Peter Spier Apr 25, 2012 10:51 AM (in response to John Hawkinson)The moving outside the folder might also point to something with the Document Installed Fonts feature. Try moving it back where it was in the package folder and move the document fonts folder out, or rename it, and see if that works.
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21. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
posterns Apr 25, 2012 3:26 PM (in response to Peter Spier)Yes. If I move the fonts folder outside the document package folder the file opens right up.
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22. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
Peter Spier Apr 25, 2012 3:31 PM (in response to posterns)Sounds like the problem is one of the packaged fonts.
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23. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
posterns Apr 25, 2012 5:49 PM (in response to Peter Spier)Although wouldn't they be the same as the ones loading from Suitcase Fusion? -- that is, if InDesign is trying to load the fonts from the packaged font folder when the ID file is in the folder, what fonts is the file using when the file is outside the folder (those already loaded in Fusion)? and if it's the Fusion fonts, they would in theory be the same fonts that ID collected and packaged, yes?
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24. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
John Hawkinson Apr 25, 2012 11:51 PM (in response to posterns)Well, Peter's explanation makes much more sense than mine about linked fonts in PDF files... it also explains why crash recovery works differently, since presumably crash recovery doesn't look for the Document Fonts file associated with the original document's path (perhaps a bug?).
Although wouldn't they be the same as the ones loading from Suitcase Fusion? -- that is, if InDesign is trying to load the fonts from the packaged font folder when the ID file is in the folder, what fonts is the file using when the file is outside the folder (those already loaded in Fusion)? and if it's the Fusion fonts, they would in theory be the same fonts that ID collected and packaged, yes?
Well, maaaybe. It depends on how you have Suitcase set up and whether the fonts are indeed the same, and where they came from, and so-on and so-forth.
So go ahead and split out half the fonts from Document Fonts and keep narrowing until you find the problem. Even if you have 128 fonts in there that's only 7 divsions in half before you find the font that's the problem (assuming only one is the problem...).
Please let us know what happens!
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25. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
Peter Spier Apr 26, 2012 4:52 AM (in response to posterns)jfreestern wrote:
Although wouldn't they be the same as the ones loading from Suitcase Fusion? -- that is, if InDesign is trying to load the fonts from the packaged font folder when the ID file is in the folder, what fonts is the file using when the file is outside the folder (those already loaded in Fusion)? and if it's the Fusion fonts, they would in theory be the same fonts that ID collected and packaged, yes?
I wouldn't swear to it, but I think Suitcase would be entirely bypassed in this case. I know, for instance, that ID uses the Document Fonts rather than the installed versions if both are present.
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26. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
posterns Apr 26, 2012 5:13 AM (in response to Peter Spier)Also just for clarification, when a job is packaged from ID and the fonts that are being used are loaded through Suitcase, when ID collects the fonts, isn't it pulling them from Suitcase's database (I have all my fonts in the Suitcase Fusion database)? If yes, then they should be one and the same fonts -- that is the ones in the collected fonts folder should be the same as the ones in my suitcase database unless some damage is occuring during collection -- correct? (Also, all the fonts used in the booklet are fonts that I had previously installed in Suitcase (none were sent to me by others)--unless an embedded font in a PDF that I placed into the document could be causing an issue or conflict with my fonts??
Anyway, I'll give John's suggestion a try in a day or two when I have some time, and re-post.
Thanks for your help in the meantime.
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27. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
John Hawkinson Apr 26, 2012 6:28 AM (in response to posterns)Also just for clarification, when a job is packaged from ID and the fonts that are being used are loaded through Suitcase, when ID collects the fonts, isn't it pulling them from Suitcase's database (I have all my fonts in the Suitcase Fusion database)?
Essentially yes, if indeed the job is packaged on the same machine with the same configuration as the machine where it is later opened. That may be the case in your situation, but it is not necessarily generally true.
And for clarity, to be technical, ID is not pulling the fonts from Suitcase's database
ID takes the fonts from the OS. Suitcase provides them to the OS. So there is a level of indirection involved, and that indirection may reflect the opportunity for bugs in the OS and bugs in Suitcase and bugs in InDesign to all interact in new (or old) and exciting (always) ways.
If yes, then they should be one and the same fonts -- that is the ones in the collected fonts folder should be the same as the ones in my suitcase database unless some damage is occuring during collection -- correct? (Also, all the fonts used in the booklet are fonts that I had previously installed in Suitcase (none were sent to me by others)--unless an embedded font in a PDF that I placed into the document could be causing an issue or conflict with my fonts??
So, yes, it sounds like they should be the same fonts. And that certainly begs the question why it would be different if ID loads a font from Document Fonts versus Suitcase loading a font through the OS mechanism. But certainly they are different mechanisms and may have different bugs.
Peter wrote:
I wouldn't swear to it, but I think Suitcase would be entirely bypassed in this case. I know, for instance, that ID uses the Document Fonts rather than the installed versions if both are present.
Well, Suitcase installs a hook that gets triggered when ID loads a document--this is autoactivation. It causes Suitcase to stop and load fonts when the document is opened. At which point it could do anything... Only then, after Suitcase does whatever it does (with auto-activation enabled, only, of course), then ID will do what it does (either loading from the OS or loading from Document Fonts).
Plenty of room for all sorts of problems...
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28. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
posterns Apr 26, 2012 6:48 AM (in response to John Hawkinson)Godd explanations and I agree lots of room for problems. Will give things a try a bit later. Thanks again for the comments and suggestions.
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29. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
John Hawkinson May 5, 2012 5:17 PM (in response to posterns)jfreestern wrote at Apr 26, 2012 9:48 AM:
Good explanations and I agree lots of room for problems. Will give things a try a bit later.
Any updates?
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30. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
posterns May 8, 2012 8:52 AM (in response to John Hawkinson)Hi John
Was off on an offsite freelance job all last week so wasn't working off my home system. So just tested moving fonts out of the collected folder and it turns out it has to do with HelveticaNeue.dfont. I didn't use the dfont although turns out it a few stray spaces in the document still had it applied (probably from bringin in some word documents). Anyway, once I pulled that from the folder the document opens just fine.
Jeff
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31. Re: InDesign CS5 hangs when opening large file
JAWWS Aug 2, 2012 7:57 AM (in response to posterns)Jeff,
I'm really happy to have found this discussion. I've just had the identical problem, using (I think) identical software. I'm not sure I followed every detail of the conversation above, but all the behaviors described matched what was happening with my files. I had gotten as far as determining that renaming the Document Fonts folder (even by just one letter, to, for instance, "ocument Fonts") was enough to make the problem go away, but I had no idea why. Reading the above post led me to remove HelveticaNeue-CondensedBold.dfont from the Document Fonts folder (it was the only .dfont in the folder), and voila! The problem is fixed. Thanks for sharing the problem and solution.
— (another) Jeff