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    [CS6] DV - Bad output quality

    Admiral Cook Community Member

      I have a problem with DV output quality in Premiere CS6 6.0.1.

       

      Nonrendered  and rendered video looks the same on external monitor - blurish.

       

      - Mercury Software only

      - DV PAL sequence

      - DV AVI video + Premiere title

       

      There is also bigger delay than with CS5.5 with outputing through firewire. It takes about a second to update image on external monitor after clicking on different part of the timeline.

        • 1. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
          Admiral Cook Community Member

          Just to add some more info:

           

          - Windows 7 x64 SP1 + all updates

          - GTX 460 1GB with 301.42 drivers

          - Sony HVR M15E recorder

          - Tried with or without Mercury HW

          - Tried with regular and legacy firewire drivers

          • 2. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
            Admiral Cook Community Member

            OMG Export to Tape also does not work.

             

            Machine is recording but timeline is not playing.

            • 3. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
              Admiral Cook Community Member

              Any answer on catastrophic DV support in CS6?

               

              I'm forced to go back to old and great CS 5.5 if there is no any solution or patch planned for this.

              • 4. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                John T Smith CommunityMVP

                >solution or patch planned

                 

                You need to tell the Adobe engineers https://www.adobe.com/cfusion/mmform/index.cfm?name=wishform

                • 5. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                  Admiral Cook Community Member

                  Told them and I'm going back to 5.5.

                   

                  CS3 - nice

                  CS4 - slow

                  CS5 - great

                  CS6 - nice ideas, bad implementation (unfinished work?)

                  CS7 (or maybe CS 6.5) may probably come as what CS6 needed to be

                  • 6. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                    Admiral Cook Community Member

                    There is more...

                     

                    You have nice graohic card and you are able to use hardware accelerated playback.

                    Timeline is playing fine, without any rendering required.

                     

                    You now want to export this to tape, but... it first renders yellow areas.

                     

                    Why this?

                     

                    As I said previously it will not export to tape anyway. Machine goes recording but timeline is not playing.

                    • 7. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                      Mitch W Employee Hosts

                      Hi AC,

                       

                      Make sure that you've selected and setup the Adobe DV playback preference under Edit > Preferences > Playback. This should help resolve the export to tape problem. Make sure to report back if it doesn't.

                      • 8. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                        Admiral Cook Community Member

                        Hi Mitch,

                         

                        Playback settings are in default state, I've only enabled "Adobe DV":

                         

                        dvout.png

                         

                        I've tried changing these options but always the same results: machine is recording but CTI stays at the beggining of the timeline.

                         

                        There is no option to choose External Device for Export as we had it in previous versions. Is this OK?

                         

                        http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/attachments/panasonic-dvx-dvc-assistant/26658d1336410913-cant-export-tape-dv-settings.jpg

                        • 9. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                          Mitch W Employee Hosts

                          Correct. There is no external device option as in previous versions. This is now handled as part of the transmit feature and is selected in the playback prefs. If you are using a combination DV/HDV device, make sure to go into the device's menu settings and select DV as the VCR mode. If the device is set to Auto or HDV, it won't properly detect the incoming signal. Once you tell it what to expect, it should work correctly. Make sure you've setup the DV Device Control options for your device (also under preferences). With the device connected and powered on, the device control options should show the device status as "online".  Now choose File > Export > Tape and you should be good to go.

                          • 10. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                            Admiral Cook Community Member

                            I've set it to DV, and device is properly recognized by the software (status: online).

                             

                            I can capture, output is working, and machine starts recording when exporting to tape, but timeline stays at zero.

                             

                            I'll post later some pictures and videos of what happens when switching between the sequences or program/source monitors. Signal is lost for a second and there is a delay while updating picture on external monitor (while moving CTI).

                            • 11. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                              Admiral Cook Community Member

                              Any idea on why with CPU rendering DV output looks the same either if rendered or not (blurish)?

                              • 12. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                Admiral Cook Community Member

                                Short video clip where you can see what happens when switching between the sequences:

                                 

                                http://videobam.com/AOtFK

                                 

                                Same happens when switching between the sequence and the source monitor.

                                 

                                I've also taken some pictures to show output quality differences between GPU and CPU rendering but unfortunately they are hard to notice on the images... SW is blurred, HW sharper.

                                 

                                WP_000858.png

                                • 13. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                  Harm Millaard Community Member

                                  That looks logical, since hardware MPE always uses maximum quality and software MPE does not by default.

                                  • 14. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                    Zac Lam Employee Hosts

                                    Hi AC, from your screenshot you've selected Adobe DV as one of your Video Devices for transmit, but have you also selected it as your Audio Device?  This is similar to the "External Device Audio" setting for DV playback in previous versions.

                                    • 15. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                      Admiral Cook Community Member

                                      Hi Harm,

                                       

                                      Sure, but the problem is unchanged output quality after rendering in SW mode.

                                       

                                      Add clip, add title > red line, blurred image on the external monitor

                                      Hit Enter to render > green line, but no any changes in output, stays blurred

                                       

                                       

                                      Hi Zac,

                                       

                                      I've switched from Desktop to DV Audio too and I have no problems with A/V sync.

                                      • 16. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                        Zac Lam Employee Hosts

                                        Hi AC,

                                         

                                        Great, so during Export to Tape, the CTI is moving now right?

                                         

                                        If you want to turn on the setting Harm suggests for comparable settings in Software mode, go to Sequence > Sequence Settings, and under Video Previews, choose Maximum Render Quality.  Then try recomparing.

                                         

                                        Zac

                                        • 17. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                          Admiral Cook Community Member

                                          No matter what I try... it renders audio, then rewinds the tape to defined timecode, then goes recording, but timeline sleeps. I only haven't tried to export with Assemble deactivated. I'll do it tomorrow and let you know what happens.

                                           

                                          I don't need maximum render quality. My problem is not difference between HW and SW Mercury but rendered quality in SW mode, which is completely the same as nonrendered.

                                           

                                          CS5.5 is great in all of this on the same hardware, with the same settings.

                                          • 18. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                            Admiral Cook Community Member

                                            Export to Tape works when "Assemble at timecode" is deactivated.

                                             

                                            However when I enable this option timeline won't play while machine starts recording.

                                            • 19. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                              Paul@NYSMSC Community Member

                                              Admiral Cook,

                                               

                                              I agree with your finding.  PP6.01 doesn't roll the timeline when "Assemble at timecode" is checked.

                                               
                                              My VTR's will go into REC mode but no data is coming into the machine via firewire("No input" error message on SONY DSR-1500A), Premiere timeline does not play as VTR is recording. 

                                               

                                               

                                              Unchecking the Assemble edit option, deck records, timeline plays, data is output via firewire.

                                               

                                              I have the same results on SONY DSR-1500A, DSR-45 and DSR-11 tape machines.

                                               

                                              Using the same hardware and PP project file/settings works under PP5.5.

                                               

                                               

                                               


                                              • 20. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                Zac Lam Employee Hosts

                                                Thanks AC and Paul@NYN, we've opened up bug #3286805 and our QE will do some further investigation.  We appreciate you providing your deck model info.

                                                • 21. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                  Paul@NYSMSC Community Member

                                                  Zac,

                                                   

                                                  Glad to hear QE is going to be looking into this.  I had to go back to 5.5 for output today.  Lucky for me they were easy timelines to recreate.

                                                   

                                                  There's some details I didn't include in my bug report, can you see that QE gets the following additional info(or is there a way to append to an existing bug report?). 

                                                   

                                                  - Once the "Assemble at timecode" option is attempted and fails, any subsequent record attempts fail as well.  Until I toggle off/on the Adobe DV Video Device in the Preferences/Playback dialog.

                                                   

                                                   

                                                  - This bug issue occurs whether MPE is in Hardware or Software mode( I'm using a Quadro 4000).

                                                   

                                                  - From this User's point of view it seems that, in Assemble mode, the application is not properly "seeing" a record acknowledgement from the deck, it's just sitting there waiting to roll the queued timeline.

                                                   

                                                  Thanks.

                                                  • 22. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                    Admiral Cook Community Member

                                                    Thanks for the updates.

                                                     

                                                    Btw I'm using Sony HVR M15E.

                                                    • 23. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                      Paul@NYSMSC Community Member

                                                      I actually missed quoted one of my VTR models, the DSR-11 is actually a HVR-M15U(I tell PP it's a DSR-11 in the device config.).  FWIW, at least we are seeing the issue in both PAL & NTSC worlds.

                                                      • 24. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                        Admiral Cook Community Member

                                                        Thanks for the update again.

                                                         

                                                        Same model, different TV standard.

                                                        • 25. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                          aldjlaidjflaewifjla Community Member

                                                          I'm glad you guys are figuring out the export to tape issue, but you totally ignored the blurry DV output problem! I'm having this same issue. CS5.5 was fine as were all other previous versions (back to CS2). This is definitely broken in CS6, as outlined in many other discussions here.

                                                           

                                                          When are you guys going to fix this!?

                                                          • 26. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                            Admiral Cook Community Member

                                                            They confimed bug where switching fields in program monitor affects output quality. This should not happen.

                                                             

                                                            I believe they are also working on other bugs explained in this thread. I've submited them all.

                                                            • 27. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                              Zac Lam Employee Hosts

                                                              Thanks Paul and AC, I've updated the bug report with your VTR model info.

                                                              • 28. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                                aldjlaidjflaewifjla Community Member

                                                                Still waiting on a fix for the DV output on PPro CS6....this is seriously cramping my style as I must output in DV to beta for the majority of my work, and it looks really bad!

                                                                 

                                                                Please fix this! Pretty please?

                                                                • 29. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                                  Chris Nierop Community Member

                                                                  Strange, it looks on this subject that "export to tape" worked fine in CS 5 as stated in this item. But for me in CS 5 and 5.5 "export to tape" fails also.

                                                                  And this is a main problem for me, because I use DV tape to archive my editing results. And without this feature PPRO 5.5 is not working for me. I have to export the project to a second computer on which PPRO 2.0 is playing, and with PPRO 2.0 I can "transport my project to tape".

                                                                   

                                                                  When I try  export to tape in CS 5 or 5.5, the recorder start to record, but there is no video and no audio signal on the output. I did try two recorders and tried a lot of "external device" possibilities. "Capturing from tape" goes well.

                                                                  I also did try the suggestions Harm Millard gave on one of his valuable forumsuggestions , to quit CPU accelerator and to change the IEEE driver into the "old" driver. But that didn't help much.

                                                                   

                                                                  So Iam wondering if CS 6 has solved the problem, but it seems not. In that case the engineers of Adobe did not solve the well known "bug" in CS 5. and I think I will not upgrade my CS 5.5 into 6 if this issue is not solved correctly. Pitty

                                                                  • 30. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                                    Paul@NYSMSC Community Member

                                                                    Hi Chris,

                                                                    Just to keep things straight, not being able to "Assemble at timecode" in CS6 is a much different issue than not being able to "export to tape" in CS5x.

                                                                     

                                                                    Anyway in CS5x, if you have device control for your VTR(play, stop, record, etc.) then your hardware is happy.  Sounds like your software may be misconfigured.  There were two settings needed in CS5x to make PPro send timeline data out via firewire.  In the Playback settings dialog "Realtime Playback/External Device" and "Export/External Device" should each be set to your DV device:video standard.  See post #8 in this thread for an image(CS6).

                                                                     

                                                                     

                                                                    Also, if you are using CUDA hardware, the CS5x release of the MPE needs to be set to software mode in order to have timeline data sent out via firewire.  This has been adjusted in CS6.

                                                                    • 31. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                                      Chris Nierop Community Member

                                                                      Ok that I misunderstood. But the solution you suggested: What do you mean with the settings you mentioned. If I go to preferences - device control -options, the videostandard is correct, the device brand is correct and the check status says "Online". The "Devices"option is set to DV/HDV Device control. That seems correct because capturing goes well, and the recorder starts recording when I push the record button in "export to tape", but no picture and no sound is recorded.

                                                                      I can't find your playback setting dialog in the menustructure. Or do I miss something. Thanks for replying

                                                                      Chris

                                                                      • 32. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                                        Admiral Cook Community Member

                                                                        Look below program monitor...

                                                                         

                                                                        01.png

                                                                         

                                                                         

                                                                        02.png

                                                                         

                                                                         

                                                                        03.png

                                                                        • 33. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                                          Paul@NYSMSC Community Member

                                                                          Chris,
                                                                          Either use the icon, like Admiral Cook suggests, or in the Sequence menu choose "Sequence settings..." then "Playback settings".  Once those settings are confirmed, you should be good to go.  Let us know...

                                                                           

                                                                          Admiral:  Thanks for posting the images, saved me the effort.

                                                                          • 34. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                                            Chris Nierop Community Member

                                                                            Admiral Cook/Paul

                                                                             

                                                                            That was the problem. In my system the option in "playback settings" is normally set by me on the 3e monitor setting, together with a second videocard driving this 3e monitor during editing. I wasn't aware of the fact that this influenced the "export to tape" function. So changing the settings allow me to export to tape and Iam ready for upgrading to CS 6

                                                                            Thanks for the usefull information

                                                                            Chris

                                                                            • 35. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                                              Paul@NYSMSC Community Member

                                                                              That's one of the nice features of PP CS6, I can use my second monitor as an output screen and send out the timeline via firewire at the same time, with MPE on.

                                                                               

                                                                              Now if only I could properly Assemble edit via that firewire connection...

                                                                               

                                                                              Zac Lam:  How does one get the status of a bug report?  Specifically,  bug #3286805?

                                                                              • 36. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                                                Zac Lam Employee Hosts

                                                                                Hi Paul, the info in the bug database isn't publicly accessible.  You've helped a lot by providing specifics for the bug report, and our QE is taking it from here.

                                                                                • 37. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                                                  aldjlaidjflaewifjla Community Member

                                                                                  Are you guys ever going to fix the DV output quality issue outlined here and elsewhere in these discussions? I'm on 6.02 now and it is no better than it was. Worked fine in 5 & 5.5, I don't see how this could be so difficult to fix.

                                                                                  • 38. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                                                    BigglesKDH Community Member

                                                                                    I have the same problem (video is displayed with reversed fields through DV output) this is completely unacceptable as I work with a lot of interlaced SD video and I need to be able to preview it and check quality while I edit, and using the DV cable has always been the easiest way of doing this (has always worked fine until CS6)

                                                                                    I only way I can get it to play out properly is by interpreting the footage as upper field, I also noticed that when I did this horizontal lines i.e. text became sharp when viewed through the program window, which normal happens if you bring in a video which premiere has incorrectly interpreted the field order i.e. lower field mpg – which previous versions of premiere always got wrong.

                                                                                    I’m assuming premiere CS6 has a bug in the way it interprets DV files – it thinks and says they are lower field but in reality the software has really interpreted them as upper field.

                                                                                     

                                                                                    ADOBE PLEASE FIX

                                                                                    • 39. Re: [CS6] DV - Bad output quality
                                                                                      BigglesKDH Community Member

                                                                                      I've just confirmed this problem is happening on both Mac and PC - looks like someone at adobe has screwed up and when premiere interprets footage as DV Lower field it is actually interpreting it as upper field first (within the software) but still indicating that it is interpreting it as LFF!!!

                                                                                       

                                                                                      Try manually interpreting DV footage as upper and it will play back with out the blur/flicker (it’s a temporary workaround but this is a unacceptable bug)

                                                                                       

                                                                                      I have sent a bug report to Adobe, I advise everyone else to send one in as well so we can get this fixed ASAP.

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