12 Replies Latest reply: Jul 7, 2014 8:20 AM by A.T. Romano RSS

    AVCHD Disc menu on DVD

    Bronte Colagrossi

      Hello all

      I am hoping someone can please help me.

       

      I have worked through Premiere Elements to make a disc menu for my wedding video footage, using the Wedding Doves template.

       

      My footage is AVCHD.

       

      I don't have a Blu Ray burner so the best way I can export the AVCHD footage is by burning AVCHD to DVD through Premiere.

       

      When I burn the AVCHD file on to a DVD, the disc menu does not really work on playback through my Blu Ray player. I can get the menu to show on my TV, with a bit of playing around, but it doesn't automatically appear like it would for a store bought DVD or Blu Ray. Also, I am not able to use it like a standard DVD menu where I can return to it from the footage etc. Fortunately, the menu markers do seem to work though, so I can at least skip through sections.

       

      I have tested burning a DVD (rather than AVCHD) and the menu works then, but obviously the quality is not as true to the original AVCHD footage, or the HD menu template that Adobe has built.

       

      Grateful if someone can clear up whether I can even use disc menus when exporting AVCHD to DVD. If so, how do I make it work?

       

      Many thanks!

        • 1. Re: AVCHD Disc menu on DVD
          nealeh Community Member

          Bronte Colagrossi wrote:

           

          whether I can even use disc menus when exporting AVCHD to DVD.

           

          You can't have menus on an AVCHD disk.

           

          Cheers,
          --
          Neale
          Insanity is hereditary, you get it from your children

          • 2. Re: AVCHD Disc menu on DVD
            Bronte Colagrossi Community Member

            Thank you for clarifying.

             

            I wish this was clearer in the program and help documents - could have saved myself some time if i knew that before.

            • 3. Re: AVCHD Disc menu on DVD
              micromambo Community Member

              To be honest - why can't you not have AVCHD menus? The documentation explicitly names it and PrE 11 i.e. does not warn about it, but even more processes all menus (you see it in the exporter progress bar) and generates everything for it.

              BUT: I have not found a single software player which can REALLY handle it - most of them just show some video with a static menu picture but cannot really handle inactivty.

              • 4. Re: AVCHD Disc menu on DVD
                the_wine_snob CommunityMVP

                The interactivity comes from the navigation that is written into the first VOB on a DVD-Video disc, by the authoring program, and is part of the DVD and BD specs. With a pure AV (Audio Video) file, there is no interactivity, except in a format, like FLV/SWF (Flash).

                 

                Good luck,

                 

                Hunt

                • 5. Re: AVCHD Disc menu on DVD
                  micromambo Community Member

                  Hi,

                   

                  Thanks Hunt for coming back on this quite old thread and trying to help.

                   

                  Well then: I did what Bronte also wanted to achieve (as far as I understand): With PrE 11 I exported AVCHD to disc (and also into folders just tom compare the results) and tested the result with different software players:

                   

                  XBMC cannot really handle the menu (in 10 sec. intervals it plays the menu like a still video, but you cannot really interact), but the main video still plays fine and I can jump to menu markers. Something not possible with PrE 11 exporting a single file (i.e. MP4)

                   

                  VLC also is really crappy in regards to showing and interacting with the AVCHD menu - and again: the main video ist played perfectly.

                   

                  So - anyone with success creating a AVCHD menu which you can interact with the same way like on a normal DVD (standard DVD format, not pseudo-blu ray as with AVCHD)?

                   

                  Thanks,

                  micromambo

                  • 6. Re: AVCHD Disc menu on DVD
                    micromambo Community Member

                    So. I checked it.

                     

                    Used "Virtual CD V10" as virtual DVD / BluRay burner with Single-Layer BD-ROM and published a media to BluRay.

                    I found a software player which correctly plays BluRay and AVCHD menus: Corel WinDVD 11.

                     

                    After successful test I tried it with AVCHD, menus and exporting to filesystem instead to disc (which definitely should show no difference) - works as well in Corel WinDVD 11.

                     

                    Summary:

                    - I would expect that "real" HW players  do the job even better than SW players

                    - XBMC (12.0 RC, "Frodo") does NOT do the job

                    - VLC does also NOT do the job - the menu ist stuck, I cannot select a menu point.

                    - PrE 11 does a correct job exporting menus for all: DVD, AVCHD as well as BluRay. Cannot tell for other versions. Give the trial a chance (as I do currently) to find out.

                    • 7. Re: AVCHD Disc menu on DVD
                      Phantomkeeper

                      I am trying to play a AVCHD file I have created as a DVD would on my computer like you do using a video_ts file that is saved to a folder instead of a disk.

                       

                      Did you create the menu for the AVCHD file using PE12?

                      What does Virtual CD V10 do?

                      I assume Corel WinDVD11 is to play the folder with the AVCHD file like a DVD menu on your computer.

                      • 8. Re: AVCHD Disc menu on DVD
                        A.T. Romano Community Member

                        Phantomkeeper

                         

                        I am not clear on all the details of your question, but here is some information about disc menus that might be useful.

                         

                        AVCHD format on DVD disc

                        Premiere Elements 12 Publish+Share/Disc/AVCHD (burn to DVD disc or burn to folder)

                         

                        You can burn your Timeline content to an AVCHD format on a DVD disc. You can apply disc menu to this burn to. Scene markers and main menu markers should be functional at playback when you find a Blu-ray player that supports AVCHD format on a DVD disc. However, any stop markers that were placed in the Timeline for that burn to will not be recognized by the player (Blu-ray standalone or computer player that supports AVCHD format on DVD disc). With Premiere Elements, you can use a regular DVD burner for the Premiere Elements burn to for AVCHD format on DVD disc or burn to folder. The AVCHD format on the DVD disc presents as a BDMV Folder with many folders. The STREAM Folder in the BDMV folder has the video file (00000.m2ts) and the menu files (00001.m2ts and 00002.m2ts). If you decided to burn to folder and the project had menus applied to it, the end product would have navigatable menus once the BDMV Folder was put to DVD disc to give the AVCHD format on DVD disc.

                         

                        AVCHD Export To File

                        Publish+Share/Computer/AVCHD with one of the presets

                         

                        In Premiere Elements you cannot apply disc menu to an AVCHD file exported to the computer hard drive by an export to file saved to hard drive route. All you get is an .m2t or .mp4 file saved to the computer hard drive.

                         

                        Miscellaneous

                         

                        The VIDEO_TS Folder has nothing to do with AVCHD format on a DVD disc. The structural unit of the AVCHD format on the DVD disc is the BDMV Folder. The VIDEO_TS Folder is the structural unit when you burn your Timeline to DVD-VIDEO format on a DVD disc.

                         

                        Menus are available for the burn to products and for the creation of webDVD which is in reality a Flash file with menus.

                         

                        Premiere Elements 11 and 12 are alike with regard to the above.

                         

                        ATR

                        • 9. Re: AVCHD Disc menu on DVD
                          Phantomkeeper Community Member

                          Thankyou this is very helpful. From other posts I thought I was having to use IMGBURN and other programs or could not have a menu with a AVCHD file. I realise from your reply the scene markers still work. Using the AVCHD format on a DVD using a DVD burner  the picture is good. ( I thought I would need to buy a blue ray burner to burn AVCHD files). When I used the DVD format the picture was terrible.

                          The menu screen is not very clear but at least I have the functionality to select my scenes now.

                          • 10. Re: AVCHD Disc menu on DVD
                            A.T. Romano Community Member

                            Phantomkeeper

                             

                            Thanks for the reply.

                             

                            With regard to the menus for the AVCHD format on the DVD disc, you should look at the following to see if they make a difference in the quality of the menus that play back

                             

                            a. Do some mini test runs with different menus

                             

                            b  If you are not doing so already, do a comparison between choosing from a menu with the "HD" marking versus those that do not have the "HD" marking. The menus trace back to .psd files on the computer hard drive. For each menu, there can be up to 3 different sets of .psd files that the program can draw on to present in the project based on your project preset. They are "s" standard, "w" widescreen, and "hd" high definition. Some menus have only "s" and "w". And, if you have a "hd" project and select one of these menus that is not "hd", the program will give you either the "s" or "w" set, often giving you the "s" choice (4:3) even if you have the "hd" project. You can verify what set is being displayed within the program by reading the Notepad document for the saved closed project.prel file involved.

                             

                            Please let us know if you are OK with the above information. Any questions or need clarification for anything written, please do not hesitate to ask.

                             

                            Thanks.

                             

                            ATR

                            • 11. Re: AVCHD Disc menu on DVD
                              fredowww66 Community Member

                              Since my dad bought a blue ray player I've tested also the workflow blue-ray format on normal DVD.

                              I've read here also somewhere (can't find it now) that videotime is limited to +- 20 minutes (depending on footagecontent).

                               

                              I have PE11 and used the standard settings (burn to disc AVCHD - dvd single layer). I've noticed also that you have only 1080i and not 1080p (the original format of my footage). I've made menu (footage was 2 shortmovies) because PE asks for it ... I've choosen save to disc in stead of burn directly.

                               

                              After that I've burned the data maps on dvd with my standard burnsoftware on the pc (cyberlink power dvd). A little confusing what I had to choose as profile (image ? movie ?) I've choosen dvd data format and think that that one is the only correct one (movie is for standard dvd vob ...) ?

                               

                              The good news is that the dvd plays well on my fathers sony blu ray disc player. The quality of the image is very good (indeed 1080i).

                              The movie started playing directly without showing the menu. But the menu is working if you use the buttons on the remote control (headmenu and chapters).

                               

                              The font of the menu is indeed ugly, the problem is described here above. Little bit stupid that some HD templates are in fact not complete HD ...

                               

                              I have a last question about duration of footage for this workflow. My footage was 2 times  +- 8 minutes. So under the 20 minutes ...

                              But I (and PE) noticed that the content was only about a little bit more than 2 Giga.

                               

                              So almost a half of dvd space was not used. Is it than not possible to write about +- 40 minutes HD 1080i to a DVD with PE11/12 ?

                              • 12. Re: AVCHD Disc menu on DVD
                                A.T. Romano Community Member

                                fredowww66

                                 

                                Part 1. AVCHD DVD, Disc Space Required and Bitrate, Timeline Duration

                                 

                                Sure you can get more than 20 minutes of HD 1080i to a standard DVD disc with Premiere Elements 11 and 12 burn to AVCHD on DVD disc, but you will probably be sacrificing quality the more your Timeline content exceeds the 20 minute total duration. If you do the burn to with a check mark next to the Burn Dialog's "Fit Content to Available Space", the program will adjust automatically the Bitrate from its max of about 15.59 Mbps downward to make the fit. The lower the needed Bitrate to make the fit, the lower the quality of the end product.

                                 

                                Example

                                 

                                22 minutes 42 seconds.

                                With check mark, Space Required = 2.76 GB and Bitrate = 15.74 Mbps. Status = Ready

                                Without check mark, Space Required = 2.73 GB and Bitrate 15.59 Mbps. Status = Ready

                                 

                                41 minutes 24 seconds

                                With check mark, Space Required = 4.38 GB and Bitrate 12.48 Mbps. Status = Ready

                                Without check mark, Space Required = 5.47 GB and Bitrate = 15.59 Mbps. Status = Insufficient Disc Space for Burning

                                 

                                56 minutes 55 seconds

                                With check mark, Space Required = 4.38 GB and Bitrate = 9.07 Mbps. Status = Ready.

                                Without check mark, Space Required = 7.52 GB and Bitrate = 15.59. Status = Insufficient Disc Space for Burning.

                                 

                                Do some mini tests runs using the option "Fit Content to Available Space" and gauge how much content you can add beyond 20 minutes

                                and still maintain acceptable quality at the automatically lowered Bitrate settings.

                                 

                                Part 2. Disc Menu, HD vs SD standard and widescreen.

                                 

                                You wrote

                                The font of the menu is indeed ugly, the problem is described here above. Little bit stupid that some HD templates are in fact not complete HD

                                What do you mean by that? The movie menu displayed in the Movie Menu section of the program is determined by the project preset. If HD project preset, you get a choice of some HD menus. If SD, no HD menus. The HD disc menu are all sized for HD sizing. And you can change font and size in the Movie Menu customization area of the program.... Later I will go back and read the rest of this thread to which you have tacked on to in order to see what you were getting out with the above that I quote.

                                 

                                Part 3. AVCHD DVD burn presets with progressive frame rates.

                                 

                                In Premiere Elements 11, there are only AVCHD DVD presets with interlaced frames rate....either 25 interlaced frames per second or 29.97 interlaced frames per second. However in Premiere Elements 12 AVCHD DVD there are additional choices of 1440 x 1080 HD anamorphic 16:9 and 1920 x 1080 16:9 each with 23.976 progressive frames per second. In 12, you will see them listed as

                                H.264 1440 x 1080p NTSC Dolby

                                and

                                H.264 1920 x 1080p NTSC Dolby

                                 

                                Part 4. Miscellaneous

                                a. Check out the DVD disc labelled 8.5 GB/120 minutes for your AVCHD on DVD.

                                b. Remember that the DVD disc labelled 4.7 GB/120 minutes is in reality 4.38 GB. And, the DVD disc labelled 8.5 GB/240 minutes is in reality 7.95 GB.

                                 

                                Please let me know if you need clarification on anything that I have written.

                                 

                                Thank you.

                                 

                                ATR