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2. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
jaysapathy` Aug 20, 2012 2:49 PM (in response to BobLevine)Hey Bob,
Thanks for the quick reply, but that's not quite the issue. The black box sits over the image, and then the black box, for whatever reason, is letting a little bit of the image show through when the document is printed. Not exactly your normal transparency issue, which is why I'm scratching my head. It's not an overprint issue, and as far as I can tell, it shouldn't be printing that way -- could there be a universal setting or something?
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3. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
BobLevine Aug 20, 2012 2:52 PM (in response to jaysapathy`)100% black overprints by default. Create a new black swatch and call it knockout black.
Use that one for this purpose.
Bob
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4. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
jaysapathy` Aug 20, 2012 3:17 PM (in response to BobLevine)So, simply create the new swatch, make it 100% black, and that will solve the issue?
Couldn't I set the standard 'Black' swatch to not overprint somehow?
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5. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
BobLevine Aug 20, 2012 4:19 PM (in response to jaysapathy`)That would be a mistake.
Bob
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6. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
jaysapathy` Aug 21, 2012 9:04 AM (in response to BobLevine)Hi Bob,
I created the new swatch, and moved everything over to the new one. I'm still getting the same problem, even while not using the [black] swatch. Don't suppose you have any more reccomendations?
Jay
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7. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
BobLevine Aug 21, 2012 9:15 AM (in response to jaysapathy`)Where are you seeing this? In print? On screen?
If it's in print, how is being printed?
Bob
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8. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
jaysapathy` Aug 21, 2012 9:41 AM (in response to BobLevine)It's in print. An 8x8, coated paper. Standard 80# I believe is what it's being run on.
It's generally terrible picture quality, but here's a brief snap I took with my phone earlier: http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/833/img0052yr.jpg/
That should be black, but the black has printed on top of the image itself. Really confused about it -- I've been told by a press agent that in order for that part of the image to *not print* I need to crop that section of the image.. But that can't be right, can it?
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9. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
Peter Spier Aug 21, 2012 9:54 AM (in response to jaysapathy`)Can you show us a screen shot of the black frame selected and the swatches and effects panels?
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10. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
jaysapathy` Aug 21, 2012 10:10 AM (in response to Peter Spier)No problem, Peter. I've included a few shots from various pages (the problem stems to all black boxes placed over images over the 64 page document) on the links below.
http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/5964/88392023.jpg
http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/9741/93991019.jpg
http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/7883/10837728.jpg
The third one is the page that I took the picture of the printout with my phone.
I've tried this on an offset press and a digital press; with 'knockout group' ticked and not. For the life of me, I can't understand why the black is still overprinting on the image when it shouldn't be.
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11. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
Peter Spier Aug 21, 2012 10:30 AM (in response to jaysapathy`)Doesn't make sense to me either.
Do you see CMY values in the empty black areas when you run the cursor around in Separations Preview?
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12. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
BobLevine Aug 21, 2012 11:01 AM (in response to Peter Spier)My only thought is that the RIP is set to automatically overprint 100% black. I would have a talk with the printer about this since it shouldn't be happening.
Bob
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13. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
BobLevine Aug 21, 2012 11:04 AM (in response to BobLevine)And another thought. I would never use 100% black in that situation.
I'd create a rich black since black only is likely to be rather dull when used in a large area like that.
Bob
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14. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
jaysapathy` Aug 21, 2012 1:59 PM (in response to Peter Spier)Separations Preview is giving me the CMY values necessary -- when I put it on black, it shows 100% black. As far as checking with the printer, I've got the assurance of my pressman that everything's set up properly.
Rich black is probably the way to go, but right now I'd settle for not having the images show through. I made a new file in InDesign and did exactly what the client has done in the file, and no image printed underneath.
I'm sure it has to be a setting somewhere.. :/
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15. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
Peter Spier Aug 21, 2012 3:25 PM (in response to jaysapathy`)If seps preview is showing only 100% k it's hard to imagine this is anything but a profile conversion issue, but that doesn't make a lot of sense, either, if the density is varying with what's behind it.
Any effects applied to the background image?
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16. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
jaysapathy` Aug 22, 2012 9:25 AM (in response to Peter Spier)Strangely, I never considered that, but after a thorough analysis, no, none of the images have any effects on them at all. I've been on this for a week or so now, and it's starting to keep me up at night. I know it's something simple (a tick box here or there), but I can't put my finger on it. The file was designed by graphic design students, so I know I'm going to find out that someone hit the wrong button or selected the wrong setting.
I've tried exporting with /1a and no standard at all, only to get the same issue on both counts. I've got everybody and their dog going over this one.. And I'm sure it's a simple fix.
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17. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
Peter Spier Aug 22, 2012 9:48 AM (in response to jaysapathy`)I'd love to see this file in the flesh. Are you willing to share it?
I'm sending an upload link to you by private message.
I have a feeling that Bob's thought about overprint setings inthe RIP might be on target...
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18. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
BobLevine Aug 22, 2012 10:22 AM (in response to Peter Spier)I’m sticking with that one for now.
There’s no other option that I can think of at this point and I really think using a rich black would cure this since that wouldn’t set off the overprint setting anywhere.
Bob
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19. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
jaysapathy` Aug 22, 2012 10:23 AM (in response to Peter Spier)In most cases I would, but the sum total of the files and all the necessary links passes the 3gb mark. It's a big, big production.
The RIP settings are 100% correct -- I've checked those myself. I'm actually the prepress guy for a print house, so to verify that requires simply going into another office.
I tried the rich black path once more, only to have it have the same issue. It's almost like the black is being told to be slightly transparent, and I can't find the setting for that particular box.
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20. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
Peter Spier Aug 22, 2012 10:29 AM (in response to jaysapathy`)Can you make a copy with just one page?
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21. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
BobLevine Aug 22, 2012 10:55 AM (in response to Peter Spier)Then it really sounds like that frame is set to overprint. Can’t remember if you showed up a screenshot with the frame selected. I recall seeing one with the text frame but not the background.
Bob
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22. Re: InDesign 5.5: Strange Printing Transparency Issues
rob day Aug 22, 2012 1:47 PM (in response to jaysapathy`)I tried the rich black path once more, only to have it have the same issue. It's almost like the black is being told to be slightly transparent, and I can't find the setting for that particular box.
What's your rich black mix? Something like 40|0|0|100 wouldn't work– you need at least 1% in all 3 CMY channels. Here's 40|0|0|100 set to overprint top, and KO bottom: