27 Replies Latest reply: Aug 26, 2012 12:10 PM by kkolompar RSS

    Fonts and Library

    kkolompar Community Member

      Hi!

       

      I have a few questions that are boiling in my mind. I own a copy of InDesign CS6 through Creative Cloud and I'm currently working on a magazine.

       

      Questions:

       

      1.I have downloaded a font for use but it is restricted due to licensing issues, says the error. The page I downloaded it at states that it is free to use, even for commercial purposes.

      Fontname: Royal

      http://www.fontspace.com/aldus/royal

      I get this error when trying to publish a PDF file.

       

      2. Is it possible to create a Library in InDesign with all assets like graphics, text,  and so on and send this file to someone else so he could use all of it. Create all the assets that will be needed for the magazine so to speak.

       

      3. Is it possible to link text so it jumps for example to another page?

       

      Thank you for taking your time to read this and I really value all answers.

       

      Regards,

       

      K.

        • 1. Re: Fonts and Library
          Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

          InDesign reads an internal bit in the font to know whether it is embeddable. If that bit is not proerly set by the font author, ID will see it as restricted and you will not be able to embed it, regardless of waht the license may or may not say.

           

          Yes, You can create a library in InDesign, but I don't think it will do what you want. You usually use a library for a set of assets that would be used many times in multiple publications to make it easy to find them, and I believe libraries are really just pointers to the locations of the original content (that may not be true for text objects) so sending a library file to someone who doesn't also sahre access to the originals won't be much use. You can "package" and document (File > Package...) which is to old method for sending things to print, and gather the document and all links and fonts together into a single folder for transfer.

           

          If you mean can text flow from one page to another, yes. That's called Threading and you should read the help files about working with text and then come back if you have unanswered questions. If you mean can you creat text in one location and hav it repeated elsewhere, but update when the original text is updated, in CS6 the answer is also yes, and that's called a linked story. You should aslo check the help files on that.

          • 2. Re: Fonts and Library
            Mike Gondek2 MVP

            1. Most likely what happened is someone used TypeTool3 rather than fontlab or fontographer convert/create this font, which does not allow you to turn off nonembed feature. You would have to convert to outlines prior to making the .pdf.

            • 3. Re: Fonts and Library
              kkolompar Community Member

              Mike, thanks for your answer. SO you have to outline it, huh? Ok, that would make sense. I feel like contacting the owner of the font and let him know on this one. Others might contribute from it.

              Hey, BTW, is there a way to have images in a pdf. and by clicking on them, enlarge them?

              • 4. Re: Fonts and Library
                kkolompar Community Member

                Thank you for your answer. I will look into the help section and let you know. I really want my vision come to life.

                • 5. Re: Fonts and Library
                  kkolompar Community Member

                  Oh man, there is ton of treasure on this forum.

                  • 6. Re: Fonts and Library
                    Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

                    Outlining text is generally considered poor technique for a variet of reasons including it renders it no longer editable (if you do it inthe document before export) and no longer searchable in a PDF. You also run the risk of losing all text adornments like underlines or paragraph rules, along with bullets and numbering, and I suspect cross-references and hyperlinks unless you do the outlining as part of transparency flattening. If you are contemplating going this route, please see Possible bug: oulining text w/ flattener in CS5

                     

                    A better approach, in my opinion, would be to find a different font (it's not like you have a lot of money tied up in this one). This one actually looks like it's really Royal Initialen which is by Dieter Steffman. I found that for download at  http://moorstation.org/typoasis/designers/steffmann/ and it is embeddable, though I don't see any license information on the site so you should contact them regarding commercial use

                    • 7. Re: Fonts and Library
                      kkolompar Community Member

                      Peter, thank you so much. The magazine I´m concepting is free of charge. I don´t know how this works, but I will have to do some research on it. It´s good to know...as for the font, yes, its really cool and I will get in touch with the owner regarding the license.

                      • 8. Re: Fonts and Library
                        kkolompar Community Member

                        I went to some sites hosting this font and they say its free. Here for example.: http://www.dafont.com/search.php?q=royal

                        • 9. Re: Fonts and Library
                          Manish-Sharma Adobe Employee

                          There is a difference of having the font the avaiable free online and in embedding.

                           

                          The fonts may be licensed to install free but can have been restricted for embedding , for which you need extended license.

                           

                          Refer to the below link in order to understand the font licensing and permission concept. :-

                           

                          http://www.adobe.com/type/browser/info/embedding.html

                          http://www.high-logic.com/fontcreator/manual/index.html?fontembeddinglicensingrig.html

                          • 10. Re: Fonts and Library
                            kkolompar Community Member

                            Thank you for sharing this with you. I found out that it is an installable font, and can be embedded in the magazine. Plus, that it can be installed on a remote machine...very very cool.

                            • 11. Re: Fonts and Library
                              Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

                              Personally, I'm very distrustful of dafont.com and similar free font sites as a lot of what's there seems to be uploaded by users and may be pirated. They seem to be sending you to Dieter Steffman's personal site, however, so it may be legit. The site I linked above says they are now hosting all of his fonts (and I made the presumption that they have permission to do so), but I don't see any indication of licensing terms ther or at dafont. I don't read German, so I don't know what the designer's site has to say.

                               

                              Free simply means there is no charge to download, but it doesn't mean you have permission to use it commercially without paying.

                              • 12. Re: Fonts and Library
                                kkolompar Community Member

                                Yes, after some research I found out the same thing...my german is not really good but I found an email address.So I wrote to him. If you preference the font it states that it is "installable". The question is if the owner made it that way or if it was altered along the way. Thank you for pointing this out. Yeah, FREE is a dangerous word:)

                                • 13. Re: Fonts and Library
                                  Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

                                  I ran the web page through Bing Translator and it seems pretty clear that Mr. Steffmann does not allow commercial use of his fonts. The site has not had an update since 2004, but there is a contact link...

                                   

                                  I'm going to send him an email and see waht happens.

                                  • 14. Re: Fonts and Library
                                    Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

                                    I have no reason to think that it was not issued with the embeddability bit set to installable. There is a reference to hosting the fonts with "CyberPee" on the web page, and that name seems to be pretty clearly associated with moorstation.org, so I 'm pretty sure those are the versions direct from the designer. Again, though, embeddability is not the same as allowing commercial use.

                                     

                                    It's also not clear if this was originally a public domain font, in which case there may be no claim of copyright (there's a ton of discussion about the vilidity of font licensing on the web, and I don't want to get into that here). I hope we hear something from the emails.

                                    • 15. Re: Fonts and Library
                                      kkolompar Community Member

                                      I just got a reply from the owner of the font. He said that it was free for private use only. I wonder if I can but this font from him? Good we did this.

                                      • 16. Re: Fonts and Library
                                        Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

                                        I also recieved a response. He say to contact Linotype.com for commercial use.

                                         

                                        I've searched the Linitype site and can't find the font, or any link to Steffmann as a designer, so I've sent off an email to Linotype's contact address asking if they know about it.

                                         

                                        In the meantime they do have quite a few blackletter fonts (103 -- http://www.linotype.com/51475/categories-Blackletter.html#646772b0816742fb7cf0a277beff272b ) and you might see something else you like. Archive Copperplate Text Std has some similarlity and is not terribly expensive at $22: http://www.linotype.com/423325/ArchiveCopperplateText-product.html

                                        • 17. Re: Fonts and Library
                                          kkolompar Community Member

                                          Hello Peter.

                                           

                                          Thank you for your answer. Great, fonts. I will take a look. I need something classy and stylish.

                                          So, now off to making sort of a library, I told you earlier about.

                                          If you have graphics and Duplicate it inside ID does the copy count to the size of the document?

                                          • 18. Re: Fonts and Library
                                            Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

                                            kkolompar wrote:

                                             

                                            If you have graphics and Duplicate it inside ID does the copy count to the size of the document?

                                            Yes. That said, if the graphics are linked what is stored in the ID file is just a pointer to the location, not the graphic itself, and pointers are tiny.

                                            • 19. Re: Fonts and Library
                                              kkolompar Community Member

                                              So you can link graphics to ID? Great. What about if I make a  PDF out of the magazine, Peter, is that compressed somehow?

                                              • 20. Re: Fonts and Library
                                                [Jongware] MVP

                                                kkolompar wrote:

                                                 

                                                What about if I make a  PDF out of the magazine, Peter, is that compressed somehow?

                                                 

                                                Other than what you can specify in the panel "Compression" in the PDF Export dialog?

                                                • 21. Re: Fonts and Library
                                                  Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

                                                  When you use the Place command to import your graphics they are linked by default. This is good because it keeps your file size down and allows you to use the same graphic content in multiple files and update it in only one location if it needs editing, reducing drive space required. Linked files can be embedded, if you wish, but there are few reasons why this would be an advantage. Pasted conten. on the other hand, is not linked, and is difficult to extract for editing if required.

                                                   

                                                  When you export the PDF the linked content is embedded into the PDF (along with the unrestricted fonts), and may or may not be compressed according to the settings that you use.

                                                  • 22. Re: Fonts and Library
                                                    kkolompar Community Member

                                                    I´m trying to figure out how this program works. It has more hidden treasures than one might think.

                                                    So, yes, I tested to export to PDF, and the size was compressed. I don´t know if dublicates count to the size of the PDF. Maybe it works like in Flash, that a symbol once in the library is used only once for the count.

                                                    I have another question. Should I edit the image resolution by myself or should I let ID handle that at export? For the web, what resolution is the best? Because I heard 72, and print 300dpi. Is that correct?

                                                     

                                                    I´m also looking for a well readable font that has a non profit license and is free.

                                                    If anyone know right off the bat, please let me know.

                                                    • 23. Re: Fonts and Library
                                                      Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

                                                      I'm not certain about this as I don't do screen stuff, but I believe that when you export an interactive PDF it creates a single instance of each linked object, similar to the way a symbol works in Illustrator. The PDF library in CS6 may even do that for Print PDFs, but I don't think so.

                                                       

                                                      Most of the time its fine to let ID do the downsampling, and for most printing 300 ppi is a good number, but see Distance-Resolution Formula for a discussion of resolution and viewing distance. 72 ppi is pretty standard, I think, for screen, but someone who actually does a lot of that sort of work may have more to say.

                                                       

                                                      For your main body copy, ID comes with quite a few very high quality fonts from the Adobe font collection (and some display fonts, too), that you may use for any purpose.

                                                      • 24. Re: Fonts and Library
                                                        Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

                                                        I heard back from Linotype this morning. I had asked specifically about the Royal Initialen font, and here's waht they said:

                                                         

                                                        Dear Mr. Spier,

                                                         

                                                        thank you very much for your email.

                                                         

                                                        We do not handle commercial distribution for him - however, he is a font enthusiast who digitizes old lead typefaces - and quite a lot of them are Linotype typefaces, meaning the copyright is ours.

                                                         

                                                        However, that does not mean we ever created a font, as most of these old typefaces have next to no demand. But since Mr. Steffmann does not want to violate any copyrights, he sends people who wish to use his fonts to us.

                                                         

                                                        In your case, however, we are quite sure that the font you are referring to should not be a problem when used commercially, as there is no copyright that we know of at the moment. Should you wish to be 100% on the secure side, however, simply choose a similar typeface from our website and purchase a license, and use that font.

                                                         

                                                        Best regards

                                                         

                                                         

                                                        Jens Konrad

                                                         

                                                        Linotype Support

                                                        • 25. Re: Fonts and Library
                                                          kkolompar Community Member

                                                          This is amazing. After all the work we put in, it finally payed off....sometimes one must dig deeper to uncover the truth:)

                                                          So, what we know is that the font is probably ok for non profit use. They seem to think that it is ok.

                                                          So what do you think Peter?

                                                          • 26. Re: Fonts and Library
                                                            Peter Spier ACP/MVPs

                                                            I'm not  a lawyer, but I would say it's pretty unlikely that Linotype, or anyone else, is going to come looking for you if you do.

                                                            • 27. Re: Fonts and Library
                                                              kkolompar Community Member

                                                              So, the journey of the Royal font is over....Fonts are a very cool thing, I should look into them more often. I will use this one in the magazine. I really like the design part, you know just use the tools to create something....very interesting.