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160. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Was DYP Sep 10, 2012 1:24 PM (in response to conroy)conroy wrote:
Was DYP wrote:
Another thing I see that I have not seen mentioned is that the icon on the top bar of the image window sometimes does not appear even though the icon shows up in the finder.
Do you mean a generic JPEG/PNG/PSD/etcetera icon sometimes shows instead of a representation of a file's content despite Finder displaying a representative icon?
Or do you mean that absolutely no icon appears in a floating window title bar?
If the former, that will be normal and correct if the file genuinely has no custom icon but Finder is able to use a Quick Look-generated preview as an icon.
I mean absolutely no icon appears in a floating window title bar, but no the Finder is not showing the Quick Look-generated preview as an icon because there is not a white border around the icon. Of course when the finder is not showing an icon the floating window title bar doesn't show one either.
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161. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Noel Carboni Sep 10, 2012 1:31 PM (in response to Chris Cox)Chris Cox wrote:
we can't work around bugs we don't understand or can't reproduceYou could offer a secret option that will cause Photoshop CS6 to save icons exactly the way Photoshop CS5 did as a workaround for users with the specific issue of CS6 not working and CS5 working... Just saying.
-Noel
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162. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
46tyie22nn Sep 10, 2012 1:36 PM (in response to Chris Cox)Chris it's a bad analogy.
A better one is that developers for the web have for years created fixes so sites would work on Internet Explorer even though that was the only browser client that made it necessary to do so.
The earlier versions of Photoshop did not and do not have this issue on the older or the newest OS systems. Photoshop 6 does. Why does that then become a problem with Apple? And if it is why was it not addressed in a beta version? The fact is Adobe Photoshop 6 does not, in many cases, function as it should with Mac OS X system. It is a condition that is/was created by Photoshop 6 and only manifests itself in that version. It is Adobe's issue to resolve.
If you want to stick with the car analogy I would suggest this is more like Adobe created a set of rims that won't mount on the car because according to them the car manufacturer put the wheel bolts in the wrong place.
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163. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Rick Meikle Sep 10, 2012 1:37 PM (in response to Kurt Lang)I believe (hope) that creds get you taken seriously by developers! On that level, creds are priceless. My creds are taking a beating, though. I mistakenly associated your long post about the "file has changed" problem with the missing icon problem. ("I then installed one of the CS items mentioned above and any of its updates. Immediately afterwards, icons would not be created for all files; a QuickTime function." Plus a couple other references to creating or not creating icons.) It may all be related, which I presume is why you brought it to this topic. I too experience the irritating "file has changed" message from time to time, but as a standalone user I just ignore and dismiss it. I visited that topic to learn about it but don't recall posting to it. That illustrates my point about how many users with a given problem may not make it known to the developer. At no time was I trying to say that all or most users have or don't have the missing icon problem. Only that it is affecting a sizable number of users, of which it is reasonable to assume that only a portion, probably a small portion, are participating in the forum. At the same time, if the problem only comes up in column view, for example, users who don't use column view won't discover the problem. There are lots of ways to argue for and against populations with or without the problem, but that is beside the point when there are enough users with it. I'm still curious to know whether any other application has verifiably demonstrated the same icon creation problem that affects many users of Photoshop CS6. To my way of thinking, this is a key step in pinpointing the problem.
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164. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Chris Cox Sep 10, 2012 1:51 PM (in response to 46tyie22nn)The anaolgy was quite appropos. Photoshop works according to the guidelines set out by the OS vendor, and works correctly on the vast majority of systems.
Web developers have some idea of the bug they are working around, and easy ways to work around basic issues.
We do not know why Apple's thumbnailing code works most of the time, and fails sometimes in some folders on some machines. That code exists as part of the OS, not as part of Photoshop or any Adobe codebase. We cannot see their source code to find the bug or fix it.
This is a bug in Apple's thumbnailing code, plain and simple. This is not something that Adobe can resolve.
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165. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
46tyie22nn Sep 10, 2012 2:12 PM (in response to Chris Cox)It was not. And, even so cars are engineered to endure and navigate the potholes and hills they may encounter.
Adobe is selling a product that does not work as advertised.
I will ask once again, as others have. Why is this a Photoshop 6 problem only, if the issue is with the OS?
And. It doesn't really matter if it is or is not an OS problem. It is still Adobe's responsibility to it's customers to make a product which functions appropriately.
You have unhappy customers, you don't have a work around and you didn't have a problem, until you released 6.
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166. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Chris Cox Sep 10, 2012 2:19 PM (in response to 46tyie22nn)It isn't a Photoshop CS6 only problem.
This is an Apple bug. If you want it fixed sooner, please let Apple know that you want it fixed soon.
Adobe cannot fix Apple's bugs.
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167. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Rick Meikle Sep 10, 2012 2:35 PM (in response to Chris Cox)I, for one, truly appreciate your participation in this forum, Chris. You take a lot of heat from frustrated users who may not realize this is just a place where users talk to users. Over the years of my (very) sporadic participation, I've seen you go the extra mile, even though once in awhile I disagreed with your position on an issue. At this point in this topic, it seems to be boiling down to whether this is or isn't a Photoshop CS6 only problem. How do you know it isn't? I haven't seen any other app, including earlier versions of Photoshop, fingered. But you have vastly greater input than us users. Are you constrained from naming names? (Even one? Like another Adobe app?)
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168. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Chris Cox Sep 10, 2012 2:40 PM (in response to Rick Meikle)Yeah, we're limited in what we can say.
I've probably already gone too far (and will hear from the fruit flavored company soon).
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169. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Rick Meikle Sep 10, 2012 2:47 PM (in response to Chris Cox)Thanks, Chris. Looks like those who have workarounds will have to stick with them until something gives in a place that this forum can't touch.
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170. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Noel Carboni Sep 10, 2012 2:52 PM (in response to Chris Cox)Conroy, perhaps not generating the icons the documented way may have been the fix to the corrupted icon problems from earlier versions of Photoshop.
I think it's amazing that something as simple as tying thumbnails to files is so difficult. Someone from outside the Mac realm could be forgiven for wondering whether a Mac - traditionally the graphics professional's choice - is a particularly good platform for running Photoshop any more! But I know that with the focus of the forum being on problems that it cannot possibly be as bad as it sounds.
-Noel
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171. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Noel Carboni Sep 10, 2012 3:10 PM (in response to Noel Carboni)Good deal! I kind of thought that the icon generation must not be failing for you, but I wasn't sure.
You and I seem to be kind of birds of a feather, in that I have few problems with Windows.
It's good to have your level of expertise here.
-Noel
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172. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
digxdsn Sep 10, 2012 4:49 PM (in response to Noel Carboni)I've been on this thread since the very beginning and have posted a few times. The only way I have found to work around this problem is a small application called "Path Finder". When I use this handy little app instead of my MacPros finder - All the preview icons show up correctly - includding CS6 files, maybe an Apple issue when an app can show the previews but the finder can't?
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173. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Noel Carboni Sep 10, 2012 4:56 PM (in response to digxdsn)Another possible workaround... I have heard privately from one of my actions customers that they have used a tool called Onyx, and apparently its scripts have immediately made the icons start working and remain working for several days for him. I have no idea what Onyx is or does, but perhaps this information can be useful/helpful in directing folks where to look for the problem.
-Noel
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174. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
digxdsn Sep 10, 2012 5:03 PM (in response to Noel Carboni)Yeah but all Onyx does id delete the DS files and it's temporary because the finder creates a new one imediatly after the old one is deleted.
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175. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
captain1944 Sep 13, 2012 11:53 AM (in response to digxdsn)been away for a while.......can anyone update the status of a resolution of this issue?
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176. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
MoonRunner 1234 Sep 14, 2012 10:50 AM (in response to Noel Carboni)Don’t bother with Onyx or any other maintenance program, you are wasting your time. Most of you are still barking up the wrong tree. The icons are properly written by Photoshop, you just can’t see them. As I said before, all you have to do is restart your computer or log out and in (sometimes twice) and the icons are there and will be there including new photoshop file icons. Eventually they will disappear again due to a restart or some other reason and they are gone again, then you will have to log out and in again and all is back to normal until it happens again. Chris Cox is right, only Apple can fix this.
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177. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Pace52 Sep 14, 2012 6:31 PM (in response to MoonRunner 1234)I await answers as well...but WAY further back in this discussion a wise person had me purchase COCKTAIL and it works. I run it maybe twice a week and it does the things I use to perform in disc utility. Running this, I have no problems with the icons at all. If I do not run it I do have problems. I realize this does not fix the issue, but it definitely makes life normal again. For a non-computer person on the left brain side of it all, but a user of all of CS6 8 hours a day in photoshop, it drove me crazy with the icon problem to the point I was using my old CS5. With Cocktail I have been fine... so its a good bandaid. Will await what they finally decide and I too hope they fix it all.
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178. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
captain1944 Sep 15, 2012 4:46 AM (in response to Pace52)Yes, Cocktail worked for me temporarily....but I still believe we deserve a response from Adobe to the issue of what is the present status of a solution to this problem.....are we not at least owed that?
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179. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Chris Cox Sep 15, 2012 12:10 PM (in response to captain1944)We don't yet have an ETA from Apple on a fix to this - we're still waiting to hear from them about what the actual problem was, and when a fix might be released. And being Apple, we won't be able to tell you much until after the fix is actually released.
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180. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
captain1944 Sep 15, 2012 12:17 PM (in response to Chris Cox)so may we assume then that Apple has accepted responsibility for the problem?
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181. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
captain1944 Sep 15, 2012 12:48 PM (in response to Chris Cox)strange doings.....if I don't get a definitive answer back from Chris this will become more mysterious than it already is....
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182. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Noel Carboni Sep 15, 2012 12:55 PM (in response to captain1944)This horse has decomposed and returned to the Earth, conroy.
Adobe hosts this site. They can do what they want with it, and they sometimes do.
It's pretty clear we've reached the limits of what Adobe is both willing to do and actually can do, and it's probably time to move on.
-Noel
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183. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
captain1944 Sep 15, 2012 12:59 PM (in response to Noel Carboni)we have reached the limits of what they are willing to do? (we do not yet know for certian what they can do).....That is quite an amazing statement Noel......Let us just suppose that this is an adobe issue(we have n proof either way from all I have read on this thread). Are you suggesting that Adobe might not accept responsibility then for fixing it if it is their problem? If not, I think all customers who have this issue are do a refund as it is advertised as Mt. Lion compatible.
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184. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
captain1944 Sep 15, 2012 1:13 PM (in response to captain1944)I do realize that the issue is with many versions.....my thoughts on the refund is that it seems in corporate America, the only thing that works is $$$. We do deserve at the very least more specifics on this issue than the evasiveness that we have received. I accept the fact that my technologocal expertise is far far less than most on here, but I do have common sense and something just isn't right here
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185. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Noel Carboni Sep 15, 2012 1:16 PM (in response to captain1944)There was a very specific context for my statement.
I really don't want to see someone as smart and helpful as Conroy banned, but continuing to post things that are being deleted - regardless of the true justice involved - invites problems, no? There are clearly forces we can't see at work here.
-Noel
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186. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
conroy Sep 15, 2012 1:22 PM (in response to Noel Carboni)Noel, thanks! I'm finished with this thread, anyway. I'm powerless to stop my posts being erased.
Note that my posts of 10 minutes ago are gone now.
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187. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
uncleotto Sep 15, 2012 1:23 PM (in response to captain1944)captain1944, if you go back to page one of this discussion, you will see that the problem started in May, a full two months before Mountain Lion was released. In my case, the issue went away when I installed Mountain Lion, and so far hasn't been back. This may indeed be an Apple problem at root, but I think that the solution would be easier on Adobe's end (regress the icon writing code back to however it was in CS5). Whether or not the bug is in Apple's code, Photoshop CS6 is the only application revealing it, and it is on Adobe's shoulders to keep its own customers happy, not Apple's. As long as the problem persists for some, regardless of whose code is at fault, the frustrated customers will blame the lone app with the problem before they will blame the OS which plays nicely with everyone else's icons.
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188. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
captain1944 Sep 15, 2012 1:24 PM (in response to conroy)to elaborate on just one incident to comon sense: Above, Chris responds to my request for specifics by stating that they await Apple's fix of the problem. I have not seen anywhere that 1) Apple accepts responsibility and 2) Such evidence exists.
If so.......it is time to put up as they say....the floor is yours.
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189. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
captain1944 Sep 15, 2012 1:27 PM (in response to uncleotto)@uncleotto I fully agree with your assessment
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190. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Chris Cox Sep 15, 2012 1:33 PM (in response to captain1944)We can't comment for Apple, and Apple will only comment publicly once a patch is released.
But as I've shown many times, this can only be an OS bug: Photoshop writes the same thumbnails on everyone's system - but thumbnails only fails to show sometimes, on some systems, sometimes only failing on some directories, and then show again when the OS thumbnail caches are cleared. The application is not involved after writing the file, only the OS is involved in creating their thumbnail cache and diplaying from that thumbnail cache.
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191. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
uncleotto Sep 15, 2012 2:07 PM (in response to Chris Cox)Chris, I understand your argument, and I do follow it, to a point. I think everyone here is willing to admit that there may be a bug in Apple's code. BUT, having spent many years beta testing software for various developers, if there's one thing I've learned, it's that a developer gains the respect of its customers by overcoming the weaknesses of the operating systems on which its applications, extensions, or plug-ins run, not by waiting for OS updates to fix them. Show me one single discussion anywhere on the web where another application besides Photoshop CS6 is having the SAME issue of the icons it creates not being visible in the directories of Mac OS computers, and the onus can once and for all be lifted from Adobe in this thread. OS bug or no, icons written by Photoshop CS5 on these same systems do appear. Blame doesn't matter here. Resolution does. If Apple doesn't come through with a fix, regardless of what or where the bug is in their unreleased source code, Adobe could work around the problem and make its own customers happy by looking into the differences between CS5 and CS6 for an answer. As stated above, my own problem with this icon thing hasn't plagued me since I upraded from Lion to Mountain Lion. This may be more evidence that the OS may be the underlying issue, but NOT that the problem couldn't be swiftly and satisfactorily dealt with by Adobe.
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192. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
captain1944 Sep 15, 2012 2:13 PM (in response to uncleotto)hear hear...
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193. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Chris Cox Sep 15, 2012 2:14 PM (in response to uncleotto)Photoshop always writes the same thumbnails - yet the OS sometimes fails to process or display them after the file has been written, in a way that seems random but somhow specific to certain users or certain folders, and that failure is fixed by removing the OS cache of thumbnail data. Short of rewritting the OS thumbnail code, there is no way for Photoshop to fix or work around that bug in the OS.
We have looked into the issue, and can't even reproduce the problem on any of our systems -- so can't do much to characterize it beyond what customers have reported.
Apple has to fix their bugs. That's all there is to it.
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194. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Chris Cox Sep 15, 2012 2:15 PM (in response to Chris Cox)And we already do go to great lengths to work around known OS bugs -- but sometimes, like this, it's something that just cannot be worked around.
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195. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Noel Carboni Sep 15, 2012 2:38 PM (in response to uncleotto)uncleotto wrote:
Show me ... where another application besides Photoshop CS6 is having the SAME issueJust a random, idle thought, but there actually isn't any other application that does just what Photoshop does. From something as simple as generating a LOT of icons/thumbnails because of the nature of what it does, to the size of the files being very large, to the way it does things in particular threads could be at fault.
-Noel
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196. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
uncleotto Sep 15, 2012 2:49 PM (in response to Chris Cox)Chris, I do not understand how it could be true that Photoshop always writes the same thumbnails. When I was having this problem, my workaround was to open files in Photoshop CS5, and save them again. The icons would then appear, every time. It defies logic to say that there is no difference between the CS versions in the way they write thumbnails. I can't get past that. I don't mean to be argumentative, but merely to point out that concurrent installations of Photoshop CS6 and CS5 will have, and not have, respectively, the issue on the very same system. This has been stated earlier in the thread. I always keep my old installations of Photoshop around for the purpose of dealing with bugs, and because in my profession I provide support for others who may not be using the newest software versions, and having the old ones around makes it possible to assist them more effectively. Can you explain to me how Photoshop CS5 could successfully write a visible icon to the same directory where CS6 cannot, if they do it exactly the same way? Are you personally directly involved in the writing of PS code, such that you can vouch for the fact that nothing was changed between CS5 and CS6? It's not that I'm saying this isn't Apple's fault. I just hope that this will encourage someone there to dig a little deeper...
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197. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
Chris Cox Sep 15, 2012 3:12 PM (in response to uncleotto)It does not defy logic, I'm just more familiar with all the details.
Again, the stuff that happens after the file is written: that's all the OS.
There is no logical way that this could not be an OS bug.
Since we do not know the details of Apple's bug, we do not know why different applications and versions of the applications are treated differently. We do know that Apple did not like the way CS5 wrote thumbnails/icons and requested the change made in CS6.
Yes, I'm a senior engineer on Photoshop - but things did change *at Apple's direct request*.
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198. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
digxdsn Sep 19, 2012 3:16 PM (in response to Chris Cox)Has anybody running Lion update version 10.7.5 or Mountain Lion update 10.8.2? Apple states is resolve an issue where icons in Launchpad may get rearranged after a restart but I'm wondering if it also fixes the photoshop icon problem?
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199. Re: Photoshop CS6 does not save icon on Macintosh
enigma51564 Sep 20, 2012 5:04 AM (in response to Chris Cox)After being frustrated by this disappearing thumbnail issue on Photoshop CS6 for several months now, and having spoken or communicated with both Adobe and Apple, I have arrived at the conclusion that Chris Cox is correct, this is a Mountain Lion issue that Apple has yet to resolve.
My conclusion is based on several things I've observed.
1. When I installed the Mountain Lion version of Cocktail, it installed with no icon for the Cocktail application. For me, that says its a Mountain Lion issue.
2. I've known Chris Cox for many years, from the days when we both participated in Kai Krause's forums on KPT and Bryce products, and in my not so humble opinion, I say Chris knows of what he speaks. Yes, I would love it if Adoble could come up with a workaround on this matter, but the buck really stops with Apple. At this stage, I'm doing most of my work in CS6 sans thumbnails, then converting the files back to CS5 so that I have thumbnails, even though they are often fuzzy and pixelated. At least it is better than just a file name without an icon.
Chris, thanks for hanging in with us and I'm sorry you've received the brunt of the anger and frustration many of us are feeling with this issue. It's been my experience that Apple is much lesss responsive in listening to its customers than Adobe has been.
A big thanks to everyone here who is trying to solve this, but I trust that Chris is correct when he points to Apple. Unfortunately, no matter who is responsble, we're still faced with the fact that frustration will continue until this gets fixed. I may just abandon CS6 until Apple straightens out its operating system issues and go back to using CS5 for everything else
Dan Casselberry




