16 Replies Latest reply on Aug 10, 2007 8:21 PM by Newsgroup_User

    Dreamweaver Training

    Media_Corp.
      Hello,

      I have long been interested in Web Design/ Development and have decided to pursue it as a career. I have developed a few websites and have informally worked at it for years. I would now like to take some courses to 'fill in the blanks' and further advance my training.

      I am seeking advice as to which Programs/ Courses/ Institutions etc... that offer good, relevant training. I am also wondering if it is at all recommended to take these course via online delivery/ distance education. I have looked into programs through various colleges here in Canada, however, I find that I've already taught myself a lot of the material. Are there 'online courses' available that you would recommend?

      Any help would be GREATLY appreciated.

      Thanks in advance,

      Derek
        • 1. Re: Dreamweaver Training
          JulesN Level 2
          Hi Derek,
          I took all of my courses online through the Art Institute. When I graduated, I flew down to Pittsburgh for my grad, and it made it all feel real. They have a few various degrees that you can obtain. I am in a small town in Alberta with no other option than to take my courses online.

          Jules
          • 2. Re: Dreamweaver Training
            Level 7
            On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 17:45:44 +0000 (UTC), "Media Corp."
            <webforumsuser@macromedia.com> wrote:

            >Hello,
            >
            > I have long been interested in Web Design/ Development and have decided to
            >pursue it as a career. I have developed a few websites and have informally
            >worked at it for years. I would now like to take some courses to 'fill in the
            >blanks' and further advance my training.
            >
            > I am seeking advice as to which Programs/ Courses/ Institutions etc... that
            >offer good, relevant training. I am also wondering if it is at all recommended
            >to take these course via online delivery/ distance education. I have looked
            >into programs through various colleges here in Canada, however, I find that
            >I've already taught myself a lot of the material. Are there 'online courses'
            >available that you would recommend?
            >
            > Any help would be GREATLY appreciated.
            >
            > Thanks in advance,
            >
            > Derek

            Derek, where in Canada are you? Both Humber College and Sheridan
            College in southern Ontario have good programs.

            I did Sheridan's Interactive Multimedia program in 2000/2001:

            http://dwarfurl.com/e5da0

            Humber's is here:

            http://dwarfurl.com/225b2

            Without knowing what your skill level and experience is, I can't tell
            you if either program would be a god fit.

            What blanks do you want to fill in?

            Win
            --
            Win Day, Wild Rose Websites
            http://www.wildrosewebsites.com
            winday@NOSPAMwildrosewebsites.com
            Skype winifredday
            • 3. Re: Dreamweaver Training
              Media_Corp. Level 1
              Hi Jules,

              Thanks so much for the help. I am in a very similar situation as you once were. I also live in a small town in Alberta (weird). I have been looking into courses/programs all over North America, but seem to get farther off course the more I dig. What made you decide on the Art Institute? I would really like to chat with you regarding your decision and also how long the course was etc...

              Thanks again!
              Derek
              • 4. Re: Dreamweaver Training
                JulesN Level 2
                My decision was based upon the size of the schools and that there are AI schools in Canada as well. My aunt lives down in Florida and told me that AI is very well known in the US. I took a year and a half to complete the dipoma program, but would like to complete the bachelor's program eventually. Time-wise, it all depends on what your schedule is like... as to how long it takes to finish it. I also depend a lot on lynda.com for their tutorials for all Adobe products and other extra programs that I need. Then if all else fails, it's back to asking questions on forums like these!

                Just to forewarn you, it cost me $20,000 for the diploma program and when I want to upgrade to the bachelor, I am looking at about $40,000 more, I believe. Not cheap... but so worth it in the long run!

                Jules
                • 5. Re: Dreamweaver Training
                  Media_Corp. Level 1
                  Hi Win,

                  Thanks for your input. It seems we're all in Alberta on this thread. lol.

                  Humber is/was the course I was seriously considering (I even filled out the application). It seemed like a lot of money ($6,000 CAD) for six months, but given JulesN tuition for AI Pittsburgh...perhaps it's not that much. It was more the cost of not working for the six months that broke the deal for me. It's a catch 22 I guess. Six months intensive and you're done....or ~2 years or so and keep working. I'm not young (32) so taking that long off work seems tricky.

                  The Humber course seems great and I've heard lots of great things about it (I'm also originally from that area), but a few courses would seem like review to me. I wrote Natasha Haniff (Program Coordinator at Humber) to inquire about distance education, however I haven't heard back. I pretty sure they don't offer that option.

                  If you don't mind me asking...what made you decide to go the Sheridan route over the Humber one? How long is the Sheridan course? Would you recommend it?

                  Thanks again to both of you.

                  Cheers,
                  Derek
                  • 6. Re: Dreamweaver Training
                    Level 7
                    AI is a diploma mill. All across the USA. They will keep you enrolled as
                    long as you can pay the tuition and have no concern for how you are doing in
                    the courses. If you stay with them long enough you will most certainly earn
                    a diploma. The real question will be how much practical knowledge did you
                    gain. Probably not very much.


                    • 7. Re: Dreamweaver Training
                      Level 7
                      On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 18:58:14 +0000 (UTC), "Media Corp."
                      <webforumsuser@macromedia.com> wrote:

                      >Hi Win,
                      >
                      > Thanks for your input. It seems we're all in Alberta on this thread. lol.
                      >
                      > Humber is/was the course I was seriously considering (I even filled out the
                      >application). It seemed like a lot of money ($6,000 CAD) for six months, but
                      >given JulesN tuition for AI Pittsburgh...perhaps it's not that much. It was
                      >more the cost of not working for the six months that broke the deal for me.
                      >It's a catch 22 I guess. Six months intensive and you're done....or ~2 years
                      >or so and keep working. I'm not young (32) so taking that long off work seems
                      >tricky.
                      >
                      > The Humber course seems great and I've heard lots of great things about it
                      >(I'm also originally from that area), but a few courses would seem like review
                      >to me. I wrote Natasha Haniff (Program Coordinator at Humber) to inquire about
                      >distance education, however I haven't heard back. I pretty sure they don't
                      >offer that option.
                      >
                      > If you don't mind me asking...what made you decide to go the Sheridan route
                      >over the Humber one? How long is the Sheridan course? Would you recommend it?
                      >
                      > Thanks again to both of you.
                      >
                      > Cheers,
                      > Derek

                      Hi Derek,

                      The Sheridan program was a full school year, September to April/May.
                      It was $12K when I did it in 2000.

                      I had attended a couple of Sheridan weekend courses in HTML and web
                      graphics. I liked the instructors and the course outline for the post
                      grad program.

                      I had an unpleasant experience with someone who was involved with the
                      Humber program when I asked for information. He who shall remain
                      nameless was rude and downright nasty. I decided I didn't want to be
                      involved with a program where he was an instructor.

                      The Sheridan program has changed since I went through. Some of it has
                      been significantly watered down. They pride themselves more now on
                      turning out grads with "leading edge" skills - and I'm not sure I
                      would hire one as a subcontractor because I'm not convinced they know
                      the basics.

                      You're right that some of the courses might seem like a review, no
                      matter what program you choose I think. Most if not all are geared
                      for either new grads with no experience in the field, or folks who
                      want to retrain from a different profession.

                      Where are you in Alberta? I'm in Edmonton. If you're going to travel
                      to attend a program, did you look here? NAIT has a Digital &
                      Interactive Media Design program, although it's two years I think. And
                      Guru Digital Arts College has a 6 month Digital Media Producer Diploma
                      Program.

                      Win
                      --
                      Win Day, Wild Rose Websites
                      http://www.wildrosewebsites.com
                      winday@NOSPAMwildrosewebsites.com
                      Skype winifredday
                      • 8. Re: Dreamweaver Training
                        i suppose it depends on how badly you want an official degree. but i've always been a fan of the "buy a book and teach yourself" approach. it's probably a lot faster than going to school (you can probably teach yourself something in a few weeks what would take months to learn in a classroom-type environment), not to mention a whole lot cheaper. plus you can just learn what you want to learn.

                        of course, this doesn't work for everyone. but i'm one of those people who learns better by practice, rather than example. i can sit in a classroom and listen to an instructor all day, but i have to actually do it in order for it to stick. if that sounds like you, i'd skip school and head over to amazon.com.
                        • 9. Re: Dreamweaver Training
                          Level 7
                          I decided on a Bachelors program is Computer Science with a focus and
                          specialty on web development, networking and some design. Since I already
                          had a previous degree, this made sense since I did not have to take general
                          ed classes again, and could focus just on the core classes.


                          • 10. Re: Dreamweaver Training
                            Level 7
                            On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 21:44:08 +0000 (UTC), "n h c"
                            <webforumsuser@macromedia.com> wrote:

                            >i suppose it depends on how badly you want an official degree. but i've always
                            >been a fan of the "buy a book and teach yourself" approach. it's probably a lot
                            >faster than going to school (you can probably teach yourself something in a few
                            >weeks what would take months to learn in a classroom-type environment), not to
                            >mention a whole lot cheaper. plus you can just learn what you want to learn.
                            >

                            See, for me, because I was freelancing 50+ hours a week as a technical
                            writer I knew that unless I stopped working and went back to school, I
                            wasn't going to be able to dedicate the time needed to learn enough to
                            make the jump to a different career.

                            Also, one thing I learned in the classroom setting was how much I
                            didn't know that I needed at least a passing familiarity with. When I
                            look online to learn something, I have to know what I'm looking for.
                            When I'm following a course curriculum, they have set the content to
                            cover all the bases.



                            > of course, this doesn't work for everyone. but i'm one of those people who
                            >learns better by practice, rather than example. i can sit in a classroom and
                            >listen to an instructor all day, but i have to actually do it in order for it
                            >to stick. if that sounds like you, i'd skip school and head over to amazon.com.


                            The program I attended was very very hands on. The instructors were
                            all practitioners; they all had freelance businesses on the side, or
                            were employed in the field and taking a sabbatical to teach.

                            We had real clients both semesters, for whom we had to build a
                            complete website and an interactive CD (we learned Director too).

                            I will never be a graphic designer. Or a photographer or videographer.
                            Or an animator. I learned enough in that program to be able to
                            intelligently specify project requirements and hire the specialists.

                            Win
                            --
                            Win Day, Wild Rose Websites
                            http://www.wildrosewebsites.com
                            winday@NOSPAMwildrosewebsites.com
                            Skype winifredday
                            • 11. Re: Dreamweaver Training
                              Media_Corp. Level 1
                              quote:

                              Originally posted by: Newsgroup User
                              On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 18:58:14 +0000 (UTC), "Media Corp."
                              <webforumsuser@macromedia.com> wrote:

                              Hi Derek,

                              The Sheridan program was a full school year, September to April/May.
                              It was $12K when I did it in 2000.

                              I had attended a couple of Sheridan weekend courses in HTML and web
                              graphics. I liked the instructors and the course outline for the post
                              grad program.

                              I had an unpleasant experience with someone who was involved with the
                              Humber program when I asked for information. He who shall remain
                              nameless was rude and downright nasty. I decided I didn't want to be
                              involved with a program where he was an instructor.

                              The Sheridan program has changed since I went through. Some of it has
                              been significantly watered down. They pride themselves more now on
                              turning out grads with "leading edge" skills - and I'm not sure I
                              would hire one as a subcontractor because I'm not convinced they know
                              the basics.

                              You're right that some of the courses might seem like a review, no
                              matter what program you choose I think. Most if not all are geared
                              for either new grads with no experience in the field, or folks who
                              want to retrain from a different profession.

                              Where are you in Alberta? I'm in Edmonton. If you're going to travel
                              to attend a program, did you look here? NAIT has a Digital &
                              Interactive Media Design program, although it's two years I think. And
                              Guru Digital Arts College has a 6 month Digital Media Producer Diploma
                              Program.

                              Hi Win,

                              Thanks for sharing your Sheridan experience. A think a year is kinda long for me at present so I'm thinking seriously about the Humber program. I've heard some good stuff about it (and some bad), but the timeframe is decent and the cost no big deal. I think going the 'distance education' route could take too long for what I'm planning. I started my Web Design company a year ago and have done a few simple jobs since (I still work fulltime somewhere else too).

                              I've taught myself a lot of stuff over the past decade, so a full year or two in college might make me a little 'jumpy'.

                              Is the industry strong? Have you kept busy since graduating?

                              Oh ya, I'm in Canmore.

                              Derek
                              :)
                              • 12. Re: Dreamweaver Training
                                Media_Corp. Level 1
                                quote:

                                Originally posted by: n h c
                                i suppose it depends on how badly you want an official degree. but i've always been a fan of the "buy a book and teach yourself" approach. it's probably a lot faster than going to school (you can probably teach yourself something in a few weeks what would take months to learn in a classroom-type environment), not to mention a whole lot cheaper. plus you can just learn what you want to learn.

                                of course, this doesn't work for everyone. but i'm one of those people who learns better by practice, rather than example. i can sit in a classroom and listen to an instructor all day, but i have to actually do it in order for it to stick. if that sounds like you, i'd skip school and head over to amazon.com.


                                Great point n h c. Over the past year of researching schools etc...I would guess that 35% of working professionals that I've chatted with regarding education 'types' (school vs. learning at home via books etc...) said the same thing - buy the books and teach yourself.

                                I actually learn VERY well on my own and agree that learning via books can be much faster and much cheaper, but I'm hesitant because of one thing (and Win mentioned this as well).... 'you don't know what you don't know'. I believe one does learn a lot from hearing others ask the questions. And with formal schooling you have the 'networking' benefit as well.

                                Anyone else gone the 'teach yourself' route? I'm now 50/50.

                                :)
                                • 13. Re: Dreamweaver Training
                                  destind4film
                                  I am no expert web developer yet by any means. But I feel that for me, lynda.com has been a wonderful resource. "The Missing Manual" series of books are phenominal as are the "friendsofed" series.

                                  I have a pretty hard schedule already with a full time job, part-time school online (to get my computer science degree), and a wife and young child. I am still stuck filling my gen.ed class requirements right now, so waiting for my core classes on web dev wasn't what I wanted to do. I guess I look at that the more I do hands on right now and more sites I get done, by the time I get my degree, I will be in a much better position for getting a better job. Also you have to remember how fast tech changes, every time something new comes out, you have to go back to school. And most colleges don't do a good job of keeping up with current software.

                                  Going through the books with their easy to follow tutorials and workfile examples, combined with the video tutorials has taught me alot. Every new site that I do is an improvement over the previous one. For me that has been a big advantage of hands on approach over classroom theory.
                                  • 14. Re: Dreamweaver Training
                                    Level 7
                                    On Thu, 9 Aug 2007 16:32:59 +0000 (UTC), "Media Corp."
                                    <webforumsuser@macromedia.com> wrote:

                                    > I've taught myself a lot of stuff over the past decade, so a full year or two
                                    >in college might make me a little 'jumpy'.
                                    >
                                    > Is the industry strong? Have you kept busy since graduating?
                                    >
                                    > Oh ya, I'm in Canmore.
                                    >
                                    > Derek
                                    > :)


                                    LOL I was 44 in 2000 when I started that program, and hadn't been in
                                    school full time since 1978. It IS a little weird to be in a class
                                    with students closer in age to my sons than to me...

                                    We moved to Edmonton from Guelph, Ontario in 2002. I put my business
                                    on hold while we built a house here (builder went bankrupt partway
                                    through so I ended up acting as the general contractor for 9 months).
                                    It took a couple of years to get back where I had been before the
                                    move.

                                    Alberta's economy, as you know, is booming. My business doubled last
                                    year and will double again this year. I started targeting larger
                                    clients and larger projects, which has been a very successful strategy
                                    for me.

                                    In Canmore, I would think that two target markets for you would be
                                    tourism operators and land developers. We're watching the housing
                                    market there very closely; there are new projects all the time, it
                                    seems.

                                    Win
                                    --
                                    Win Day, Wild Rose Websites
                                    http://www.wildrosewebsites.com
                                    winday@NOSPAMwildrosewebsites.com
                                    Skype winifredday
                                    • 15. Re: Dreamweaver Training
                                      quote:

                                      Originally posted by: Media Corp.



                                      Great point n h c. Over the past year of researching schools etc...I would guess that 35% of working professionals that I've chatted with regarding education 'types' (school vs. learning at home via books etc...) said the same thing - buy the books and teach yourself.

                                      I actually learn VERY well on my own and agree that learning via books can be much faster and much cheaper, but I'm hesitant because of one thing (and Win mentioned this as well).... 'you don't know what you don't know'. I believe one does learn a lot from hearing others ask the questions. And with formal schooling you have the 'networking' benefit as well.

                                      Anyone else gone the 'teach yourself' route? I'm now 50/50.

                                      :)


                                      you and Win make a good point, that you don't know what you don't know. i'm not done learning by any means, and i kind of just figure things out as i go along. i discover what i don't know when someone wants me to do something and i don't know how to do it! and while this hasn't been a problem for me, obviously some people would rather just learn it all at once and be done with it.

                                      Win also makes a good point about the time factor. i have the luxury of having a job that allows me to learn as i go along. obviously, you have to have the time to devote yourself to learning this stuff on your own. if you're working 50+ hours a week, that's probably gonna be pretty difficult!

                                      i suppose it also depends on how much you want to learn. if i wanted to learn programming and stuff like that, i'd probably want to at least take an introductory class.

                                      but it really all just boils down to what you feel most comfortable with, how much money you want to spend, how much time you want to spend, how much you want to learn, etc. etc. etc. i'm sure you'll make the decision that's right for you! and hey, if you decide to go to school and don't like it, you can always drop out and go the other route.

                                      good luck!
                                      • 16. Re: Dreamweaver Training
                                        Level 7
                                        On Fri, 10 Aug 2007 22:03:51 +0000 (UTC), "n h c"
                                        <webforumsuser@macromedia.com> wrote:

                                        > Win also makes a good point about the time factor. i have the luxury of having
                                        >a job that allows me to learn as i go along. obviously, you have to have the
                                        >time to devote yourself to learning this stuff on your own. if you're working
                                        >50+ hours a week, that's probably gonna be pretty difficult!
                                        >

                                        Plus two teenagers, and a husband who was traveling a lot back then.

                                        Things to consider:

                                        * what's your preferred learning style? Personally, my aging eyes
                                        don't like reading online for long periods of time. I like having
                                        books I can write in. And I like having an instructor who leads the
                                        curriculum

                                        * how much time can you dedicate to learning, if you are also working?

                                        * what exactly do you want to learn? Some subjects work better in
                                        classroom settings. Some work just fine for solo learning.

                                        Consider it one more section of your business plan. Work out the
                                        cost, the schedule, and the specs of what you want to accomplish.

                                        Win
                                        --
                                        Win Day, Wild Rose Websites
                                        http://www.wildrosewebsites.com
                                        winday@NOSPAMwildrosewebsites.com
                                        Skype winifredday